The O.C.

It's this f*cking website versus magazine thing...... You will NEVER replace the enjoyment I get in reading an actual magazine over the website anyday.......f*ck the internet (when it comes to car $h!.)

True....but wierd thing... On the C&D website, they rate the 0-60 on the standard 3.6L as 7.0 secs....(not that bad).....but in the recent C&D mag I just got, they have it at 6.4 secs.....which is awesome for the base 3.6L..... Why the discrepancy? Hmmm.....

I agree. The enthusiast in me says...."give me more horsepower"..... But the realist in me says, for example, the 2.0L L4 Turbo in the A4 I'm driving is MORE than enough performance (and economy) that I'll ever need.

True....but the G8 is a heavy piece....relatively speaking..... I know that from experience, the HF V6 is less-than-sparkling, performance-wise, in my 3800-lb CTS.......and I average 18mpg in mixed driving. In retrospect, I SHOULD have ordered a V-series.....because I don't think I would have gotten that much worse mileage.....and the car would have been way faster.....hence, if in the market for a G8, it's V8.....ALL the way.....

OK....back to RL.... Honda....get a CLUE...! Bring us a RWD, V8 powered premium sedan........and call it the Acura Legend...! NO one will think about G35 for much longer.....

If you want to get serious, one could argue the ES has a superior interior environment to ANY GM product....even the new CTS (and I'm not saying styling-wise....but fit-and-finish wise.) So...the true challenge is there.... How do you get a next-gen LaCrosse to a level that it matches the ES350.....when the General's top-of-the-line product (Cadillac CTS) barely matches the ES350 (Lexus' BOTTOM-of-the-line product?)

That's why I think....cost-be-damned....they should have done the Sixteen.....or something close to it......even style-wise without the big engine......but as usual, GM pussys out.... The obvious avenues to world-recognition and admiration are all but abandoned by this adrogenous band of Detroit executives that REFUSE to see the BIG picture......

I sat in the Vibe for awhile before the Pontiac people kicked me out at the L.A. auto show. Funny....because other manufacturers with WAY more significant intros, allowed us all over their cars (need I say this was PRESS days and the Pontiac people were being dicks....) That being said, the Vibe interior looked alot like the old one, style-wise, but did seem to be put together quite a bit better than the old one. I'd say go for one with the 2.4L.....it would probably be a pretty good runner!

Like NOS...... LOL

We forgot our cameras....and I'm not good with imageshack..... Here's an idea of what to expect..... http://carsandcoffee.info/main.html Cheerios, Chris

OUCH....! LOL So....Croc.....you haven't answered the question to this original thread.....yet.... (j/k....pickin' on you now....'cause I know you now....LOL)

It was a good time......!!!!! Thanks for making the trek down...... The show was incredible, as usual.....wish others could have made it....... Croc....it was great getting to meet you! You're not so bad as everyone makes you out to be....... (j/k) Actually, I really enjoyed spending time with you two.......

I got Smallville seasons 5 and 6....and let me tell you.....Aquaman and Green Arrow BOTH have it workin' WAY more than Welling.....and I'm a Tom Welling fan myself.....so you need to check out those later seasons. Lots more action too.....lots more of "Superman" coming out of him......

Well, maybe not exactly.....for the lack of torque, it had a solid 30 more horsepower than the original 5.0L TBI V8 that was introduced in the Caprice Classic (and acutally 5 more horsepower than the TBI 5.7L.) And I bet the SFI 4.3L V8 would have been a bit more fuel efficient than the 5.0L.....

Oooooo sorry.....didn't mean to snap your head off...... (actually I wasn't trying to snap your head off....lol)

That's what I'm trying to find out.....this wasn't the "spy information" section of MT, but in the new-car section. And the rags always get that info from new-car long-leads and press releases. So I'm betting it's accurate and GM had plans for it.....now if they actually carried through with production or not, I'm not sure......

No they do have a specific Saleen-only VIN.....

OK....so I'm flipping through some old C&D rags and in the 10-93 issue, highlighting the "1994 New Cars" there was an article in the Technical Highlights section talking about GM's new "baby" LT1 variant....a 4.3L version that would be the base Caprice Classic engine along with the optional 5.7L LT1.... Does anyone remember this engine? I don't even remember it existing.....and surprised we didn't see it in other applications (might it have fit tranversly in a GM-10 of the time??) Here's how the two engines compared: 4.3L, SFI V8 (5.7L SFI V8) 200 hp (260 hp) 245 lb/ft torque (335 lb/ft torque) Let me know if you know anything about it...!

You know what's kinda cool......Saleens all have their own unique window sticker showing the Saleen-specific VIN and other information. And it doesn't in any way resemble Ford's sticker...

Me too. Although, contrary to what many people on here think, I do have a unique affinity for GM (and Buick in general) due to my previous career with Buick....and my Mom worked for Buick too for many years.....I grew up with GM cars...!

But think about this possibility...... Alot of guys that have Saleen Mustangs are almost more "Saleen" enthusiasts than they are necessarily "Mustang" enthusiasts. A link-up with Saleen and Camaro could have some really positive effects.....not the least would be the press and attention in the media the cars would get. And you'd probably pull some guys from the Fords...!

Dude....I couldn't make this $h! up! If it weren't so sad, it would almost be humerous......LOL Back in, I think in 1993 sometime, C&D did a report on "Crystal-Ball Buicks." If you weren't familiar with these cars, go online and try to find the article, or pull out your old C&D rags. It was test drives of a bunch of the Reatta and Regal prototypes we had at the time. I at one time or another, worked with those cars, drove them, even helped with performance testing of some of them at Buick. One Reatta we did was converted to RWD with a Corvette rear-end, and we stuffed the Grand National 245hp 3.8L Turbo in it. Talk about a Corvette-killer for the day. Chevy squashed that project so quickly it wasn't even funny. Funny thing is....if the car had been executed right, it might have run with the Corvette (or even quicker?) but it would have been more of a gran-touring car....roomier....not as hard-edged....just what a Reatta should have been. We had the SC Reatta ready for production when Cadillac killed it. It was so easy to put into production (compared to a RWD Reatta.) It was basically the Reatta you saw in production but with the completely off-the-shelf SC3800 from the Ultra. It slipped right in. Cadillac execs were complete idiots. They had the NS V8 on the way for theirs....and their car was priced in a completely different atmosphere. The SC Reatta wouldn't have hurt them at all......but it might have made more of a chance for success for the Reatta......and that's where GM was WRONG...

The problem with Saleen is......the company IS a manufacturer.....legally.....just like GM, Ford, Honda, et al. They are going to face the same cafe requirements as anyone else.....which means you may see less-and-less (relatively) affordable Saleens and more high-end stuff (like the S7 or the high-end, $80K S/C Mustangs they do.)

Unless you are talking about the Alpina B7.....that is, I believe, a S/C 4.4L V8.

Hence the crux of this problem. Even when I worked at Buick, back in 1988-1999, there was fierce internal rivalries between the divisions. Way too often we spent our time bickering over why we were better than Oldsmobile, or Cadillac.....instead of why we needed to be better than Lexus, etc, etc. Reason Reatta didn't get a SC3800? Cadillac saw it as too much competition to Allante. Reason Reatta wasn't built originally on a RWD version of the Corvette chassis? Competition for the Corvette. Reason Riviera stuck with the 3800 and SC3800? Oldsmobile wanted to keep the 4.0L V8 to themselves. Reason Buick didn't take the 3.4L Twin-Dual Cam V6 for the Regal? We convinced ourselves the 3800 was superior.....thereby ignoring the massive trend in the marketplace in general to move towards DOHC/multi-valve engines. (Alas, 3800 way outlasted the TDC.....but since has given way to the far superior HF V6s.) These are real battles that I fought right on the front lines....not something I'm just making up. We should have been focusing on what the market was dictating.....not fighing amongst ourselves in corporate bull$h!. If the brands, even back then, had been properly managed, there wouldn't have been nearly as much infighting.....because we would all have been staking out our claims for the respective markets we were targeting. Instead, we studied comparisons of sales rates for Regal vs. Grand Prix vs. Cutlass vs. Lumina. Not Regal vs. "anyone-else-non-GM-out-there." I shudder to think there's still some of the same mentality floating around GM today in 2008....??