surreal1272

And don't forget, it's not like ICE cars don't have problems off the factory floor and sometimes major problems and they have been on our roads for well over a century. This, like the YouTube video depicting it, is making a mountain of a molehill, if you ask me.

The Tacoma is built in San Antonio but still a whole lot of contradiction there lol.

Me, after seeing this one page...

Ummm, you might want to read that again lol.

Is that you Blu because you sure have a wash, rinse, repeat nature about you and the obvious EV trolling?

By that same token, it seems like you parrot sources that get paid very well to slam EVs, but maybe you're not ready to hear that yet. That would be a valid statement if there weren't also compromises with ICE cars. David wrote it and did it for free so maybe save the ridiculous accusations for somewhere else. That pretty much kills your entire "argument" by assuming that somehow the article was bought and paid for lol.

I am on the exact same page. Initially, it comes off as more of a "Mid-cycle refreshed" vibe. Even the interior door handles and tunnel appear to be carryovers. The only real difference at first glance are vent shape changes and the large slab of screen across the dash, which is becoming par for the course. Not sure that design element works in a car like this but maybe seeing one in person will alter my thoughts on it.

I should have taken a picture I saw this morning of a stranded Trailblazer and a man behind it holding a gas can. True story. I am so sick and tired of the troll articles and posts about EVs running out of juice with a limited (overall) infrastructure support while gas powered cars still run out of gas literally across the street from a gas station (again, true story). Both are the result of simple driver error and have squat to do with the means of propulsion underneath the hood.

Yeah because it's not like anyone has ever run out of gas lol.

That "clean sheet" is derivative boredom and ugliness on the outside. They should have went back to a drawing board IMO but the China market is very different beast than it is here in the states so at least I don't have to stare at one in person lol.

Even for the China market, that is simply hideous.

Shingles is the one thing I don't have to worry about. Never had Chickenpox lol. Will be going for the latest booster here in the next month though.

I like facts too and you know for a fact that recalls do not equal long term reliability yet you love bringing it up whenever Toyota comes up even though that fact still remains. From dealerships to auto publications, They are near or at the top of damn near every reliability study and data set out there. https://www.carmax.com/articles/most-reliable-car-brands https://www.wane.com/news/top-picks/the-most-reliable-car-brands-for-2022/ https://www.autolist.com/guides/most-reliable-car-brands https://www.kbb.com/car-news/consumer-reports-lexus-makes-the-most-reliable-cars-lincoln-the-least/ https://www.hotcars.com/most-reliable-cars-last-miles/

Just because you think it’s true doesn’t make it so and I’m done trying to convince folks here who would rather gaslight because of their own prejudices than to understand the wealth of data that contradicts their view. BTW, I like Cadillac but that is gaslighting 101 if you think the Northstar was the only big issue with Cadillac back then. And that mirror goes both ways Olds. Just sayin’.

And in both cases, way overblown (owned one of those 3.0 sludge cases via a ‘93 ES300 with absolutely no sludge issues). Again, I am more than happy to side by side some the competition from those years and their related issues but I’m not wasting any more time trying to convince folks who don’t want to be convinced.

And this is why I don't try to argue facts versus feelings here (no offense Olds). Countless reliability and quality studies over the last 30 years or so directly contradict this "shytty as the next OEM" assumption. Again, I am not saying they are perfect because they are far from it but reliability is still not one of their main issues unlike companies like Fiat. It's not even debatable when we look at actual facts. @David--As far as this rust nonsense goes, I can put that to bed too. While working at a couple of used car lots years ago in NC, I found out one thing very quickly. Any car purchased at auction DID NOT come from up north, regardless of brand. I've seen rust on everything from Nissan, to Ford, to Audi and BMW and they all came from the north. It is not just a "Toyota thing" because some folks decided to file suit against one generation of trucks (forgetting the fact that no other Toyota seemed to suffer this supposedly "rampant" problem, so much so that folks went to court over it). That is all.

Does not change my stance behind the post one little bit.

Decided to put this here instead of the Hornet thread (since that's where it started but was diverting from the subject of the Hornet). My last Toyota. 1996 RAV 4, FWD, Auto. Bought it March 2016 with 252K miles on it. It was purely my "beater car" to get to work and back. I sold it December 28th, 2019 with 267K miles on it. Clearly, I did not drive it much. It sat outside in my driveway in Peoria, AZ (Robert knows lol) all those years (no room in the garage lol) with ZERO window tint. The car spent its first 17 years or so of its life somewhere in Davids neck of the woods (according to CarFax). The rest, it spent in 120 in summer Phoenix, AZ, which was at seven years by the time I sold it. These pics are of that very RAV 4 and while the paint was faded six ways from Sunday, the body and frame were both solid and NOT ONE crack in the dash (or anywhere else for that matter), headliner droop, or otherwise faded material (save for the seat fabric of course). But yeah, that Toyota quality and reliability was soooo overrated. I just don't get why millions buy them every year. ? (As he tips out for the night)

As a former owner of four different Toyotas, and host of other makes, I will respectfully disagree with the Toyota assessment here. Next, someone is going to tell me that Fiats are better than Toyotas and I’m just not ready to laugh that hard.

Mmmkay there bud.

That was just one example @Drew Dowdell. It is still true and has been since day one, which is 10000% intellectually honest and it’s a bit insulting to imply that is not happening here. The parts are higher than average and a bitch to get in a timely manner. It’s really that simple and it is one of the reasons why Fiat and Alfa have been a big ole fail here. And I’m not talking about just spark plugs either.

Global or not, they do not carry the majority of replacement parts here. They have to be shipped in which leads to delays. This is from a Fiat 500 group talking about that very thing. https://www.fiat500owners.com/threads/love-my-fiat-but-hard-to-find-parts.119153/

That can be said for every SUV out there (the mall crowd). However, calling it underrated or otherwise trying to diminish it comes without facts. They are proven off-road SUVs worldwide. It’s not even debatable. They have a resale value that reflects it reliability and durability so it really doesn’t need any further explanation (something it shames Land Rover on). It just doesn’t. For the record, you’ll find old FJs and LCs in the AZ desert, hitting the dusty trails there. And you folks keep bagging on the Tacoma/Tundra examples from 20 years gap as some secret indicator that Toyotas are $h! because of them. I am more than happy to bring up the “quality” stuff from GM and Ford from that same time period if you’d like but we will run out of pages here doing that lol.

While it’s true that there are delays for everyone, there is a big caveat here and that is once those worldwide delays are done, there will still be parts delays from Alfa and Fiat, much like Land Rover. The parts are made there and only there and will be delayed getting here for that very reason. That’s an issue for most folks, especially with a notorious pile from Italy. Come on man. It’s still a Trailblazer, end of story. That Vette heritage does not change the source material here.

And that means what exactly @Drew Dowdell? I can search for a bunch of class action suits against otherwise supposedly dependable vehicles. Ford, alone, has countless suits from F Series owners. Does that make them junk or unreliable? Maybe. Maybe not. Bringing up this one suit doesn’t change what I said earlier about Toyota OVERALL (an important distinction). “Lol” indeed. And I guess I lied when I said I was done but that merited at least one last response.