VenSeattle

My statement: I'll reword it: Why do I feel this way? GM's interiors, especially Cadillac & Chevrolet, have long been criticized for looking too busy and comprising of too many parts. Too many pieces lead to consistently poor fit & finish because there is more potential for error during assembly. It also provides the potential for more squeaks & rattles as parts become loose with usage. This issue is a legitimate concern for the new Avalon because I’ve yet to sit in one where the dash pieces were all aligned properly. Also, the silver painted plastic doors on the center stack and console feel flimsy. This helps to contribute doubt about interior material quality. IMO, the new Avalon interior has dropped in quality. The 2nd generation Avalon interior was much higher.

I've been to Pearl Harbor... I didn't think it would move me as much as it did... but WOW. Very emotional experience. I learned so much about the event there. It takes hours to thoroughly go through the museum. As Fly said, Tora! Tora! Tora! is the most factually accurate movie ever made about Pearl Harbor. Even if you don't like war movies, see it.

The entire center console on the ES330 is hard plastic (and not finished very well)... check it out. The Lucerne lower dash is the same as the Passat: hard but low gloss/high quality plastic with nice texture. Styling is subjective and depends on the target demographic. The Lucerne's interior quality IS EQUAL and/or ABOVE its class. It's traditionally styled on purpose. That does NOT make it inferior though. It's only a matter of taste/preference. The Avalon has fixed hard plastic hooks for garments in the back seat along with “rental car grade” mouse fur used as head liner. The Lucerne uses woven fabric for the head liner and A & C pillars along with dampened hooks in the back seat that retract when not in use. The Lucerne does not have LED dash lighting but the gauges do not look economy class by any means. They have a similar look/feel to them as a Jaguar. The Avalon’s interior also offers faux wood which is no more convincing than the lucerne’s (although in application, the Avalon’s dash seems to suffer from too many pieces that don’t seem to fit together perfectly) You also forget that many items are optional, not standard on the Passat & Avalon. Even though they have some features that the Lucerne does not have… the Lucerne also offers several features not available on the others too: OnStar, MRC, Heated/Air conditioned seats. Lucerne’s warranty also bests the Avalon’s. The Lucerne also comes with Roadside assistance where the Avalon does not. Definitely check them out. Each one excels in a category while lags in another. That's called being competitive. The Lucerne is definitely competitive for its class as a whole.

see below: 2002 V8 Aurora - MSRP $35,085 curb weight: 3,802 lbs 4.0 V8 250 hp/ 260 lb ft pass volume: 104.4 cu ft trunk capacity: 14.9 cu ft 2006 Lucerne CXL V8 - $30,265 curb weight: 3,969 lbs 4.6l V8 275hp/ 295 lb ft pass volume: 108 cu ft trunk capacity: 17 cu ft 6 Standard airbags (includes Side curtain airbags) Just because mike feels the interior looks cheap, it doesn't make it gospel. I can refer to dozens of other posts by members here that feel the Lucerne's interior is above its class.

And I'm not quite sure what this means..... Unless it's the author trying to pit GM's divisions against each other... You know, same dedicated buyer base ONLY to canabalize sales. Or maybe it's just a dig at Caddy, or just to confuse the reader. [post="53840"][/post] You should know this by now: if a Toyota emulates Lexus, it's a good thing, but if Buick becomes "Cadillac-like" then it's a bad thing. GM is damned by the media either way. It's either not good enough, or it's good enough, but for the wrong reasons. As said before, the Lucerne isn't a Toyota/Lexus clone. The Lucerne addresses the buyer's wants/needs differently. That doesn't warrant an automatic "inferior" rating.

It's alive and well in the Dallas/Ft Worth Metroplex.

They probably do steinravnik... but if the commercial is on cable, then it will show nation-wide. Besides, we all know LA people don't go skiing in the San Gabriel and San Bernardino Mountains. How stupid of Buick. Don't forget those weekend trips to Lake Tahoe that LA residents never take either... nope, they don't. California and near-by areas have nothing but beaches and 80 degree weather. :rolleyes:

I have a feeling it's comparing the standard V6 in the Century to other Mid-size standard engines... which are usually 4-cyl. The Century was priced comparable to the 4-cyl competitors after all. So in this case, the Century's 175 hp would still be greater than the 2006 competition (Accord's 166hp & Camry's 154hp.)

balthazar, I saw your post but didn't get to it in time... sorry. Yep, I have "The Buick - A Complete History" 6th (Centennial) Edition B) Fantastic book. Let me know how the Packard Book is... and which edition. I might want to pick one up also. :)

Ocn was very close but BuickEight hit it right on the head. This is a 1936 "Buick 8 Limited" limousine modified by McLaughlin. This Buick was the personal limousine for King Edward VIII. Congrats guys! B) two websites for reference: http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/bv/...ghlin-buick.htm http://www.sjwillderantiques.co.uk/ Enjoy!

not a Packard... :AH-HA_wink: It is a Limited Edition, though. :)

Don't worry, I won't jump on your Buick trivia questions... feel free to ask away :) And yep, I like Buick. Very much. It's easier to be a fan of new brands that only have 10-20 years of history. Most of the info is easily attainable. Claiming to be a fan of a 100+ year old brand requires a lot more effort and research. :lol:

I've never made a "Guess this" topic... so here it goes... Let's see if it lasts 5 minutes :lol: :

If you need any Buick info, I have most of Buick's sales breakdown from 1904 through 2004 :)

I think several of you are confusing brand image with brand profitability. The last time GM reported which divisions in the US were profitable and which weren't: Non Profitable: Oldsmobile, SAAB, Saturn Profitable: Chevrolet, Cadillac, Buick, Pontiac-GMC, HUMMER *************** And sorry BV... Pontiac profitability is no longer figured alone. GMC & Pontiac were merged into the PONTIAC-GMC Division back in 1996. One won't go away without the other. Buick's sales channel has been "aligned" and merged with Pontiac-GMC, but (as far as my knowledge) they're still two separate divisions. Buick General Manager is Steve Shannon. Pontiac-GMC General Manager is John Larson. The catch is, Steve Shannon reports to John Larson... go figure. <_<

Top 3 brands in sales for 1908: 1908 Buick sales: 8,820 1908 Ford sales: 6,181 1908 Cadillac sales: 2,380 Buick sales break down in 1908: Model D: 543 Model F: 3,281 Model G: 219 Model S: 373 Model 5: 402 Model 10: 4,002

IIRC, Buick was the best selling brand in 1908, passing Ford. I'll have to look to verify, but it was the profits from Buick in 1908 that gave Durant the ability to form General Motors.

Well, "Beyond Precision" is just beginning. There are more commercials to follow, I'm sure. I hope Buick sticks with this slogan and nurtures it. Buick needs to come out with commercials that feature the entire line-up. That's the way to introduce a new slogan. One thing I just noticed while looking at the Buick line-up on a different website: The 2006 line-up is all new. None of the vehicle names existed prior to 2002. Rendezvous is now the oldest name in Buick's line-up. Just WOW! :blink:

What about Sigma2? Will the next gen Sigma platform be engineered for convertibles?

Heh... we just had snow for the past two days. The mountains are also loaded with snow. Several people are heading to the ski resorts. I think the heated washer fluid needs to be played up all winter long. This is more of a seasonal feature. B) Alternate commercials need to be played, but keep the heated washer fluid one in circulation. Sometimes you need excessive coverage to catch the ADD & overly busy individuals of today (aka most of the US population.)

I don't believe any of the manufacturers publicly report fleet sales separate from retail sales. I could be wrong though. I've only found fleet sales info referenced in journalist articles and press releases.

The next gen CTS can't come soon enough. PLEASE let Cadillac have a coupe/conv planned for the CTS!

YEP! You are correct! Good catch! B) Th only thing unfortunate about Buick's numbers is that GM didn't build enough LeSabres to keep sales up before the Lucerne became fully available nation wide. But it's great to see the Lucerne finally arriving at dealerships.

Griffon... which Daewoo is this one? Is this the interior of the vehicle already posted? http://autospy.dreamwiz.com/board/bbs.php?...iew&uid=657&p=2

I have a feeling the disparity comes from GM's commercial truck/van sales. That's a large part of GM's fleeting where Toyota is almost nonexistent. Most of Toyota's fleeting seems to reside in sedan rentals where GM is strong also.