smk4565

ATS and CTS are important, the next CTS if it takes the low mass engineering of the ATS combined with the interior of the XTS could be a winner. But what is the difference between Infiniti and Audi, BMW, and Mercedes? The G37 and M37/45 are both good cars and are in the volume segments, yet no roadster/sports car and no flagship in their line. Infiniti lacks the full line and prestige the Germans have.

No car sells at full retail, no idea what Mercedes discounts for fleet or other use. But Mercedes in the first quarter 2012 had more net income ($1.4 billion) than GM or Ford, so the profit margin per car must be very high. GM sold 2.2 million vehicles in the first quarter, Daimler (with trucks) sold 420,00, yet made more money. Their business model works. I agree people mostly shop by size and of course body style and price point. The XTS is over 1 foot longer than an E-class though, and the Mercedes buyer is a bit more upscale than the Cadillac buyer. A Hyundai Equus is actually a better target for the XTS, other than the MKS and ES350 which is the same sort of car just smaller. Mercedes still has a flagship, they have the S-class, and the Pullman coming with the new model. Maybach isn't needed and was a money drain on Daimler.

It was the retail price with the value added tax that Mercedes and Cadillac list on their websites. I am not so opposed to Cadillac having a fleet/livery model, but it would be nice if it was a rear driver at least. Or at least have Cadillac call it what it is and compare it to the MKS and smaller ES350, and not make comparisons to the A6 or E350 on the Cadillac website. If you click the competitive comparison link on cadillac.com if by default brings up an A6 2.0T FWD and an E350. How is a mid-size rear drive sedan a direct competitor for a FWD large car? This is what is so frustrating about Cadillac, either they are really stupid, or they think the consumer is. Saying the XTS competes with the E350 is like saying the Toyota Avalon and ATS compete because they cost the same and have 4 doors, leather, and a V6. For Cadillac to really compete with the 3 German midsizers, they need the CTS to outdo the XTS interior, then get 8 gears and new V6 and V8 engines. And once the CTS has every bell and whistle from the XTS, a better chassis, better transmission, better engine, better steering and handling, what is the point of the XTS? It will become irrelevant like the STS became.

BMW and Benz are still the top luxury brands in Europe though. And German police and taxi companies must like the durability and longevity of Mercedes, because they could use an Opel, a Ford, or VW Passat but they choose not to use those cars despite being cheaper. An E250 diesel w/ automatic in Germany is 50,900 Euro with the VAT, a CTS 3.0 V6 automatic is 50,400 Euro with VAT. Mercedes does make a few E-class models with 4 cylinder and manual for the low 40s, but I wouldn't call that Chevy/Buick level. 42,000 Euros is still $52,000, granted 19% of that is tax, but it is actually cheaper to buy a Mercedes here than in Germany by the exchange rate and the taxes over there.

^^ Good points, but I don't think the XTS engine will change in a year or even at all during the life cycle. The Deville/DTS basically went 1994-2011 with the same engine, and this is the same sort of car. It is sold to buyers who aren't looking for performance.

That is too much red.

Very true. There are a lot of Toyota loyalists that will never go elsewhere. Lexus vehicles are reliable, and those buyers don't seem to care about style, performance, handling, good looks, etc, they just like the reliability of their appliance.

That does not appear to have much "sport" in it.

Agreed on CUE not being a good fit for the target demographic of the XTS, but I think they are trying to make an old person's car appeal to younger buyers by offering technology in it. Not sure that it will be cheaper to own or more reliable than an E-class, or depreciate less. Mercedes was #6 in long term dependability in JD Power this year, Cadillac was slightly ahead, but Buick and Chevy behind (and there is a lot of Buick and Chevy in this car). We already know this car will be fleeted a lot also, the DTS and Town Car had miserable resale values, Mercedes usually hold value fairly well. But I also think people buying an E-class are concerned about "cheap to own" they want the best car on the market from the most prestigious brand. Although I don't see many people cross shopping the XTS with an E-class or A6 even.

Well Cadillac's website lists the Audi A6 and Mercedes E-class as the competitors for the XTS, but I thought that was what the CTS was for? Once again the product planning fails. I don't get why they even list those, Cadillac can't seriously think this car competes with the E-class.

I like the new Escape, Ford has a really good design theme going now.

MKS got a turbo in 2009, not like it helped any. Not sure how much cash the XTS will infuse, and it does nothing for the brand image, which is the area Cadillac needs the most work.

Looks like it will be a blend of the current car and an oversized GS. Hopefully the horrible looks scare the old folks away and people stop buying this car. With carryover engines, it is going to look rather underpowered compared to the Germans. Actually, it will look underpowered compared to the Hyundais.

XTS isn't going to get another engine. They can't put a V8 in a front drive car (well they could but they don't have one and it is pointless), and a 4-cylinder is too weak for that much weight. The only option down the line would be a turbo V6, but GM hasn't seemed in much of a hurry to develop one. And more power means more torque steer, and it still doesn't solve the transmission, unless they make a new tranny as well.

In Caprice trim it looks much more rental grade than the G8 did. To me this car looks really cheap and not worth the money. You could find a slightly more used CTS for the same money and on the CTS they at least bothered to paint the door handles the same color as the rest of the car.

Not for $4500, maybe $3500

I have read four reviews on the XTS, all like the interior, which is a good sign for future Cadillacs that materials and build quality seem to be up. All liked CUE, but complained about the slowness and fingerprints on the screen, so a few bugs to work out there perhaps. Personally I don't like the LCD or TFT screens for speedometers, but it seems many are going that way. All the reviews also brought up the steering, engine and transmission as weak points and drew it back to being based on Malibu/LaCrosse underpinnings. The XTS seems to be typical of GM, they get a lot right, but miss in key areas and come up short. They can't seem to put together the total package. And no matter what you do with the interior, it is still a LaCrosse underneath. I think the cars.com review was the best, as the guy said would he buy an XTS over an A6 for equal money, heck no. And if you just want a soft cruiser, (and most old folks won't care about the technology) why not save $15,000 and get an Avalon, Azera, LaCrosse or ES350. I see this as the problem with the XTS (and MKS also) it doesn't really target a big demographic.

The wheels really hurt it, otherwise I like it.

Autoblog posted a review of the XTS, they liked the interior and the soft highway ride, but said the powertrain was a major disappointment. My guess is the current powertrain is all it gets, so the XTS could get uncompetitive quickly.

SV6 just like the Pontiac Montana. That will create EXCITEMENT!!!

Or, it can simply be that GM does not have a suitable Hybrid drive train for the XTS. The Volt's is too underpowered and not particularly adaptable use the 3.6 V6 as the ICE. A BAS-II system ala Buick LaCrosse does not do enough to be worth marketing. An all new system for the XTS does not not have enough volume to make a reasonable business case on its own. The XTS could have been the springboard for a new hybrid system that would then be spread to other vehicles, just like the CUE system. Again, the XTS was pitched as a sumptuous, techno-cruiser for people that want a comfy ride and plenty of toys. Similar to the Phaeton. Not implementing a new hybrid system just feels like a missed opportunity. They pitched it that way, but GM likes to over sell and under deliver. This car was never going to be more than a fancy LaCrosse. Although I think they are making the right move, because GM doesn't have a good hybrid system, they don't sell many hybrids to begin with, and the XTS target market won't buy it.

It is still front wheel drive (with awd added on). Adding more power to a bad handling car just makes it a faster, bad handling car which is a scary thought.

Glad to see more rear wheel drive.

I'd say Jeers if buying it as a collectible. Roadsters or sporty cars, sometimes luxury cars are much better for that. Pickup trucks basically look the same over generations so they aren't as interesting as cars that have more styling changes through the decades. And at $17k you could get a more modern pick up if it was going to be a daily driver.

Nor surprising, as luxury hybrids don't sell well. On a smaller car like an MKZ or Lexus ES it may work, but not at the XTS's price point, nor the demographic that will buy it. A diesel makes more sense, especially for the livery market that wants durability and better fuel mileage. But I suspect the XTS for it's lifespan has only the 3.6 V6 and 6-speed auto combo.