turbo200

buickman may be a fine salesman, but if he'd try his luck in Los Angeles, where dealers are bleeding and NOBODY will consider the product, I think he'd find just how bad the situation is. There are something like 32 million people in the Los Angeles area alone, and there are many more cities throughout the country that are just as bad for GM.

you're right, but the G6 coupe with five seats would look different from that proposed sedan, and probably just as killer [though it's hard to imagine] as the Camaro. And sedans can look pretty badass too, right?

Also, talking about sheetmetal differentiations, it's self-defeating since (a) this is far ahead and no one knows what GM plans (B) GM, I beleive and hope has learned this lesson. With the attention they are putting to design, I think they understand design and character are the fundamental ways of extracting an image for brands from the cars they make. Bottom line, don't worry about that kind of issue, it's too far away, and the new GM should take care of it, or they better or I'm sure we'd all pitch a fit.

Who's to say the G6 itself wouldn't have just as much of a kickass design as the Camaro, only with a different Pontiac flavor. If G6 were to be on zegma, it would be able to start at just slightly higher than Camaro prices. Gm won't release Camaro for a price a lot higher than 22k. Having G6 and GTO on it only makes the costs of the units go down significantly lower. I am also tired of all RWD detractors. Dammit, can't I have som fun too? You guys have the whole freakin lower market to yourselves. Isn't there room for one fun RWD sedan in the 20k segment? Also, the 300 has proven RWD is acceptable to the masses, at a higher price than your average G6 would go for. I will use that line as many times as I need to.

Aren't you at all concerned Kerkorian wants to rip apart GM and sell it for the profitable units?

Camry engine will have 268 hp, be faster than the Lucerne [lighter weight, Avalon is already pretty fast], be more fuel efficient, and just as smooth. I was really referring to the 3800 engine, since it comes in a 26k Lucerne (!); but you bring up an even better comparison. Take off the GM blinders Fly, there are benchmarks and GM needs to be that benchmark, not chase after it.

Scott has already said these are pretty close on CZ28. He's also said it's unfinished, but that is to be expected since it is obviously two concepts together.

This is what I don't get about Buick or GM. What is there to motivate someone to purchase this car over, say, a new gen Camry, besides exterior style? Yes, the Lucerne can be a classy looking car, though for that, I think you need to get at least a CXL. The Camry will have a much much superior interior design. The Cmary will have a better engine. The Camry will have similar interior space and similar dynamics. And of course the Camry will have the indomitable Toyota reputation. GM needs to make standout cars, and the Lucerne is not it.

Yes it would be a different platform. The Global RWD platform is Zeta and is totally different from Camaro "Zegma" platform. G6 would be on Zegma, yay Zegma.

that song is ten thousand times better than the tired Zep song. It's such a better fit too, it actually updates Cadillac into today's world. Let's make a compaign to get them to change the song to this. I love the video too, great ad.

This unique position in the marketplace will also be unique among foreign makes. No one else offers a RWD sedan/coupe in the G6 price range, excluding the 300 which would be slightly more expensive and cover a different size/sportiness range. I am all for a RWD Tempest! I completely agree with your points griffon.

ZEGMA!!!

RWD! G6 RWD! It's a necessity who's time has come. This makes total sense. Business case is improved for Camaro, and G6 becomes a profit maven. Though, I would like to see G6 coupe be a 5 seater as it is now. GTO coupe to cap off the lineup with a distinct fascia would be perfect. I can't think of anything better than this lineup for the G6. At that time, Buick, Saab, Saturn, and Chevy will all have Epsilons. That's enough of that platform to use. Create G6 on Zegma, as evok called it in another thread and you have a winner!

my sister has one, and only her kids ever use it, but at least it's good for that. Though any other SUV with less pig-like dimmensions and more overall efficiency could handle this task just the same. I am still waiting for a Maxx like wagon vehicle from GM with three rows. Come on, 3 rows and all the utility.

The 3rd passenger is insignificant when the new 900s offer more space, better mileage, and better looks to boot. Most will go for the 900 and those seeking a cheaper option will be relegated to the Lambdas. The EXTs, as stated above by many others, are pure garbage in relation to the rest of the market. Even a 4 cylinder Highlander is better for the average person, WHO NEVER TOWS, and that's average person folks!!

They still have them? If any of thier mods are invited to the press event, I will take thier place! :lol: In all seriousness, that shows a complete lack of respect for the company we're supposed to be in support of.

Well, it seems it's the concept Camaro. See, evok is our insider, and above he's the one that revived this thread and asked, now, do we know who it is. So, apparently, it's the Camaro. Someone else can back it up.

that's interesting. I could definitely see the dealers asking for this, it hurts GM's bottomline a lot more than it hurts there's. And no, I don't blame Wagoner for listening to the dealers. But, a quick question, if you'll do me the honor, why hasn't Wagoner, or someone at GM really pushed for realistic pricing levels. We all know the Lacrosse sells realistically at a point probably 3k under its MSRP. Couldn't we save a lot of time, and increase resale value, and the perceived value of our products by not always discounting, if we just went to value pricing. I don't mean the value pricing GM introduced this year, where GM spoke a lot about pricing cars near to their market value, and then didn't follow through. I mean real pricing levels. I always see the Malibu being advertised for 15k, and I see a lot of Camrys for around 18 or 17k. IMHO, 16 or 17k would be a better base price for the Malibu, than the 19k it's at currently. I don't know why any sane person would choose the Malibu, at similar pricing over the Camry, other than loyalty. The Malibu is a good car, but we all know it lacks the refinement to push it into an upscale arena, it's got a poor man's car image, whether that's true or not. So, fbodfather, why can't Wagoner push for real pricing levels. That's one aspect of marketing I think is failing, pricing.

one of the most beautiful, real, foward-thinking concepts ever produced. That Cadillac, produced today, would belong right in the upper echeleon of luxury cars, and looks like it belongs parked next to that Continental GT.

yes, absolutely. I wish those other sites would respect the wishes of GM and take them down. Do you think that autoweek and major mags would pick up on these, if they're marked confidential?

I've sat in a few and can't get past the fact that I am disgusted this is what we have in a 25k-30k Pontiac. My constructive criticism would be to start over, and follow the things OC said about committee think and out of touch with reality materials, he's right on.

I've been seeing them going back and forth. What I don't get are the sites that clearly knew this was an issue. I won't name names, but there is a site that seems to always do what C&G does, that site knew we had taken them down, since they always do what we do, and still went on with reposting them later on. that said, I was able to see the other views of this car from that time, so I am guilty too. I loved what i saw though!

yes. he posts on this site now too. he also posts at Cz28, he's the person responsible for getting out invites to Camaro enthusiasts for the big unveil. you can see why he would be upset, it's basically like a betrayal. their are reasons why these kinds of things are kept under wrap. Now, the big day at NAIAS to silence the investors and critcs won't be quite so big.

In this Cobalt thread, me3head says it's back on. post 11 Any news on this? To answer Ah-ha's vague question, I believe Saturn is going up, and will be staying in business for long. Will we instead get the real Astra, and perhaps a Zafira to go along with it, and start to get direct Opel transplants here?

agree with ah-ha, at least as good as I could have hoped for.