smk4565

V12 is just special. Regardless of how many turbos or whatever you do to a V8, it still isn't a V12. And any turbo or supercharging, or hybrid systems that you put on a V8 can be put on a V12. I would like to see Cadillac offer a V12 engine, even though they don't need one, it would be cool to have.

Not only better fuel economy, but it should solve the lack of torque in the current Cruze. Unless this is a horrible diesel engine, the Cruze diesel won't only be the most economical but the fastest also. I hope the power numbers are similar to the Jetta TDI, if so, great move by Chevy.

A trip back to 2005 finds us 3 excellent and affordable options, none of which are high mileage or beat up. Merecedes S430 4Matic Audi A8 Quattro 4.2 Porsche Cayenne S with the highly desirable 340 hp V8. A 2008 Audi A6 can be had for as little as $25,000.

Isn't an LS3 (and LS2) V8 about 450 lbs? The new 5.5 liter AMG engine (non turbo for SLK) weighs 412 lbs and makes 415 hp, pretty close to the 400-424 the LS3 makes. So it isn't any lighter or more powerful. And the AMG M157 bi-turbo V8 is 450 lbs. Same weight as the LS3, far more power. The LSA is 467 lbs, so heavier, less torque, less fuel economy than the AMG M157. The McLaren 3.8 V8 makes 592 hp and weighs 439 lbs. Again lighter than the LS-series engines and more powerful than all but the LS9, which is a near 500 lb engine. The more power from less engine weight is a flawed argument. I still don't understand how a pushrod V8 is better than a DOHC V8, but a pushrod 4, 6, or 12 cylinder is not better than a DOHC. And if pushrods were so superior, why don't any of the wealthy car companies that can have any engine they want invest in one? Only the 2 bankrupt car companies still make them, plus Bentley who is using an engine from the 1960s out of some traditionalist appeal to their old school buyers.

C&D test of the '11 BMW 528 returned 71 db at "true 70", 68 at '70 cruise' w/ DOHC. "60" is a lofty goal- automakers are only going to achieve that with more & more sound deadening (= more weight). The 3-series I've seen at 66-68 dBA, but the big Cadillac needs to benchmark the most quiet cars. The Hyundai Genesis and Lexus LS460 are at 63 dBA, and the Rolls Royce Phantom is 59 at cruise. But if the Genesis can get 63 dBA, a $100,000 Cadillac should be 60-62.

I still believe pushrod engines are too loud, the Cadillac flagship is going to need an interior sound level of about 60 dBA at 70 mph. GM's most quiet car now is around 67 dBA, and their pushrod V8 cars are over 70 dBA. The 2012 Impala is another example, they switch to DOHC and they gain 91 horsepower and fuel economy goes up 1 mpg. The only reason GM still has a pushrod V8 instead of a DOHC V8 is because they don't have the money to make an all new engine. CO2 emitted is another consideration for overseas markets. For example a CTS-V gives off 13.3 tons of CO2 per year vs 11.0 tons for an S63 AMG. Even a V12 BMW 7-series has a smaller carbon footprint than the CTS-V. Which makes me think a V12 Cadillac sedan should be possible, because the the Escalade's fuel economy and carbon dioxide emissions are on par with the V12 sedans, as is the CTS-V.

The Legacy is bigger than it looks, it has a bulky design, but it is smaller than most mid-size sedans. Even the SRX V6 is 14/22 mpg, that isn't fuel efficient. The STS is 17/26 which isn't too bad, but I agree with Drew saying it is too big. Plus it is like a 65 year old's car. The MKZ gets 28 mpg hwy with FWD, but it drops to 24 mpg on the AWD model (same with the Fusion). So that is a big mark against the MKZ. A 2010 or newer Legacy with the 4-cylinder gets 23/31 mpg. It is hard to get better gas mileage than that with AWD, so if high mileage is more important than luxury, the Legacy is a better option than the MKZ. Personally I like the MKZ. The Pontiac Vibe had AWD too, plus it has EXCITEMENT!!!

Back to cars, In searching near $20k AWD cars, the results were Legacy, Impreza, Fusion/Milan, Taurus/Sable, MKZ, and higher mileage A4, 328, and C280. For equal money, the MKZ is the best Ford product, so it becomes MKZ vs Legacy, which isn't much of a contest. But $23,990 gets one a 2007 Cadillac STS V6 awd, with luxury package and navigation, moonroof, rear parking aid, chrome wheels, heated and cooled seats, and heated steering wheel.

Cheaper and FWD outsells expensive and RWD. In China the A6 (base) is priced the same as a Mercedes C200. FWD may get them volume, but RWD cars can bring more profit. And I think also as the mainstream front wheel drive cars get better and better, RWD gives a way for a luxury brand to differentiate itself. 10 years ago Cadillacs had 275-300 hp (near the limit for FWD) and Camry/Accord/Lumina type cars had 190ish with the optional V6. But now family sedans have 270 hp and are getting more and more equipment. Rear drive and suspension are ways to set a luxury car apart and get people to spend the extra money. I however would be okay with 1 FWD Cadillac for a smaller than ATS car. It could be a hatchback or a Mini/A3/B-class competitor. To attract younger and urban area buyers, Cadillac needs such a car, primarily on the international market.

#1 selling luxury brand in China is Audi (140,000 cars first 6 months of 2011), followed by BMW then Mercedes. Lexus sold 49,000 cars in China in 2010 and 410,000 worldwide. Lexus had half their global volume from the USA last year, because Lexus (like Cadillac) is designed for the North American market. This causes them to struggle in Europe and China (like Cadillac). Cadillac has sold 14,000 cars in China so far in 2011; Audi is outselling them by 10 to 1 margin. What the Chinese want seems to be similar to what the Europeans want. Volvo even outsells Cadillac in China by 3-2 margin. Cadillac needs diesels, smaller cars (ATS is the start) and a complete top to bottom line up without big gaps or weaknesses or stop gaps.

[quote name='Oldsmoboi' timestamp='1310961444' post='668413' I think the MKZ is an excellent suggestion. He already likes the Fusion, so upselling to the Lincoln wouldn't be hard. Completely disagree about the Saab interior, I like the Regal's much better, and so does he. The thing about the MKZ is it isn't much of an upsell. On the used car market, the MKZ is priced fairly close to a loaded Fusion or Milan. Fusions on average run a few thousand cheaper, but most of them have 4-cylinder, FWD, cloth, etc. With the MKZ it is easy, they pretty must have all the equipment standard, and it seems like 60% of them are AWD. There was also less styling change at the 2010 refresh, so the 2008 MKZ looks more current than the 2008 Fusion. The other sensible option for economical AWD is Subaru. On the SRX, they would fit the price target, but they are also like 195 inches long and even the V6 isn't that efficient in there. The running costs on that would be higher than on an AWD sedan. I am disappointed in this thread however, no one has brought up the Pontiac Aztec and all wheel drive motoring doesn't get any more exciting than that.

They don't need a big line up, 3 car lines (with sedans, coupes, wagons, convertible mixed in) and 2 SUV lines all done well is what they need. But they have to have eery model be a home run, so that they can sell them anywhere in the world with minor tweaking for each market. The Germans already have a huge lead in China also. Cadillac sells like 20-30,000 cars a year there, Audi sells 200,000. Cadillac hardly has solid footing in the USA, they are 4th in sales, but Audi, Acura, Lincoln and Infiniti aren't too far behind them. Although 2 of those brands I don't see catching up any time soon. In foreign markets Cadillac has no footing, they need to get in to the emerging places before those countries become super loyal to German brands too.

You can. I saw a CTS with AWD and direct injection for $23k. I think it had 50-60k miles though, but I seem to remember a less well equipped CTS with fewer miles for the same price.

We're searching for a car due to reliability problems in our Honda and you're recommending an X-Type and a 9-3? Our CR-V has a metal antenna now... I don't think he'd care. I certainly don't. Well that is why I originally thought MKZ, because it has all the desired features, it is ranked near the top in JD Power quality and reliability, and the MKZ is one of the most fuel efficient AWD V6's out there. The MKZ meets all of the previously stated criteria and is available in any color for near $20,000. With all the people here that like the Regal GS at near $40k, and are clamoring for the Insignia OPC with the turbo V6, I thought the Saab would get more love. It has the Haldex AWD, the 2.8 turbo V6 from the SRX and Opel, better looks than the Buick, better interior than the Buick, half the price of the Buick. That Saab has what all the Regal and SRX lovers like at half the price. But at the same time, I wouldn't buy a Saab because it will break down all the time. There are Audi A4's for $20k. Personally not my sort of car, but my mom has an 07 with over 100k miles on it, no major repairs, in fact I don't think anything has broken on it. And the 2.0 will average 25 mpg even with our hills and traffic.

Well as much as I like this X-type for under $19,000: http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=302720252&dealer_id=64481301&car_year=2007&systime=&doors=&model=9-3&search_lang=en&start_year=2006&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=both&distance=50&min_price=&rdm=1310952683837&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=&fuel=&keywords_display=&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2009&make3=&showZipError=n&make2=JAG&certified=&engine=&dma=PITTSBURGH_NO&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=&default_sort=priceDESC&max_mileage=&color=&address=15202&sort_type=priceDESC&model2=XTYPE&max_price=25000&make=SAAB&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=8&standard=false THE SEARCH ENDS HERE! I personally wouldn't buy it (because it almost certainly will break down) but the fanboys will love it. http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=303243117&dealer_id=566566&car_year=2008&model=9-3&pager.offset=0&search_lang=en&start_year=2006&search_type=both&distance=50&rdm=1310952683837&marketZipError=false&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2009&showZipError=n&make2=JAG&dma=PITTSBURGH_NO&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&first_record=1&default_sort=priceDESC&address=15202&sort_type=priceDESC&model2=XTYPE&max_price=25000&make=SAAB&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=8&standard=false I can see the point of an AWD Hyundai because their new cars are quite good, have good value and you get the mega warranty. But $26k for a Compass? I sat in one of those at the auto show, the interior is produced by Rubbermaid and it has a metal antenna from the 80s. $28k for a Tiguan that looks like a roller skate? I think not. Chrysler products will likely break and depreciate like a rock thrown off a cliff and the Taurus is massive. My 3 selections are hard to beat.

2008 Lincoln MKZ, heated AND cooled seats. $21,000. http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=302439046&dealer_id=566807&car_year=2008&model=MKZ&pager.offset=50&search_lang=en&start_year=2006&scarid=302439046&search_type=both&distance=50&rdm=1310952084582&marketZipError=false&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2009&showZipError=y&make2=CAD&dma=PITTSBURGH_NO&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&first_record=51&default_sort=priceDESC&address=15202&sort_type=priceDESC&model2=CTS&max_price=25000&make=LINC&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=23&standard=false

Can it be a used car? If so how old? 2006 Mercedes E350 4Matic with 41k miles for $22k. Hits all the criteria except for the fuel economy part.

Jobs and investment is good for Flint which could really use it. But GM already has too much inventory of full size trucks right now. It isn't like they need extra capacity for GMT900s. Unless this is for medium duty truck chassis for dump trucks, school busses, etc.

Lucerne has 108 cubic feet of interior room. The Genesis, Equus and S-class are all 109 cu ft. Now that the Town Car is dead, those cars are about as big as it gets. Unless you look at a Rolls or Maybach which is more limo than car. But isn't something like 90% of driving done with only one person in the car? Small and mid-size cars are roomier than ever now also, the huge car has been on decline for years. I think for the better also, because small cars 10-15 years ago offered practically no equipment at all, now you have power everything, heated leather seats, sat-nav, even self parking aides in compact cars.

Agreed on being profitable in all markets. Cadillac may never be a big seller in Europe, but 1,000 cars a year isn't going to cut it, at that level they are probably losing money. Cadillac outside of the USA is sort of what Saab is in the USA, and that isn't going to work. I think they need to get to where 50% of their sales are from outside the USA and get to 350-400k annual global sales volume. But everything has to be right, if they make a good ATS, then blow the flagship totally, they lose credibility. Any negatives in their product line or marketing is going to drag down or cancel out their positives.

I believe that Cadillac's strategy of 2015-2020 should be to go all in. They can't hold back, or do things when they get around to it, or do what the think is "good enough." Every car they design has to be able to sell internationally as well as domestically. So they need DOHC, diesels, some form of hybrid assist, etc. Americans may not expect a diesel, but in Europe (and China) they do. Cadillac needs the ATS, CTS and whatever the s-class fighter is with the ability to sell all over the world. The American market is saturated, if Cadillac sits here and doesn't go global they become Lincoln and Lincoln is headed to the grave. I also think Cadillac needs to get some outside help. Cadillac doesn't fully understand the luxury car market, so they roll out cars like the XLR-V or STS-V that have big price tags and big horsepower and lousy trim and fit and finish. Or you'll see the leatherette wrapped dash with stitching that looks nice, and then the door panel is cheap plastic. Do they think a customer will only look at 50% of the interior? Their cars, their lineup, their brand image is all inconsistent. They have to solve all this at once to make an impact.

Lucerne is quite big, my Aurora is bigger than I wish it was, and the Lucerne is another 5-6 inches longer than that. Although for as it is on the outside, they don't make the best of that space on the inside. The Lucerne is bigger than needed, and that is probably why it is dead now. The Lacrosse even looks big, because it has a high and bulky look to it, likewise with the Taurus/MKS. These huge FWD sedans are a dying breed.

I don't buy that diesels are noisy or slow. A BMW 335d at 70 mph cruise is quieter than a CTS or LaCrosse, it is even more quiet than a 335i. The 335d does 0-60 in 5.9 seconds, that matches or beats any CTS 3.6 times I've seen. Yes it is a bit heavier and slower than a 335i, but it also get 36 mpg. I am not necessarily saying that diesel is better than gasoline, I am saying that Cadillac should offer both of them.

E350 Bluetec is $1,500 more than the gas version. The gas car is 0-60 in 6.5 seconds, the diesel is 6.7 seconds. The diesel gets 10 miles per gallon better on the high way though. 10 mpg difference is significant. Sure most customers won't want a diesel, but some will and I think it smart to appeal to as many people as possible. Cadillac has to do something, they can't just offer V6s when Lincoln, Lexus and Infiniti have hybrids and the Germans have diesels. Cadillac has to have a high mileage option. I would say that come 2015 both the ATS and CTS should have a powertrain option that gets 35 mpg.

I'll take it in a smaller car also. I think Mercedes is crazy for not putting the diesel V6 in the C-class. If it gets 34 mpg in the E-class, I bet they could get 36 in the C-class. And that engine has 400 lb-ft of torque now, but for 2012 there is an upgraded version with 455 lb-ft (240 hp) for the M-class and S-class. Imagine a C350 bluetec with AMG level torque and 36 mpg. Likewise an ATS with more torque than a Corvette or Escalade that gets compact car fuel economy. I'd put a diesel on the ATS, CTS, and full size rwd sedan if Cadillac ever gets one. BMW needs a 535d to go with the 335d also.