Mr.Krinkle

great, more moving parts...these are all untested waters with regards to tranns with 6 or eight gears. thats a lot of parts. wouldnt it be funny if everyone starts clammoring for the 4 speed. what they call poetic justice. 8 gears--even six--in a "family" car (mover). they get what they deserve i guess. where we all going anyway we need 12 gears. $h!, the supermarkets 3 or 4 blocks away...ok maybe a mile or two depending where you live. im more than pleased with my smooth shifteing four. everone else, let me know how the six and eights are. gm got lambasted for getting to ahead of themselves. 468 rin a bell? this is getting more interesting every day now.

whether goshn was sincere or not (i suspect smugness on his part) so be it. teddy roosevelt knew just what to say to people like that. lets see what happens. bring it on.

yes, its all about st. enzle. we are all entitled to our opinions, dont try to change mine unless its worth it. and it aint. get lost.

oh stop it you harbinger of doom. what is this supposed to mean?? yes of course nothing is safe, thats a fact of life. its what comes next thats important too. olds was a great company, but lets face it for once and for all the name sucked for the world we live in now. im not saying eventually it would be ok, but thats long, long term time. i like the cutlass and 442's, and such...but thats past. nothings sacred, nothing matters, its business as usual. im not syaing there wasnt a better way to go about it or that it was right but its done now. lets hope they learned from this. its over, time to move one. buickmans not going to bring that back. no one will --so why bring it up? his plan is shortsighted and his attitude sucks. it wont help nothing no how. oldsmobile is gone but still lives in a way. as long as gm is still making cars and trucks the names will live on in a way. but, once the company is gone nothing will be left and they will all just be memories. chevy, pontiac, buick, and oldsmobile.

yeah, but its still camry. if thats what you like then go for yours. i prefer some character and personality. besides, is anyone ever really comfortable in traffic? no matter what you drive. in fact the biggest a**holes are usually are in a lot nicer cars than a "camry"

what is a camry anyway? is that all there is to look up to? i dont like them. id much rather any american, pushrods and all kind of car. what is the lure? the atraction? what makes them so good? i know thats a lot of questions, but really now. is that what people want or is that what they are told to want? if only there was a way to conduct a "pepsi challenge" with this horsesh*t. this has been said many ways many times--if you like to drive you dont want a camry. they are no fun. just transportation. a to b. is that all people want. damn this instant messaging, ready in one hour drive through thank you come again world were living in now. id still rather have an impala. or really more so a bonneville.

at some point the smug arrogance will come back to haunt them. im betting sooner than later.

damn you. damn you flybri. dont you know this is more important.

maybe i just dont like the word then...no biggy.

whoaa...keep your pants on. doesnt that just make it low volume? edit: niche would indicate to me- 21-24 years old, less than 2.3 children, sagitarius,

arent all cars "niche" vehicles. im tired of that term. every single car is made with someone in particular in mind. theyrre not niche cars just cars.

being dismissive and adding insults? ya know, you guys were making good points for a while, almost intelligent for a while. i think its safe to say all the car companies have their problems and the bottom line its a business and it should be run as such. whatever that entails to insure the best chance for success. shady practices? skeletons? good luck bringing those to light from japan or korea. i havent heard great things about korean labor. but what does that matter. do you think they came here soley to give us better cars? by give i mean sell. wasnt out of the kindness of their hearts. toyota has clearly set the target on gm but while they are out getting new product and entering classes and options in an attempt (largely successful) to trump gm, the koreans have been quietly sneaking up. pretty soon they will have two fronts to deal with, much in the same gm has had 3 or 4 fronts to contend with. not to mention the luxury markets toyotas been sorely trying to rip from from the germans. a task proven to be more difficult than their "conquests" over here. they must be scratching their heads or laughing how easy we are over here. not too sound overly dramatic but i dont think toyota will ever be able to deal gm a "death blow" its gonna happen at their own (GMs) hands if it does at all...which i personally dont see happening. as for the internet dealy--check your facts. print publications are sinking and offer phenomenal deals to keep or add customers. more and more advertisers are neglecting traditional radio and tv spots for cyber messages. so, yeah, more people are exposed to the internet than any other form of advertising. its one of those things thats constantly there sometimes you dont even think about it. like a marlboro ad on F1 cars or the billboard in right field. those have been proven more effective than most types of advertising. oh, and lastly- i doubt there will be free giveaways and lowered prices if worst case scenarios ever play out. prices are just gonna keep going up. like they are already. more economics. very smart people figure out the most someone will pay for a product. camry is going up slowly but surely. last year during those giant sales, toyota raised their prices (among others) and still had better sales. a very sad comment indeed. lets hope things dont change so much for now. i think its foolish to have a complete or total allegiance to one car company. there are many great products from all makes. grinding an axe on a web boards is easy to say and im sure most here do have their reason for what they say, be it personal or whatever. competition in markets is a good thing. if the bar was never raised itd stay put. even so, id take an impala over a camry any day of the week. i think id personally take anything over a camry. i just dont like them and i have a feeling their bubble will burst soon. theyrre all over the place and im sick of seeing them. i wonder if others will feel similarly and begin to look elsewhere.

yes, but believe it or not in this day in age there are some people who refuse to by korean manufactured products. same way so many wwII survivors swore not to drive german cars. eventually this card will have been played then no excuses will be left. Theres really no car or truck youd consider? that really could be an indication of the market in general. nonetheless, unless a dire personal vow exists to never ever own a particular car, most do cross-shop. its foolish not to see what the others have to offer. then factor things like price, style, dealership, etc etc. in the end its the cars that sell themself. if its not up to par then you hit the bricks. i honestly dont see that much difference between the brands, low to mid price range anyway. $h! i saw a benz sl convertable the other day. impeccable absolutely stunning interior. i could have owned any other car in the world and felt like crap after seeing that.

yup, thats pretty much the deal. popular mechanics evaluates all this alternative fuels this month. as far as biodiesel is concerned, they say...its good but still will cost more than what gas costs now. about 3.50/gal. some pretty good stuff there. but they too basically summed it up with drum roll* variety.

yeah it might be nice change of pace if they were the size of a typical manufacturer. a little focus can go long way. the gm model of business never really took the future into account. the feast or famine scenario i like to call it. times were good everybody got what they wanted. who cares, have some seconds...desert on the house. now its hardly like that to say the least.

"So, the media is justifying their pre-set opinions? At least come up with a credible explanation...other than accusing media types of accepting bribes...which, again, you've substantiated with nothing. i never used that word...br be is such a dirty word. its called advertising and sposorship. lets not be so naive. just look around the "internet" long enough and you can find your own examples. ill play along and give you one. when the enclave concept photos were released there was one site in particular that ragged on it. a closer look revealed the content was sponsored by lexus. its not a bad thing but a general rule of business is not to upset your major sponsors. You tell me why a normal consumer (not an enthusiast w/insight and knowledge) should take a perceived risk with their hard earned money? You can't. Solve that riddle and GM or Ford has a fat job waiting for you.... are you offering me a job? (BTW-just to show you how wrong you are, please reread any recent review of the GMT-900's or the Vette...both of which got excellent press, are selling well and MOST IMPORTANTLY- are world class, value-priced products. If GM could manage a couple more, they'd be just fine. Time will tell if 'wait until next year' is finally around the corner. Meanwhile, GM is having its clock cleaned...walk into the morgue that most local GM shops have become and ask them how sales are... [ yes they continue to sell well regardless. maybe a little more so, but the fact is these cars and trucks always did well. they just now get the support and commendation. im not arguing the fact there are differences in autombile ownership, but everything will have a risk. whether its an idiosyncratic flaw or something given a cute little name like "electrical gremlin" there will be something. theres been a lot of technology thats been introduced so i would hardly call it fred flinstone type cars. drive by wire, heads up d, hydroformed chassis', theres got to be more. it would be foolish to solely blame the media. thats not what ive been saying, but i do at least acknowledge a disparity that exists. have you ever heard dont by this benz, its gonna break down? no, but at least youll be comfortable waiting on the side of the road. answer this, how come whenever i hear an older or poorly kept import, japanese in particular, they sound like pure crap. thats not subjective its a fact. but when an older american made car chugs by it sounds meaner and nastier than a stock car.? i think, this is only my opinion now, i think that as cars get older american ones specifically can get by longer with less. assuming their basic integrity is in tact and not rusted and rotted. theres no fact or evidence, just an observation on my part.

just to clarify-- that above post isnt about my truck. i dont have a toyota truck. it came from the link about the engine problems...i do however currently have a 92 bonneville with 100k+, and yes its been leaking since it was booght used from the "little old lady who only drove it too church on sunday" no one can pinpoint where its coming from but it runs like a champ still today. luck of the draw sometimes.

no company that builds autombiles is without sin in regards to defective products. My 1989 Toyota (so pre-Tacoma) 6 cylinder blew a head gasket. I discovered that Toyota had a "case by case" extension of the warranty on the gasket to 100K miles and mine blew at 107,000. The dealer wanted to fix it for real money and I wanted Toyota to pay for it. After much back and forth Toyota paid for the repair but not the several hundred dollars it took me and the trunk home along with the rental while we argued over who would pay. The engine was never quite the same and I've moved on to anything but Toyota and anywhere but that dealer. Any manufacturor, including GM, that knows they have a lethal problem with an engine should go out preemptively fix them. To do anything else is to lose customers for life.

wow, someones been busy. the bias stems from the this, most people when testing a car need or want the american brands to prove how good they are. when testing other cars they need to be disproved. at least thats the way i see it, thats how the writing ususally shows it up. thats the bias, and its not a conspiracy theory or secret handshake bull$h! so dont try to minimilize it. a lot is paid advertisement, kicknacks, or response to consumer letters and phonecalls. they like to supply the auidience what they want to hear. its a popuarity contest, not a quality issue. and its so ingrained in most mindsets it never gets questioned. a lot of people get burned by cars. mercedes, audi, bmw...terrible records with regards to reliability. however when these cars get stuck its rationalozed--oh well, theres so much electronic gizmos, im driving the best car in the world, ill just get it fixed. who wants to accept they flushed away 50, 60k + for gremlins?? if it happens with a japanese car, its befuddling. no one expects that. hmmm let me take it in...problem fixed, have an i pod and a great day. see you soon. well....they get my vote. i like to watch motorweek because they rarely have anything bad to say about any car and when they do, you know its gotta mean something. heres a quote from that same blog. its nice to keep an open mind.

yourre right i dont know much about it but the fact still remains, how long can you tax a plot of land? the soil will eventually give up. am i wrong? ive seen the people filling their tanks on used veg oil and such. i know it works. but can it really replace fossil fuels with no consequence. or will we have to import rapeseed. im not arguing, i really dont know if it is feasble, or not. i really do like the smell of gasoline, but hell, id love to be able to take my orange peels and coffee grinds and throw them in the tank and have nothing left over other then the sweet smell of a spring rain or bakery fresh cinnamon rolls but is that really possible?

who is the son of a bitch that said it looks like it has buck teeth? thats so funny, its all i could think when i saw the pictures. but to be honest when i saw the video of the car, it didnt look as bad...i hope to see it in person at the nyas if i can get myself to go to the javits. i hate uptown, i hate midtown more. i think its worth it though to finally get to see the fiat panda. wait i mean the camaro and challenger. edit: among others,... especially the fiat panda

dont forget...its not what you drive, etc.... that 3800 is a great motor especially when wound up the right way. any car with that engine, i think, can take off like nobodies business. numbers dont always tell the whole story.

i think the biggest obstacle right now is marketing. people used to want a buick. they used to want a pontiac. "theres a tiger in there"......"when better cars are..." ...and so on. how do you convince younger buyers to buy a brand that in all likely hood their parents swore would never buy again. whats the comeback for that?? its not going to be wheel base and hip room. its a popularity contest for the most part. these cars arent lacking all that much, if anything. the message needs to be loud and clear. how else will the consumer know? by what their parents tell them?? c'mon now. oldsmobile had the right idea. its too bad no one ever stuck with a gameplan long enough to see it through. what if the plug never got pulled for the Grand National? imagine all the kids growing up now that were able to relate to the pseudo legacy that car created in a tangible way ny being able to purchase one for themselves. i do believe a car can sell itself, but its a lot more difficult when the chips have been stacked against it. and for what? time to move on.

we need to have choices. the point is energy is limited. there is no one source of fuel that will solve these problems. oil is limited. corn and the e85 in great in theory but is not plentiful enough to be the only solution. its renewable but for how long? who the hell knows. i think the best we can do is have a variety of ways to power the machines that we depend on. nuclear is the best thing weve come up with but its lack of practicality is the sore thumb. who the hell wants radioactive waste piling up in their backyard. ( and the other stuff too) so, in effect that is limited as well. maybe even more so. who wants "mini hiroshimas" every time theres a fender bender? (unless they could solve that one) in a sense we are only procrastinating until the next solution. just buying some time until someone figures it out. coal was bad enough, steam--oil, solar maybe. i dont even have a clue how that could be harnessed effectively. moderation and conservation will only last so long. there is no cure all unless we can harness telepathy and mental pathwaves. god only knows what problems those would reveal.-- we better getta move on. of course this is way down the road. way way off before it realy becomes a true problem. i do think e 85 is a great start. where the hell is doc brown??? bastards.

gm has obviously been playing catch-up. their pockets arent so deep that they coul afford all of their costs and have quality products. this nail has been hit several times in this post alone. so some jackass thinks its ok to save 32 cents per car adding up to millions of dollars saved. whos gonna notice? a lot of people (especially you o.c.) all the wheeling and dealing and freeing up cash is a sign of a big move thats happening or about to happen. its a mass mobilization so to speak. yes, too bad it was needed yesterday but somebody f*%&ked it up along the way. it couldnt go on like it was. maybe they tried for too long. a "lets ride it out" mentality, but it turned bad in a hurry. the old expression first things, first. labor disputes, union wages-the legacy costs. thats being handled or will be shortly. thats first. its dead money. that caddy cts shot was a teaser of whats to come if tings work out. and i think it will be applied more liberally, not just cadillac.--assuming its really not too late this time. everything will be budgeted accordingly once the maximum overhead is at an acceptable level. its almost as if their hands have been tied for the last 20 years by the unions ropes. now they realize things need some changing and it needs to be more equitable this time. or else everyone is going to lose. lets see if thats whats sinking in this time around. o.c.-thanks for having thick skin.