hyperv6

They can see the people wanting them but they make more money with them loaded up. Options = Profits.

IF they are looking for miles they should up the amount as I have see many with more than 200K. Hell my Uncles S-10 has almost 300K with an old Iron duke that has had nothing more than a plug change and clutch.

Plain and simple GM in general has way to many dealers yet. The problem is they are not easy to loose unless you spend billions to buy them out and that is not going to happen. This comes back to the Tesla sell direct debate where someone like GM can not spend the money to kill the dealers they need as they need the money for product. But as long as you have too many dealers you will continue to have prices that fall as dealers locally compete. They are hurting each other. If you had to drive 100 miles to the next dealer then they have a better chance of holding the line on price. As for names they have to have names and while many have tried the regional thing when you have 4 dealers in a metro area three others have to chose a name. Some do it better than others. For years we had one here that was owned by George Delorean. [brother of John] and it was Cadillac by Delorean for years. To fix the issue you need one dealer per so large a metro market. It needs to be a modern dealer with a high quality tech look. I think this plan here may be more to help squeeze some weaker dealers out. Call it strong arm but GM has some ways to apply pressure but it is a fine line to walk or they end up in court. I have seen it here with a local Chevy dealer they want gone and a GMC dealer they would like to see take over. They have forced the Chevy dealer at ever end as they are not a well run dealer and the GMC only dealer is getting all sorts of help but they are a very well run dealer. Hell how many Pontiac GMC dealers just went GMC and are making a good living should tell you how good they are. But even Audi and Mercedes here have come in and made all the dealers build new dealers and they are all up to date and not crowding each other. It is a pain many are farther away from owners but that is the price you pay to own an exclusive car too. I see a plan here to remove Cadillac as much as they can from just being a GM division and being a motor company that is just owned by GM. They want the company to be seen as their own deal and a new dealer plan is just the start of it as well as the move to NYC.

Sorry I should have said 1963 Riviera for #5

1 Nervous Norris My mom had the record when I was a kid. I loved this song back then. 2 Rickenbacker "Eddie Rickenbacker". 3 Golden Commando V8 4 Triumph 5 Riviera Bonus Silver Arrow I It was originally going to be a Cadillac or a LaSalle rebirth but was rejected by Cadillac. This car is still around and in prime condition.

And drew this is the problem. Tesla is not going to be a major factor in this but the Chinese is the 600 pound Gorilla in the corner I speak of. You let them in untied to a dealer network and they will be at a supreme advantage before they sell their first car. They could do a lot of damage here if they can produce a reliable decent looking car. It will be tough enough with their low labor but add in no dealer required for them is like handing the keys over to the market. So unless someone has a real workable idea I expect things not to change. What politician wants to be seen as the one who let the Chinese in with a great advantage. Not going to win them much votes in the next election.

Drew For those couple companies yes. But it solves nothing of the Detroit 3 and letting them be competitive on the same level as the other non franchised companies. Then the cheaper Asian cars come in with little to no overhead or added cost of a franchise and they price you out of your own markets. You need to take this back to the drawing board as it is not a fair or feasible plan. You have to either come up with a plan that is fair to all or you have to live in a system that can not easily be resolved unless you can find a way out and at this point there is little way out. All three Detroit firms would love to be direct sales but they can not get out of the position they were place in by government rules. So if they can not get out they are now supporting keeping the franchise system in place at Tesla as they do not want any new comers to have a leg up on them. The way you have it the present automakers in the franchise system have one arm tied behind their backs and you want to let in new blood with both arms free. Is that fair? No! Now bring me a plan that is fair to all. If you can you could make a lot of money selling it to them. You can not just think in basic terms here you have to deal with winners, losers and fall out from the losers. Also you have to deal with fair trade as if the Chinese get in with direct sales that would make NAFTA look like a kids game. Then finally the PR aspects of this. Note guys read the book What Did Jesus Drive. Killer book on PR in the auto industry. Not much GM but it is a good lesson on how things work and don't work in the industry. I give it two thumbs up!

Defelt Yes they would buy some of the dealers for delivery and repair but not all of them. GM has about 3 times the dealers they need as franchises now and if they go to the delivery dealer concept they would only need about 1/4 of the dealers they have now. So you would be left with a great number of dealers who would not be bought out and would be getting legal representation to force you to buy them out at a cost you really don't have the money for. Just consider the billions on legal suits and pay outs for dealers on top of the ignition deal and how that money is really needed in developing new product. While you have part of this right you still have the massive 600 pound gorilla in the corner really to take a big bite out of your budget you have set to make better products. Like I said this is a very complex issue and is not one that would be easily resolved. You now need to come with a plan on the dealers you don't buy out and how you deal with them to keep them from taking you to court or costing you large amounts of money. God knows GM has tried to kill many dealers already and just look how bad that has gone. It is a PR nightmare closing down many long time Family owned dealers and not giving them a thing. We just saw that 5 years ago till the government stopped them.

I expect Cadillac to do engines of their own design but they will stick to the similar displacements. 2.0 Turbo 4. 3.0 Turbo V6 and I think it was listed as a 4.0 Turbo V8. I just read a engineering story on these sizes and they are the optimum size that the MFG have found for the balance of power and economy for most applications. These numbers pop up often and it is not just by chance but these are where their numbers meet the criteria they need to meet in performance. I will have to find the story again and post where it can be found. It may be the new R&T. Either way they will be boosted and new designs of their own not shared with the present GM engines. I just wonder if they will partner with someone like Cosworth or Illmore.

No that is not going to happen as it would cost them billions and why should they be forced to pay for something they never asked for or wanted? Sorry it is not just that easy or simple. You have to find a way out that the Dealers and MFG are neither hurt or penalized. Give me a solution that entails that and you have solved the problem here. But the fact is there is nothing like that you can do and in the end someone will be hurt for a lot of money. Or the Government chooses to keep the old game in place and make Tesla joint the club and anyone else that follows The bottom line is the automakers can not afford to buy out the dealers and why should they? Two the politicians do not want the blood money on their hands for costing many family business their dealers. And finally Tesla is not the issue but if a large number of Chinese MFG send their product here we could be faced with many low price cars built at near slave labor rates and no dealer network to add to their expenses. The perfect storm to upset the recovery of the American auto industry. When playing this game you have to use all the cards and not just the trump ones. You are holding the Grenade in a mall and have no pin and have no where safe to throw it. The only way out I can see is a slow break down of the system and slowly let things unwind. It would take a lot of negotiation and work but it could be done but it would take years to let things die out on their own and to let deals be made to make sure few are hurt. It is not a simple or fast solution but it is about the only thing that would work. The first difficult step is to get most parties to agree to this. The Dealers would do their best to fight it but if you can offer them something over time they may see it as a way to retire or move out.

I think we all agree it is out of date but the real question that needs to be answered is how do you kill this law and not cost the Dealers or MFG's billions of dollars or cost a lot of jobs? Sure it would be easy to kill this law but the real issues is how do you deal with the fall out. Just look at the flack GM took on the dealers they tired to kill because they have too many. It will be 20 times worse here. If you want to resolve this how do you negotiate a way to let the MFG take over the retail end and close down the dealers. The trick is you can not expect the MFG to buy out the franchises and you can not expect the franchises to eat all the cost of losing their businesses. You know full and well if they MFG's cut off the dealers this would all end up in court and the dealers will all win out of court settlements that would cost the MFG's Billions. You can not expect the MFG to be penalized for this law they did not ask for it nor the dealers. You also know the government is not going to pay for the break up either. Hence this is why the law will remain in place unless it can be overturned by the SCOTUS. GM would kill off the dealers today a any MFG would if they could sell direct. But they know that unless someone eats the cost it is not going away and they know since they have more money than the dealers they are more likely to get hit with the cost they can not afford. So if you want to continue this argument provide a reasonable workable solution and you might do something some of the best legal minds can not sort out. This is one of those damned if you do and damned if you don't. The other issues is you also can not just let new MFG's come in not saddled with dealers and gain a advantage you can not give all the other MFGs. So don't even go there. Tesla is not the issue here but the many Asian companies that want to come here and undercut the prices of our cars will be an issue. You can pick or choose your solution has to be for all or no one. Lets hear it!

Well door locks and inter working parts are fine as long as they are high quality. Now as of things like the engines you need to change things here. While they did a good job on the V sport in terms of performance etc the marketing aspect is totally lost here. If they chose to use the TT in the Buick or Chevy it will a real mess. Benz and BMW do a lot of marketing with their engines and offer leading technology no found in cheaper cars. while some don't car many do. This is why Cadillac wants to have their own engines and will get them in the future. I am not sure how they will do it? Partnership with Cosworth or Lotus engineering etc? But while it is cool I have the same engine in my Malibu as the CTS is based on it is not really cool for the guy who just paid $65K for a car with a Malibu engine. If you want to be the Standard of the World you must set the standard that all others must compare themselves too. Little should be shared openly with Buick or Chevy. Even if they kept the Chevy based engines at least change the size or make some kind improvement to them that really sets them apart. The TT was a good move but I expect other will get it soon like Buick.

I think we are missing the point here. The point of luxury cars is not so much total volume here. We are not talking Camary's here. The point of a car like this is to make a profit and how much profit. Luxury cars are the most profitable vehicles on the planet. If you can only have $100,000 in the car and sell it for $150,000 and cover your investment in small number of sales then the rest Is profit. At these prices there is so much more room to make money and for a company like GM with the rescores and technology they could easily see a profit. But even the best can get fooled as Benz failed on the Maybach as they added some token things and charged more for it but the S had a better image so they sold very few. The only one on the streets I have seen belongs to Lebron. The other question too is for the money would invest here would you get it back faster with this or if you did three other models include very profitable CUV and SUV models then worry about the big show later.

I agree Tesla has no franchise. But the laws are written that they are to sell through a franchise system and that is why they want to change the law. If there were no law or I should say laws since it is state to state then what is stopping them and making them to try to change the law? The real question is ok change the laws but how do you untangle the mess? Do you tell the thousands of dealers good luck and nice knowing you? Do you let them go after the MFG's for billions of dollars in court cases? Do you force the MFG to buy out the franchises you forced on them in the first place? Do you leave it all the same and force Tesla to sell car like everyone else in the system that is so tangles there is no simple way out? Yes you are right it is a bad law but it is one in place with little way out. This is like that scene in Saw where the guy need get out to stop a murder but the only way he can get there is to saw off his leg. It is a no win on many levels. Now if they wanted to work out some kind of deal where it brought change over a length of time and worked to bring change to where things could get worked out then you may have an answer that all would be happy with but even then how would you do it. If you just strike the law MFG's and Dealers today will be out a lot of money and the courts will be tied up for years. Only winners will be the Lawyers, Tesla and the many Chinese automakers that will come in once they get their act together. Yes the Chinese will exploit this to the end as while they are behind they will in do time have cars people will buy since we are giving them so much technology to sell cars in country there. Also they will be cheap. As for pricing there is a lot more going on out there than you think. I see it often at work were MAP pricing is laid out on many products. While there may not be a lot of laws dealing with it retailers do use and abuse these laws. The larger retailers buy in numbers where they can under cut pricing of smaller retailers. The MFG tries to shut down the larger retailers non compliance but often the retailer just says ok we will drop you. In many cases as the ones I see first hand the companies we drop we are well over 50%-75% of their business. After about 1-2 months they cave and we pick them up again. I have had several MFG tell me that if not for us they would have shut their doors. In the mean time the little retailers are getting crushed. Companies like Best Buy get around Map buy making the price only available in the cart or they play the Sony game where they sell you the PS4 and then give you a gift card for $50. I could go on with more examples but the games are played and the larger retailer rule. In the case of the MFG's the Dealers would die a quick death as most people have little loyalty to them and the Automakers really would love to sell direct and take all the money. But again who do you pick to lose here? Dealers or MFG or even both as I would expect if the law was just killed? If you do not chose then give me a plan on how you can cleanly make this go away with no losers. And sorry no you can not say Tesla can go with out dealers and the old MFG's have to keep there. You have to be fair to all MFGs as they are either all in or all out. It is not inconsistent logic it a law that would be selectively in-forced as you state it and that would be inconsistent law. That is like taking a class of school kids and saying ok all of the kids who have been here for years have to take Math but the new kid that just got here you don't have to take math because you did not start the year here with a book.

I agree the law was put in place to protect the dealers from the MFG. But anyone getting into the game also has to follow the same rules as all other MFG and not sell direct to the customer as written law by most states. These laws are state to state but vary a little. While Tesla does not have dealers ships they are required as most law state to sell through a franchise system. This is why they want to change the law. But back to the existing MFG and Dealers. Ok if you change the law how do you untangle the mess you have at that point. Do you tell the local dealers tough luck you lose? Do you let the dealers go after the

That is the whole point Telsa has no dealers or franchises. This is what most MFG would love to do but in their case they were forced into the franchise system and now if they want to get out of it if the laws are changed the dealers or the companies will have to lose. As for the customers while I think they will find service a little more consistent since they are dealing with one network vs. many different networks of franchises they will not see major savings in the long run. If there are profits the companies will take them for the most parts. As for protection? Well if a company goes down like Fisker not much there. In the case of Saab many of the parts new and old are still there and available thorugh GM for so far back. But even in the case of a 80's Chevy Citation if it is not a common mechanical part and it is not reproduced good luck! Just the nature of the business as companies just do not keep on these parts forever anymore. Case in point the Console skeleton on the Fiero is broken in 75% of the cars left. Even the low mile ones they fracture with age. Where do you get one. Well you don't. The bottom line is there are good and bad to both sides but even if you wanted to make the change how to you fairly get out of this system and not damage someone financially.

Well I am not a Elon fan but I understand why he wants to do as he wants to do. There is not a MFG that would not want to sell direct as Chrysler tried it in California before they were shut down. I even had a Ford owned center here that was to sell only lease used cars direct but folks were buying new there till they got shut down. the problem is we have a knotted up mess of a system and to undo it someone has to lose and lose big. The MFG's even though they hate the way things are will stay with the old system if they are forced to buy out all the dealers. So that is not going to happen. The Dealers do not what to take the loss. Yes some can become factory pick up and service sites but how many will you need. maybe a 20% at best. And the politicians are lobbied on all three sides and as long as they remain neutral they will continued to be lobbied with the perks that come with that so why act. So until some on is willing to pay to dissolve the dealer system as it is and pay for it I do not see much change. The only way I can see a major change is If the SCOTUS acts with a ruling and then at that point the dealers are out cold and the lawsuits will arrive. To me the dealer system is like setting off a Nuke. Once you have done it there is no easy painless way to undo it and someone is going to suffer. I suspect things over time will remain the same. Elon can make a lot of noise but in the end even he is limited to what he can do. At that point he will deflect off to tube shooting people 1,000 MPH from NY to LA. He did that gain this week as I predicted on another site where the day before they reported his stock dropping 9%. The next day a Tube story came up again. Elon fancies himself as Tony Stark but lacks the Ironman suit.

Keep in mind this 12 Billion is on top of what is already budgeted I believe.

This is far from it all as there is going to be a lot of changed at Cadillac. As for Cross overs and CUV models these are the future as they this year out sold sedans. As cars get smaller the taller and more open floor plan CUV models are proving to be popular. People love the utility that most cars no longer have. Also the tall roofs make for a more roomy feeling. Also CUV models are pure profits like trucks.

Here is the deal Unions are not effected here at the dealer level. As for big business they are only looking to not be at a disadvantage here. Union are not even in this picture. Here is the deal. You cut Tesla loose all the major MFG are at a disadvantage as they are saddled with all the dealers they were forced to work through via government regulation. Now if offered a deal where GM, Ford and everyone else can do a company dealer and dispense of all the small dealers they would take that deal in a heartbeat. Hell they would love to sell just on the web direct if they could. But the government will not let that happen either as the local dealers too often lose out of their investment. This is a house of dominos The bottom is the MFG that has to support the dealer they were forced to sell through. You remove the bottom domino and the whole thing collapse with the small guy on the top falling the hardest. It all comes down to this. You let all the auto MFG sell cars direct and not be responsible to the dealers or you make them all have dealers. That is the only fair thing. The government dug their hole on this when they forced the trade agreements on the MFG and now that it is place they need to either stick to it or the government need to be responsible to the dealers that are forced out. Fairs fair. The MFG did not chose to be in this system so why should they pay for what they were forced into and why should one company get to skip on it just because they don't want to play by the rules others are forced to live with. Hey I am all for no independent dealers and sell direct with set prices but it has to be everyone not just one who was lucky enough not to have been around when the government enforced this system. Also be wary as if companies control the markets there is always risk here too. I am not a fan of dealers unions or politicians. But I am a fan of fair and equal here and one set free while others remain stuck with a dealer system is not fair. One set of rules for this game for everyone.

You really want to know what is going on read up on Aleksandr Dugin as this man is behind much of the things going on in Russia today. He is dangerous and could play in some major issues and problems the work will face into the future. He makes Osama look like a amateur. The anti gay stuff all started with Dugin. Russia is working to regain their nationalism and he is playing a major roll. He is mixing far right politics with distorted orthodox religion and nationalisms in a way just as Hitler did in Germany in the 30's. He is now targeting the Gays as Hitler did and they are in great danger in Russia right now. This and the stuff at the Olympic are nothing compared to what we may see. The Jews in the old Iron Curtain countries are also nervous as they know they will get to them next. The policies of this man are being followed by Putin and others in Russia and will be felt globally in due time. Also when I say far right I mean so far right that this guy considers Tea Party people extreme liberals. He is a Fascists, Fascist. He hates Americans just as much and has a lot of pull in Russia. He has influence not seen there since Rasputin. The lack of a Strong America is going to play into this too as he is no longer intimidated. Right now he is not happy with Putin as he feels he is moving too slow and what is scary Dugin has enough growing influence that he may effect change there at some point in leadership. His far right group is now spreading across Europe and has joined with Iran. The more Chaos they can create the easier it will be for them to make their moves. Just look up and read what he teaches and you will see Putin has been following his advice and he has much more things he has said that are down right scary.

A lot of people have a lot of jobs and money at stake here build around system that they were forced into years ago. They have tried to change things many times and never have been let loose. If Tesla can change this then they all should be able to join in. But in the end someone is going to lose a lot of money. There is a difference between should and can. To negotiate this one out is going to be a tough one for both sides.

Some of these models can be down right detailed anymore. I have a number of Exoto Can Am Cars various Chaparral and 917 Porsche models and they are amazingly detailed to some very small things most could not imagine. Even the dash panels have all the wires to the gauges. This Viper is nicely done.

To whom it may concern Uncle Bob Lutz will have a story in the new Feb Road and Track outlining the Zora Mid Engine Corvette program and how it all started and when. Good read as it gives the time line and why things were delayed. It also covers the realties of how and why cars are chosen for production and others are passed over and delayed. While I know most of us here understand that some may learn the realties are not all fun and games at a company like GM. Either way the story is spot on of what I have heard for years with a few Easter eggs dropped in like the Chevy Solstice they were looking at etc. Note the end of the story is where he plays coy as he said the car has 50% chance for production and may have been in the works for the last 6 months. Well the photo's tell a different story and we all know Bob knows more than that and could not play this card as it is GM's card to play. I believe he is still on retainer to them. Note too this story appeared days after the Ford GT and the Photo's. I suspect it was a well planed story from GM to get more info out in a non official way. Bob is still very tight with these people. He also scrapped his normal column and went to two pages over the normal one.