hyperv6

Chevy is doing this as it helps Chevy better address past Pontiac owners with the only Pontiac that was worth continuing. The Charger to a degree and the lack of RWD at Ford also are factors. Plus you need to factor in the Mark R love factor as well as the need to keep the plant busy down under. I will have to see the face of the car and what they do to it. Also price. There is a red G8 GT I see daily that I wish I had so I have to say I have an interest but by the time I buy again It depends on what is out. I could go for an ATS Turbo just as easy for the same price. I do not live by cylinder count anymore I live by performance results. Also MPG could be a factor if gas stays up. I would be more interested in a Ute if it comes.

As long as Gm keeps this car profitable and this platform profitable that is the whole point. There is little chance in this market that a large RWD V8 sedan will ever sell 100 units. It is not the only platform of choice anymore nor is the car priced a the average price of a new car anylonger. The only way they could meet those numbers are with fleet sales like the Crown Vic but this is not that kind of car. The reason GM needs cars like the Camaro to sell in greater numbers here is because it is not shared anywhere else. This will change soon as it will be sold elsewhere in the future just as the new Mustang will. The is a price we pay with global cars where we have to have them meet some odd regs we may not like but on the plus side it gives us a shot at cars like this that would never be built and sold here because it would be diffcult to sell them in the numbers our market would take and make a profit. I would say there are BMW and Benz that would not be around today if they had to just rely on the Euro market. The US and Asian markets make them profitable as they keep the volume in hand. Market watchers may squawk about production numbers but most in the general public never know what the real numbers were unless they get posted somewhere. I had to go throrgh a Chevy marketing manager to prove to the HHR people there were more SS than they thought because the numbers were never posted anywhere.

I know they won't do it but it would be cool to see them put Chevy badged on the cars at the race in TX. It would make it a Ford vs Chevy battle here and even the folks down under would not be offended. God knows we ship enough Chevy items there daily at work. You would be suprised how many Camaro's they have there.

You really are out of the loop here. This is a V8 only sports sedan and it will be low volume. It may start i the mid 30K range but it will reach into the $40K range. This car is not an ATS as the ATS will offer things this car will never have. For one thing it will never touch the ATS 3200 pounds. The SS will appeal to the meat and potato American more than the BMW freak. This car as long as it is in small volume will do fine. The G8 still trades at a good price as there is a small market for a car like this. As long as no one expects it to be a volume car like the Caprice of old it will do fine. There is room here for this car and the V6 version. There are those who want FWD and those who want RWD. With this car being a global car GM can afford the small volumes in this market. The only reason Holden failed here is Pontiac. The dealer priced the GTO into oblivion and the G8 For the most failed in the end because Pontiac died. Opel failed here in RWD form because it was not a good choice for Cadillac and few people knew Saturn even sold a version.

While SS seems short it makes little difference. This is the Flag Ship for the Chevy passenger line and will represent the top of all the SS vehicles. To be honest if they are like many SS owner they take hte badges off anyways. The hot topic with many is how to debadge them anyways. I left mine on as I paid for it and I am damn well going to show it LOL! There is another name lurking out htere as a V6 sedan and wagon will not be Super Sport. It will be interesting to see what they do there. We already have a good idea what the Ute will be. You know with their how they are naming things it will be called a Sprint. [Just Kidding] As far as I am concerned they could have called the the Mud Flap GT as long as they bring it on. As for the nose I expect it will be similar to Chris Doane's illistration. It fits what has been said and the grill has a Impala tone to it. They have cut back on the silly fender flairs on the car as I had hope per what has been stated so far and Chris's drawing represents that. For the most it looks like a cleaned up Holden. I too would like to see it spelled out ala 1966.

There are many people that would be happy with a RWD sedan V6 with 323 HP. Not all the Dodges are V8 as they sell a hell of a lot of V6 cars. Also not everyone will be ready to pony up $40,000 for a SS sedan no matter how many like it. The V6 is added sales and added production for Holden as they are not selling as many as they used to. It would help them if they keep production there. I also see the positive motorsports connection here as this car will be the racing choice in to different markets. Chevy and Holden could market them together as the Austrailian sedan series is becoming very popular here. While they are more stock than NASCAR they still are far from stock but it would help make a nice connection to the street car. The thing with this car is they can't hide it much longer as they need to get it on the track to test. Once it is on the track we will get a good idea of the basics even in primer. I just hope they fix the grill and get away from the small Aveo like grill of the Caprice. It is not bad but it is far from agressive for a car that will wear an SS badge.

They will have a name as they are looking into doing a wagon, V6 sedan and an outside chance at a Ute. You can't call all of them a SS performance sedan. Al Oppenhieser said they had a name almost two years ago picked out and he liked it. Lets just let them get this deal closer and they will anounce and show you what it will be. SS will be in the name but you will get another well known name to go with it. The question is just which one. What I wonder is will they export this for a year and then move to the old Camaro line. I am watching to see where the Camaro Alpha will be built and that may be our next clue. If Chevy plans on a larger volume V6 model I wonder if they would move this car to Canada and only import the low volume Wagon and Ute after 2015. Not sure on this but it might prove to be worth watching. They may be doing a Regal kind of intro so there is no down time between models. The Regal did the Euro to Canaa move in the second year and added more options.

No matter what we like here Kia and Hyundai are a growing force that even Honda and Toyota have shown fear to. They are giving more stylish cars with ok quailty at a cheaper price. That is what Chevy needs to do with better quality and they are working toward that. The issue Chevy has is the problem with precieved quality. Chevy can put out a better car and for the most does but many people will reject it because the precieve it and not as good as the other. This trust needs to be re earned with time and better cars. you can't buy this and you can't market it as this is something the people have to find for themselves. Great of better styling is the frosting that helps sell the cake and GM is now using this to get people to give them a chance. Why most have forgotten how bad Hyundai was in the past they are willing accept the good quality now for a lower payment. THey have used styling to draw attention to their line. Odd cars like the Soul and Veloster are not styling stand outs but many people just flock to them because they are different. While may want to credit retro for the HHR and PT just being different also played a major roll. The key in being different is not to play it too far like the Aztek. Different cute sells like in the mini and other cars. Different ugly is a hard sell no matter what.

Now for all those who have said they want a perfomance Nox the Trax is the better option. The Nox is just too heavy for any real performance to be worth while and still get MPG. The Trax is lighter smaller and a 2.0 Turbo with a tuned suspension would be interesting. Some how I feel this deal is a major over reaction here for now. The Nox and Terrain will need to be changed in the next couple years and I suspect from what we have hard the Nox will shrink and I am betting we will see another small SUV to take the place of the present Nox and a Trax in the use market. The key here is what we do not know as there is more going on than is shown here. We have so many new models coming that we have no clue about since GM seldom speaks of any new product till it is well along anymore. Lets face it we are about a year and a half from a new Alpha Camaro and as of now we know so little. The 5 gen we knew pretty much what to expect 5-6 years out.

As for the Taurus I was never a fan. It was a step up from the 500 but that is not saying much. I also note the interior feels so cramped in the front seat. The console makes you feel crowded as does the dash. The Fusion if priced right will do great and will rob many Taurus sales. GM will hit Ford in the gut with the new RWD Chevy if they move to a full line up. Ford really has nothing planned to counter it.

I agree Hyundai is a package. Precieved Value and Precieved Quality are two parts. The third part is styling. Lets face it most Hyundai owners are people who have been buying Toyota and Honda and do not want to consider an American car. They see the Hyundai line and while to us here the styling is oh hum to a Accord owner it is like a Da Vinci. Thank God many are now giving the American cars a chance now and we are seeing more migration back but they will have to work to keep them with quality and price as these people are not blind loyal to GM and will be unforgiving if they feel slighted. The fact is most Asian car styling sucks and the Hyundai offers there most stylish they have. God know the new Camry and Accord have entered the Aztek Zone.

The one thing we need to keep in mind here is styling is subjective. While the Current CTS appeal to you and I it is still a turn off for many, Also I and many others love the Sixteen. But even with a shorter hood it wouild still be fine in my veiw. As for the Impala I love it and I think the market will scoope them up in great numbers. But the market loves many of the Hyundai models and to me I just never connected there. I will admit they are more stylish than a Honda and Toyota but I just was never inot that type of styling. The Mrket is diverse today and a lot of people have a lot of different expectations. For better or worse I guess that is ok as it cuts a company slack if they miss on the styling. It seams like someone ends up buying no matter how good or bad. The Aztek proved that. For the most people want to stand out and be seen in a vehicle that has some appeal. Their wants and likes have changed too. As while many are not car enthusiast the retro look is lost on many of them too. I see that with my HHR. as half love it half hate it. The one odd thing is the SS styling, There is hardly a gas stop that I do not get told they love what I did to my SS. THen when I tell them I bought it that way I get the look of Chevy did that? Most really are not HHR fans but they are drawn to the SS because it is different. THen the shock comes in when they find the SS is more then body work and badges. The next question is Chevy makes that and then I tell them not anymore. I find it amazing what people want today in a vehicle. I used to find it odd with my 04 GTP on how many people came up and told me how much they liked it. The styling was ok but far from what I would call stunning. We did have the 5 spoke wheel options and that did fit the car better than the 10 spoke GTP wheels. I guess you just ever be sure what people will embrace today..

Let them compete. No matter how much GM tries to avoid, it cannot prevent that. Case in point, Lamda quadruplets. Look how much sales Chevy had compared to Acadia and Outlook, but it virtually kept itself away luxury-wise against Enclave. GM should have had the Chevy to leverage sales before the Saturn and GMC. Alas, Jill wanted Saturn to be "Upmarket" and volume maker. Kia and Hyundai compete also, yet together they are doing company good. 100,000 of one vehicle is worse than 75,000 and 45,000 of two vehicles, for a similar sized market. GM's strategy with Buick/Opel and GMC should be simple. Design as a Chevy platform, and then do the design magic on the mid-brands. Anything extra from those mid-brands will be gravy. As far as Caddy and Buick are concerned it should be converse, by charging more premium on Caddy for same platform vehicle, it forgoes volume but leaves huge margin for Buick to operate in. That is one slipperly slope. Going back to overlapping lines is like Lohan needed Rehab again. I expect t be some overlap yet but as time goes on and as Cadillac and Buick move up it will get to where they need to be. The only mistake here is this should have been a Chevy and not a Buick. It may have impacked the Nox a little but at lease it kept the custmer in house at Chevy,. Lord knows I see enough people on the Nox Forum complaining about MPG. I just do not understand what they do not understand about a two ton vehicle and the MPG. The Nox does well but if you hammer the 4 in it the MPG will drop. This vehicle should be lite enough to be able to be driven hard and still get good MPG.

I fully agree that the box is getting smaller and smaller to work in but there is no excuse for poor design anything this side of a car the size of a Sonic. Note there is no hope for the Spark size. The lack of risk and creativity is one of the major issues. Also the reality of the real world keep many cars from using some styling that just will not hold up long term. I think that GM has shown what they can do with the Impala. They have taken it from a dumpy little odd tail lighted car to the next gen that is what I would term stunning for a car today. While taste may differ there are still many cars today that display some nice lines. The only point I do disagree with is that a great looking car can not be created today with the lack of retro styling. I think The Cadillac Sixteen showed that and I fully expect that the new CTS and Flagship will reflect this same kind of thinking. While even the Ciel is not my cup of tea it was well recieved by many and shows the risk I feel a now refinaced Cadillac will take a chance on. We need to remember we really have not seen much of the new designs post Chapter 11 yet as cars like the XTC, Impala and Malibu were all pre Chapter 11 designs. While some details may have changed for the most these cars were shown to the press pre chapter 11 so we know that they were well along before the money arrived. By the way I removed the neg that someone posted. You should not be hit for just saying what you feel.

GM is in a fix here till they gain more room for Buick. Cadillac still needs to move up scale to give Buick more room to expand here and they will do so with each coming model like the new CTS and flagship. Once they move up it will give Buick room to become the American Lexus. There is no Buick in Europe so this would be an easy edition as Opel will also move upscale with Buick in time but they have no Cadillac at this time and will have the more upscale models once they do. The only thing that would make it worse here is is Pontiac and Olds were here and then they would be so layered up they would not have any room for original models. I do agree though after seeing the Buick in person this should be a Chevy. But as it is just because they say no here does not mean much. In time it just may find it's way here at some point. When we here these not here comments it often just mean not here now or it means we have plans in mind that you have not seen or heard about yet too. Best to let them play their cards out and see what happens. As far as I am concerned we have the Buick here so it will be a global car no matter how you put the emblem on.

Ch#$r%*et has lied before. What makes you think they didn't do it again? They told everyone that the Lumina replaced the Monte Carlo, just because the Lumina took over in NASCAR. Styling and evidence proves otherwise. According to the book _Chevrolet: The Complete History_ [copyright 1996 by Publications International LTD], on page 348: "With the new Lumina coupe and sedan effectively replacing their Celebrity counterparts...." And, on page 359: "Taking the place of the aging Celebrity sedan was the Lumina sedan ... a coupe version followed in the fall." Also, the Lumina shared types (Eurosport), dashboards (flat/horizontal), tail lights (3 square on each side, across the back panel, more or less) and FWD with the Celebrity.....NOTHING with the Monte Carlo (or Impala, for that matter). Cort | 38.m.IL | pigValve + paceMaker + cowValve | 5 MCs + 1 Caprice Classic CHD.MCs.CC + RoadTrips.hobbies.RadioShows.us66 = http://www.chevyasylum.com/cort "My depth perception must be off again" __ Saliva __ 'Rest In Pieces' Take some time to relax and get our of the house. You are just way too focused on this speck on the wall. They could call it a Corsa and if the car is right it would still sell. Seeing they are selling it as a Lumina overseas with no issue the name is not a problem as long as it is on the right car. [Not saying I would like the see the Lumina name again. I did not like it the first time] Like I said lets just see what they do and be glad we have a RWD V8 again.

While you may be ok witth A Da Vinci on black velvet or an Elvis Impersonator some of us expect companies to make better attempts to create new classics and not just spew out modern interpitations of a pass creation. Retro and historic cues are ok but don't abuse them. If you put the blinders on we will never discover the next great master piece. We always need to appreciate the past but we still need to strive to the future with new ideas. My issue with this is I do not see enough work or risk on creating a new classic. Companies are not pushing the envolpe like the likes of Earl and Mitchell as design just does not have the power it once held in most companies. Today they are just a department while in the past many people could name Earl but could not name who the President of GM was. Rita was great in her day but she had her time. We do not want to go there because we have already been there. We always need to remember and embrace our past but we need to continue to move forward and create new classics. Many hot rodders have created some nice cars based on todays cars using things MFG would never risk. Boyd/Foose, Steve Moal and others have shown oiginal design is still alive but most MFG's are not willing to take the chance.

The problem today is what I feel very good designers anymore with new original ideas. The stylist of today just put little emotion in their designs. To be the retro thing is a cop out to play with your emotions like the memory or a old girlfriend who was perfect 30 years ago in your mind. There are still some designs that do come through like the Bently Coupe and the Ferrari Italia. These cars are not only good looking but you kind of feel the design inside. Add to the lack of original thought today you also have to factor in other things to be fair. Many designers are restricted by managment that would like style a car by committee. You also have the companies who put aero above styling but to be fair even a well styled car can be made aero efficent as Ferrari has proven that with several of thier models. Today the lack of thought has created many cars with the same hallmarks. How many cars today have fender vents because someone else did it? How many companys have copied other cars with good or poor results. Even the new Ford Fusion has a Aston look to it. I also see where cars have to be practical to build and durable for the long term. I see this in my HHR. While it has a different body style that sets it appart it also suffers from issues with the design. If you do not have running boards the rear fender will be sand blasted in 2 years. The stone chips and bugs do not just hit the front of the car but the sides and top of the nose of the car. Some owners have come out and found where someone sits on the fender denting the hell out of it as the HHR fender is so thin compared to the fenders of old. Finally companies are often reluctant to take that risk on advanced different styling. They are affraid some designs can be polarizing and if the car fails it will cost a lot of money to fix and someones future. This leaves us with many playing it safe. The HHR is a good example of taking a risk on a polar design. In this case it paid off but with many other love it or hate it designs like the Cube only the sales in Japan saved it. There is no reason modern classics can not be achieved today if companies are willing to take the risk. Dynamic Proportions and lines can still be created if someone at GM or any other company is willing to step up. The sad fact is the best we see is only when they take the safe way out with the retro stuff that is getting a little long in the tooth now. We need designers that have more an eye for lines vs the Jetsons.

While the Blackhawk made a fine show car it would have a lot of issues in an every day world. Also the cost and weight of the body panels would be an issue. With big fenders like that someone would sit on one and they is no way they would be near as thick as the originals. Also stone chips on the rear fenders would be a mess. A really cool car not something I would want for everyday.

Nice car but would not traslate well onto a modern car. This styling needs a larger and I mean larger car and the aero of today would mute the best parts of this design. Also the fact they would not do hide away head lights today since they are heave had harder to keep in alingment today. The one thing I do fear is a wide waste line on a new Riv. Most of these cars had a thin coke bottle waste line. Today for crash standards the sides of the cars just get wider and wider. That would hurt a longer car that needs to flow like this one.

This is a time where like Lutz you need to think like a car guy. You play your best card and tat is what you do not just what people remember or might remember. Now keep in mind when I say use some highlights fromt he 63-65 I do not mean go full hog on retro here. To be honest GM needs to better than go retro here. I would like to see them use some highlights of the car or a full on modern with a little pontoon fender look. To be honest there are none of the past Rivs that would generate very good direct modern aero package. This car could use a little from several gens. The photo Camino posted and I have posted in the past of the small Buick from the GM lab uses a fender that represents the 63-65 and the rear roof line from a 71-73. The key here is to make a original car with only highlights from the past. While the 79-85 may have been popular then means little today in the big picture. As for people talking to you about the Olds. I get the same thing with my HHR SS and Fiero. Does that mean everyone wants one of those too? The fact is these are cars that look different and while they stand out that does not always translate into sales. The bottom line of what Buick needs to do is a great car with mostly original styling with only hints of the past. This should not be a car like a 5th gen Camaro where it points to one year. The car needs to look like a Buick and it needs good styling that identifies that but can stand on it's own. That is what help set the Riv appart. It did not follow trends it made them. So keep in mind when I say 63-65 I do not want to see a 2015 version of a 63-65 but I would like to see styling that makes that kind of statment or just juse a little of the styling say like from the front fender. To me the 63 set the standard for styling trend world wide. Many of the worlds best designers praised it in Europe and that is what I would like to see. There is always a risk in doing this but I think the GM staff is strong enough to do it again. The Lab car has enough old Buick in it to let you know it is a Buick but it is it's own design.

I don't think that car would make a good Riv but elements of it styling would play well on a larger RWD coupe.

Lets face it how many people are working on or saving any of these Rivs. While they were not bad they were just the best of the era. In the big picture they will never be remembered as well as the 63-65. The 63 was made a milestone car years ago by the Antique Auto Alub of America. This is not a title they share often. Like I said I would not want to get too retro here. I just would like to see a ground breaking design on par with the 63-65. Many of these older Rivs would not translate to todays aero requirements as well.

I had a felling things were not going good from things I was hearing. I was honored to get cused out by him once when the order for his cylinder heads were delayed. His temper was as spicy as his chili. My dad got to meet him at work in better conditions at Goodyear and my dad really did not know much about him but said he was a very good guy and straight shooter in their meeting. He will be missed. I was thinking when I learned of his recent illness how many of our great racers and owners are all getting to that age where we will not get to have them around much longer. Treasure the Jr Johnsons, Penskes and Jim Halls while you can.

I think this is just the start for all cars. I was reading how many auto makers that are now looking for ways to cut weight in cars. One way was to convert the audio and entertainment systems to phone based and pad based system. They are looking at mostly just giving you a sound system where your phone or pad would supply the music or video. With the onset of things like Pandora and most radio stations on the web I could see it being done at some point. Also I would save the companies money in vehicles they did not supply the smart phone with. Note Mylink and Intellink both are fully operational now just with a smart phone. I can even put my home Dish TV audio on my GMC radio and listen to any TV show on Dish Network. I also would not under estimate the love of pads by the old. In my wife job she deals with many seniors and they have taken to many of the pad systems out there, Even my DTS loving mother in law has taken to the pads now, While it may be true that many 70 and 80 year olds right now would be not as interested the people who are in their 60's or under worked with computers in their jobs and as the younger people get older in the next ten years more and more will take to theses systems. While some think the theft statment was funny I feel that is the biggest issue involved here. The automakers need to find a way to prevent the smash and grab thefts. I could see those becoming very common unless you can lock the pad to the cart in some way. Either way this kind of technology will become more and more common and accepted by more and more people. As fhe use of the I pad I think GM was smart to start with. I hate I pods and I tunes but the fact is Apple products are the most common and fastest selling in the world. I do see them making many of these system work with the other smart pads and phone like my Intellilink system in my GMC does. Most of this stuff is just bluetooth and they will adapt to most systems. Also note Mylink and Intellilink systems can be upgraded by the owners with new firmware and updates with from GM on the web. You can use a flash drive and or a lap top to down load these updates in just as you do with any of the smat items. GM plans to make it so you can update the system to new OS systems and also add new apts. The truth is the new smart phones and pads for the most are very easy to learn and getting eaiser as time goes on. It will be common for people of all ages to all have one or the other if not both with them where ever they go. We have yet to see what all they will do and it will shock many.