hyperv6

So say you. Many here are too close to the auto industry to really see what the unwash massed believe. We know the truth on many things but these idiots Hemm Customers pay more for thinks like E3 plugs and other things that cost more and do nothing. Many here predicted failure of the sale of the Ecoboost DOHC V6 Turbo, a very unpickup like engine. Today people taking them as soon as the dealer gets one and paying not only a grand more than thre V8 but also near or full sticker. Chevy would be doing good if they could move 20% of their trucks with a V6 let alone near 50%. Never underestimate what the public will demand or think is best. As long as you offer a Chevy engine in a Cadillac it is just another GM engine. I am not sure how they will do it but they really need their own power plant that only they will have. It should not be found in a Camaro or a pick up. While the Nstar was not a perfect engine it did a lot for Cadillacs image vs the 307 Olds or the 4.9 boat anchor. GM needs to sell Cadillacs to people who don't care about GM now and really never would want a Chevy.

BM and BMW have never really been as good as many give credit to for Quality, God know I have had to fix some really f'd up stuff on both. Cadillac on the other hand was much worse and today are as good or better. They even show it in the ratings. the real issue is precieved quality. It is like Toyota for years people give them ore credit thant they should have gotten. In this case Cadillac does not get enough credit. With products it is not so much how good you are but how good people think you are.

Slam the rear door on a Optima. It is the worst sound in the industry this side of Lada.

They killed it in or around 08/ It had a lot to do with the health of the company and also the volume. This is why many here think this relationship with BMW may produce an engine to Cadillacs spec but be produced with engineering from BMW and GM. Besides a little BMW DNA in a Caddy may change some minds of those who only blindly think German. It is a Cost, Volume and Marketing idea we have that would not hurt Cadillac and may just give them the engine they need to put space between Chevy and themselves in the eye of the consumer. Besides BMW can not afford the big programs like the Volt technology and getting GM to share it would help both companies. It would offset the cost of what GM spent and save BMW the development cost they can not afford on their own. The key is where to draw the line that both companies protect themselves in the deal.

The Regal turbo for some here come across as if it is some kind of a performance car which I don't understand. It is a sporty sedan but it is not a sports sedan and has never claimed to be. Just because a car has a turbo no longer means it is a sport sedan or performance car. The fact is the Regal is a bridge to where GM is going and not the destination. THey needed something quick to market and they got it. We will see this car move and evolve into a much better car in the future. As for the Sonata. It will be like many other Asian cars here in the midwest when it is 10 years old, Rare. You pay less because this car is all upfront. In time it will rust and fail like they did in the past. Hyundai is playing the middle between quaility/refinement and cost. These cars will not last for ever mechanically like a Cobalt or Beretta. GM trumed the mechanical end and always short cutted the interior and trim. GM car may not look pretty but they keep on running like the ever ready bunny.

Just don't see em in this shape anymore. I remember a customers car I used to work on. He has a 62 Sedan Deville maroon with a white top with less than 10.000 miles. The interior was sill sealed in that 1960 plastic and looked better than new.

A Mini/HHR car would be FWD. I also don't see a small 2 seater out of this at least right now. with the economy in the tank GM could be better served on higher volume cars that will make more money xs a low profit low volume car. I would love to see them get creative witht e Alpha and see what they could build on it that would be new to the market.

This car needs to improve all areas of the 2nd gen CTS if Cadillac will ever get to where they need to be. The CTS is wonderful but it is also a few years old while the others are movin ahead in all areas not just the cabin.

I have not heard anything solid on Camaro but I do get big smiles from people who do know.

You think?

I love all the people that are expecting a small CTS here. I think when it comes out they will be shocked how much more than just a small CTS this car will be. Cadillac is moving up and the CTS was only the first step and the ATS is only the second. We will see some changes at Cadillac in the coming years many never expected. It Expect it may become the car it should be. Ruess and Lutz now have the money to do what is needed not just what they can afford. I suspect the BMW thing may be the key to the engine program they have needed to put some space between them and Chevy.

BMW like many companies are buying major parts from suppliers anymore and in some cases always have. The development to do all these parts are too expensive and they can get an outside company to do it cheaper and as well. BMW is no where near the size of VW, Ford or GM and it has to trim the cost where they can. This is why many in the industry expect BMW to work with someone in the future to keep independent. Development cost have gotten so out of hand it has even driven the big players like Ford and GM to share in transaxle development. Getrag first were used in GM cars in the 80's. It was their 5 speed design but GM built it in Indiana. The 5 speed Fiero's came with Getrag designed boxes in the V6 cars and GM advertised it a lot back then.

Or transaxles... FWD transaxles. Benz did just anounce a new FWD roadster. You may have a real good point.

Yep lots of padding on this one. The new graphics also do a great job of messing with the eye.

I have long considered BMW as a supplier of an engine. This is something they have done for others. BMW would not just hand them a M series engine off the shelf but I would see something either based on a BMW produstion block built to Cadillac specs or even an engine produced for Cadillac in low volumes that is of it's own design. The Mclaren F1 used this system of BMW engine tech and Mclaren tuning to make a very capable engine that BMW never used themselves in identical form. I think even if it was only a optional engine that was used in only a few models at Cadillac it would help advance Cadillas away from Chevy and give them more autonomy to be their own brand. I think with their engineering and GM engineering working together to let BMW build in the proper volumes for Cadillac is a good combo. Remember Mark said Cadillac is not all big V8 engines and Supercharger anymore. Could this be a Small V8 or even a 6 cylinder? Or could it be an option on a V12 for the Omega? Time may show us some new interesting stuff. GM has a long history with BMW, Lotus and Porsche. Few people really understand what all engineering they have shared. One few know about is Porsche did the tuning on the GM designed 1988 Fiero suspension. They tuned the front suspension for better feel and turn in. Many claimed Lotus did it but that was false. Even Zora Duntov drove for Porsche racing while working for GM.

The torque curve is more of a plateau. The Turbo VVT DI engines hit max torque low and generally hold it through most of the range. To anyone who has not driven one of these engines it will suprise them. This is not a performance engine but still has good power and torque. Boost comes in early and fast so there is little lag. It will be interesting to see if GM Performance Division will make a Turbo Upgrade like they did for the 2.0. Gains of 55 HP in the Auto HHR SS and in the case of the 5 speed Kappa 70 FT LBS were added with only two 3 bar map sensors and a computer flash. Mods will be easy but they need to be well sorted as if the tuner misses the mark damage can and will happen. What has been given so far is just a basic package with the 1.4 and I suspect better versions are to come that will better take mods to advance power.

Could this be where mark is going to get a Cadillac engine? GM could source some BMW engines built to their spec? Mclaren and others have done already with great results. GM and BMW have had on going projects in the past that have helped each. The 6 speed auto the most well known. Shareing this technology both ways could help both. Also BMW has been outlined before as needing a dance partner to absorb development cost. They are not as large as many think and do need help with rising cost of development of parts be it a supplier or another MFG. They above all want to retain their autonomy. Note I would not expect any engines to be direct trades from a BMW engine by to a GM bay. I am not a BMW fan but if it would help put engine in a Cadillac not shared with any other GM division lets do it. That is as long as it is a very well advanced, refined quality engine. Also sharing the Volt technology will help recoupe the cost faster and help accelerate development for better range and lower future cost.

The CTSV Does that now and you you see all them people flocking to Cadillac to make thme #1 don't you? GM has the results and from what I see styling all going in the tight direction but they lack leading technology. It is like the AMG and M series cars you see Clarkson pointing out the crazy stupid bottons on the steering wheel to all sorts of thing to get the stig around the track. Many here underestimate people in this class. While they may not be able to point out the exact location of a part on the engine they can still tell you all the electronic aids they have to put the power to the ground. Their hands may not be dirty but they do read up on what they buy. The Fact is Cadillac still has more work to do. If they plan to do a Flagship they really have a lot of work to do. I get the feeling we will see a influx of technology soon that many here just don't expect in a GM product. Marks words are telling and GM now has the money to compete. Lets face it the CTS was done when they had to make do with what they had. They did a good job but it was not enough yet. More HP is not the answer. It takes Styling, Quality, Performance, and Technology in this class. Each have to come in excess as that is what all these cars in this class are about. Many owners understand each while others don/t but they all know they have the best when they buy it. Even in this day and age Results msy not even be enough for even just a Chevy. Marketing sells and the guy who can convince he has the best and most wins. Like stated many may not know what they have and I know most never drive or use the technology they own but the fact they have it feeds the ego. Cadillac has a lot going for it but it still has not gained that factor for many that says hey I drive a Cadillac.

See they are not tageting people like you that think a Swisher Sweet is the best damn Cigar. Cadillac is looking to target the La Gloira Cigar lovers. Yes they are both Cigar and they both burn the same but a Cuban is somthing people consider special and make folks willing to pay up to $20 each for them. Cadillac needs the Delight factor as Bob Lutz puts it. When products are done correctly they bring great delight or pleasure. Cadillac needs to build cars people love and find great delight in. Delight is that cool factor and that thing about a car that projects it's image onto its owner. You will find most buyers of BMW and Benz do so because of the image the car projects and how it makes the owner look or feel. Few ever drive at a track or in triple digits and ever test the cars performance. Just knowing they can is all they care about. A guy can get by just as well with a 2011 Impala but it just dose not fill his ego with delight nor does it wow the guys at the country club. Buyers in this class want the best technology, the best performance and the best luxury. Quality is not as much of a issue here as witnessed the lack of it with major brands over the last few years. Like Bob said the more delight they find the more it make those little Squeaks and rattles vanish. How do you think cars like this get great owners ratings but often have many mechanical issues. Think of it this way. A convertible normally makes for a very poor car. It lack support, leaks, creaks, rattles and has issues that a normal coupe never has. But the owner loves it so much when he puts the top down that all those issues are worth the extra trouble. I think Bob knows what he is talking about. Any guy who can sell a premium 2 seat car with a folding top, no roll up windows and no outside door handles and little trunk understands customers wants in a premium car. Just try to sell a Sonic with no door handles a leaking roof and a hot cockpit. Cars are all about wants and needs. Chevys are for needs when Cadillac is all about wants and excess. While the present CTSV is a really cool car it still lacks things as if it had what it needed people want they would not be buying other cars. GM and Cadillac are not going to slay Benz and BMW with the ATS or the next CTS or even the Omega. But the goal of each of these models is to take more customers with each line and each generations. We have heard the saying death by a 1,000 paper cuts well that is what we are looking at here. BMW and Benz did not take Cadillac over night or with just one model to think GM would would be foolish. It is like the old pushrod DOHC argument. Yes the pushrod is great but it just does not have the same image or technical image many in this class look for. The same could have been said for the Cadillac V16. Yes the V8 was all it ever needed, It has less parts and is cheaper to build. But what car did someone buy when they wanted to make a statment about who they are and what power they held? I just wish GM could do an engine for Cadillac that it did not have to share. I know the cost is a factor but it could really boost their image with something really advanced and special. To beat the others GM needs to best them in technology and image. These new models will grow the image.

The Sonic is aimed more at the people that used to buy Cobalts because they were cheap. The Aveos were for people who could not afford a good used cars. Chevy has moved the Cruze up and has aimed for a higher level of buyer. They want older people and families to look at the Cruze. Note many say the Cruze was the first compact car targeted at older adults. GM had moved the targets for these cars and aimed higher. The Aveo buyers are now going to be targeted by the Spark. The Feel in a Sonic is better than a Aveo and it look better but it still feels like a low cost sub compact car. A higher quality sub compact but still a sub compact. The Cruze now feels more like a Malibu and a little more solid than any Cobalt ever did. In either case these cars are not fully directed at all the same people of the cars they replaced. I also see a change coming with the New Malibu and New Impala as the market has been changing and for once GM looks to change with it and not play catch up.

While I agree with you that it'd make sense for all of those things to bring down the numbers, the Malibu with a non-direct injected 2.4 gets 22/33, and weighs over 3400 lbs. The Verano will have a DI 2.4 (which as I understand improves fuel economy and power slightly while reducing emissions), and weighs less at 3300lbs, so the numbers are perplexing. Gearing for imporved performance. Our Silverodo here MPG sucks because of the gearing in it.

The Sonic will attract the younger buyer while the Cruze will have wider appeal. The Sonic is for the most the new Cobalt. I expect they will low ball the prices on the Sonic like they did with the Cobalts to get the collage market and first time buyers. Or even target those who want a cheaper second car. I am sure it will take a few sales but they are two different cars. Sitting in a Sonic is not like sitting in a Cruze. The Dash and overall feel of the car is different not bad just different.

The new Variable Valve Timing will address this in the new engine. It is the VVT more than the Turbo that does this.

You are not the kind of person GM needs to convince Cadillac is worthy of the price. You like many of us are ok with the CTS V as it is. The fact is many people not GM fans don't feel the engine as powerful as it is lives up the their standards. To gain non GM buyers GM must give these buyers what they expect in a car and more. The only way for Cadillac to grow is to take buyers from Benz, BMW, Jag and any other luxury car maker. What Cadillac has offered already was not enough so they need to ante up the stakes.

Bigger engine, more power, more options, more quiet = Less miles. With the way GM is doing the hybrid thing they may do with it like the Lacrosse and add a high mileage version too. Keep in mind of all the Eco based cars GM has now you will find the MPG's are more than listed by GM. I have found they all get 2-5 MPG better in normal driving. My HHR was listed 19 MPG city and I have never goteen worse than 22 City driving it like I stole it. I have a couple of friends with a new Cruze and both better the MPG 2-4 MPG that was listed. I have seen this on other GM eco powered cars too. I don't know if it is GM that is doing this or if it is just the way the goverments new way of figuring it is doing this. I am sure if you drive in some kind of way it may be worst case but even with my hard driving I still better their numbers as do many others.