razoredge

I have a 97 Oldsmobile LSS and did have a 99 Eighty Eight for a year. Besides the Riviera, Aurora, STS it is the only other body style by GM from that era I would consider owning. The PA is alright but has retiree written all over it. I would never consider a 92-04 LeSabre. They are horrible looking things, they are an anti styling statement, much like grunge was an anti guitar tec statement :lol: I prefer the LeSabre from 86-91 better [own one] but no way on that 92-99. I used to like the XJ but after a decade of 92-99 LeSabres I can hardly look at any of them. I have not found a difference in quality between my 90 Regency and my 86 LeSabre and I know they are the same car. My 90 Regency has a front inner fender from a 87 LeSabre. Better quality styling on the outside for the Buick, better styled interior on the Olds. Also oddly enough there was a larger volumn of large 85-91 Oldsmobiles around here than Buicks, there was an abundance of both however. But even cruising the junk yards you find more Olds than Buicks, same with the classified. Mostly history now though, the old H&C bodies. I would agree on a PA preference to the 98 from an exterior styling standpoint on the 91-96. I know enough about the cars to know better than saying there is a day and night difference. Ven I wasnt really thinking about the exact reasons that Olds was not giving a chance to return an investment in less than 30 days :lol: I was talking about the decline and falling of the American automotive industry since the 70's. Its not about to stop either, its about to take a real plunge. There will be only a few survivors held together by bandaids. What comes from third world countries after the fact is just that, they wont cut it with typical American car buyers and more will migrate to Toyota, Honda, Audi and BMW, much like you mention about the Olds buyers. Just watch :(

So whats your pay and contribution to society ....."idiot".

Still waiting on this one ? steel cost ????? is it less or more now that we got rid of the American steel industries ? Well its more because of oil and China and shipping at any rate.

Well I explained that no amount of "reduction" would be enough, shy of working for free. But you ignore that. You keep insisting all health & retirement plans must be giving up..... this is your 7 billion. You dont care that exec are and have been getting their pockets lined. You dont care that the problem is the healthcare industry itself. You want the auto workers put in check...but not the healthcare workers not the insurance industry not the corporate leaders that have had the ultimate say in things not our government for these highly unbalanced trade agreements unfortuantely you dont see that the Japs have been playing a game of chess with our industries and our government has allowed this. Why, because rich American investers have been involved in it and have much to lose if our country did business like Japan does. Just ignore that lads and keep your minds on the smoke screen that points to the guys on the bottom when the result of decades of corporate mismanagement and one sided government trade agreements come calling. Id rather fix the whole picture.......wouldnt you ?

Cant say as though I miss that scene. Sometimes yes but Im glad I dont have to live it. Its not the best way to find a real good girl but there has been many great relations that have come from "going out". Me and my wife hooked up at a local bar on band night. We werent strangers but that was the slow beginning. This girl was one of those attention junkies, doesnt make her a bad girl, it just makes her undesireable for little more than she is looking for anyhow. Extremely outgoing and/or aggressive girls are hard to deal with long term. long term could be anything more than one hour.

Yes indeed you are 100% correct, except for the fear thing, these people are afraid of nothing at that point in life. Then after that it takes strenght to throw in the towel. Most that dont, dont because they are too scared to die or self inflict pain, fear of the unknown. Sorry I dont think Im wrong nor do I think Im insane. I am aware of my somewhat different views but I somehow always come up more on the accurate side of reality. I dont know much about it but this was an accepted part of many Asian cultures, I dont think fear or weakness allows a man to stick a sword into his belly and give her a shake. But what do I know. thanks for your suggestion but as Im sure you can see I make my own decisions on my own time. B)

Its nothing more than my opinion, a feeling, something I have had since all this stuff came to mind after the Olds announcement in 2000. Even earlier really if you think about Plymouth, American Motors, British Leyland, International, GMC and so many others. Everything Ive observed since. Combined with recent developements that were also not a surprise. like so many others I would like to pretend none of this is going on and that it will not have a destructive effect but it will. No real new product for Buick. Nothing but negitive reviews of the recent releases. No special product in the making, No promise of any real exciting product in the making. Somekind of vow to never make Buick sporting again. Continued views of Buick as old folks car. Theres probably other things that have enforced this view in my mind but I cant think of everything at this time. Time will tell, just sit back and watch, I could be wrong. The American auto industry could be the last and only survivor, it could make the world book of records for doing so too. If it does survive names like Buick, Mercury, Pontiac will be long forgotten or some Asian use of the name that has nothing whatsoever to do with the car. It will truely at that point be just a name. Like an adopted son can carry your name but not anything else. In fact its close to that now, when the 38 is finally gone there really wont be anything Buick about a Buick. All new power plants are Austrailian or Cadillac and Chevy based. GM powertrain yea yea yea but everybodys gonna have the same engines. It wont take long. How is Buick profitable ? If I recall last years total sales were only a few hundred thou above what Olds was in 2000, I expect this years total to be even lower than what Olds was. All we can do is just watch, I have been for a long long time. Thing is I never liked horror shows.

I gotta go look you up, somethings not making since here.

Just a reminder of what you really said now that you are waffling on your origional meaning WEAK shit happens lacking in self confidence I would consider throwing up before school kinda weak I say it requires great strenght to truely take ones own life. Self confidence to get the heck out of here and hopefully on to a better palce. Not the crying for help or attention efforts but the real ones like this girl might have done. Im sure there were far more reasons leading to such a thing. Not just the two highlighted. I believe they were significant to push someone to the point where they were ready to check out. I believe more people dont do it because they are scared to or dont want to make a mess for someone else to clean up. Sensationalism, on the part of the press maybe but the death of a child normally brings out extreme emotions which would be viewed as sensationalism by uninvolved parties as well as those with issues. I do agree with one posters remarks but I actually have better more appropriate terms.

What was the Johnny Cash car song ? "One nail at a time" :lol:

"How about the countless billions lost on healthcare?" Yes I agree 100%, this is why the country should be coming down hard on our health care and insurance industry. Even though health insurance is not a "loss". "How about $6,983,188,500 lost due to the cost disadvantage GM suffers vs. Toyota and Honda, etc, last year ALONE? Yes, alomst 7 BILLION DOLLARS IN ONE YEAR." Wow, so now Ven just said GM was profitable last year yet you have a 7 billion dollar loss ? Interesting. Now is that the total health care cost at GM ? Interesting, I guess once again we are rallying for no health insurance what so ever, thereby eliminating this cost disadvantage ? Interesting. All this happened last year or was it first 2 quarters this year ?

We've already discussed the "market share" smoke screen, last year was GM second largest volumn year ever. Your two wrongs question could be asked of your own agenda. but you only want to cure one wrong and sweep the other under the carpet.

So the losses in those quarters were from what ? Im wondering if the Fiat losses were thrown into this scenario to make it look so bad. Perhaps heating oil and other oil products used also added to this ?

At least since 1986 Buick and Oldsmobile H & C & E bodies have been fully galvanized. My 90 Regal W was also fully galvanized. Thanks for the info :lol:

well I searched hard for a quote where you expressed your feelings about GM cars quite well but either I was searching the wrong thread or, puff gone without a trace.

now that was entertaining Blu maybe you have a future as a script writter.

" and they are profitable," Oh !!!!!!!! I thought GM wasnt making any profits ????? Boy this is so confusing :blink: Listen croc, I can speak for myself, you seem to make a habit of speaking for others, gotta problem, more of that trouble making perhaps ? Im not bitter about whats going on with the unions, it has no effect on my life what so ever. I just know that GM is going down along with the entire American automotive industry. Buick will be cut quick. Not worth going into details, just watch theres 4 model years between now and 010. No better time to start shopping for your Toyota or Honda. Right croc ?

So Gm was profitable last year and the year before ?

The 89 Trans Am was a Buick Turbo V6 as was this car 13 years earlier After their successful pace car project for the 1975 Indianapolis 500, Buick was asked to provide a another pace car for 1976. The '75's pace car with it's huge 455 cid V8, didn't have the acceleration needed at high-speeds. This time, Buick engineers tried something new. The solution turned out to be turbocharging. But instead of another large V8, it was applied to the tiny 231 cid V6! After a long absence, the V6 had made it's return to the Buick line-up in 1976. A Rayjay turbocharger, Rochester 4 barrel carb and 20+ pounds of boost, helped the little V6 propel the large '76 Century from 90-110 mph in under 9 seconds (twice as fast as the 455!).* * "Buick's Turbo V-6", by Mike Knepper; Motor Trend, June 1976. I would think the newer GTO's as well as the GXP's and that Comp G have been the fastest but they aint all Pontiac either. Maybe something Trans Am or Grand Prix 1970 would be the fastest whole Pontiac ?

Wonder if Wagoner and Co would give back those big bonus's they got last year.........and the year before..........and the year before............and the year before...........and the year before..........and the year before...... and the year before?????????

:unsure:

What was that ? The 4.4 billion losses at Fiat ? The 7-8 million losses at Fuji ? Not sure how much has been spent on saturin and Saab but its all been loss Forgot what it cost to close Olds not to mention the sales losses Perhaps they should have seen this coming Whos shoe which foot ?

apparently somebody felt the exec were owed something with that severance increase. I guess its which ever side of the fence your standing on. line em up

:lol: :unsure:

So does this mean the japanese builders have better analysts, marketing and engineering or cheaper work force ? <_<