CARBIZ

Lost in the media frenzy to bash American autos is the fact that no European vehicles were named to the Top Ten either. The vaunted names Audi, BMW and Mercedes, all costing thousands and thousands more than their Buick, Pontiac, Chev or Ford counterparts were also shut out. However, the media tends to focus on Detroit and ignore Europe. After all, most of these hacks are driving BMWs and Mercedes anyway.

Is this bankruptcy story like a game of musical chairs with the media? You know, they pass the story around while the music plays and then when the music stops the media conglomerate with the story still in its hands has to publish it! Perhap I am getting jaded and cynical as I get older, but truly I am getting just exhausted with the media saturating the market with whatever THEY decide is the cause of the week, month, or whatever! MOre and more I am convinced that the media no longer reports the news, they create it. Let's face it: if the media keeps printing stories like this one, it will become a self-fulfilling prophecy. It will scare so many prospective customers and so many investors that nobody will buy anything from GM. Or is that Wallstreet's hidden agenda?

There are a couple of things about this bill that concern me. Firstly, with older luxury vehicles, it is usually the repairs and maintenance on the luxury toys that result in an othewise perfectly good car being scrapped. Case in point, a recently traded in '93 Grand Marquis was flawless as far as the body, motor and mechanicals went, but it was the fact that two power windows weren't working, the a/c was dead and the power seat was locked in an uncomfortable position that resulted in the car being traded - and with a couple grand worth of repairs the car probably ended up in a scrap yard after we wholesaled it. If sensors and other safety items are made mandatory, then as these vehicles age the vehicles will depreciate rapidly and be scrapped earlier. Secondly, and this is going to come across as a little heartless, but as we raise an idiot generation of drivers's and, worse, an idiot generation of children, we are going to have to accept the fact that $h! HAPPENS. How ever did we survive our childhood? My parents had no magnetic locks on the cupboards - I did not poison myself. My school bus used to deposit me on the side of a busy highway and leave while I had to look both ways and cross the highway on my own - no mechanical arms with stop signs on the end, no traffic monitor who has to stand in the middle of the road with a stop sign, blocking traffic in both directions while little kids dawdle, shove and play in the middle of the road. I am starting to sound like my grandfather, but kids need to be taught safety and driver's need to look behind their vehicle before they back up - better yet: NEVER DRIVE FORWARD INTO A PARKING SPACE IN THE FIRST PLACE, always back into it. End of sermon. (Steps off soapbox.)

But that is the point: in the '80s, Oldsmobile for a couple years sold more cars than Ford did. At that point, the Cutlass Ciera (velour and all) is what people wanted. Even though this was before Wagoner's watch, is there any coincidence that the rise of Saturn paralleled the fall of Oldsmobile? Surely we can see that funds had to come from somewhere to build up Saturn. Oldsmobile could and should have been the import fighter. I am sure there is plenty of blame to go around, but the traces of GM's rot clearly do go back to the Smith era and the lack of product leadership. Mid-80s Cadilllacs, for example - a joke that paved the way for Acura and Lexus. This Delphi thing really worries me. How could a company be "spun off" if the parent company is still on the hook for legacy costs? That is just silly. I hope that Wagoner and his cronies have aces up their sleaves and are speaking out of both sides of their mouthes because they have to. Hiring Lutz is one sign of encouragement. Or am I just being naive?

No doubt, but there is a difference between front page or feature article and buried in the back in the business or financials. I haven't read the car mags in years. They disgust me with their BMW-Honda a minute articles. I can, however, speak about the main stream media, which I do read and I never saw a mention of it - which isn't to say that it wasn't, but I can assure you that the Toronto Bleeding Star puts GM's foibles on the front page (as they did with the gas tank problem, which was Petro Canada's and not GM's) while news of Toyota's sludge problems was a tiny business section article.

I think I just had an acid flashback.................................

Well, as we know the news is a couple months old and nobody (especially not customers) know anything about it, we now conclusively know that Toyota and Honda successfully dodged yet another bullet, courtesy of a willing media. And we all know if this had been the other way around it would have been GM ripping off the public on the front page!

I can only speak for the Toronto area, but in this area Kia and Hyundai are formidable competition, too. As Canada's larges market, it would be a shame for GM to get drummed out of it completely! The Freestar (a total dog), the Caravan and the Uplander are all occupying the bottom of the price ladder. The Sienna and Odyssey the upper end. I don't see any of my upper echelon customers even considering the Uplander any more. Frankly, being forced to sell only on price, we are more and more getting stuck with the credit rating challenged and the customers with no teeth! (Okay, I exaggerating for effect.) Five years ago, it was easy to sell the Venture against the existing competition. Now, it is getting harder and only price will do it. I mean, the not so base Uplander is $10,000 less than the Sienna - so who wouldn't be tempted? But it is becoming like the Cavalier last year: take it because it is too cheap to resist, but not because you actually WANT it. Canada needs a fun, sexy and well priced minivan, which is why I have been carping that we need to ally ourselves with Europe. (However, since I sell Chevrolet and it looks like Saturn will get the Opel and Vauxhall product, I may be slitting my own throat here anyway!) LOL

Whoa, there is a whole lot of bitterness here. Walk a mile in another man's shoes...anybody every hear of that? You should rent the movie Suckers. Although exaggerated and hilarioius, there are some interesting points. The sales manager asks the sales staff during one meeting if they think that customers care if they make any money, and wouldn't a customer rip off a dealer any way they can? I have seen both sides. Recently, a good customer walked out of the parts department with a thousand dollars worth of goodies for his SSR by convincing the manager that the salesman (who was on holidays at the time) had promised him them. The salesman had to pay for it out of his pocket! I was there for the confrontation with the customer and the guy just shrugged and walked away. People don't seem to mind getting discounts off MSRP, so why shouldn't the dealer charge more when they can? I am sure there are dealers out there making a lot of money, but the last stats I saw for Canada (put out my Macleans magazine and DesRosiers marketting a few years ago) indicated that most dealers LOST money in their new car show room. Many GTA area dealers still have 2004 Monte Carlo INtimidators on ground. Do you think GM gives a damn? Can you imagine the interest on 18 months worth of a $35,000 car? GM armtwists the dealers into ordering certain vehicles to keep the plant moving, then leave the dealer holding the bag. I agree that GM should take control of the dealer network so that the MSRP can be the SELLING PRICE. That is as it should be. Believe me, most salespeople don't like the games either, but it usually is the customer who is playing them, in my experience.

I've never understood why Chinese are so addicted to Japanese cars. After all, Japan was no friend of theirs during WWII. If it wasn't for the Americans, Beijing would be filling with grass and weeds while most Chinese would be in labor camps. Many times I have had Asian customers walk onto the lot and demand to know why they should buy an North American car....I want to mutter something about loyalty to the country that is hosting them, but I don't. I just sigh inwardly.

A customer told me last week (who lives in Oshawa) that GM is piling up cars at Mosport race track. Hmm. I wonder if there is any connection to the upcoming Delphi deadline? I mean, if there is a strike or a lock out, both GM and Ford are going to be hurting for parts, right? Wouldn't it make sense to start stockpiling vehicles now? Just wondering.

Don't forget that there are far MORE domestics out there to break down and piss people off. The often-trashed J-cars were #1 in their segment right up until when they were discontinued - far outselling either the Mazda 3 or vaunted Civic. Therefore, it will be easier to find disgruntled J-car customers than a Civic or Mazda 3 customer, obviously. I believe that when someone makes a conscious decision to pay MORE than they should (the Civic being more than the Cobalt, the Camry being more than either the Impala or the Malibu, for example), they would then be loathe to admit they made a mistake. I have seen this many times when dealing with import car owners: they dismiss $300 trips to the dealer as merely "maintenance," and a $2,000 repair bill on their a/c as "normal."

Yesterday, in the National Post there was an article about a writer and his spouse going to the Auto Show and the remarks his wife made. Of all the vehicles that she saw, and the Bentley was mentioned, too - it was the PT that stopped her in her tracks and made her mouth gape. Chrysler has been producing innovative products for the past 15 years. Keeping one step ahead of the competition has been the company's only saving grace. Their forward thinking is where GM was 25 years ago. Kudos to them!

This is why I've been saying that GM-Oshawa needs to divorce itself from Detroit and ally itself with Europe. With GM putting all its money into SUVs and trucks, Canada in general and the Toronto area in particular is getting crushed in the crossfire. GM will cease to exist in major Canadian markets within a few years if we don't start getting some product that WE can sell. I doubt 70 Tahoes have been sold in all of Ontario yet, let a lone at one dealer! I undestand the Tahoe is an important vehicle for GM's profitability, and I certainly am happy for dealers in the States that are selling buckets of them, but in the Hinterland (where we are paying about $4 a gallon) and an LTZ Tahoe is nearly $70 grand and where Toyota is OUTSELLING all of GM in the Toronto area, we need segment busters that are fun to drive and great on gas. 20 mpg doesn't cut it if you are paying $100 to fill the tank! Dealers in the GTA only average 50-60 TOTAL new vehicles a month! I understand that in the States many dealers sell that in a week. We haven't seen those numbers in 10 years. Our sister Toyota store sells more vehicles on a weekend than we do in a month - and its only a few blocks away! So pop the champagne corks and enjoy your sales, guys. Personally, I am waiting for the new Malibu (and it had better be the doozer that we are hearing it is) and the new minivan or cross-over or whatever it will be called, because that is what we sell up here in the Hinterland.

As a $20k dog (Canadian) it is a great buy, but the lack of interior space and the lack of a true folding seat in the 3rd row is becoming an embarassment. I hope there is something significantly better in GM's bag of tricks coming soon.

Sorry, I was speaking more of the Aveo than the Echo, but my point was they are suprisingly quiet - meaning quieter than expected. One's perspective is drastically effected it one is driving a Lexus or Deville - clearly quieter than most anything on the road. I've driven professionally most of my life (starting as a car jockey in a major downtown hotel in 1981) and have particularly seen how small cars went form raucous and scary on the highway to almost pleasurable. I am 6'2" and have no problems sitting in the front or BACK seat of the Aveo, BTW.

I'm hoping this guy is kidding............. However, there is one thing I partially agree with: Ford and GM need to find an American way of dealing with Japan Inc. and one of those ways may very well be to stop trying to build a better Camry or better Civic. I don't like the way Japanese cars look, especially inside. I am an average North American demographic: male, 44, educated, $60k+ income. I grew up with American cars and looked at Japanese cars in the '70s as curiousities at best. I've never changed my opinion. Ford and GM need to figure out how to sell to people like me....forget about seeing who can come up with the coolest round dials and guages - what about the truly wacky, wierd but different interiors that GM used to try (ie., late '80s Buick Riviera, early '90s Olds 88...) These are just off the top of my head, but if GM lets the tables get turned whereas WE are seen to be copying THEM, then all is lost. I passed by a '91 Cavalier Z24 today while walking my dog and I have to say that that car was better looking than either the Civic or the Corolla of its day, but better than that you knew it was an American car.

Isn't Lear responsible for the amazing, segment leading interiors that GM has been boasting over the past few years?????

For those of you bashing any of the vehicles in this segment, they are all surprisingly quiet at highway speeds and feel decently stable. Personally, I prefer the look of the Aveo 5 over either the Echo or Yaris because the design is cleaner and more balanced, IMO. We can all look down our noses at these vehicles while paying $2.50 a gallon. I can GUARANTEE you that at $7-8 a gallon, these vehicles will ALL look so much better to you. Only in North America do you see people driving anything other than these type of vehicles (except maybe oil rich nations that charge 25 cents a gallon!)

Ghost, nobody argues that unions don't contribute to their pensions, but everybody lost money in the stock market meltdown 6 years ago. Many companies have had to prop up their company pensions since. Those of us who only have their own private pensions just had to suck it up. One friend of mine watched nearly a quarter million of his and his wife's retirement fund evaporate! The new world economy is placing pressures on investments like never before. Wall Street has no patience either! Boards are under pressure to produce results TODAY. Long term thinking is rarely rewarded. GM's mess of the last couple years is partially of its own making - nobody denies that. However, there are a lot of external pressures, too.

Well, Toyoguy, I don't know how they test in Europe, but on this side of the pond (where we live and are concerned about) the Aveo scored a 5 star for frontal crash by the NHTSA on its current model. It is interesting how you Toyota crusaders immediately get personal and affronted when anything Toyota is criticized. I never said the Yaris was a bad vehicle, I only said that it should have aimed further ahead because it has only just caught up to the Aveo in terms of ride, fit and finish, interior space. Oh, and for the record: I sell Toyota and Chev.

Nobody can live on $7 an hour, for sure. Isn't it ironic that it is those same unions that helped to foster the middle class in America 75 years ago are now presiding over the demise of the middle class? The culture and history of the "emerging markets" are vastly different than our own. I wonder at what success rate unions are going to be able to grow in these markets? In a Communist state? I am not a union fan, but do you think Industrial America would have awarded wage and benefit concessions voluntarily? Even the government had to be dragged, kicking and screaming to pass workplace safety legislation. IN many ways, Brazil, China and India are where North America was 75 years ago, but with one HUGE difference: hundreds of millons of idle laborers.

Frankly, it is good to see Toyota hitting off the mark. The current Aveo is way better than the Echo was. Toyota had two years to catapult by the Aveo. All they succeeded in doing is barely catching up to the current model Aveo - sort of like what GM did with the current Cobalt barely catching up to the Mazda 3 and then being lept over by the Civic. I still can't get past the Yaris' UGLY looks. The 5 door Aveo is a far more balanced design; the interior less so, but pretty damned good for the money! GM needs to ditch the crappy automatic in the Aveo and get a better one. And for the record, the Aveo is a very important car for certain urban markets with a high immigrant populaton (Toronto being one.) They are predisposed to small cars, coming from areas of the world (South America, Asia) where all cars are small. I find that discussions on plastics, guages, fit and finish, etc. are pretty amusing on these classes of vehicles. It wasn't too long ago that they had metal dashes and virtually no guages. Now, people demand power windows on a $12,000 vehicle!

Am I the only person on the planet who thinks that DVD navigation systems are going too far? Are we raising a generation of idiots? This means that as they get cheaper, paper maps will become a thing of the past and NOBODY will know how to use them. I don't know. From the clowns that I see weaving on the expressway while talking on the phone; now we have to worry about them looking at a screen that is way below eye level to see where the hell they are! I can already see the lawsuits. And you know there are chips out there to over ride the safety protocals and allow movies to be played in them while driivng.

As long as it was only blue collar jobs that were being offshored, it was reasoned that service sector jobs would pick up the slack - and they did. Nobody can doubt that North America has enjoyed the greatest run of prosperity that the world has ever seen in the past decade or so. However, now it is those service sector jobs that are being offshored as well. The real trouble is that countries like India and China literally have hundreds of millions of underemployed people. This isn't like the industrialization of Japan a century ago! How long would it take the labor market to raise the Chinese and Indians populace to even half the level of North America? Probably decades, I'd say. Japan did it in a generation, but then we were only talking about a hundred million or so people, not billions! The thinking goes that eventually labor prices will rise as jobs are filled and the newly affluent middle class demands increases; therefore, the West allows their standard of living to rise to our levels and then they price themselves out of the market. THAT IS THE THEORY. We've never tried that with 1.2 billion people before, especially not when India's population alone is increasing with the population of California every year! Major companies are tripping over themselves to supply these new economies, but I have grave reservations about their abilities EVER to saturate their own labor markets. Frankly, Americans could never buy enough Chinese televisions or hire enough Indian telemarketers to give all of them jobs. And let's not forget that America's current prosperity is being fueled by the consumer market, which is buying mostly foreign made products and are being paid for by foreign bought treasury bills. What will happen when the middle class in America collapses and stops buying things?