The O.C.

I'm not debating fits....because that can change with production. But the materials and switchgear were a step behind what I've seen in a Charger. The materials were cheaper (and the dash top has that same "dot matrix" plastic trim as my '07 CTS) and the center stack controls and steering wheel stalks were flimsy at best. But it definitely looks better and is more attractive than the Charger....

Damn it seems like it......doesn't it.....? I think the exterior is attractive.....although it's not a "must-have" for me......but I AM attracted to the IDEA of this car, with Mustang GT-like performance, with THIS interior, AND RWD...... (edit: Considering the price and performance....AND RWD....I'd probably take this over an Accord V6 Coupe or an Altima SE V6....!!!)

They do (I think....) The british mags have shown a "Ranger" that looks to be somewhat of a more modern take on our Ranger. I don't know how truly competitive it is, though. I'd say that small, compact pickups, though, wouldn't see the kind of renaissance you think. Why? I don't think you can make a compact pickup small enough and efficient enough to offset the advantages of a larger, more powerful variant.....at least enough to justify one's decision to downsize. Look at how the Colorado does compared to it's larger import competition......way less power and performance, but negligible, if any, improvement in economy of operation (not trying to rag on your rig.....just trying to debate the merits of staying "small.") But....who knows.......

What you are doing is two-fold.... Primarily you are trying to spin away the increased demand for in-dash navigation systems.......partly because no Chevy car offers it outside of a Corvette. Also, you are trying to "sell" OnStar as a viable alternative to an in-dash nav unit.....which it is not....(edit: Enzl beat me to it above.....sorry....) OnStar by and of itself is fine....and useful....and I'm sure there are people that appreciate it. But it doesn't necessarily replace an in-dash nav unit. That's all I'm saying. BTW....most (if not all) current nav systems are GPS-based.....with continual updating without the need of any interaction from the driver.

Not at all. I think the GM minivans are some of the most poorly-conceived products that GM has given us. Contrary to that, I think the Lambdas are some of the most well-conceived products GM has ever given us....

I'd have to say the Charger interior is better finished.....but the G8 interior is better styled.....so call it a tie I say......

Probably true......but even though I'm fond of the older Maximas, I'd still prolly take a RWD G8 V6 with 250-260hp.....over a FWD Maxima with 306hp.....(but that's ONLY if I could get the G8 V6 with a manual.....which won't happen....)

Oh.....but he said the G8 GT was "faster" than......and the GXP should "smoke" the SRTs...... I think it will be a good race between the GXP and SRT-8s.......remember, we don't know how much the GXP will weigh......LX SRT-8 sedans and G8 GTs are pretty close in curb weight.....so we'll have to see....

OMG.....I can't believe I'm the first one to post on here how MUCH this looks like the CTS interior.....! :wink: Incredible for any car.....much less a Hyundai...... I wonder how much for the 300hp turbo version?

Yeah....and it's called RWD..... :AH-HA_wink:

She sounds like my friend Julie.....who had that Civic....went to a Jetta VR6.....and now she's onto her 2nd 3-series.....which she loves. If your wife is intriqued by the "BMW" mystique, then you could be setting yourself up for a fight. Even if she drives the G8, and even likes it, there is a good chance that a few months or years down the road she could "resent" you "forcing" her into the G8.....when deep inside, she really wanted the Bimmer. Don't ever underestimate the value of BMW's (free) maintenance program!!! This can make a difference. Everything is covered minus tires and wiper blades (even brake wear and oil changes) for the life of the BMW warranty (4/50) which would more than cover the amount of time you'd lease the vehicle. As far as G8 V6 versus 328i......I think you'd find performance quite comparable (even considering the BMWs lower hp rating.) A 6-speed manual 328i has run 0-60 in 6.1secs in two separate C&D road tests.....figure the auto would still be well under 6-secs....maybe 6.7? 6.8? The BMW will be a bit smaller.....but much higher quality inside....so pick your trade-off. 3-Series models on the base (non-sport-package) suspension ride quite comfortably, but probably are just as stiff and handle just as good as the G8 V6 would. Even being a GM fan, I can't believe you wouldn't enjoy driving the BMW. So, if it's what she really wants, and the numbers work out, go for it. BUT I agree with Empowah.....with EITHER car, if you are going to lease it, I'd put down as little money as possible.

Kappas...... Extremely poor soft-top design, next-to-no luggage space (even worse with top down), poorly-executed interiors (SKY slightly better due to center stack) that use extremely cheap materials all around, flabby, unsupportive seats, and very poor ergonomics (such as cupholder and window switch locations.) Does it really sell better than Miata on a sales-per-dealership level? Or does the sheer number of Pontiac dealers (compared to Mazda dealers) contribute to this? XLR...... Unexceptional interior (good for a GM car....unsubstantial for it's market segment) combined with Corvette-like flabby, unsupportive seats. (Again...) lack of luggage space, even worse with top down (even compared to SL which has a similar folding hardtop.) As far as the Jag, I'd argue, based on everything I'm reading, that the new XK would be the sportier of the two (XK versus XLR.) Finally, in order to get an XLR that will run with an SL, you need to step up to the XLR-v....with an SL550-rivaling pricetag..... AURA...... Interior, and the interior alone, simply kills this car......plus what's the pushrod 3.5L doing in the lineup? SAAB..... Doesn't matter how "okay" the "new" 9-3 is.....GM has killed this brand by taking away almost all of it's individuality (a 9-7 "TrailBlazer" for goodness sakes?) And frankly, as archaic as the 9-5 is, to me, it still upholds way more traditional SAAB "traits" than the 9-3 does...... Sigma..... We haven't seen YET if the CTS-v (v.2) HAS changed the game in our favor. It looks fantastic and promising......but it's still also a huge game of brand equity....something the M5, AMG E/CLS63, and to a lesser-extent, the S6 have in spades over Cadillac at this time. STS is an also-ran. Not a bad car maybe....but it's an Acura RL to the CTS' TL.....doesn't really give you any more luxury, room, or driving pleasure for the added cost over a CTS (especially the '08 CTS.) W-Body..... Retail sales or not.....it's still an old architecture with old powertrains......certainly doesn't belong on my list above....... Not trying to turn this into a rag-fest on all these cars.....just responding as to why I didn't include them on my list above.

I actually had the GMT-900s on there.....and they certainly sell well, so maybe they SHOULD be on there. AND, I personally like them.....but I do have to agree that functionally-speaking, they are a step-or-two behind the others in some critical areas such as 3rd seat roominess, stow-ability of the seats, and lack of IRS (which contributes to the former.) Lamdas are FAR ahead here, as far as I'm concerned...... The rest of your post I totally agree with.......

Where the hell did that come from?

Don't be tricked by all those dealer ads. Coming from a dealer.....it might be one of those ads where they say to "bring in your current car, and we'll take it in on trade".......and then "we'll give you $9,000 off any new Toyota." What they are really doing, is applying what incentives they might have from Toyota and making up the vast difference by under-allowing on the trade-in value of the vehicle. For example, maybe the car is worth $15K on trade-in, but the dealer will only give you $11K. Then they'll transfer that $4K difference to the new-car sale and make it look like additional "money" off.....meanwhile the dealer will log the vehicle in with an ACV (actual cash value) of $15K...... It's just money-pushing from one side to the other......

Question is.....powertrain...... Will they step up and give the Maxima the 3.5L, 306hp engine from the G35? Or the 3.7L 330hp engine from the G37? I could imagine this thing to be a torque-steer monster with either of those engines......but it would make the "new" Maxima seriously quick if you could get the power down to the ground. The G35 already gets close to a G8 GT on speed (0-60/100 in 5.5/13.6 versus 5.3/12.7).....so that would make Maxima quite formidable (for a V6 competitor)....if a bit slower than G35 due to FWD traction off-the-line, etc. HOWEVER, FWD Altimas with just 270hp are breaking into the high-5's 0-60......so maybe a 307hp Maxima would do better than we think.....maybe Maxima would come in lighter than G35....????

Here's what I found for C&D.....they ran actual numbers on the G8 just in their recent 4-08 issue......I scrounged out the 9-05 issue (Magnum SRT8) and the 6-05 issue (300C SRT8) for comparison purposes.....same magazine, same testing procedures.....(I couldn't find a recent test of the Charger SRT-8 in C&D) G8 GT (4,100lbs) 0-60 - 5.3 0-100 - 12.7 1/4 mile - 13.8 @ 104mph C/D Observed - 16mpg 300C SRT-8 (4,212lbs) 0-60 - 4.7 0-100 - 11.2 1/4 mile - 13.2 @ 109mph C/D Observed - 14mpg Magnum SRT-8 (4,379lbs) 0-60 - 5.1 0-100 - 12.1 1/4 mile - 13.6 @ 106mph C/D Observed - N/A I think it's fair to assume that the G8 GT is not quite running with the SRT-8s......as you can see, even the heavier (by about 165lbs over 300C) Magnum stays ahead of the G8 GT. BUT....G8 does seem to be staying ahead of the mainstream Hemi LXs......it's somewhere in between. The GXP ought to bring it in line with the SRT-8s.....maybe a bit faster with the manual tranny..... But to me, I'd rather have seen the 430hp rating as the Corvette.....if for nothing else but bragging rights over ChryCo......and give us the trick exhaust option from the Corvette.....if for nothing else than the barking V8 note..... (I have a fear that the GXP is "only" 400hp due to divisional in-fighting and corporate politics wanting to protect Corvette's turf.....which is stupid....considering no one would ever really care if a G8 GXP had "gasp" as much power as a Corvette.......)

Actually.....not quite true.....the original Japanese compact pickups were sold alongside domestic offerings such as the Chevrolet LUV and the Ford Courier.....I've got old buff rags that had numerous tests and comparos between all of them....and the LUV and Courier were no more competent than the Japanese trucks of the day (in fact, the LUV was an Isuzu design.....ironic that now Isuzu is selling GM-designed compact trucks.) In today's time, we have Japanese compact (midsize?) trucks (Tacoma, Frontier) that are superior to their domestic competitors (Colorado/Canyon and Ranger.) Only the Dakota seems to be sized appropriately to take on the Japanese in this segment.....

That's a generalization if I ever saw one.......and btw....who has a VCR these days? All I'm saying.....is that "turn-by-turn" is no replacement for an in-dash navigation system. It may be sufficient for some people.....but there's a reason that in-dash nav systems are gaining in popularity. People obviously DO see a benefit in the additional cost. IMHO, for me, I've never seen the benefit of the monthly outlay (as reasonable as it may be) for OnStar. (In the same vein, I've never seen the benefit of the monthly outlay for satellite radio. I listen to CDs or talk radio way too much to have the need to search out additional, commercial-free radio stations.) I have no problem with GM offering OnStar in their products. No problem AT ALL. What does concern me, though, is the Malibu for example. What would concern me is GM NOT offering an optional navigation system, instead insisting that OnStar is a sufficient replacement.....that's the kind of stuff I'm worried about...... In Europe, many of the Cobalt-and-smaller class of cars offer things such as nav systems (and auto climate control, xenon headlamps, etc.) and many of the cars sold over there DO have these features fitted to them. I for one would love to have the option of getting a smaller, less-expensive car that still has these luxury features available.

What the hell is wrong with wine?

Well, I don't have specific numbers in front of me, but I have a distinct feeling that a huge number of Uplanders are put into rental fleets. I know there has been some fleet business on Acadia, but I bet the percentage is alot lower than Uplander. Also, you are comparing a Chevrolet product that has a much greater distribution network than the GMC product. A better look at the overall picture would be either compare how Enclave is doing compared to the old Terraza.....or wait until Traverse gets here and gets going for 6 months or a year....then see how THAT product compares to previous Uplander sales.....

Weren't the Duke boys from Hazard, KY....? BTW.....funny about the Corvette plant in Bowling Green. I've been to many beauiful areas in KY....and Louisville and Lexington seem to be fine cities each. But I have a hard time associating America's premier sports car with a town as depressing as Bowling Green.......

Sigma? You have to be kidding me.....(edit: CTS great....STS beyond lackluster.) ONE decent Epsilon (Malibu) XLR is in no way a "halo" roadster (edit: unless you meant Solstice and SKY? Which are poorly-conceived and executed at best.) Edit my list of three to include Corvette and, maybe (most-likely) Astra.

Truly.....(emphasis on "truly") competitive products from GM......? CTS Lambdas Malibu That's sad for a corporation with 8 brands......

You have GOT to be kidding me....! You mean to tell me that GM needed to "gauge public response" before they decided to go to market with this important type of product? Are you saying GM needed to be "pushed" to make it...? OMG.....this is the best example I've ever seen of the sheer lack of foresight GM has always had.....even with competitors such as Toyota shoving it down their throats. How many years has Prius now successfully "gauged public reaction?" Guess what...? Toyota did GM's research for them. You know what? If GM couldn't see the signs years ago to introduce a better (and mighty-fine looking alternative I'll admit) Prius.....then they deserve to go out of business. You know....posts like yours just reinforce to me that GM really hasn't changed. They haven't learned from any of their mistakes over the last 30 years. NO ONE, not a single person could have predicted the Prius as being SUCH the success it is now....when that first, low-production, somewhat half-hearted Prius was introduced so many years ago. Why are we still waiting for GM's (admittedlly seemingly superior) version?