El Kabong

Sorry for your loss, Olds. Sorry to hear of the passing of a forum member also. Kinda eerie, too... part of the reason I haven't posted recently was my own personal brush with mortality. Some great work by emergency room docs made life a lot, well, longer. I hope.

Smallblock all the things.

Guess they're planning on building more trucks and SUVs this year. Link here: http://www.motortrend.com/news/gm-spends-148-million-boost-production-v-8-engines-trucks/

Well, it sure looks suspicious, according to this piece from Motor Trend more at the link: http://www.motortrend.com/news/bmw-win-luxury-sales-crown-aggressive-fleet-sales/

Well, it worked for the Audi TT.

Lincoln doesn't have a clue what it's supposed to be, besides possibly "not dead." You don't blow through three design languages in three years if you have any kind of vision. Cadillac has had the same design theme for 15 years. Where's your love for them? I DO think D6 will eventually make it to production. But it will have an awful lot of ground to make up.

History has proven you wrong on the Mustang heritage front, as I have shown. GM need not resort to V-Series cars to do in current Lincolns. Regular Cadillac's will suffice. Maybe regular Buicks. Haven't heard much about D6 lately. Five billion dollars when your luxury brand sells so low in numbers (and probably at the expense of your mainstream brand) is awfully costly. And for no immediate benefit... Lincoln's "success" is a Roger Smith-style of success. That is very very bad.

Nope. They're playing the long game, if anything. Consider: Alpha is currently putting the hurt on its largest domestic competitor, in multiple market segments, some of them quite lucrative. I doubt Ford will ever stop building Mustangs (although the Probe debacle in the 80s shows anything is possible). But I still feel that Lincoln's future is pretty shaky. So, play it safe with the pricing now (especially in such a snobbish market as luxury sedans) and try and expand market share on multiple fronts.

Actually I'm basing my price estimate for the 1LE a bit high at 42. Al intends to get it in at exactly 40 large. GM doesn't need to be aggressive with pricing in any segment the Alpha is in. They HAVE been with the CTS in particular, but when you're building gonzo numbers of a premium platform you have options as far as product pricing goes. And don't forget that this also applies to engines. The LT1 and that TTV6 have lots of commonality with the Vortec and 3.6. So, to answer your question: American cars are brilliant, because they provide greatness to the masses (when done right).

Eh. Whatever

Folks, this is all it really boils down to: As I've said elsewhere: One Ford has been nothing but a problem for the Mustang. We cannot seriously expect Dearborn to match the engineering muscle of a company that builds three hi-po RWD platforms (Omega, Alpha, Y-chassis) for a standalone coupe. By the same token, we cannot seriously expect Ford to spend the same amount of effort on an engine configuration they are actively trying to get out of the rest of their lineup. GM has used their economics to scale in this segment to devastating effect. They're the Golden State warriors, and it's almost unfair to watch.

The Z/28 thing was pretty straightforward: they had some LS7 engines knocking around and excess plant capacity. Slap on a nostalgic badge and spend a few months at the Nurburgring and tah-daah! I've already answered your question as regards Porsche.

Why? The Z06 already goes there FWIW, but beyond that why?Porsche depends on the elevated prices of its lineup to survive as a brand, even (especially now?) within the confines of the VW Group. Corvette? Not so much. No. The Corvette is fine.

As for the Corvette: what's the problem? Seriously. It makes money, it sells well, and it doesn't siphon sales from the Camaro. Why the beef about the price? Isn't six figures for a pimped Z06 costly enough? It's almost two separate models now anyways, because the widebody ain't exactly a cheap variation. No. The Corvette is just fine.

Answer this question, El Kabong... Too slow on the draw. I already did.

I would love to see proof of this "fear" you speak of because I believe that is a gross misrepresentation of the facts. What you are saying is pure speculation, just like Bong but he is the only one catching grief for his speculation. Just saying that you are using a double standard here Suave. Maybe, just maybe, GM doesn't want to price the Camaro any higher because they have something that Ford does not, which is why Ford is able to price the GT350 the way they do. It's called the Corvette. It's really that simple. It's not fear. It's simple math and the common sense to not step on the toes of your halo car by pricing it too close to it. I don't even think it's that, necessarily. After all, the Z/28 and ZL1 overlapped the C6. And the ZL1 replacement will as well. I just think that if the Corvette is well-executed and the Camaro is well-executed the buying public will give each one their props and pay checks in good measure. But ya: Ford doesn't have a Corvette. And the only way they can fight that is through asymmetrical warfare, or something.

ROFL@futilie arguments

There's nothing terribly exotic about a flat crank. Certainly nothing any more or less exotic than magnetorheological shocks. Hell, a spinoff of GM INVENTED MR SHOCKS. sorry man. Try again! And why would GM want to move the ponycar upmarket? To what market, pray tell? #makesnosense

Because, again, the Corvette and the ponycar are two separate entities. When I owned my Corvette I appreciated the unique aspects it had. When I owned my Camaro I appreciated the unique aspects IT had. Like back seats. And a bigger trunk. And other stuff I already mentioned. GM knows full well that this is true, too. Otherwise the Camaro wouldn't be in the lineup. But I already mentioned that too. Which means the arguments are becoming circular, and nobody has really been able to lay a serious counterargument on my posts or vids. So I guess Al Oppenheiser's confidence in the 1LE is justified, for multiple reasons.

Totally missed the point. If the Camaro can gain conquest sales out of segment, then good. But the segment itself remains about bang for the buck. There is no aristocracy, despite what the various badges and stripe packages may imply. If your car can't deliver the goods for X amount of dollars it's not gonna do well. And the 1LE is about to finish tipping the apple cart.

Economics freestyle rap: Don't be hatin' on the One Percent/ When we had Karl Marx and we know how THAT went/ Gotta big shout out to my boy Adam Smith/ Division of labour y'all, how you s'posed to deal with/ It's the tax bracket schemin' and American dreamin'/ When all a gearhead wants is a whip he can believe in/ And his face is all droopy, 'cause the ladies don't love no hooptie/ ...and white boy just ran outta gas

Ya, that was just all KINDS of wrong, right there There's nothing intangible about why people buy Corvettes over Porsches and vice versa. It's VERY tangible. Some folks like their engines in front of them, some folks like their engines behind them.

What nonsense. The SS already has the edge on the Shelby in some performance measurements as is. The future, as they say, is now. The 1LE will merely be the icing on the cake. Because lost among all the name-calling and accusations is this one thing, left unanswered: Would you honestly pay 57 thousand dollars for a track star Mustang that cannot outrun a 42 thousand track star Camaro? But that's ok, because we already know that the answer to that is: no. No, you would not. So suck it up, deal with it, and get on with life. Because these are the facts. And the facts ain't changing.

I'm iust posting facts. Links, vids, etc. If you don't like that, then don't get mad at the messenger. The messenger could not possibly care less. Get mad at the brand you want to win. Because they're the ones at fault.

Cute emoji tho. And no, I assure you that the only thing Shelby added to the GT500 was his badges.