The O.C.

Actually they don't upgrade the materials....that's what I don't like..... Other than seat trim (cloth versus leather) the dash and door panel materials, plastics, woodgrain, and switchgear are all the same from CX to CXS.

I always considered this a bull$h! excuse from Ford. If Mazda can build a (relatively) affordable small car on this VERY platform (Mazda3) why can't Ford bring the European Focus over here? Even base Volvo S40s (same platform) start at as low as $25K MSRP......and Volvo is considered a "premium" brand!

.....and you can even pay to get the maintenance program on a Certified Pre-Owned BMW.....(as long as it's within a certain mileage and time period.)

Grand Vitara shares nothing with Equinox. The new XL-7 (on it's way) is another story.....

The next generation XL-7 is a stretched "Equinox" and is very much close to production and not likely to get cancelled in any way (according to Suzuki sources themselves.) So you'll have a "new" XL-7 that will be significantly bigger (and with a third-row seat) than the "new" Grand Vitara just introduced. It's also got a 3.5L V6 engine....but my Suzuki sources couldn't confirm if it was the 3.5L HV V6 or the 3.5L Honda V6 (from the VUE.)

My point is....motorcycles aside.....Suzuki is the 4th largest seller of Japanese AUTOMOBILES in the world...... While their contributions to GM may be suspect, that doesn't mean you can classify them as "global losers."

Looks like the concept to me (which is nice.) When do we get to see production pics?

Remember, Chris....I lived there working for Buick for 5 years..... There's like 5-6 Buick dealers in the Flint area.....an area with a population of less than 500K....(Genesse County statistics.) Trust me...it's all GM business. In fact, I'd wager that of the GM cars purchased in the Flint area, 100% of it has some sort of GM employee/retiree/supplier/friends 'n family discount attached to it.

I think Turbo's trying to make a point about the EXECUTION of the interior......regardless of the actual style or design..... True it is a love-it-or-hate-it design.....but the execution and materials are top-notch.

I'll agree with Turbo 10-times over on this issue..... Whether or not you like the styling of the Civic's interior.....the way everything fits, the way it was designed to fit, the materials (yes, SOFT-touch on the dash and door panels) and the switchgear shows true attention to detail and a definite LACK of cost-cutting.... ....compared to most GM interiors....including the G6.

Speaking of name-calling.....these two (the Lienerts) are the true morons..... I've never really read much of their stuff.....but reading the G6 "article" makes them look like idiots...

Toni, That's totally uncalled for. As many know, Croc and I don't always see eye-to-eye, but no one on here, even him, deserves to be called a "moron." Let's leave the name-calling off of here...

Croc, I actually expected more from you......you really don't know me....so don't even BEGIN to try to catagorize me......THAT's what gets old from YOU.... There's no more bias from me than anyone else on here. You may or may not believe it, or you may or may not like it....but I call it as I see it... And I'm sorry it pisses off the GM kool-aid drinkers on here.... OH, and BTW.....this supposedly "biased" person (that lives in import-dominated southern California) has two domestic cars in the driveway.....and one of them is actually a 2006 GM vehicle.

You call many of my observations as "subjective." That may be....however they are subjective observations that the media and many consumers in the marketplace have picked up on. And, my Mazda6 vents were damped and did NOT have any sort of cheap "clicking" sound. You asked for a rationale for people picking on the G6 interior's quality....and I tried to produce some constructive criticism in response.

You can call me biased or not, but you won't see me "rip apart" peoples threads like you do... Like YOU said....WHATEVER dude...

Nah....the interior is basically crap. Sorry....but IMHO, the actual design and/or styling looks good. But the plastics, seat comfort, and center-stack control quality are all at about the bottom of the pile... I like the Cobalt....but I hate the interior.....it's a deal-breaker for me.

Nope....totally different trucks..... Or you could say the 1st gen Tundra was a redesigned and reengineered T-100.

I see your point....and actually it's the major problem I have with the Lucerne.....it's okay for a $26K CX model.....but lacks enough flair for me to consider spending $38K on a CXS.

Have you ever driven one? A MINI is a wonderfully-handling, driving little car! (NO....I'm not a twink....lol)

Uh, you need to recheck your facts before you declare Isuzu, Subaru, and specifically Suzuki as "global losers." Fiat...? Maybe more of an argument there... But you can't base a declaration of a brand being a "loser" just because it doesn't do volume in the U.S.A. Last time I checked, Suzuki was the fourth-largest Japanese manufacturer world-wide....and wildly profitable to boot. Not to mention the successes they've had with motorcycles, ATVs, and (to a smaller extent) outboard boat motors.

....but the thing is, is most people don't complain about some additional cost in owning those vehicles.....because in most cases, they are more pleasurable vehicles to own compared to most GM products....at least in those consumers' eyes... I don't complain about having to put premium gas in our cars....because we love driving them. As far as maintenance costs, we don't pay one dime for the X5. (Free maintenance for 4yrs/50K miles.) Sure it (V8) gets $h!ty gas mileage....but it's no worse than any V8 GM SUV....and it performs alot stronger. Our insurance isn't any more either than any other cars we've had. Because we don't have to pay for any brakes, L.O.F. changes, or other stuff, it makes up for alot of the additional cost of premium gas and stuff.

It's the QUALITY of the hard plastic....not whether it's hard or not in the first place. 9 times out of 10, the Japanese do it MUCH better and nicer than GM. The hard plastics in the RAV4 and Oddessy are matte-finished, nicely-grained, and solid (not brittle or flimsy-feeling) and look good to the eye compared to what you find in the comparable Equinox and Uplander. (I'll give Uplander credit to the fact that the overall design looks good and the upgraded switchgear seems as nice as the rest of the imports......just that the hard plastic slathered all over that nicely-designed dash is brittle, hollow, and looks and feels cheap....)

I don't necessarily disagree with SOME of thier picks, however, Consumer Reports is just a big pile of crap in my opinion. When I was at Buick.......... I'm not sure the year or month of the magazine, but during the '97 generation Regal's life, CR did a comparison test of midsize sedans. As you all know, CR goes out and actually buys test vehicle right off the dealers' lots. In the test, the Regal came in DEAD last. The Regal they "bought" and "tested" was a base LS, with cloth seats, and the base suspension and tires. It even had plastic wheel covers.....not even alloys. No duh that pig-of-a-Regal came in last place. CR advised us of the test prior to the printing of the magazine. Supposedly that is normal practice to give the manufacturers notice of an article prior to publishing. At that time, we complained to CR that the test vehicle was not representative of Regals that we were selling. The majority of Regals that were selling at the time were either more loaded LS models with Gran Touring Suspension, leather, and 16-inch wheels or they were GS models (SC 3800, good susension, tires, etc.) Certainly NOT base models, with plastic wheelcovers, cloth seats, etc. We (Buick) offered to BUY BACK the base Regal they bought......and offered to locate at a dealer and sell them a Buick that was more representative of what we were selling (a GS or a loaded Y56-packaged LS.) We asked them to retest THAT vehicle for their comparo. They refused. They went ahead and printed the comparo. Then there's the Suzuki Samurai thing.....and the Isuzu Trooper thing.....and so-on.

I don't give EITHER Consumer Reports OR J.D. Powers alot of credibility. Unfortunately, consumers do.... J.D. Powers' quality surveys are heavily biased on the responses that consumers give them.......for example.....the Lexus buyer would never DARE report any dissatisfaction with their new Lexus because they are so convinced it's the "best car in the world" and they've told all their friends and peers the same thing. In many cases, it's an ego thing. Why do you think Japanese designed-and-built Suzuki would consistently be at the bottom the J.D. Powers list? Well, a significant portion of people that have bought a new Suzuki only did so because it's all they could afford....or all they could get approved for due to low income, bad credit, or other reasons. In other words....they come into a Honda/Suzuki dealership looking at a loaded Accord V6....but end up in a base Forenza because its all they could get approved on....so of course they have disdain for the Suzuki from day ONE. Then what happens? J.D. Powers & Associates comes a 'knockin looking for feedback. There are no "checks and balances" for J.D. Powers to guarantee that consumers are TRUTHFUL in their responses.....both good AND bad.

To show you how inept Suzuki management is........(this according to a friend of mine that worked at Suzuki....) As the new Swift was being developed for Europe/Great Britain, the Japanese in Japan offered the new car to the Japanese management here in the U.S.A....and they resoundingly turned it down. THEN the dealer body started seeing the new Swift in the magazines, etc....and were CRYING for the car. Alas.....at this time, it was too late to bring it over here because it doesn't meet U.S. certification and would cost way too much to redesign it to meet our standards. The dealers apparently love the MINI-esque styling, the much-improved interior styling/quality, and the relative affordability that the car would have brought to the current Suzuki line. Too bad....I think the new Swift could have been a much-nicer alternative to cars such as the Aveo, Yaris, Fit, and Verso.