Cory Wolfe

To be honest, who cares? It wasn't exactly a great vehicle. I'd rather mourn over many others that will be no more.

Say it with me: Assumptions. A Cobalt is 94% the size of the Malibu and 88% of it's weight. Oh noes!!!!1!1!!

I think I reached 1k back in '04.

It wasn't nearly as affordable, costing over $10k more than what the Genesis bases at. As such, it's going to have limited appeal at that price. It would have been great to have a full line of Monaros imported over with the GTO given more unique styling above to rest to appease those who couldn't appreciate the design. Could have made a great line of Grand Prixs in the lower trims with that one SEMA concept representing the actual GTO. Unfortunately, all these 'what if's' and imagining what could have saved the brand doesn't change anything.

I'm using it in the same vein as that, which was my point. Again, I'm not going to deny any claims that one is more heavilly (literally) engineered than the other. However, if we only have similar amount of proof, what does it really matter? Regardless of what 'package' is packing more power, its not very good proof of anything. As I said, I'd like to see the raw data to support the claims made by others, not simply "company X has tested this amount of power in car Y". I don't care what people may have stated against GM. It's completely irrelevant and I'm not in that boat. Simply put, I don't agree to stooping to that level to prove a point as so many do here. I've rallied against this many times in the past and I always get the same old line. Honestly, why bother? Are you really going to solve anything by stooping to a lower level? No. I personally love how anytime someone defends a foreign car here, it's met with all of this bull$h!... And I really doubt it has anything to do with the cars themselves. Per the car itself, again, I'm not comparing it to the Camaro. As far as I'm concerned, they don't compete directly. As I've been saying, both are great cars. Those "facts" are like saying a Lamborghini isn't as good as a Ferrari. The differences are so little and the cars are both compelling in similar, and in different, ways. One caters a more mature demographic with more emphasis on grabbing you with its design and higher performing trim levels while the other caters to a younger, more tuner oriented demographic focusing on refinement and modern trends... One puts a modern, yet history rich twist on an existing segment that's been dominated by its arch rival, while the other revives a segment that hasn't been popular since the 80s. Yet, both of them do it for an affordable price without many compromises. Two thoroughly well rounded coupes that do that they are intended to do, and do so very well.

Marilyn Manson - Get You Gunn.

Two more.

-Shot of Knox Dale, Pa from approximately 4 miles away. -Random closeups of the Cutlass. -Detail shots of blooms around the house.

I finally took the time to sort through all the pictures I've taken thus far this year. Click to enlarge the thumbnails. -From a light display in Altoona, Pa. -The last two pictures of my Jetta, taken a week before the accident. -Taken in Dubois H.S., Dubois, Pa. -Millenia. -Random shots from around Ramsaytown. -Aftermath of a fire that destroyed the Perkins restaurant in Dubois, Pa a few weeks ago. -Sunset from around Dubois, Pa.

I have no doubts about what you said, it's just the principle of the matter. If you're going to say I'm mistaken, prove it. Otherwise, there's nothing to consider besides some claim by some fanatical forum member. If someone says "You're wrong, but I can't prove how", are you really going to listen? Per the Genesis, I'm not going to doubt that Camaro most likely is more heavilly engineered, despite the lack of any proof. However, one of the comments made was based on how Zeta is engineered to handle the extra power of whatever GM may throw at it. In the same vein, the Genesis coupe is on a shared platform, as well, with the Genesis sedan and Equus, available with a 375 hp V8. Then, to also consider is the Genesis coupe in Formula Drift competition thats currently making nearly 500 hp on a light dyno run and an engine they're still tuning. Considering that's the same argument being used to show the Camaro is engineered to handle more power, I could easily go ahead and make the same claims for the Genesis coupe that everyone and their mother are making for the Camaro. As I said, what's the difference? Neither you nor myself have actual proof, so who's right? That is why I stand here defending the Genesis. What argument? You have no argument. You've said absolutely nothing that means anything to anyone other than yourself. Again, this segment has been dead for years. I agree with many others that say the Genesis and Camaro are not direct competition. The fact they can compete so well is surprising, for both vehicles. Each one is a class act that are going after a different audience. The problem is, only one is receiving the recognition it deserves here. Why? "It's not as good as its touted to be." Why? "A fifteen year old car it doesn't compete with is so much better." Why? "It just competes, it doesn't beat cars outside its competition." Why? "It's not engineered as well." Why? "It doesn't have heritage styling." Why? "Others have been doing this for decades." Why? "It's a Hyundai." Over and over; assumptions, senselessness, lack of anything fact-based and the stupidest reasoning possible. No facts. No equality or fairness. That is why I stand here defending the Genesis. Seriously, does anyone have anything to add that's not the same old $h!, regurgitated again and again throughout this thread? No one can provide me with any facts to back up anything they say.

Facts that show what? I'm not saying the Genesis is any better than the Camaro. I said it can compete. What you posted shows that to be true. How much of that is solely to handle the power, however? What is a 'significant portion' defined as? Unless you have specific figures to prove anything, don't tell me I'm mistaken. Tell me exactly how much of that weight went towards being able to handle 40% more power than what's offered and where that weight is. I would love to hear the specifics. If I'm wrong, show me the data to prove it. What I'd like to see even more is the data to prove the Camaro is any more engineered to handle that power than the Genesis. Both platforms were engineered for V8s and both platforms are being equipped with tuned engines in certain motorsports. Show me how they differ and I'll listen.

Because I can... The naysayers with nary a clue are just as predictable as any rag. You might as well join Reg in arguing senseless points full of assumptions and lacking in facts all day long. It really doesn't make any difference in how successful the Genesis will or will not be. Two closed-minded individuals posting on a small scale forum with a general anti-Import agenda isn't going to change any opinions. You're singing to the choir.

The Millenia is fireproof. Sorry.

There are, indeed, some very nice photographs in that collection.

The Cobalt idles around 1500 on a cold start.

Okay Reg. Thanks for your valuable insight.

Because a Hyundai badge has had so much merit? It has nothing to do with the badge. The Genesis would not lose a single ounce of attention whether if it were a Ford, Mitsubishi, Toyota, or even a brain zapping Yugo. To discredit this car with such a statement is absurd. A company goes out and makes a world-class car, shattering the less than stellar stigma this company has... and suddenly this company's badge means something. Well. The Genesis really has done its job. It's brought the crazies out of the woodwork who insist its badge dilutes the mind of all whom show interest. Fascinating, Reg, truly fascinating. Oh, and the Eclipse is a tub of lard. It doesn''t deserve being mentioned in the same reign as either car in this comparison. Next.

Some sort of image editing software helps, indeed.

Oh, I forgot, I also saw a '65ish Catalina in all its wide-track glory.

You forgot to focus. The BMW still looks schmexy.

I've done the opposite of cut back.

I can understand the Genesis isn't going to appeal to most on this forum over the Camaro for the shear sake of the styling. We all know it's no Camaro in the styling department. With that said, its only one possible fault. As impressive as the Camaro is without considering its styling, it is, perhaps, even more impressive that the Genesis can compete with it, let alone outperform it in a comparison such as MT's. It's been said that GM can make a world class vehicle... when it feels like it. But Hyundai?! Do you remember what they were making just 15 years ago? To come from that, to competing with arguably the best bunch of sports car Detroit has had to offer in a while, as well as the best from Japan and Europe... It's pretty surprising. Pontiac could have greatly benefited from its own Genesis coupe. Again, I don't think this comparison has any real loser. It was fairly close with it being decided on a slight performance edge and a few minor nitpicks. It speaks greatly about both vehicles.

Hmm... the side glass on that Probe looks similar to the Volt's.

Subjective. I'm not entirely sure what 'early '90s econo' cars you're looking at... I'm probably far more in tune with what the '90s had to offer and nothing comes to mind bearing any resemblance whatsoever. Celica? Nope. Prelude? Not a chance. 240SX? Hardly. Probe? That's a funny one. MX6? Perhaps after a few bottles of Vodka. Grand Am? Might as well start smoking crack in addition to the Vodka to see a resemblance. Corrado? Okay, okay... That's enough. I wouldn't say the Genesis' design is revolutionary by any means, but its not terrible. Its a fairly attractive sports coupe. Besides, what about the opening pic is flattering to either car? The Camaro is too dark to see any details of the design besides the snout cut-out around the headlights.