Flybrian

Also consider the fact that for a few years, the entire Buick lineup consisted of two platforms spawning four sedans, one of which being overpriced and two of the others being virtually the same vehicle with drivetrain and minor cosmetic differences. If it didn't die then, why would it die now? This is almost like a bad SNL skit. Top story tonight: Buick Motor Division is still...not dead.

Yeah, pretty much.

What's even sadder is that there are people out there in this world who are irredeemable monsters, a group of people whose actions are so henious, so damaging, so disgusting they deserve to forfeit their life. Its my personal belief that many if not most non-sexual criminals can be rehabilitated to varying degrees but people like child rapists, torture killers, and the like aren't worth the time or effort to keep around for anything.

Caprices are still the best squad cars despite their age and the fact they haven't been made in a decade. Crown Vics are tame & lame by comparison.

Don't ask me, I'm just translating.

He's prediciting the low-line Tundras will have the chintzy black plastic grille surround currently found on low-line Tacomas. The cheap crap that looks like this... Something no GM truck has to that obvious degree. http://www.autobase.com/photos/large/02262728.jpg Ouch. Sorry.

I'm just going to read the above post again anytime I need a good laugh. And if you're referring to the Lucerne with your last statement, yeah, the Northstar is such a piece of $h!.

I think you need to clarify, BV. Overhang is necessary on any car while excessive overhang is an issue. As far as the Grand Prix goes, look at the Ford trio or just about any French car for equally or more-bad overhangs.

Hehe. A Mazda1 would probably be a subcompact, but somehow Mazdaspeed1 sounds more like a cable TV network than a car.

Translated, they're shouting, "We're here, we're queer!"

Agreed. So, to get this thread back on topic (there's a topic?), Ocn's last comment made me think of... ...commandos. But they're Iraqi commandos, meaning they're worth like one Danish soldier, one Russian conscript, or perhaps two nutjob Americans with guns.

My eighth Sonata in a row...with rental barcodes. Yes, folks, that's an unbroken succession of rented Hyundais.

Why, out of everything you can make, would you make that?

They do need more colors. The colors now are limited to a select few that really look good and bring out the decent looks of the highline models. Regarding the starting price, last time I checked Chrysler > Dodge...was this information not communicated during the merger? I to this day will not comprehend why Chrysler insists on - forgive the pun - charging less for the Charger with more equipment (stability control!!) and a better engine (3.5l vs. 2.7!!) than it does for a Chrysler with less. What shocks me more are people aside from Dollar who buy that 190hp 300 when there's a Charger across town that's more well-equipped for less. Even you have to admit...that grille ain't that nice.

Even in the second pic, the stack doesn't look that 'premium', especially with that freaking pea-green radio display!! Ugh.

Is this "So is your mom" style of argument really necessary?

You know, I thought I wouldn't have to do this but... What I wrote? Sarcasm.

See the bed? That's where you put your Tundra.

IMO, the 300 is a mixed bag. Peep the generally unadorned rear comapared to the front, especially the taillamps. To me, the design relies too much on the waffle grille and low greenhouse because nothing else about the car sticks out except its total blockiness and somewhat stunted trunk. The market is overflooded with these things and I see way too many of them to even be mildly appreciative anymore. They're like square Camries in my eyes, especially since 3/5 I see around here are rentals or wannabe 2.7ls that look like this... ...replete with blank grille insets, afterthought amber reflectors, plastic trim, plastic mirrors, and plastic wheel covers.

Incentives and fleet sales. I really don't see what's appealing about a Sentra over its competition.

By 'magic' I hope you mean 'flair for style,' because the 300 box o' cues shouldn't be replicated on a smaller scale.

And yet, they didn't do crap with the Sentra for its whole life.

There is great truth in that. Yet, let's not be so quick to continue holding up Toyota on its pedestal. Its clear to many objective people that for the past generation or so, the majority of their product has been resting on Toyota's once-deserve laurels. The 2002 Camry, 2000 Avalon, 2000 Rav4, and 2003 Corolla are all vehicles that didn't own up to Toyota's accolades in certain aspects and to varying degrees. All brands of all manufacturers go through their natural crests and troughs. I'm not going to amplify Ven's repeated and very valid points vis a vis Avalon. While the Lucerne lacks a potent midlevel V6 and some interior accruments, the Avalon lacks interior and cargo volume and some levels of content. We could go on, but the horse has long since passed. One thing I would like to expound upon is the tone a few people have around here lately. I'm not naming names because you probably know who you are, on-both-sides. When I see someone being badgered and critisized on their opinion because it differs from your own, it raises a flag. When I see comments akin to "All those ignorant Jap lovers" or "All those ignorant GM fanboys", that sets off the alarm. Together, it results in a line being drawn in the sand. We should all be able to handle ourselves maturely without the snide winks and public asides about "us" and "them." We have for a long, long time and I don't see how something as trivial as dash materials causes people to act like that. If someone thinks the lower dash on the Lucerne is fine, they're not an idiot or a blind follower - they just don't think its a big deal. If someone thinks the lower dash on the Lucerne is crap, they're not a moron or a troll - they just think it should be better. Thank you.

One thing that is getting tiresome as of late are these accusations about people sitting in cars. Now, I admit I myself have alluded to it once or twice in the past and I have remarked in the past that we shouldn't completely rail or praise a car's material texture based soley on a picture and until we've sat in it. But the tone this has taken lately is annoying. When one opines in a way contrary to your opinion, it doesn't mean they haven't 'sat in the car' and 'sat in the car' should not be a catch-all qualifier for the validity of one's opinions. For the record, I've sat in the Lucerne and of all the things that would make me not consider this car, the dash plastics aren't one of them. To me, it doesn't matter that much. But, remember, I sat in the car, apparently unlike Cananopie, so that makes my opinion worth more.

Just so you know, EPA ratings foretell that the V6 isn't really that economical, even compared to a V8.