91z4me

Umm...I don't think your particular market is ANY indication of either suburban areas in Canada or the US market at all. Corvette essentially OWNS the V8 2 seat coupe/targa/convertible market and makes enough profit per car to fund all of its future development (including the Z06 and Blue Devil). A V8 only targa/convertible car won't sell well in a colder climate urban setting vs a warm climate open road setting (California). MC is dead after this year, everone knows it. The car is just not competitive anymore (though I am willing to wager that it makes a profit). The Cobalt outsells the Pursuit/G5 in the US as well as Canada, with the US being a total non competition. The Wave is a rebadge of the Aveo/Kalos and sells purely based on price and appearance. The Suburban/Silverado sell in suburban areas (imagine that). Take a look at what has kept GM afloat for the last decade and you will see. They likely don't sell well in your area because it is a large metropolitan area that is better suited for car usage vs trucks (likely the same in NY). Add in the higher price of gas in Canada and their general preffrence for smaller cars and you can easily see that your experience isn't the norm.

[zing]Ok, Mr. Tiny![/zing]

Wheelhop ring a bell?

Let me just say I am glad that Toyota is on the UAW's radar now and that workers need protection in some areas to avoid being bullied by a large company, just like this. That being said I have something I want to say to Mrs. York: Then quit. Kentucky is an at will state. You can leave whenever you want! If it is to tough on you to do the work or work during your scheduled shift then quit! My mom works a job that is MUCH harder than handing out printed papers and though she complains quite a bit (and trust me I hear it) she understands that her job is why she makes money and her job is tough and she will do it until she either can't stand it anymore OR doesn't need the money anymore.That is life. Get over it!

Well that would give Lincoln a new niche on which to build.

If this has an air ride suspension I would stear clear.

You also didn't mention that the engine is completely vertical. The VQ's stroke is at an angle not vertical, making it shorter. That is the problem. If the Atlas was mounted at a 45 degree angle it would package easily into the upcoming Zetas.

Yeah because they are the only automaker in Ohio.GM has at least 9 plants in Ohio.

B segment Touring Coupe (coupe of the BLS most likely).

I won't concede that because I don't believe it to be true. I have a 97 MC Z34. Arguably one of the least reliable engines that GM has ever made. And guess what it has never left me stranded. It has had problems, alternator and O2, sensor but that is nothing to be shocked of seeing on a then 8 year old car. The interior while filled with hard plastic doesn't have any cracks or fitment issues, the paint is in good shape except where it has been dinged. I have ridden in several ES300s/Camrys from around 2000 and none of them were perfect. Sure it is individual results and is not statistically relevent but I can't ignore my own eyes and ears. I don't know how to find those long term reports but if you find them be sure to post. Even if they 'prove' me wrong.People left GM/Ford/Chrysler because they made sub-par products at various points in the 70s/80s/90s. Each company had a bad period. GM's 80s cars pretty much sucked (especially the early ones). Ford had reoccuring paint problems in the 80s-90s as well as various engine problems and couldn't make an automatic transmission to save a baby. Chrysler cheaped out on lots of small things that make me not consider any of their 90s models despite the nice interiors/exteriors. But Toyota has made crap also. It is just that those 'anomolies' are forgotten because people believe what is reported as truth (rarely the case).

Are you sure you have the conversion of $ to Euro's right? It seems that there is something off.

Does JD Powers agree that GM is behind? How about Ford? Wasn't there a study done recently that put the Fusion ABOVE Camry and Accord? Sure problems from the past can be brought up for fun. But how about we talk about current stuff. Toyota, GM, and all the big players have large amounts of recalls. What do we know? The GMT900s, Lambdas, revised Impala have launched w/out a hitch. The current F150, Mustang, 500, and Fusion all without problems. The Avalon and Camry launches both had problems w/ transmissions (IIRC). The Tundra seems to be doing quite well and I hope it doesn't fall flat on its face because they are in a new high volume plant w/ many new employees. If they were smart they would slow growth and make sure quality is up before rushing out to be #1.

My guess on the new front end.

A little lite reading for you tonight.http://www.allpar.com/cr.html

The Camaro will be in production w/in 1.5 years. The GR1 concept could be on the streets now if Ford hadn't decided not to produce the car. I can't see the attatchment but unless it comes with a 340 hp V8 5speed auto SLA front suspension and 5 link rear for under $27K it isn't competing w/ the Charger or the upcoming Pontiac G8, which a Passat will not do. And it is cool knowing what Europeans think of American cars.

There fixed that for you. Where's your data to back up your assesment? Otherwise you guys arguing are just waving your weiners at each other talking about who's is bigger. Data or this 'arguement' is just a waste.

I don't quite think that is true. There is a few examples but US automakers have a LOT more. Basically anything sporty from the 60s-70s will be aggressive. Because European cars are smaller and tend to have more lux features whereas American cars tend to be larger and have less luxury equipment at a given price point. This is due to higher fuel costs in Europe vs the US, different needs by owners, and displacement/cylinder taxes leveled by European countries (which hurts the consumer's choice for performance). That isn't what I would call as attractive. It looks like a 10+ year old minivan. THAT is design! That is HOT!!! It seems your Euro-centric view is clouded, just like our American-centric view. But seriously what European marques could put out something as tough and exotic looking as the Camaro concept?

No, and they aren't available either. Except for Supercars of course. Americans in general aren't to fond of the French, speaking for myself and those I know. No they are mostly odd looking. No. No. I think by here you mean the site. Of course we think that it is what we grew up with and we know. Big and powerful is what most American's have wanted for decades, it is what sells. I like some European cars, but in a different way than American cars. The two are mostly totally different classes.

Big problem there is packaging. The Atlas engines are vertical and have a long stroke, so they are tall. They won't package well in the VE/Zeta cars, if they fit at all. If the Atals engines were designed to be slant mounted I would say sure but the fact is they weren't and so they just don't fit. That being said I would love to see the 291 I6 in any car, it would certainly be an interesting swap into a 3rd gen for instance. But I don't expect it to live on much longer due to packaging issues. And I am sure you will.

Are you SURE about that?

That is a V8 in the bay so that isn't at the Kappa plant. It seems like it would be the Vette plant in BG.

I think you mean 2 series. And I like it better than the new 3 series.

And add that GM will be using the 3.6 in Sigma Caddies, VE Holdens, all Epsilon cars, all Lambdas, all Thetas, and in the oversease pickups. It looks like the 3.6 will actually a be very high volume engine.

Just some supporting evidence for the 3.6http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...c=17317&hl=

I am hanging in here but won't be done until December 09. 32 credit hours this semseter, I will work up to at least 35 in the next few years. It will suck but at least when I graduate I should be done with 5 different national boards and will be ready to enter practice.