smk4565

here is a picture of a Buick to get back on topic

This is what the CTS needs as options (it isn't all BMW stuff, some is STS or Merc stuff) 4 years free maintenance upgraded leather, leather on dash, not leatherette, brushed aluminum trim, not plastic wanting to look like metal upgraded carpet and floor mats 7.1 surround with at least 14 speakers, 400 watt (a Genesis has 17 speakers and 520 watts) 14+ way power seats heated steering wheel tool kit and rechargeable flashlight Blind spot monitor and lane departure warning LASAR adaptive cruise control power rear sun shade, manual side sun shades heated rear seats push button start headlamp washers electric close trunk (e-class you can shut the trunk from the driver's seat) voice command head up display night vision auto high beam headlights that switch off when oncoming car approaches cashmere headliner magnetic ride control On a side note, an 09 STS V8 premium luxury performance package is $68,165. No one in their right mind would pay that, the STS isn't that good and 07 STS V8s are like $25,000. If they revamp the CTS they can make a legit $47-67,000 car.

Ford is on their way to fixing problems, they don't need a loan right now and might get $6 billion for Volvo and can keep their focus on the Ford brand. If Ford could shed the legacy costs and get the pay rate (including health care) equal to the foreign transplants they would be in good shape. GM has a lot more problems than Ford right now.

Fully agree. The people that plan on spending $55-60,000 on a midsize sedan are looking at M-B and BMW and aren't even stopping at the Cadillac dealership to give the CTS a chance.

VanDevere Buick-Pontiac-Hyundia/Kia in Akron, OH has a 2008 DTS that looks pretty well equipped for $21,995. They also have a 2007 Accord with cloth is $20,995 (both are gray with about 28-29k miles). A 1 year old Cadillac should not cost $1000 more than a 2 year old Honda, but that is the sad reality of Cadillac resale value. STS is basically obsolete, it should be killed off and the exclusive features (blind spot, lane departure warning, etc) it has should be put on the CTS and the CTS should go up in price to make room for the Alpha car. The features that the 5-series and E-class have should also be on the CTS and material quality (leather, carpet, etc) should match up. Put the CTS directly against the 5-series in price. Bring on Alpha, make it outstanding, sell 80-100,000 of them a year here and then send it global.

It is bland, but it is well equipped and performs well. Cadillac, Acura, Lincoln, Volvo, Lexus, etc don't have a 375 hp V8 and 17 speaker stereo for $40 grand. Genesis is a great car in a boring package. I think the Azera is supposed to go away when it's life cycle runs out, but it is $7,000 less than a base Genesis and front drive vs rear drive, so that isn't much overlap. Especially compared to the Malibu and Impala or Acadia/Enclave intra-dealership competition.

It sounds as if there aren't too many requirements and conditions tied to this, aside from becoming viable and having a positive net present value on March 31. It is doubtful that they will reorganize in 3 months, and be able to prove viability. I think in March we'll be having the same discussion we had this month, and GM and Chrysler will be looking for another loan. They should be forced to bankruptcy on March 31 if they haven't fixed the problems by then. If they just keep kicking the can down the road, they will never fix the true problems.

Agreed. I sat in a Genesis and it was nice, it wasn't even the top of the line version. I am curious as to how they drive.

And it is going to win North American Car of the Year.

STS was a failure, they didn't put enough effort in, and it is too big. GM mismanaged Cadillac's product portfolio and almost has to start over. They better get Buick right the first time, and not do Avalon size for Camry price. Buick could be in the situation Olds was in the late 90s, where it is just too little, too late, so they better hit home runs on every product.

The real gain will be the Malibu V6 by getting rid of the 3.6 that gets 17/26 mpg, and putting the 3.0 in. I bet they can get 20/28 out of the new V6 which is a good trade off to losing 30-40 lb-ft of torque, most Malibu buyers would rather have more mpg's than .2 seconds off the 0-60 time.

The E-class is more successful than the A6 and M35, especially globally. Cadillac should aim high, the wreath and crest used to mean something, it's time for an American car brand to be top tier and restore credibility to American cars. Europe has all the exotics and ultra luxury cars, so people think anything European is good, and American cars get the perception of rental cars or junk. Personally, I'd put the CTS at $47k base and add a sedan above that.

A base E350 is $54,075, Cadillac needs to step it up. Modestly equipped the E-class is over $60,000.

5-series sold 2900 last month, that is a bad month, they are usually in the 3-4k range. (plus global sales which helps economies of scale) I think $40k is as high as a front driver can go from any brand (I know what a S80 and DTS cost, those aren't exactly sales winners). The sweet spot for Buick is in the $28-35k range I believe, with a loaded up sedan going to $40k like the ES350 and MKS. People will pay $30-35k for a car because they have been paying that much for SUVs for years. SUV sales are dropping, families are downsizing, gas will go back up eventually and people will want a vehicle that is a step up from the CamCords of the world, but won't want an SUV. This is the demographic Buick needs to get after, small to midsize premium will emerge here as it has in Europe, Buick better be ready.

They tried that, it didn't work. GM is spending more money than they bring in to try to keep all these brands going and it still isn't enough. What bothers me is GM won't make the hard decisions (something they could have started a year or so ago before running out of cash). There should be a greater sense of urgency and more elaborate plan on how to "right size" the company. If they don't do it, the government is going to force them to bankruptcy and do it for them. And that may not turn out great.

Cadillac for sure needs a car smaller than the CTS, and should be given at least $1 billion to develop it (the 08 Malibu cost $500 million). It has to be rear wheel drive and 180-183 inches long. They may need another $3-400 million to get coupe or convertible variants, but it will be worth it. Base price should be $34,000-34,995. Overhaul the CTS and move it to $47,500 base price.

I think these are good engines, no where in my original post did I bash them. If the 04-07 Malibu, Impala, Buicks, G6, Grand Prix all had a 3 liter DOHC V6 they might not have picked up the unrefined label when compared to the Japanese sedans. I am glad GM has caught up and even gotten ahead of the curve a little with DI and will have class leading engines. About the 180 hp four, I meant DI didn't do much to raise power. 30 mpg highway on an SUV is very good, hopefully the Equinox isn't overweight like the Vue.

These are good engines, especially the V6. The 2.4 makes 174 hp as is, adding DI didn't do much, but at least 180 is an upgrade. Probably tuned for mileage. GM should have made the push to DOHC years ago. I remember in 04-05 when the 3500 and 3900 "high value" engines were GM's new thing and thinking how that was a mistake because everyone else had DOHC. At least they got it right this time. The 3.0 V6 will be successful because 255 hp is enough for the vast majority of motorists, and it should have good fuel economy. In hilly areas of the country the 4-cylinder will probably seem inadequate in something like an Equinox but in the flat states like Florida it will be ok. The 2.4 DI will be good fr the Cruze and Malibu.

Yet the UAW employees get paid 95% of their wages while sitting at home. Why should they get taxpayer money to pay people to sit at home. This is a business that is guaranteed to fail, that is why Cerebus won't put their own money in, the gov't shouldn't either. I think GM and Ford will be better off if they are the only domestics and Chrysler dies. The market is supporting 10 million sales, take out Chrysler's 1 million and GM, Ford and the rest will pick it up, those domestic suppliers will still sell parts.

Toyota will be fine in the long run, they won't go down. They just like their slow, steady growth and don't want any shocks thrown into the system. If Toyota was so worried about the Detroit 3, they could buy them and inject cash in, but clearly they want no part of that mess.

Too many models, too many brands. They need to dump brands fast. Without downsizing, they will be in Chapter 7 liquidation before 2009 is over, even with a government loan. GM is currently losing $67 million per day. If that keeps up for a year, it will be $24.4 billion, even with the $18 billion dollar loan they are still bankrupt in September 09.

At least GM tries to hide the platform sharing now, the Cimarron was god awful, they didn't bother to change anything really.

While maybe not the worst car ever (those Russian communist cars take that title) the most damaging was the Cimarron. 25 years later and Cadillac is still haunted by that. Luckily, they'll never rebadge a Chevy into a Cadillac again. Oh wait, the XLR, 2010 SRX and 20?? Lambda Escalade, hmmm.

Only works if GM's only brands are Chevy, Buick, and Cadillac and they have 2 sales channels. Otherwise they are just Lincoln-Mercury and a big step down from what BMW and Mercedes are. Cadillac's image right now is too frail to be associated with Buick, and Buick isn't near good enough to be associated with Cadillac. (Buick-Cadillac also only works if the base model Buick is at least $28k and they don't need discounts)

Also a chapter 11 bankruptcy will likely lead to a chapter 7 liquidation unless the government loans them money and keeps them afloat while they reorganize. GM doesn't have the cash to survive chapter 11, if they filed a year ago they might have been able to. I think best case scenario is Chevy-Buick-Cadillac, and about 15% market share if they manage this well. Given Wagoner's track record, Chevy-Cadillac and 10-12% market share wouldn't surprise me.