hyperv6

What proof? You have no DOHC engine to compare it too for a real assesment. Once or if they produce an engine you can make such a statment. Just because it has DOHC does not make it less able to make as much or more power. You are smart enought to know that. Besides did you account for the parasitic loss of power to drive the supercharger? LOL! I wonder if we will see a boost in power in the future? I remember the GM engineer who over spoke on the ZR1 engine said it could pass the emissions and warranty test up to 725 HP with no issues. I wonder if they will raise it up as a send off for the C6 before it is done? I love these video's. Job well done Vette team!

It comes down to a point with some of these cars they are no longer worth of the cost to keep them on the road witht he cost to repair the stock engine. Cars like a 308 Ferrari or 318 BMW can cost way too much to repair the stock engine but still have a chassis still road worthy. Case in point we has a Jag XJS sedan with a V 12 that liked to drop valve seats and kill the head. It also had a failing computer. The car was a very clean TX car but after two engine failures and $1200 each in the bare head castings it was time for a change. While SBC in Jags have been done since the 60'a we used a 428 pontiac since we had a couple laying around. The car is still on the road and only had a tranny failure later [GM Turbo 400]. The car while in good shape was not worth the cost to rebuild the V12 again. The same could be said for these other cars like the 308 that I have seen good running condition cars only sell for $25K but get one that lost the timing belts could cost more to repair the engine alone. I would in no way say take a new M series car and replace the engine with a Chevy but if you have a clean 318 that is worth nothing do it. Same for old american cars. If you have a old 79 Olds wagon dump a SBC in it. Now if you have a 442 with a 455 HO keep the SBC away from it. Too muchj value to be lost there if it is a real 442. It is just common economic sense.

Anyone notice with the many thing GM has reaffirmerd this week about the importance of being global. Cadillacs being built overseas and the importance of Chevrolet being a global brand. It is all about appeal and marketing to the global market anymore no matter if it is a Sonic or a Corvette. While it will effect us here in the state is some ways positive and some ways negitive it is coming. The economic model anymore for most companies it to be one compny globally and not offer a totally different car in each market. I think that is why there is talk of two engines. I could see the 32V as the primary export to suit the other markets but what the hell off it as an option here too. If you have it use it. There again I would expect the perfromance to be nothing less than the new LS engine or what ever they call it. If it were slower the Vette team would not do it.

I have only heard about some of the Asian powerplant options and they look to really be pushing a diesel over there. No word on what may be here. I suspect as Eco 4 and maybe some V 6 options. Who knows if they bring it here we may get some small diesel option? I would suspect a crew cab would be offered. They did it with the S10 and Colorado presently and they seem to sell well. We will just have to wait to see when or if they make the call to bring it here to see more of what they have planned. I figure within the next year we will hear something about this truck.

You know what I mean. No need to be one of those kind of people. Besides the tank on the truck is much large and take more to fill it. The whole point is it takes much more $$$ to drive the truck the HHR when I can haul most of what I need daily in the smaller truck. I have been using the truck more since we are moving and I need it for the taller or bulkier item.

I would really be shocked if they don't. This truck would do very well here if they can price it right. Also if gas stays up it will be important that they do have a small truck as I am sure the rest will find high MPG trucks to send here to take the place of the full size trucks. People will only pay so much for a tank of gas. I know with driving the 09 Silverado truck it kills me to fill it up. The HHR uses only 1/4 of what the truck takes to fill it up for a week. The sad part is the HHR has almost as much power and can haul many of the same things better as the truck like a 8 ft ladder with the door shut that the 6 foot truck bed lets stick out. .

True- Too many here always believe the grass is greener over the fence/border, dismissing the grass here because it's 'here grass'. These would be the first group to damn the abandonment of the Corvette's heritage when it didn't show any bump in volume (as if the Corvette chasing volume was in anyway an advisable approach). I would like to reiterate, again, that none of these armchair critics still get who the real customers of Corvette are. I have seen the performance market fundamentally change in the last 18 years. While there are some tried and true areas where the pushrod engine is still dominate it no longer has the dominate lock on the market. Today I deal with a market that is now inclusive to V8, V6 and 4 cylinder engines. I see Single IBC to SOHC and DOHC. Turbo's in the past were novalties and today if you don't carry a lne of intercoolers and other turbo accessories you are losing money in a growing market. Years ago it was Ford Chrysler and Chevy and nothing else but today it is now all makes types and models. While most Vette owners will vote Pushrods many would show interest in a DOHC engine. Also if GM plans to push Chevy as a world brand they will have to offer things in other markets that may not be the first choice here. No they don't have to sell the Vette overseas but if they want to be taken seriously as a world brand they will have to sell their best world wide. The auto market is changing and GM is playing catch up. Also yes they are doing ok selling their 15K-25K Vettes a year but if they can sell more world wide then why not. I am well aware of what most Vette owners like and or want. I am also aware of what how GM wants to grow Chevy as a world brand. Lets face it the loss of the pop up lights was startling to many Vette owners. They were lost for several reasons. Yes GM messed with a sacred cow but in time most have accepted it and the cars keep right on selling. GM could just keep on selling the same things and keep the same group of owners. But as the youth of today grow older most don't give a dam about IBC let alone in many cases V8 engines. GM has tried too often not to mess with change and made money. An example is the Buick Le Sabre did fine in the 70's and 80's as it sold to a group that came back over the years. But they never appealed to the younger buyers and saw it hurt sales. I see many areas in life where traditions are great but if they don't find ways to adapt they tend to in time die. Just look at many old time things that have not transformed to the present markets and are either dying or are dead. The fact remains as long as they offer both engines it will satisfy most in the market traditional buyers and new converts. In no way would endorse a complete purge of the IBC engine but there is no reason to oppose a intro of a modern engine with equal or better power. With the heavy investment in the Vette plant I suspect that they plan to go more global. They did not make the XLR just because it felt good, they built it to use up the extra capacity at the plant. It just was not the right kind of car and was in many ways to close to the Vette. If the DHOC engine is as bad as many make it the engine will die or just go on with Cadillac. The way I see it if the IBC is as good as you say why would you get so worked up if they offer one. It would die on it's own. Or are some affraid it may in time replace the IBC? No matter I just see it worth the shot if they continue to offer both engines. If they do go more global they will need it. The rest of the world see the sports car market a little different than we do here. To survive in the future most companies will have to be global with lines of vehicles that are nearly idential less a few market tuning issues. The Cruze is only an example of where they are going.

It only comes to reason to expect G8 pricing with a little $$$$ added based on inflation etc.

Even with out the mark up's I still expect the V8 Camaino if built would be over $30,000. Depending on how it is optioned it could come close to $40,000. If we are lucky they will also offer the V6 at just under $30K. I expect GM dose not plan on selling alot of these. Since they only had plans on just over 30,000 G8's I would expect they will seek 10,000-15,000 Utes to sell. Who knows if this works out this could create new plans for a Utes on other platforms in America say on a Alpha at a lower price. But that is a big if and we can dream.

The larger HHR would give you more room and right now a cheaper price on a low mileage used one. The Sonic would have better MPG and a little better quality since it is newer. I would like to see them let GMPD so the tuning on this car and see what they can get out of it. No need to call it an SS or what ever but a real good tune on this car would be interesting. The graphics on the one above with brown metalic paint would sell in Cleveland as the Browns edition.

Just because you see no advantages does not mean they are not there. Too many MFG are showing a lot of support for DOHC engines in their numbers and investment in them. Just might be you just are not seeing the whole picture. What is pointless to you is not pointless to those who build cars. My whole point is what have you got to lose or fear if GM offers both. You get your ICB engine and the potential of an engine that will bring in more money with as good or better performance depending ont he tune. Who loses here? I like both engines and see room for both but find it odd how only the two companies that went Chapter 11 have done anything with CIB while other have spent countless other have spent $$$$$$. They must be making money some where with this to justify the investment. Liked em or not DHOC are not going away. I too remember many of the same people who poo poo'e the use of the Ecoboost TT V6 in the trucks. With sales as they are I would never underestimate the public on what they want or will accept.

The whole Ecoboost deal is making for a lot of money and have people buying their cars in some cases just because of the engine. I really am not a AWD fan but I see it as an option at some point again it has it's fans and will attract buyers. I would really like to see the car get a little smaller and lighter. This would add performance an engine could not add. Imagine a 2900-3000 pound car. This would enhance handling to greater levels and improve braking to a retina detaching level. The new Mclaren is I believe at 2800 pounds and does some great things. I agree people are not expecting as an option and a high tech advancement. I just am not a fan of it as some others. It would be ok to offer it as an option just as the DOHC engine. That way you spread the appeal of the car. Let the buyers choose.

You really have hit the kool aide. No the GTR should not offer the IBC as only people willing to accept it are Vette owners and pony car owners. IBC fans are in the minority today with limited models. Logical or not. The only sports car in the world that can really get away with a IBC V8 is the Vette. But you should already know that. It is not likely that Vette engineers could make a proper DOHC engine. The fact is they would not do it unless it was as powerful or more powerful. Again offering it only give the Vette more options and the ability to attract new buyers. As you can see by last years sales they can never turn away any buyers as their sales ebb and flow. I can also see you have no real concept about companies like Ferrari. They are nothing but Heritage. While they do change the names of the cars they are generally upgrades of the model it is replacing no different than Chevy does with the C4-C5-C6. They are not also affraid to mess with some of the sacred things in the name of performance and image. Things like the gated shifters are going away for more advanced systems. Either way we are just going to have to agree to disagree. If they should ever choose what to do the DHOC sales will prove who is right here. The questions that needs answered is if your view is so right why is it only Chevy really has chosen this path. Nearly all other companies have gone the other route with out even offering IBC. Why are they all so wrong and you are so right? ~ Autoblog We all know this to be true here. Now convince the general public!

The whole Ecoboost deal is making for a lot of money and have people buying their cars in some cases just because of the engine. I really am not a AWD fan but I see it as an option at some point again it has it's fans and will attract buyers. I would really like to see the car get a little smaller and lighter. This would add performance an engine could not add. Imagine a 2900-3000 pound car. This would enhance handling to greater levels and improve braking to a retina detaching level. The new Mclaren is I believe at 2800 pounds and does some great things.

The small block provided enough power in the 60's to do what nearly all Impala owners ever needed to do. Unless they were towing a big trailer or were running a special weight class in drag racing the engine was more a novalty than anything else. Don't make it anymore than it was. The DOHC engine in a Vette would provide a powerplant that would interst many who could care less now about the pushrod engine. As hard as it may be for some to beleive there are many who hate that engine as much as some hate DOHC here. You may call them snobs but if they have money they are potential customers. I don't care how they feel or if they are right or wrong but giving them an option is just good business. I agree that keepimg the Vettes weight down is commendable. I still would like to see them lose some more weight and a little of the bulk of the car. I would love to see if more as a true sports cars and a little less a GT type car. Ferrari has no issue, Jaguar has no issue BMW has no issue, Aston has no issue Mclaren has no issue in dealing with the power, weight or handling. I don't see that an issue with the Vette as long as the powertrain was intergrated into the design of the car. I Know GM is smart enough to be able to figure it out. "De-tuning the power with a heavier engine & worse handling is NOT going to raise the appeal ante'" Where do you really get this stuff? I Know you are smarter than this. The fact is the Vette lead engineer has made it clear that they would do nothing to the Vette unless it made it a better car. If they did do a DOHC you can rest assured it would out perform the present car and perform better and no less than the Pushrod engine. Give them a little credit they are not that stupid. The Vette is in good hands with Tadge Juechter and he will accept nothing but the best for the car by taking no steps backwards. If they do go with a DHOC it will not be ill handling nor slower. They have not let us done before. Hell where were you when they added the weight to the ZR1 with the supercharger. With your way of thinking that should have made the car damn impossible to drive with all the added nose weight. I never heard you complain then. Lets face it you appear as a Pushrod snob as much as some are DOHC snobs. They are both wonderful engines and the fact is there is room for both. Funny how so many condemed for for putting the Ecoboot in the F150. They look like geniuses now with sale climbing and taking near half the sales with a $795 premium on them over the V8. I think if you can get diehard V8 truck people to buy a TT DHOC V6 F 150 A DHOC TT V8 Vette should not be a hard sell. Like it or not the buyers are there and their money is as green as anyone elses.

I got to spend some time in the 5 door and 4 door last Feb. They look better in person and loads better than the Aveo. The interior is interesting with the Motorcycle like dash. Fit and finish on the preproduction car was good but the materials felt cheap in the door panels etc, but everything in this class feels cheap for the most part. The doors shut and sounded better than most Kia's. I am glad to see they like how it drives as I got to play with the car but not drive it myself I was wondering how it drove. It sounds as if they gave it enough turn in and handling to make it fun but not enough to lose a kidney. The press gushed over the Cruze too but many 6 month later are not gushing as much. This is a trait with the press on GM for year. I hope this car can break this trend and they are still looking favorable at it by the time it comes to market. In this class the hatch has the usefulness down but Americans like trunks always have always will. I still think in a car this small the hatch will not be that far behind the sedan in sales. Small hatches are generally better accepted as often it is the only way you can haul anything in these small cars.

The fact is 95% of the owners of the older Impala never needed the BBC. It was more marketing and Image much as the DOHC is today. How much torque did an Impala owner really need? The cars were not racy light nor all that sporting as the smaller cars could be. But it gave the family guy a car with the SS cool factor all the same. Second you underestimate the modern DOHC engines with VVT today. The Solstice with the GMPD upgrade will do 340 FT-LBS all day with only 2.0 liters. It will hit max torque at 2000 RPM and keep it to over 5000 RPM. There is no down side. Others like the Italia and MP4C have DOHC and have no issues with weight, balance and handling so why would the Vette if engineered to take advantgage of said plant. I fully expect the C7 and C8 to lose weight only helping the full spectrum of performance in acceleration, braking and handling. BBC in a smaller Camaro and Nova a very real tangible. BBC in a Impala - Semantics. DOHC VS IBC Marketing to a new group of buyers that would not consider the IBC. They are out there and they are growing. Younger people today do not hold to the old ways logical or not. Hell many would rather have a Turbo 4 today vs a V8. Blasphemy it may be but it is what it is. In fact just the Turbo factor is not lost on the younger demographic. They love this kind of stuff and will pay more for it if done right.

Sports cars in general are not recession proof no matter what engine. These are cars for expendable money and that is something many are short on today. The one thing that hurts the Vette more than anything else is some of the quality related issues and the service at many dealers. I have seen many electrical and other similar issues where they will get bugs even a good service department could not fix as it was a design flaw. My locl dealer told me of a Disc changer issues he had to tell the guy they could not fix as it was a GM software issue that they did not expect to get addressed. He said try telling that to a guy who just paid $65,000 The other is poor serice departments that are just providing poor service. A good example is the Turbo Upgrade for my HHR SS had a few issues from GM. This kit while not overly difficult to install it needs to have connectors crimped with the right Kent Moore tools. Many dealers are not doing it correctly and many owners are having drivability issues. Also the T map needs to be clearanced with the AC compressor. I was the one who figured this one out and shared it with GMPD as the engine would torque back and hit the Compressor and short out the sensor. Now they at telling the dealers how to fix it. My dealer is one of the best Chevy dealers around and I was lucky to have them. I see so many other dealers with such poor service it is amazing anyone buys cars from them. I know with the SS many have stated they will not buy Chevy again based on their service experience. I could see the same happening with the present Vette as even more money is at stake for the owner. I tell many SS owners with Upgrade issues to seek a different dealer to get this fix and often it does resolve the issues on the first trip to the new dealer. I can only imagine the feelings of people paying an average of $75,000 and getting similar service. I do not see the LS engine hurting sales but I do see I do see the new engine adding sales that would never have come in. The car can live with out it but it could do even better with it. That is why this is such a no brainer and a case where if the engine is shared with Cadillac it has nothing to lose. Many cried how the new Harley messed with tradition but now that it was here it complimented the line and brought in buyers who never would have bought in the Harly line before. Even Chevy in the past. In cars like the Impala the BBC was not really needed but it did compliment the line and provide buyers with an option. The fact is someone wanting a big engine would have gone to Ford or Chrysler if they could not get the BBC in the Chevy.

No one said it would not work. The real question is how much more expensive is it. GM and Chrysler have not rushed to it. It may have been the lack of money or what. It for the most is the out growth of the duel cam in block GM looked at and passed on. It is coming and it will be interesting to see what it will do for the Chevy V8. It will be interesting to see what the cost is as it will also add to the cost to build it. But for what they gain it will be worth it.

The XLR was more a sporty luxury car vs a real sports car. The real issue was the XLR was not really a very good car for the money. Too little performance to be a true sports car. I would think the Vette team would have a totally different take on the high tech car vs what Cadillac offered.

I know it has been a part of the Viper but it is in so few numbers I really don't count it yet. The Chevy will be in the trucks as well as the Vette and any other GM V8 application. This I consider the first real world use of it. TYhat is if GM does go forward with this as I think they might.

As of right now the cam phasing in a DOHC is much more advanced than the CIB right now. Add to it the DI system helps a lot too. Once they do the cam in cam phasing in the new Chevy it could be on the same ground. But we have yet to see it yet. Right now with 4 cams and VVT you can do a lot of things in controling the engine. Also we have to see how they do the combustion chambers to get better flow and burn. They have improved but when you have 4 valves around the spark plug it make it hard to beat. The bottom line is simple there is no reason not to have and offer both engines. Why totally abandon a market people want? I find it odd how some cry for wagons and manual trannys that take up less than 10% of the market but then get upset with the though of offering an engine that takes up 90% of the market. As for the new sports cars with all the electronic controls. This is something that will not go away. The younger generations like this and they do give many cars the ability to be driven to levels few drivers could. I just hope that most keep in mind we like to shut this stuff off and keep that an option in all these cars. The fact remains many coming up grew on with Grand Turismo and like this kid of car. Times change and markets change. Those who keep up live those who done fade away like many others. The Vette deal is like Harly Davidson. The Vette is as much an American Icon that it will sell even if it is a crap car. The crap interior is like the oil leak on a Harley just something to expect. Harley has stepped it up by getting updated with more modern bikes and engines while still offering some old school things. It has helped them and many others have tried to copy what they are doing. In todays market you must make an appeal to as many peopla as possible as the fortunes of a model can change fast. Few cars have loyal followings anymore as people are always looking for the next trend and options.

The 6.2L AMG costs a cool $40,000 while the LS7 costs around $15,000, both produce similar numbers, with the LS7 certainly to give better fuel economy. Is it the price to pay for perception? May be GM should start marketing LS engines as most advanced engines in the world and go head on against AMG and M engines, then people will perceive differently. In one thread there was a need to lower cost of Corvette, now there is a desire for having expensive engine in it. Does not work both ways. But what you overlook is many people will pay the $40,000 more because of what it is as much as what it can do. Like I said Marketing is a big key issue. Just the same with a strip down Vette Vs loades. Most people want all the toys while a hand full of guys want a stripper. The LS7 numbers mean little to the many who what the more advanced or complicated engines. The fact remains that if there were no value or money being made on DOHC engine they would not exist. Like the Prius many buy it for the tech factor as much as any kind of fuel savings.

Actually, I don't see anyone complaining about the CTS-V engines. Not the American journalists, not even the European ones. It is not that people complain so much but how many pass it over for the more technical hardware? Preception is one of the largest factors in marketing. There is no logic to it and never will be but that is a large part of image and sales in these higher priced models. It may be the brag factor at the golf course. Buyers of these cars seldom do any modifications on their cars either a tuner does it or it remains stock. Theses guys are not Mustang guys or Camaro guys who will do their own work. So often what buy is what they get. Example Benz may be offering a special edition engine from AMG that was done just for the model where as Cadillac offers an engine that is pimarily used in a truck. To you or I we understand and know that there is nothing wrong with that, infact we being GM fans we can overlook this very easily. But on the other hand to win a guy away from another brand who really has no love for GM but does like the styling on the new CTS coupe you need to offer what he wants logical or now. If he is willing to pay for it you need to offer it. Like I stated Marketing is a big part of this. Preceved value for what you pay also is a big part of the deal. The more complicated or advance the more precieved value. Case in point. I had a Ford engineer in collage who came in and had a very frank presentation on customer. He covered topics like idiot proofing a car not fool poofing etc. One point he said many people would look at the orange peel on a Benz years ago and said many people felt it was there because Benz used more paint on their cars. He said it was an odd case where a flaw in the car was naturally look upon as a benefit. He said it was sad that people back then had no idea that the poor pain was really not the best paint job. Like he stated then that preception is a big part of selling cars. Most times a understood advancement is what does it other times it is a misunderstood concept. Also as time goes on the pushrod engines will get more expensive too. They will always have a size and weight advantage but the aditition of DI and VVT will add to their cost. They will make a lot of gains with these two items so it will be well worth the investment.

DOHC heads have better valve placment and plug location to take advantage of better burn. This is step one for better emissions. CIB have improved their heads too but it is hard to get the same flow and central spark plug location. The company I work for has two head companied and they both have engineered better CIB heads but they have limits on location and also on size of valves. As Olds has pointed out VVT or even cam phasing like they used to do would help improved efficency of the engine and emissions. Smaller engines making a lot of power often make less emissions. Finally DI is the real gain. It will be interesting to see what effect it will have on the new Chevy engine as will the VVT. It should help them make a smaller engine and not lose power. Finally marketing is a real big issue too. People want techinolgy and if that is what they want you need to give it to them. Henry Ford may have had the right idea on making all Model T's black but people wanted other colors they also wanted an affordable 6 cylinder, Chevy gave them that and took the lead in the market for years. Henry used logic to sell cars when people wanted something else. The bottom line is a good company will give the people what they want and not force their will on them. If not they will go else where. This is where the DOHC and CIB engines both being offered is a good idea. let the people choose if they are willing to pay the extra hell take their money. You really underestimate what these people will want and do. No matter how logical your argument the fact is people are wanting and buying these engines. The companies all have found the investment in these engines has also paid off. In many cases they can charge more money and for the most make more profit. It is not like they are giving these away. When the dust settles I see no problem keeping the regular engine around but I can see no reason GM should not have a top class DOHC to offer in Cadilacs and as an option in the Vette. While the Chevy engine is a good engine it is a markting nightmare in the Cadillac vs the other cars in its class. You know and I know that it is a fine engne as shown by the CTSV. But in the unwashed market of luxury cars people want the latest and most trick toys and will pay much more for them. Too many just see the Chevy engine as a pick up engine. Yes they underestimate it but too often to the point they don't even consider a GM car because of it.