smk4565

Not surprising, G3/Wave, G5, G6, Vibe are all front drive. That is the bulk of what Pontiac is.

4 cylinder turbo is fine for the base model, but they have to offer a V6 also. I hope it isn't the 2.0 turbo either, that engine will be 4 years old by then, and gets only marginally better mileage than the V6. They need 30 mpg highway out of the turbo 4, and the interior has to be better than the CTS. Assuming it will be 3-series size, people will compare it directly to the 3-series, and the next 3-series is out 1 year after this Cadillac. Unless Cadillac goes Cimarron 2 and prices it around $27k and gives it the corporate radio and HVAC and makes it a TSX/Jetta fighter.

The back is too high giving it a hatch look, I agree with Moltar on that. The door looks like it doesn't fit the car, perhaps a test mule problem. The grille is what I have the most problem with, it is all gray plastic, it already looks faded and old, they can't come up with a painted or metal grille like every other luxury car has?

A V16 is dumb, too big, too long under the hood. V12 has a place in Ferrari/Lambo or Rolls Royce type cars, but Cadillac won't ever be in that range of cars. The engine they need as an all new DOHC V8, with twin turbo option and in a couple sizes, perhaps a 4.0 liter, and a 5.0 liter. Even Hyundai has a new V8, and they have a 5.0 liter version of the Tau V8 with 420 hp coming soon. (Cadillac can't keep up with Hyundai?) The LS motors will never make it in the luxury market (they are from pickups and Camaros of 10 years ago), they don't have the refinement, or 100 hp per liter ability (without a massive supercharger like the ZR-1) like the Euro engines do.

BMW and Mercedes are both heavy on engineering and they both sell over 1 million cars a year globally, Cadillac is lucky to push 250k. Cadillac is 4th place in their home market and sales are down this year. The current plan isn't working.

The 09 7-series has no V12, but the 2010 model getting it back makes sense, it is supposed to be a twin turbo V12 I think as well. I've driven plenty of pushrods that I didn't like, even most SOHC engines I find unrefined. BMW's inline 6 has better refinement than any GM engine, pushrods and the Northstar don't cut it, they need a new engine if they really want to compete, but I believe GM is happy with Cadillac being a $35-55k brand that shares parts with lower end models.

Pushrods aren't as refined as DOHC, I have a DOHC V8, I wouldn't trade that on a pushrod ever. "Distinctly American" might be a turn off to many luxury buyers. The current perception is that German and Japanese cars are better than ours. To beat the Germans, they need to out-engineer them, recycling a pushrod from a Chevy pickup or Camaro isn't going to do anything, but further tarnish the image of Cadillac as just another struggling GM brand.

Or people that rented it from Avis.

The 2.3 turbo used in the 9-5 now vibrates a bit while stopped, but once you are going it isn't bad, and the turbo boost makes it quite quick. It is a louder than most V6s, but that engine doesn't whine much, it sounds like it has higher displacement than it is. The Mini Cooper S has a 1.6 liter turbo and it makes 162 hp, not bad for a 2700 pound car, but in a 3600 lb 9-5 that could be a struggle.

Wow, this is sooo different than the 05 model. Pontiac clearly is a viable brand and could never be killed with such up to date vehicles as this. For the same money, why would anyone want an 08 Malibu (or Accord or Sonata or 09 Fusion) over the G6?

BMW dropped the V12, but they could always update it and bring it back. The M5 might go to a twin turbo V8, and Jaguar is V8 only as well. The V12 Mercedes are $125,000 or more. The DTS and STS base under $45k right now, the replacement (if they ever make it) will probably be $50k, a V6 and V8 are fine for that price class. GM puts pushrods in Cadillacs so clearly they don't care that much about engines, doing to a DOHC V12 would be quite a jump.

They don't need a V12 since they aren't going after Bentley any time soon, but they do need a new DOHC V8. A turbo or supercharged V8 is enough for under $125k cars. I thought the STS/DTS replacement was scrapped, I hope it isn't on Zeta, a Chevy/Pontiac/Holden platform that is heavy has no place at Cadillac. They need to develop one from scratch, I know it is costly, but they find money to rebadge lame SUVs, they can take it from there to make Cadillac legit. As for names, I don't care if they stick with STS/CTS style or go to Fleetwood/Eldorado, they sell cars mostly in English speaking countries anyway. I just read about Mercedes' new engine lineup yesterday, they have a, 300+ hp diesel V6, 435 hp twin turbo V8 (replaces the 5.5 liter) and a twin turbo 5.5 liter V8 with 570 hp for AMG cars. Direct injection on gas engines, plus a hybrid S-class with lithium ion batteries. All this is coming in the next 2-3 years. BMW and Mercedes keep pushing the envelop, Lexus and Audi have a hard time keeping up, Cadillac seems too underfunded to get in a battle with those brands.

But Jag of the 70s, 80s, 90s, was known for poor to mediocre build quality and dated designs that didn't look like they were from the current decade. Nothing to aspire to be, although they at least used real wood trim and had a V12.

Overall it looks good, but I would have liked to see the bar across the middle of the grille, rather than near the top of the grille. The tailights look like they were inspired by a Camry or the old GS300, not really a fan of the back. 2011 model year is a while away, Civic and Fit are updated for 09 and new Mazda 3 for 2010, plus the Euro Fords will be here by then, and the Insight comes out next year and is supposed to get 60 mpg or something crazy. GM coming 2 years later with a 40 mpg car isn't going to make a big impact.

I don't like this because it kills resale values. It is good at clearing out inventory, especially on stuff like Impala, G6, Trailbalzers, but it is bad to do on CTS, Malibu, etc. They need better products that they can sell without deep discounts if they want to recover.

I don't like Alfas, I can see the 8C thing being on there, (Jeremy Clarkson loves that car) but not number 1. I think the XF looks better than the XK, and the Aston Martin DBS should be on the list also, but maybe they didn't want 40% of the list to be Astons/Jags which look similar.

The S-type (which was terrible) went out of production 6 months ago, and the XJ, though dated looking is very light for it's size and is pretty quick. It really needs the redesign that is coming in 2 years, and the new 5.0 liter V8 should make it plenty fast. The XK and XF are athletic, they are what Jaguar is going to become.

But Jaguar is a sports car, more so than Cadillac. Buick makes soft riding cars that tend to float, and at a much lower price point.

This can be traced back to too many models, too many brands. Saab is selling under 25k units a year in the US with the 9-5 sedan/wagon, 9-3 convertible/sedan/wagon and 9-7x. The Kappas are a better investment than the Saab brand. GM has to shed some brands and focus resources into Chevy, Cadillac and 1 or 2 other brands. 4 strong brands is better than 1 good and 7 weak.

And the Accord is 2.5% fleet. Any fwd Cadillac is a bad idea. They need to start Cadillac over from scratch, they are becoming another outlet for GM platform sharing, and are far from being "standard of the world." 3 years from now, Buick and Cadillac will be even worse off than they are now, and GM will be talking of how each brand is going to get in e-flex car in another 2 years and that will save the brand.

Not surprising, but sad. GM has tons of front drive generics, none of which are really hot sellers or profit makers. They need some rear drive products, and need sports cars and convertibles. I'd keep Kappa, but 2-seat roadsters are a niche market. GM really needs a 3-series type platform that can do sedan/coupe/convertible/wagon in a compact size.

Detroit knows they can't make money on cars, so they are hoping the midsize crossovers of the 2010s will be the Explorer and bigger SUVs of the late 90s early 2000s. GM's 4 lambdas, and the 5 or so Theta/theta premium SUVs have overlap, plus Flex/MKT, Edge/MKX, and the recent Japanese crossovers form Mazda/Acura/Infiniti, and it is a rather saturated market. Really all GM and Ford are doing is shifting body on frame SUV sales to crossovers, there isn't really a net sales gain. The Equinox is the size of a Highlander now, and the Nox is expected to grow a little. So GM still lacks a Rav4/CR-V competitor, aside form the Vue, which grew larger and got really heavy.

I think it looks too much like a Vue or Equinox also, and I don't like the wheels. This is a step backwards from the current SRX, and will probably move down market in price.

For the type of people that buy those kinds of crossovers, they won't know the difference and it will do fine. I'd like to see Cadillac more than just a Acura/Lincoln/Lexus imitator that dresses up a mainstream car and calls it entry luxury and more like BMW or Mercedes.

In 2008 (no half year or production ramp up) they sold 25,651 Enclaves in 8 months, that works out to 38,474 if they hold that pace through the fall. The Lucerne is on pace to sell 47,571 units in 2008, and they sell that car to rental agencies too, though not at Impala or G6 levels. The Lucerne doesn't sell at an average of $34-37k and it can't crack 50k sales, how will the Invicta/LaX, with the Lucerne priced the same on the same showroom floor. The Lacrosse has sold 23,231 units in 8 months this year, so it is a total dud. The BMW 5-series is outselling the Enclave this year, and the 5-series has been around a while and costs a lot more. The 5-series does well for it's class, but I wouldn't call it one of the hottest selling vehicles in the industry. The Enclave's average buyer is 56, which isn't that young, although better than the 67 year old average for a buick sedan buyer.