The O.C.

You have to look at the markets.....and the consumers IN the market......and see what vehicles they are most likely to cross-shop. Perhaps EVOK could find some actual data concerning cross-shopping in the various pickup segments...? Colorado is a very mainstream compact pickup with little-to-no innovation in architecture or features over what is considered a "traditional" pickup truck. Ridgeline could HARDLY be called a mainstream "pickup truck" for good OR for worse. The only other thing out there in (perceived) size, price, and capability that shares part of the Ridgeline's unique positioning in the segment IS Avalanche. You MIGHT call the SportTrac (Ford) a competitor as well as it is a "pickup truck" that's based upon an SUV chassis/architecture. I don't even see Tacoma and Frontier aficionados cross-shopping with Ridgeline.....

The EPA sets the final mileage estimates.....GM doesn't "pull them out of their ass." :lol: ES330 is priced more like Lucerne, but is a smaller car. I would rather see the LaCrosse competent enough to take on ES330 (but it's not....) Lucerne seems to be more of an Avalon competitor from a size, performance, and price standpoint.

Oh come ON....... 3-Series IS the BMW brand. To say it's their bread-and-butter is WAY understatement...... This new 3-Series was SO critical to BMW, they HAD to produce a winner. Also, don't forget that BMW with the 2002 and early 3-Series invented the "sport sedan" segment. It's been the benchmark for as long as it's been around. That's MAJOR significance to the marketplace and your comment comparing it to the VUE update was quite ludicrous..... As far as the Ridgeline, it's the first true unibody pickup truck ever. Baja doesn't count....it's a castrated 4-door Legacy sedan with no pickup or SUV overtones (other than the "bed" if that's what you want to call it.) AND whether you like it or not, Honda does present some new innovations with the Ridgeline such as the trunk-in-bed. Ridgeline has MAJOR significance in the marketplace.....(even if we disagree with the styling, etc.)

I agree..... In many ways, that's why cars like the EVO and WRX show such impressive acceleration times.....it's the great launch they get with the AWD. You have to abuse the clutch and driveline to get those sub-5 sec 0-60's with those cars, but it's possible. One time, from a rolling start, when I had my Mazda6 V6 5-speed, I WASTED a WRX up to about 70-80mph. The WRX is supposed to go 0-60 in about 5.8 seconds according to the buff mags....the Mazda6 in about 6.7 seconds with manual. BUT, in this case, I made sure he couldn't launch his car (he was behind me...) so I rolled away from the light in first gear and then once we were moving, punched it at about 5 mph. Since he didn't have a chance to dump the clutch, he was off-boost for awhile and that's all the advantage I needed. He never caught me. Back on topic....I think the SRT-8 will be a monster with a brake-torque launch and AWD but the aerodynamics and weight will begin to catch it by the quarter-mile....but same will be true for Cayenne Turbo and TrailBlazer SS.

But the point is....if you have one of these cars with oil life monitors, etc., you don't need to do ANYTHING..... NOW....if you like to check the stuff BECAUSE you enjoy it....you're a gearhead/enthusiast, etc., then that's WAY okay.....I understand that.... I also like to hand wash my car myself.....with today's touchless car washes, I probably waste time and effort doing it....but I enjoy it...so I see your point. I'm just saying that if you are not into doing that stuff as an enthusiast, there's no point or reason to doing it. That's all....

I seriously don't see the same level of cross-shopping between Ridgeline and Colorado as I do Ridgeline and Avalanche. Colorado doesn't offer a fraction of the functionality and "style" of the Ridgeline and Avalanche. I think in this case, looking at the REALITY of the marketplace, you are far more likely to have people shopping functionality, style, utility, etc. than you are having them shop Colorado and Ridgeline JUST because their weights, prices, and overall size are closer. I can't disagree with your dimensions you quoted, but I gotta tell you my impression is that Ridgeline has WAY more room inside than Colorado....and seems way bigger on the outside. Perception is reality I think in many people's minds.....

True....true.... Toyota would have two midsizers.....unibody Highlander and BOF 4Runner...... Alas like GM......unibody Lambdas and BOF Trailblazer, etc.

The REAL question is what's going to happen to Highlander when it gets its next redesign? I'm guessing it will get bigger too..... With Sequoia getting even bigger on ITS next redesign (along with the new, bigger Tundra.) Then Toyota would really mirror GM........RAV4 (Equinox), Highlander (Trailblazer) and Sequoia (Tahoe/Suburban) And I'm sure we'll see a new, compact SUV from Toyota but who knows when and what it will be called and what it will be like.....

Man oh man....don't ANY of you take this new RAV4 lightly..... I saw the real deal in Frankfurt.....and it's WAY bigger, at LEAST Highlander sized if not larger, and has 7-seat capability. It's also got the Avalon 3.5L V6 as an option. It's also way more attractive.....I think seeing it in person, with it's new, larger size more relative, helps. Pics don't do it justice. It has really good presence. From what I could tell, the interior is a major step up in the class....with premium materials and plastics. Equinox/VUE/Torrent are about to eat a HUGE piece of humble pie......sorry to say.....

Hey I'm no Ridgeline fan.....but I bet you guys my first-born that Honda never even CONSIDERED targeting traditional F150/Ram/Silverado buyers with Ridgeline. Avalanche? Maybe....maybe....but even that's not very likely.... In fact, if I remember correctly, they were trying to offer an alternative in the marketplace for people currently in unibody SUVs/etc., looking for a bit more towing capacity, etc., and with a more pickup-like bed in the back. A Pilot owner looking for something with similar utility, but sportier and with a more rugged style....

That's a waste of time and energy..... At LEAST during the warranty period of your car, it's MORE than safe to trust the monitors. I have and have never had a problem with ANY car I've driven that's had them.... AND if something goes wrong with them, it's not your issue.....warranty would cover it. Now maybe if you kept the car AFTER the warranty, you might be more diligent to check it more often.... BUT the BMWs we've had, have 4yrs and 50K miles on the warranty.....AND all maintenance (including oil changes) are covered by BMW. Therefore, BMW's procedure is to perform services based upon the computer-controlled service intervals. Plus we've never kept them anywhere near the length of the warranty..... There's absolutely NOTHING wrong with embracing smart technology that works....and CERTAINLY doesn't make me ANY less of a "driver"

I'm sure the AWD does a much better job of getting all that power and torque to the ground....much better than the RWD/TC of the others....

Well, I AM a GM fan....and regular contributor to THIS fan website....and ONLY this website I might add....and I also find the Toyota-bashing childish and nitpicking.... They may be in-your-face, but Toyota is doing whatever it can to be successful in selling and marketing their products in the U.S. Point is....GM has done the SAME thing in the past advertising-wise.....they've been misleading in the past.....and they've been controversial in the past as well. Toyota is not the only offender here. If GM were doing it now, you'd be congratulating them. I'm not going to buy a Toyota....not now, and probably never.....but I can give credit and appreciation where it's due....and they build a nicely-designed and executed product that hits the mainstream American consumers right in their hearts and pocketbooks. (By the way.....this post is in no way any sort of defense for Polishkris....just my feelings regarding the unusally harsh bashing of Toyota.)

Yeah...you ARE right. The consumer has been conditioned by THE BIG THREE not to buy domestic...because of all the totally undesirable cars (either in design or quality) that the Big 3 offered for too many years.... That's the only "conditioning" that has gone on.... Sounds like the same old "...it's someone else's fault...." thinking from certain GM loyalists that we've heard way too much lately....

I'm not dragging out my health care packet to quote how much I end up paying....needless to say, it's my fair share. As far as getting to know a UAW family, I lived in Flint and Detroit for 7 years....and got to know PLENTY of them....and yes they were good people. That doesn't mean that I agree with their organization or how it's run or how it's managed...or that I agree with the relationship structure they have with GM management.....or the cost-structure they've forced GM to live with.... Those UAW families that I knew also lived quite nice lives.....had toys, took vacations, had nice homes, provided VERY nicely for their families. I certainly didn't see ANY hardship cases....

I talked to a guy on the assembly line when I was picking up my C6 in Bowling Green and he said simple use of a hair dryer and the GM emblem will POP right off.... I've already had numerous people comment on the badge. First of all, they can't see that it says GM unless they get up close....and then when they see what it is, everyone thinks it's stupid....and they think it ruins the looks of my clean-bodied black convertible... AARRGGHH The hair dryer is warmin' up right now!

In today's world of oil life monitors and on-board computer-calculated service intervals, I can't remember the last time I pulled a dipstick out to check oil....

:blink: First of all.....I'm very happy with my career. I'm the Western Regional Sales Manager for an automotive finance company, and I've been in the automotive industry my whole career (12 years plus an additional 5 years that I attended school at GMI and worked for GM.) I'm certainly not bitter that any UAW worker may or may not make more money than I.....why would I? I make a good living myself and have a VERY high quality-of-work life. You ask "is the economy treating me fairly?" Well, I have a solid job in the automotive business working for a large company, I just paid cash for a C6 Corvette, I own a $675K home in coastal southern California.....YEAH, I'd think the economy is treating me QUITE fairly. You say since I'm out of college, I feel or act like I was owed everything......? I wasn't owed ANY of the above.....I earned it all fairly because I was dedicated to my goals and dreams and I worked hard for what I have now. The total cost structure (wages, health care) that GM has to deal with because of the UAW is what I have issues with....not to mention the antiquated union-labor/management relationship structure. Not to mention the immaturity of grown adults (UAW workers) keying the cars of white-collar workers that crossed their picket line....(which I witnessed myself during my 7 years in Flint and Detroit.) AND, did I mention having to call a UAW worker to come to our offices to move office chairs into a conference room so we could start our meeting? And having to wait 45 minutes for them to get there? AND THEN having to be written up because I thought the whole thing was incredibly stupid and moved the chairs MYSELF so we could start our meeting? THAT'S why I don't have any sympathy for them (as a whole....I know not everyone is the poster-child for the UAW's ridiculousness.) I myself, as an example, never had to be a part of, or contribute to the antics of an organization like the UAW to be successful working for major corporations. WITHOUT the UAW, I've had a strong, and enjoyable career at GM and the other auto companies I've worked for....and WITHOUT the UAW, I've been able to achieve the kinds of things that I enjoy in my life today.

As far as fuel economy, check out MT's long-term test of the Silverado Hybrid.....fuel economy appears to be no better than any other normal full-size pickup. I believe the as-tested average fuel economy was around 15mpg. The Silverado system only shuts down the engine at stoplights....it doesn't aid performance OR fuel economy on the go. It's a pretty weak attempt....as hybrids go...

I'm sorry.....but that's about the funniest thing I've heard in quite awhile...... I'd say their level of hard work and technical expertise is FAR outweighed by the ridiculous level of money and benefits they receive.... Coming from someone that spent 7 years working in Michigan next to the UAW....you'll get very little sympothy from me for the UAW.....just IMHO.....

Ditto for me......every option except chrome wheels..... That's quite a bit of car for the money. Compare that to a new Passat V6 loaded for about the same money (although the Passat, at 280, has more power...???)

Yeah....but it's Chevy/GM that decided to use that awfully-tuned electric steering in the vehicle....and it's Chevy/GM that decided to use the hard, brittle plastics inside the Equinox... I do think, however, that the reliability issues are probably not that common. GM cars hold up pretty well overall these days.

Ditto..... And you know, the Signum (loosely-related to the Maxx overseas in Europe) is supposedly not doing well there either (compared to the "normal" hatchback and station wagon versions of the Vectra.)

YEAH..........WTF is GM's thing lately with deleting the shift indicators on the console? I know, I know....they are in the dash, but you know, every GM car I've driven lately without them has REALLY irritated me as I tend to look down to the shifter when shifting from P-R or D and vice-versa.... Get used to it over time? Maybe.....but I see it as a (small) deterrent for people cross-shopping those GM cars with their competitors.....

GM dealers aren't the only culprits......I was at Irvine BMW the other day and the new M5 had a window sticker of over $90K....with a $30K markup.... AND they have a huge list of people waiting to pay that for the car.....the M5s stay in the showroom for like a day before they are prepped for delivery to their customers... I think it's crap that dealers do this.....but on the other hand, I certainly can't argue with supply versus demand....you know it is only a "Manufacturer's SUGGESTED Retail Price"