El Kabong

Nonsense. If Ford wasn't nervous about the Shelby's chances against the 1LE then my link to their attempts to make optional equipment standard wouldn't exist. You only do that when you want to drive down asking prices by forced economics of scale.

I'm not a fan of the styling on the less-huge Bentley sedans. But that less-huge V8 is becoming more and more impressive.

I am thoroughly enjoying the outrage. Really. I am. The Shelby name carried weight when the man was: -alive, and -directly involved with the stuff bearing his name, if it -took care of business in a righteous way. By these criteria the original 350GT, Cobras, and whatnot from back in the day became legends. But let's be honest: nobody sheds many tears for Shelby K-cars or rebadged SVT Mustangs. These are not real Shelbys (although the Omni GLHS may yet prove an exception). The only reason the current Shelby is called that is because Ford Marketing and PR knows it has more cachet than an SVT badge. Ford typically seems to be more confident in hawking brands and names that didn't originate in-house than they do their own stuff. But it hasn't been working too well for them as of late. And if that price gap doesn't come down, like, a LOT, that trend will not change with this car. Suave: nobody buys pony cars because they can command a price premium in and of themselves. Their objective performance has been, and will continue to be, matched by a strong emphasis on objective value. So no: my example of Lexus (and Acura with the first NSX for that matter) shaking things up with heir appeal to objective value is a valid one. Indeed, one of the cornerstones of the ponycar segment is the image of the working-class hero, the gutsy underdog, yadda yadda yadda. The fact that that image is increasingly belied by the true greatness of what lies beneath is almost besides the point.

A win is a win, and that's something from your playbook. I'd hunt to find where I saw that, but I'm pretty sure my jarred memory, Maserati edition is better than even yours. Like I said: C/D gave the Ford the win. Because they know it's now or never. And I'm ok with that. Just like I was ok with R&T admitting that they may have made a mistake giving the Shelby it's Driver's Car award. Something better, this way comes.

LOL@saying companies don't want the business of people like me. People like me RUN this business. Or any business. It's just Darwinism with tires, man. You think that Lexus didn't scare the Germans with my mindset back in the day? You think Porsche and Ferrari exist in their current state because of laisssez-faire business?

On the contrary. I'm looking golden on this argument. Your car can't even win a stoplight win against a slushbox SS. It's pretty much a given that a 1LE will match it, at the very least. And that price gap!... And Ford is already juggling the option packages before Job One gets built. Now THAT'S telling.

I've left the intangibles alone because as someone who has owned both a Corvette and a Camaro I already know they exist. I also know that they are very different animals, as did Car and Driver. They didn't call their "comparo" Asymmetrical Warfare for nothing. They did Ford a solid by giving the Shelby a comparo win before its real conpetition arrived.

Look. Just quit while you're ahead. I posted the OP. We have the Shelby's numbers. We have a video conparo of the two. And we have Oppenheiser's claims. Also his track record. You have Jay Leno driving a Shelby in isolation and an admitted hatred for the Camaro based on a movie.

You proved shyte...EL K... What...a journalists point of view... I countered with Jay Leno... He said the engine was the GREATEST engine built in the US today! He said the GT350 is a PURE REAL 100% European Sports Car. And a bunch of other stuff... And that my friend....just counters YOUR shyte that you call proof. Yet...you choose to ignore that... Auto Journalists have magazines to sell... Jay Leno...talks with his money...his own money that actually bought the car for his own pleasure... THAT my friend...trumps ANYTHING YOU have to say... OH...you bought yourself a Zeta Camaro...good on you... The thing is...THAT also shows your bias... Jay Leno...he got Mustangs in his stable...but he also got Camaros in his stable... Sorry EL K...your bias shows big time... Your zealousnous shows big time... Your trolling is very apparent. I calls them as I sees them. They have laser surgery for that now.

For the most part I'm onboard with this. But the Corvette truly is a different animal. It is no more a competitor to the Mustang as it would be to a Charger or SS sedan.

There's no irony. You're just avoiding the reality of the situation. Hell, they got this exact thread cooking over in FIN and they're admitting that the changes Ford's making to the Shelby options list are a reaction to the 1LE's pricing. I'm sorry if these things sting you. But that's kinda what Bumblebees do.

For the luvva gawd. I've posted stuff out the wazoo to support my claims. It ain't trolling if you can prove it. And as far as I can see, I've proven it as well as I can until they strap test gear to the 1LE to back up GM's claims. But even then, I'm stalking my claims on GM's claims. And they're the ones making the thing.

But the Shelby IS overpriced. I just assumed that now went without saying. Fifteen grand for an engine note is going to be a deal killer for a LOT of people. It just is. GM can price their RWD stuff lower because they build more RWD stuff. This allows them to add more quality to their RWD stuff too. It's nothing against Ford specifically. But they ARE part of the collateral damage.

Sorry man. The shouty font just looks silly. I don't understand all the fury over a few vid and magazine links. If you have an irrational like or hate for something then fine. But there is not one soul who posts in here who would buy the Shelby and not wince at the fact that they're spending an extra fifteen grand for an engine note. There just isn't. But shooting the messenger ain't gonna change that.

Shouty font don't change a thing, man. GM has a good thing going, at a great price. That's just the way it is.

Not based on what's going on up here with the GT500 and Zeta ZL1. Consumers know that SVT is the real development muscle behind the Shelby name, so it's judged accordingly. Yeah....its a little too soon to be talking about Zeta ZL-1 depreciation...Come and see me in just a short 3 years... Why? You yourself keeps on wax poeting about the Alpha Camaro... As good as the ZL-1 was...YOU yourself is clamming about OVERPRICENESS and OBSELETENESS...you think the Alpha Camaro wont hamper on the ZL-1's depreciation? Dude...the Zeta Camaro was NEVER lust worthy...in the end it was a fantastic performer...but that's about it... Like I said....YOU YOURSELF thinks the Alpha Camaro is the second coming of Christ...hey...its your rules... You lost me at "Zeta Camaro was NEVER lust worthy."Yes... All those sales crowns were just a pleasant surprise. #inconvenienttruth

Not based on what's going on up here with the GT500 and Zeta ZL1. Consumers know that SVT is the real development muscle behind the Shelby name, so it's judged accordingly.

"Who gives a phoque about price advantage?" #youcantbeserious

That has nothing to do with the 1LE having a huge price advantage over the Shelby.

Hey, if they bought one right out of the gate then good for them. If they didn't then that's between them and their wallet. But where your comparison breaks down a bit is the fact that it took Ford two or three years to reel in the Chevy. The Alpha Camaro was already capable of being a headache for the Shelby as soon as it dropped, which was only months after the Shelby. Which, in turn, is already seeing it's options list juggled around in order to try and fight back. Oh ya. Forgot about that. Ok, time to tow the line!

Seriously. This is getting ridiculous. I'll even reduce it to bullet points: -The Alpha Camaro SS already has some performance metrics that match or exceed the Shelby GT350. -The Shelby GT350, with all the performance-enhancing goodies, rings in in the mid to high fifties. -The Camaro Chief Engineer has said that the 1LE Camaro has the GT350 as its performance target, and is based off the 1SS, which starts at 37 grand. -Ergo, expect a 1LE to ring in in the low 40s. Now, the fifteen-thousand dollar question: How would you feel if you spent an extra fifteen grand for a pony car only to not be able to outrun another pony car that is fifteen grand less? ...and be honest about it. Because having owned my fair share of not-cheap machinery, I know here's some level of ego involved.

No. It would appear you're wings now. ...congrats?

Wow... Pure trolling. Never has anyone but a person whos never driven the car, claims Ford needs to try harder. I think that most reasonable folks would agree that a 50-some grand Mustang should have a clearer-cut advantage-indeed, any apparent advantage-over a Camaro SS that starts at 37. But it doesn't, at least according to the vid I posted. That ain't trolling on my part. That's you being entertaining.

I don't hate on the GT350. I just provide vids and links that show that the Camaro does as well or better for a far lower price. Calm down already

Some haven't been too eager to comment on my video either. But alas