hyperv6

No.

It is really amazing to watch the change of opinon once people really see the car with out Camao. I really don't expect the car to change much from what the intro will show. GM has not been playing many games on main line car when they intro them anymore. The Cruze, CTS Coupe, Camaro and others have pretty much been what we were shown to start with. We did see a few market changes witht he Cruze but most were under the skin in the drivetrain. In some cases there was a little too much show car left in the production car like the interior of the Camaro. As for the lack of the V6 it has not killed the Regal. I just had a co worker that just drove one the other day. He said since the car was built in Germany GM must have used a BMW engine. He really had no clue on the car. I told him it was just a detuned version of my HHR engine and it was the same Eco used in most GM cars. He was shocked. For the most this is your typical buyer so impressions accurate or not are very important. If this car was larger I would be more concerned about the lack of a V6 but with higer gas prices and the market already 3/4 4 cylinder it is not going to be as big of an issue on this car. The key is that the car drives right and is quiet. Keeping the price under the Regal will also be key. While I have not seen the final interior it has gotten better as the car has the more it has come together. I will wait till the entire car is here in person to pass final judgment. It is amazing how much better or worse a car look once you see it live than even photos. The CTS Coupe is one car that just can't be captured in photos to experess how it really looks on the road. That car in person is just amazing.

Why am I not suprised

Thanks Guys

Here is a video from the ATS Forum. Nothing really new here but at least we can see the car move. There are some shots of a Regal GS going by too. Please note 1:29 in the video. At the bottom left to right is some kind of white box on wheels. Any ideas? http://www.atsforums.com/forums/showthread.php?2557-Cadillac-ATS-prototype-caught-on-video-for-first-time! It did not strike me as a Granite as it was too square.

You got that one backwards Horshack. We are not looking for Failed Euro cars going to America. GM even messed it up in the other direction. L series, Catera etc.......

Don't be so sure on that one. Do we need to replay the crash tests of the Brilliance BS4? What Chinese homegrown cars top the ones being imported there? The past is not the future. With the forced partnerships of the western automakers in China with homeland automakers I know they will steal what they need to improve their cars. But even then they will not advance beyond what anyone else has since they have a difficult developing their own advanced technologies. There industry also lack the discipline to keep the standards up. They can get things right but the problem is keeping it right.

Yeah the CTS is large enough (mere emphasis) for us here. In some segments (IIRC) you might see up to 60% sales as diesels. And in company car sales, which are important, the weight of 4-cyl diesel cars in the 5-Series/E-Class/CTS size category are probably higher still. The ATS should definitely have 4-Cyl models, gas and diesel, but thses should be tuned to higher hp/torque than the Opel variants so they could be marketed as exclusive to Cadillac. Do you think a deconteted ATS [and I don't mean fully stripped] would appeal to the market there. I know every BMW, Benz and Audi is not fully loaded there and I think they sell a good number of lower content models. Also how many of these are fleet sales and do they make any money on them? I know a car like that here has limited appeal as we have seen the cheap 190 Benz, base 318's and others come and go here as no one wants a cheap looking German car. Few here want to be seen in stripped down Cadillac either for that matter. The bottom line would be would GM be able to move enough cheaper ATS to make up the volume to keep it profitiable? The goal is to build a car a German can afford but a Albainian would still steal. You understand the thinking there better than anyone in the states. Do you think this is something they should look at?

It's not about quality. Cadillacs are simply not adjusted to European market preferences and never were adjusted to those market preferences (size, engine size, and fuel economy being the three major aspects where they don't fit). Of course that it is great that the CTS-V exists and that it (in coupe form IIRC) was considered by readers of a German magazine to be the best import car in Germany, but even with that 5-series sized car in the form of the CTS, Cadillac does not try to challenge the 520d or the E220CDI or the A6 2.0TDI, and those 3 examples are where the sales are over here in the CTS category: 2.0L to 3.0L diesel engines. That was my point. They like cars that are more intune with their market even if it is a crappy car. The CTS is large and not everyone in Germany whats a Maybach sized car. I don't know were we could get the numbers but would it be resonable to think one third to one half the cars are diesel. Could it even be higher than that? I hope that GM treats the ATS as a Global car and really tunes it to each markets needs. At least tune it more so than they ever have any other Cadillac. Cadillac of Europe may be built on the back of a Diesel and Turbo gas 4 cylinder and not the CTS V

Now back to GM and Cadillac in Europe. I have one question as for Europe. What GM North American car outside the limited success of the Corvette has done well in Europe? I was just running through cars that GM has sold there over the years and I find few that have done well FWD, RWD etc. I know Hummers H2 and H3 were popular for a while. There have been limited exports of the Camaro over the years. I saw a 4th gen export car here in Ohio not long ago. In the past the older Fleetwoods Limos and a few other older cars did ok but I really can't think of any real hits for GM in Europe other than some trucks, vans and the new Cruze that really is a global car. Anything GM has really done well with is Opel or Vauxhall. The only reason Ford has done well is they have been there a long time with Ford of Europe and amount to just being another Euro car in the eyes of the public there. Getting Cadillac to be profitable is the key and not so much volume. To sell any GM car in Europe that is not a global car is going to be a challange. This is where China has been easy. They are selling to a public that many have just moved from a Mule to a car. Also the local cars are not anything to compare to even the worst cars we have had here. Lets see if we can name list of the cars GM has exported well, the numbers they sold in and length of time they sold well over there. I think it would be interesting to see just what GM has done in the past as what it would take to sell GM car not native to Europe. It might just be a Opel XTS may be a better idea. They do rename Holdens there. I just want us to take a little different big picture view of this and think outside the box. There is more to this issue than just FWD or RWD. I think Euro buyers like Euro cars no matter the quality. Other wise there would not be any Fiat, Lancia, Lada or Peugeot. That should show us how bad the goverment run Brits cars really were.

Global warming is nothing new. Arctic Ocean Getting Warm; Seals Vanish and Icebergs Melt. Washington Post-----The Arctic ocean is warming up, icebergs are growing scarcer and in some places the seals are finding the water too hot, according to a report to the Commerce Department yesterday from Consul Ifft, at Bergen, Norway. Reports from fishermen, seal hunters and explorers, he declared, all point to a radical change in climate conditions and hitherto unheard-of temperatures in the Arctic zone. Exploration expeditions report that scarcely any ice has been met with as far north as 81 degrees 29 minutes. Soundings to a depth of 3,100 meters showed the gulf stream still very warm. Great masses of ice have been replaced by moraines of earth and stones, the report continued, while at many points well known glaciers have entirely disappeared. Very few seals and no white fish are found in the eastern Arctic, while vast shoals of herring and smelts, which have never before ventured so far north, are being encountered in the old seal fishing grounds. A Washington, D.C. resident John Lockwood was conducting research at the Library of Congress and came across an intriguing headline in the Nov. 2, 1922 edition of The Washington Post Neither side can prove it is true or false at this point. Even those who really are at the top of the field of climate can't agree. We have only tracked weather records for a little over 100 years on earth so we have little to draw from for long term changes. We also can use some historic accounts and ships records to learn more but that is very limited. The earth has been in flux for millions of years and has been effected by natural actions as well by actions of every living thing. I agree we are like feas along for the ride. The one thing does make me question the warming claims of some are the fact some have made a major industry of Global Warming. People are now making a lot of money off this like GE, the Carbon Trading Exchange etc. Some involved are Al Gore and other prominate names in goverment and industry. I learned of Maurice F. Strong long ago and find him someone that many should really learn more about. Here is a man who globalized the eviromental movment now a Billionaire hiding in China. Why? I don't know if he is hiding from the UN Oil-for-Food scandal or what else he is into now. I am not going to say that warming is false as it they may be right. But there are still a lot of things that need to be questioned and answers given on both sides of the argument.

Its in orbit near Jupiter. You must mean the first 4th gen F-body. The first F-body was perfectly fine for its time. Ours is a earlier one. So I've done most of the fixes myself. That reminds me, I still have to dig the parts out of the garage and fix the bouncing headlights. Jupiter, I like that. 3rd gen too. I know many with the crossfire engines and other things that plagued the car. I have a buddy with a very clean Z that seldom drives it as you never know if it is going to start. I guess if it won't run it will never wear out. Did you get the softer back seat. I saw a guy on the GP forum that had a buddy take a later 04 for a test drive and made the swap when his dealer would not replace the seat for the later softer one. Mine missed the year and date mix up as it was just built after New Years. FYI if you have not fixed the lights how do you stand the crazy headlight reflections? They drove me nuts right after be bought the car. The fix helps but it still has some bounce left.

Any one know where 911 is? that is what I drove in Malibu. I too heard the Bu would peek out at NY. I just saw it posted somewhere but it was not from GM. I see no issue with the cars being released some place a year before NA. If they ment for this or not the first year cars released ovrseas have been safe to buy here in the first year. Too often the public cry has always been "Don't buy the first year of a GM car". The Cruze release has gone pretty well unlike cars like the first C4,the first F body and others. Even the 04 GTP was an issues. The early built cars has a lot of little dumb problems. Mine was built near the end of the model year and had many of the panned 05 fixes in place. I still had to wait for the TSB to fix the bouncing headlamps. The delay here may just get me back to buying a first year car on the NA market again.

I wonder how many with a Malibu know where the E brake is? I bet most have low pedals since the rear pads are not adjusted up.

Here is a real Caddy that was built to race recently. It is a real 24,000 mile car and still retains the power windows and much of the original body structure. This is a Outlaw 10.5 car that runs 10.5 inch slicks. He runs 4:40's at 160 MPH in the 1/8 mile. He is at 3:35 in the video. Check out the car after the Caddy. A Mustang wheel stands 3 times down the track and near 120 MPH gets all 4 tires in the air. How he ever made it I will never know. I work with a lot of pro drag teams and get to work with many of the NHRA drivers but I am not a real drag race fan. But I do like it when someone does something like this car that is not just another Camaro or Mustang.

Here is a peek at the car Dennis Burnevik, pending approval from the various legal entities, wants to return a Cadillac Pro Stock. Dennis has taken over the work of fame car builder Don Ness. He as a hand full of unnamed supporters [race teams] want this car. As you can see the car has a similar shape to the GXP G6 and would make for a easy transfer to a new body. The GXP is still a dominate car. The Camaro is coming out of the plug soon and will be approved by Chevy and the NHRA. But there are some things the teams are concerned about aero wise. The cars are now doing low 6 second runs at 215 MPH so aero is very important anymore at these speeds. Dennis wants Cadillac to give their blessing and if they do this car will be put on the fast track so to speak. Drag teams will again get support from GM soon and but they like to keep the advantages they have now. We all know GM will want to approve Chevy but would they give a couple teams the ok to run with the Caddy? I will post if I hear any more.

Denali, is it a National Park, a Mountain in the park, Sara Palins back yard, or an over chromed GMC of some nature? Brougham or Bro Ham each are used daily in different parts of our society. Too bad Cadillac no longer has bullet bumpers or it could be a Grand Tetons editions based on the old legend of that name. These terms mean different things to different people. As for Denali if they can make a profit with it call it what ever. I just pray it has more content than just chrome and trim than the last Denali. The GM name BS was king on the Fiero. They had a story that they had a late night meeting and pulled that one out of a book. They claimed it ment Proud in Italian. Funny how in the late 60's the name was on a Firebird Show car the Firebird Fiero. Back then it ment Firebird Aero Concept. A lot of this comes down to some marketing and image. But a lot comes down to cost and who ownes the rights. GM has a long list of registered names that they pull from often. It is much cheaper than to seek a new name and then do a search and then legaly get the rights registere. I think I saw somewhere some new names can cost $15,000-$20,000 to register. Some times the marketing backfires as with the Cutlass name. People bought the Cutlass Supreme because it was a very good car. Just because you put the name on a bunch of average FWD cars did not transform them into great cars. Content is much more than name. A good car can over come a bad name but a bad car just sucks no matter what lable it gets.

I agree that the Denali should be reserved for a version of a model that has more advanced AWD and more power in the engine. Things that just can't be found on lesser models. Just adding bling to a Acadia or Terrain just will not do a special name justice. I never considered the Denali as a performance version like the SS. My point was that is should be something special over and above it just being a trim packages offered. We saw the SS go from a true performance car and trim to just being a trim package on a Malibu was my point. I never saw a problem on the SS being on a Trailblazer or Cobalt if it offered real performance. The Cobalt SS in real perfromance times and track times is at near the top of the list. But on the other hand the 2005 Malibu SS was not really anything more than Fog lights and badges. Special up level models should be set appart like the SSEI Bonnie was from the regular cars. My SSEI has many features you could not get in the regular Bonnie and added driveline options. The Terrain Denali with the extra trim and a Haldex AWD system would be a good start. The SRX has it so we know it could fit. The bottom line just don't give me a buch of chrome and call it a day. Make the extra parts more interactive. It does not need to have 500 HP but give me something special to give me a reason to step up with the extra money. The AWD Denali Pick up was a good example of the template they should follow. The best engine standard with AWD and Sliding sun roof with a better interior that you could get in the regular Serria. Just please no more Acadia like Denali's.

This is what my feelings are. It used to mean a Pick up with AWD not a 4x4 with the more powerful engine that you could not get on anything else. Right now it is becoming more a chrome package. It is as wrong as the SS became just a 1990's trim package. If it is just going to be a trim package rename it. Chevy can get away with LTZ and LT as they realy don't impact a vehicles name as much as a full name like Denali. If you were to use a name with this much impact there really needs to be something there to back it up. Other wise it becomes a Malibu SS. As for the styling it has warmed to me I still could not buy one just. The grill is too big and the fenders are just too big or square. I just can't decide which it is that just does not work for me. These features are just too big on a vehicle this small. But it has appeal different from the Nox and that is good and GM did a good job in keeping space between them. If everyone loved them both their appeal would be to a smaller group of people and they would be competing more with each other.

This is a really excellent idea. Make it more like mercedees: AMG, BMG, CMG, DMG, EMG, FMG, HMG, etc. or like BMW does with it's top trim level: M, N, O, P, Q, R, S, T. Great idea that really creates a strong association thru 'mixing it up' with a different name for each different model. I like it. I'll go you one better. Why not make the model nameplates interchangable with 'snap-in' tags. Say you like the Sierra truck but hate the greeny association with the Sierra club. Boom! Swap on a "Terrain" or "Savana" nameplate and make it your own! Who says only the manufacturer can dictate what a model is called. Power to the people!! See below as Someone gets it.

GM did. See page one. Then let them finish the car and really see what it is in final form. To prejudge something you have not driven let alone seen is a little short sighted. A informed opionion good or bad is the only one that really counts. I may write this car off too but I will wait till we know a lot more about it. Meh, that's a tired old refrain at this point. As I said before, we already know enough about the XTS to know it doesn't belong in the european market. Ok what will the 0-60 times be? How short will it stop? What kind of lap time on the Green Hell will it have? You may be right but until we know the important real performance numbers we really know nothing. An informed opinion is the only one that really counts. To be honest even the ATS will have a difficult time selling over there. GM is going to have to get it spot on and do one hell of a marketing program to make any headway. I feel if they can just show a profit even on a small volume that is all the more we can expect short term. China is where Cadillac will see the most growth. I hope the same will be seen in America.

At times I wonder if this would be best too. I also wonder how well GM markets to where the pockets of American car lovers are. Norway Sweeden and Finland are big time American car lovers. I wonder if they really focus in these areas. We ship container after container of American car parts new and old there. We have one shop in Norway that has done over a million dollars in buisness with us last year just on American performance parts. Germany is going to be a tough sell no matter what they send over there. I think if the car is right they could do ok in GB they are open minded and really have no home car industry to support anymore. That is unless they consider the Mini still British and not German owned. France another tough sell. I sometimes wonder if it is better to learn how to beat Benz and BMW here before you spit on their turf.

I like the nose as it is, it's not just another pick up trying to look like a mini semi. Some of today trucks are a mess like the F250. A little chrome like on the full size GMC is ok but too much of anything is not good. I expect the GMC version to get a little more truck like nose and with the Chevy offering a more car like it will give people a choice and make either happy. In the past I bought GMC because of the lack of chome as I liked the body colored grill on my Sonmoma over the plastic chome S10. The wheels are nice and based on the new SUV spy photo's GM looks like they have a new range of wheels coming for most of the new trucks.I learned a long time ago that wheels can really make or break a vehicle. Even on my Comp G GP I have the SPO 5 twisted spoke chrome wheels vs the 10 spoke comp wheels. I have had more compliments on the car and wheels than any other car. Most people say they never liked the new GP but they liked mine and often said the wheels made the difference. The thing I wish GM will get right is tires and wheels on the regular trucks that don't look 3 sizes too small. With such large wheel wells they need to better size the wells and tires to make them look better. Some of the base trucks look down right cheap because of the smaller tires and wheels.

I knew it would happen! Consumers have been calling for one since the Terrain hit the dealer's lots. Now GMC will push it out to keep the Terrain line fresh. I just hope it doesn't look silly... I'd prefer GMC to put out an All-Terrain model, a'la Jeep Patriot, since the Terrain Denali can't sit much lower to the ground than the regular model already does. I don't know if making a GMC like Patriot is all that good of an idea. These are not really off road vehicles and to make them into one is not going to give you are very good off road vehicle. Even the Jeep Magazine has voted the Patriot and Compass as two of the all time 10 worst Jeeps ever and there are may that could make the list. The Denali thing is getting a little over done. It is like Olds naming every car Cutlass. You can over do a good thing. The whole thing with the Denali concept is to juice up the car with more trim and make more profit. As long as GMC keep making more money I suspect every version will get a Denali trim. I just wish they would come up with a different name for each top level model. Name each one for a different mountain. God made a lot of them and some have some really good names.

GM did. See page one. Then let them finish the car and really see what it is in final form. To prejudge something you have not driven let alone seen is a little short sighted. A informed opionion good or bad is the only one that really counts. I may write this car off too but I will wait till we know a lot more about it.