The O.C.

More than likely.....this is an engineering mule on the old body. The different front end could be to test a modified/new front structure (for pedestrian-accident purposes...?) That's what I would guess.....

Hmmm....I'd like someone "in the know" confirm this. It doesn't make sense that BMW would just do a "nose job" for '09 after just doing a "nose (and tail) job" in '05. I've heard from sources that the next 7 is ALL-new..... Are these old pics from the '05 refresh?

Okay, for some reason, whenever I hit the "eight" on my keypad, it gives me this..... WTF? (see above post from me.....and where I tried to say "SRT-eight"

Not in the same league? Well, personally.....compare any STS to a loaded 300C (even v-Series vs. SRT- and I don't find ONE thing I like better about the STS.... I'd take the 300C any day of the week.....and, like you said, for way less money.

Regarding Cadillac.....I had a distrubing conversation with a friend (31 yrs old) yesterday. He was asking me my opinions on new cars 'cause he wants to get one. He's a non-enthusiast current driving an Eclipse V6 coupe. He asked me about the TL, G35, A4, and Volvo S40. That was his current list. I gave him my opinions on each then I asked him....."what about a Cadillac CTS?" And I proceeded to plug the CTS's positives. His response was..."I will NOT drive a Cadillac no matter how good it is." I asked "why?" And he said....."it's an old man's car." No $h!......I didn't expect THAT. Maybe from a Buick suggestion....but not from a Cadillac suggestion. I just shook my head.....and went back to discussing the other four cars with him. Looks like he'll settle on the A4 I'm guessing. (BTW....interestingly enough, he said he thought the G35 was too much "old mans car" as well....)

Okay.....but about Buick being "grampa".... What do you do when more and more of the "grampas" in this world ARE ending up in Accords and Camrys and Avalons because....more and more of them GREW UP in imports....unlike a generation ago that grew up in domestic cars..... THAT's why IMHO Buick HAS to start weening themselves off the blue-hair set of yesterday....and focus on the blue-hairs of tomorrow.....because their perceptions and desires will certainly not stay the same.

I think it's interesting that automotive "Industry Towns" such as Flint, Anderson, (and Detroit on a much larger scale) and others tend to just wither and crumble in the wake of GM's cutbacks, plant closings, and layoffs. I spent 5 years in the Flint area while attending GMI and I've NEVER been to a more depressed, downtrodden, and simply ugly city ever before.....filled with the most bitter people that do nothing but sit on their asses....blaming GM for their lives..... What happened with diversifying your industry and attracting new businesses? Why can't Flint and Anderson remake themselves much like Bethlehem, PA did after the demise of the steel industry? Bethlehem is a similarly-sized city to Flint (adjacent to Allentown) and when I last lived in Philadelphia, Bethlehem was well on its way to a renaissance......considering it's one industry, steel, up and died. People started moving there and commuting to Philadelphia and NYC (thanks to lower housing costs,) Lehigh University has thrived....and unique new stores and restaurants started popping back up downtown. Or on a larger scale (similar to Detroit) look at what happened in San Diego 15-20 years ago. When the country made huge cutbacks in military and defense, San Diego was in turmoil. Military and defense WAS to San Diego what the "Big3" are to Detroit. (It's not DIRECTLY compared to Detroit's challenge....but a good enough point to be made.) What did San Diego do? Well, military and defense still have a small presence there....but the San Diego area's major economic viability has come from high-tech and high-education. Call it kindof a west coast "Boston." And for any of you that have been to San Diego lately know that the city has done nothing but become a major boomtown with a lively downtown littered with more new highrise condo towers than you can count. It's also now the 7th largest city in the U.S. with about 1.3 million residents in just the city alone (not counting suburbs.) Meanwhile, Detroit has slipped to UNDER a million people....and OUT of the top-ten in population (replaced with San Jose, CA.....) Of course I'm sure San Diego's beautiful setting and stunning weather help to attract workers and so forth....but it's a dauntingly high-priced place to live too...which works against it.

As you've most likely heard, the Prez is presenting a deal to have the government of the United Arab Emirates take control of major ports on the east coast. Do you think that Dubya has finally "lost" it? I can't believe this is actually happening. He even said....and I quote...."if Britain can operate our ports, how are they different from the U.A.E.?" How can you compare Great Britain to ANY middle-eastern country? In my opinion, G.B. is as close to sainthood as you can get when talking about U.S. allies.... I don't intend to get into a huge political debate here.....but IMHO, to give ANY middle-eastern country access to major ports in the U.S. is taking a chance that we can't afford to lose.....whether they have good intentions or not.....it's not racism...it's just a realistic look at the history of terrorism over the last 10 years or so.....

I'm having a REAL problem with all the "Political Correctness" that seems to now be forced upon everyone..... Example....I have to now pay to listen to Howarn Stern because the FCC clamped down too hard on radio talk.....instead of letting people make the decision to listen, or CHANGE the channel. Example.....I can't spank my unruly child in a grocery store because someone will NOT MIND THEIR OWN BUSINESS and will turn me into child protective services???? Example.....I can't get married to the man I love and want to spend the rest of my life with.... Example.....If I spill hot coffee on myself (in my car) I can sue McDonalds and become an instant millionaire. Example.....Remember that bitch from Michigan that tried to get "Married With Children" off the air because she thought it was offensive? NEVER MIND the fact that IF she had succeeded, she would have impeded OTHERS' rights....people that chose to, and wanted to watch the program. The fact of the matter in this country today is that a good majority of the people out there will NOT take responsibility for their OWN actions. And by not doing so, they are forcing their convoluted beliefs and morals on the greater public.

I'll submit that I think the Saturn of today is about 180-degrees from the Saturn when they started (with the exception of the dealer body.) I replaced a 1989 Buick Skyhawk coupe with a 1992 Saturn SL1. I was THRILLED by the car, and it garnered attention everywhere I went. At the time, the styling, interior, and even powertrain were symbiotic of what the imports were offering at the time....and a major advancement over the "import fighters" that GM was offering (J-cars, etc.) I FELT like I was driving a Honda, etc. compared to my Skyhawk (and I say that in a good way....) Now, the Saturn product is by-and-large also-rans when compared to the import competition. HOWEVER, I do think that products like the SKY and AURA could really bring SOME of the magic back to Saturn. ("some" because I feel you can never regain the spirit of individuality and uniqueness that they had when they were a separate corporation from the parent company, GM.)

......maybe people buy Toyotas for OTHER reasons than just product quality ......maybe they buy them for engineering, fit-and-finish, interior quality/stying, brand reputation, powertrain smoothness, a (read non-floaty or boaty) solid ride-and-handling compromise, and yes....exterior styling (be it conservative or whatever...) Toyota wouldn't be as successful as they are today IF the only thing they could hang their hat on was simply "product quality." If THAT'S the case, GM's market share wouldn't be in the freefall that it is.....(because GM's quality/reliability is just as good as anyone else's....)

Buicks will NEVER be compared to cars like Passat/Volvo S40, S60/Acura TSX, TL.... It would take decades of superior product, marketing, and advertising to even BEGIN to change the perception of Buick in the marketplace in order to have it appeal to people shopping VW, Volvo, Acura. That is what Saturn should charge after......Chevy doesn't have the brand equity to appeal to those people either....

Dsuupr, Go read my previous post on this thread about WHY the MINI is considered a success. It's not all sales numbers. I GUARANTEE you that a MINI dealer is making much greater profits on every MINI they sell than a Chevy dealer makes on any Aveo. Most are still selling here for window sticker....and some hot models are even selling $1K-2K more.... Remember MINI dealers are selling every MINI they can get their hands on. They are severely limited in allocation by what MINI USA can get. The only way for my dealer to get more MINIs is to buy them from other dealers across the country and get them shipped out here. THAT'S why many people consider MINI a success.

What the heck are you talking about? I'm a big fan of the new RAV4. I never said anything bad about it. I think they leapfrogged the CR-V.....and I even think I'd take a loaded RAV4 Limited (with the V6) over the new Acura RDX (or whatever they are going to call it.)

If that's the case, and they come through with the product, then I like that scenario. AURA.....competing with Jetta/Passat, Volvo S40, Acura TSX, etc., etc.....it could be a great alternative to those types of cars....

You are missing the point about "road feel." "Road feel" has nothing to do with the level of power assistance......well, not directly at least. In other words.....a car doesn't have better "road feel" just because the steering is harder to turn.... My C6 has a pretty stiff steering feel as you are at speed....but doesn't have near the road feel that my BMW 330 had (that I replaced with the 'Vette.) The C6 is not bad, mind you, but it is a bit more numb. If you want a true idea, go out and test drive the two extremes in "road feel." That would be an Equinox or Malibu........and let's say a BMW 3-series (without the Active Steering option.) Sure the 3-series sedan has a less power steering assistance than an Equinox or Malibu, but unless you are an 80-year-old woman, I don't think you'd have any more of a problem steering a 325i sedan around town than you do the Malibu.

1 ) Ditch the rear spoiler.....even on SS versions. It's SO 80's-domestic-sport-sedan-like. 2 ) Take the chrome strip off the rear of ALL Impalas. Make it body-color like on the SS. 3 ) Base tire size of 17-inch to fill the wheelwells. You can keep the plastic covers on the cheapy LS models....but at least put more meat in there. 4 ) While you are at it, black-out the chrome around the greenhouse on SS models. 5 ) 5-or-6 speed automatic transmission 6 ) 2.8L and 3.6L HF V6s in addition to V8. How nice to have a base LS Impala rental-grade model with a smooth, revvy, and nice-sounding 210hp 2.8L HF V6? 7 ) Add a FRIGGIN gear indicator on the floor console. 8 ) Give us a more "euro-like" interior option of beige with black/charcoal upper dash and door panels.....a la LaCrosse CXS.

The only reason I harp on this.....is I think that too often, people don't think about the HUGE impact that rental and corporate fleet sales have on specifially GM and Ford's sales numbers. When you sell 250,000+ Impalas a year......and 62% of them (the old model) were sold to fleets, that leaves you with LESS than 100K of them that were sold to actual paying customers that DESIRED that product over all others. That's a HUGE discrepancy! And hard to consider a car like that a "true" success in the marketplace.

Okay....correction. I was going from memory after reading Automotive News earlier. On page 12, the "opinion" section, titled "Who's First? Who Cares? It's a Ho-Hummer" It was talking about January....it says "In January, neither Chevy nor Ford finished first where it counts most.....in retail sales. If unprofitable fleet volume is excluded, Toyota outsold both brands during the month. Ford and Chevy gorged on low-profit sales to daily-rental and corporate fleets." Plus, I don't think the market is any different for GM in January and February than it is for anyone else.

Hey don't get me wrong.....Toyota STILL builds a top-quality product in my mind. It's just that so do other companies (like GM) now. Where Toyota, and other manufacturers, still excel is in the area of material quality, fit-and-finish, design (yes) and engineering. These are the areas that other manufacturers can pull significant gains....and where GM, in many ways, (top-notch reliability or not) is still lacking. Take the new Camry for example. Everyone complains about Camry being boring and conservative. And, yes...it is. However, with this new generation, Toyota just leapfrogged Chevy's new Impala. Impala, which was recognized as a dramatic improvement over the old Impala now looks to be "the" conservative design in the marketplace now (optional 5.3L V8 notwithstanding.) So it's not reliability or durability that are the defining factors in the marketplace now....it comes down to one simplified word in my mind....DESIRABILITY. And "desirability" comes from many fronts. Styling, design, engineering, features, consumer perception, reputation, quality, and yes, reliability and durability.

rrrrrrrright..... "perception" of quality.... "inferior" product..... You may not like Toyota.....but it sounds really kinda childlish for you to try to infer that Toyota makes an "inferior" product.

First of all, while I would like the AURA to replace the Malibu, I would take a Cobalt 100-times first before I'd even consider an ION (coupe or sedan.) Fact-of-the-matter is.....you really could get the job done with just Chevy. The AURA could, supposedly, replace the Malibu. You could put the Honda V6 right into the Equinox......the only real advantage I see with VUE over Equinox is that engine. SKY would fit PERFECTLY in Chevy's lineup! They currently have an awesome Corvette with no lower-end sportster in the lineup. Other than the dealer body, I see no product reason for Saturn to exist anymore. BUT we know they aren't going away.....

The SCARY part is that in the article, Automotive News reports that if you take fleet sales out of the equation, Toyota beat BOTH of them for the year. In other words....Toyota is the #1 brand that "people actually chose to buy" (i.e...."retail" purchase, not fleet sales or rental-car sales)

How come GM couldn't figure this out when others have done it....with existing platforms.....(Escape Hybrid and RX400h) I believe the Ford is a "traditional" AWD system and I think the Lexus actually uses the electric batteries to power the rear wheels..?

Isn't it a known fact that we get the LaCrosse Super with the 5.3L for '07? I thought that was a done deal. Don't see it as a "performance car" but I'm curious as to what else GM will do to it....suspension tuning/wheels/tires/interior mods/seats/etc....