surreal1272

What part of "moving to EVs' are you not getting here? Does the simple concept elude you so much that you, again, have to make up this phantom about advertising and marketing timeframes? Seriously? How long has Benz been promoting the still not for sale Project One? Or how about thew G-Wagen? First shown off by Mercedes September 2021 and still prominently on their website. Again, you spend post after post complaining about other companies tactics while avoiding the fact that ALL brands (including your favorite) do this and have been doing this for decades now. Give it up already. Again, until that 3 year delayed truck is actually on sale, we can talk about "scale". Judging by it's most recent testing though, you have WAY higher hopes for it's success than just about everyone else lol.

You mean the company that hasn't changed the design of their first sedan since it came out in 2013 (save for bits and unnoticeable pieces)? It's 2023 and we talking 2025, a whole TWO years. I've seen longer future talk and any number of companies since well, ever. That is not a new practice. It only seems that no because companies are attempting to push a lot of product in a relatively short period of time. About the delays hell, it could show up one year late and still be ready to actually sell before the Cybertruck (a joke but I'm really not that far off). As long as they don't have a Tesla like delay with it, they will be fine. EV dude. EV. That is why. They spent billions on EVs so advertise now, not two months before it actually comes out like old GM. It's not rocket science.

I will agree to disagree because the entire shape is the problem to me and most folks out there, apparently. Nothing about the exterior design screams “best or nothing”. And the entire rear three quarter resembles the S Class about as much as a jellybean resembles an S Class (it doesn’t). Just slimming down the hood does not help it look anything like the S Class. Two completely different designs. But back to the EV9…

The funniest part is how he thinks the high cowl on the Jellybean twins is the only issue with them.

The new interface and system is all Google software ( a big "yikes" for me) and yes, excluding CarPlay is a huge mistake.

True but it also applies to Luxo snobs. Same principles.

That's exactly my point in regards to the same person who always asks the same question, at this stage of development, and then speculates when he doesn't get the answer he wants (even when it's just not there at the time) while knocking any price point he perceives to be "too high" because in encroaches on Mercedes territory (oh the over-compensation issues here lol). This "analysis" goes for EVERY brand not coming from Daimler. That's my issue here.

Common sense? You mean the price question he asks for everyone else but one manufacturer? How about we actually wait on the price before delving into your analysis about what car is worth what money (again, for every brand but one)? The only thing known is that early estimates have it around $55K for the base model. That is it. Nothing more.

Ummm...

Exactly. It's almost like it makes sense to do this in order to spread word about the brand, something sorely missed by Mr. "it's not a Mercedes" like anyone outside of the Daimler fanboy club gives two s**ts about the Polestar NOT being a Mercedes. Good grief.

Okay so you have insulted 3 out of the 4 (at damn near every turn) and the only reason for not bashing Tesla must have to do with stocks because it sure isn't because of the quality of the auto. Cadillac had FEWER sedans than Mercedes. It's like David said, and anyone who is not Mercedes fan looking for yet another chance to bash any American car company NOT named Tesla, it was lack of marketing more than anything else.

A very "Lucid" front end, which is not really a bad thing in this case.

I could honestly do this all day.

(Resharpens knife for next bubble popping) And "YES" to the rest of your post. I am just tired of the fanboy logic being thrown out there without even a lick of simple research and data to back up said "logic". For crying out loud, go ahead and price a Chevrolet SS right now. They sold for $50K new and I routinely see those sell for that price with more than 30K miles on them. Lower mile examples go for even more. His logic is easily flushed down the toilet with a simple google search. Even the Camaro ZL1 has staying power and 20 years from now, it will continue to go higher with the Camaro ceasing production and being a low production trim itself.

Good lord. Did you miss the limited production part of the Demon or do you somehow think there will be millions of them 20 years from now? It should be noted that the other cars you mentioned are all less than 20 years old too so maybe (skipping the fact that I routinely see CTS-V Wagons going for right at their original sticker with low miles), pick a spot and sitka with it because you can't have it both ways. A low mile limited production Demon will fetch above original price 20 years from now. They start at $69K and the Redeye starts at $76K so...go ahead and explain this... And this...

Did you just seriously type that with a straight face?

Oh FFS. How many times are you going to beat this horse to death, Market valuations and the house of cards that is Tesla profit margin has been explained to you time and time again yet you come back two months later with the same debunked BS. Just stop it already. I'm assuming that you can read a basic graph. I would that losing over HALF of your market cap is the opposite of a good sign for Tesla but keep cherry picking that data to prop them top, for whatever reason. Ignore all the facts that show the dangers for Tesla. You haven't convinced anyone here of ti yet but hey, it clearly hasn't stopped you from beating that dead horse for the last three years now, much like your Cybertruck talk. Oh and... Now, maybe we can go back to the subject at hand, which is the Challenger Demon. Let's try that, shall we?

Is that why the three years delayed Cybertruck has been such a sales hit? And let's not forget that legendary Tesla reliability and build quality because, you know, efficiency. Yeah, so much winning lol.

"If...if...if" We have been hearing that about the Cybertruck for what...three years now? And your price point argument ignores a couple of things. First, the Cybertruck will not be even $50K, as it has already been pointed out. Second, while the D3 have pushed their tuck towards higher price points, $80K trucks are not even close to their volume and they start at around $15K LESS then this hypothetical $50K entry price of the Cybertruck. Two words for you regarding the D3 volume movers. "Work" and "truck". Third, the loan rate talk applies to Tesla as well so, how exactly does that help them get to that magical 200K number? This is not even close to a legitimate comparison (in regards to sales volume and price points) and you know that but you have been pushing this "if, if, if" nonsense for so long, regarding the Cybertruck, that it just like Elons claims over the last three years. Just empty words and white noise.

I see some dipped their whole head into the devils lettuces before they posted this, with the coup de grace being "a Tesla becomes cheaper than owning a Corolla.". BTW, I think I will compare Escalade sales to Sprinter van sales, while we are it. Or how about Ford F-150 sales against Mercedes Benz EQE (in the same vain as your asinine EQS to CT4 sales comparison)? That sounds about right, doesn't it? Just pure fanboy nonsense SMK. Sorry.

Nah. It's subjective, just like your subjective observation of it. It is really is that simple but if making a mountain out of molehill is the way you want to go, then knock yourself out. However, it seems like you are just focusing on the one bullet points copy and pasted by David instead of the article itself, which provides much better context. Again, though, maybe making mountains is where you would prefer to do here. In that case, I am tipping myself on out of it. Nothing personal.

The word you are looking for here is “subjective”, not “lazy” but I guess we all pick strange hills to die on. Just skip the fact these “lazy” writers have far more exposure and wheel time with these cars than you or me. Dismiss it as “lazy” all you want but it is the exact opposite of lazy.

I am on the fence with them. Love the van look (spent the first 13 years of my life traveling around in the same 1972 Chevy Sport10 van) but like Drew, I don't know how it succeeds beyond its obvious niche. Commercial use could be a good starter for getting the product out there and using that as a springboard to push it into the consumer level market. I defiantly dig the concept though. I am that weirdo lol.

And there are two really good reasons for that. 1. Volume of cars involved. Far more domestics than European cars here. 2. Frequency. If there are five separate problems from one company (Ford, for example) and only two from another in the same time period (Toyota, for example), then there are going to be more reports on them. Those are my two main points behind my “assessment” and there is data to back that up.

Then maybe you are only looking at certain stories because I’ve seen plenty of flak directed at the Koreans over the last few years and the Germans (see diesel gate). Toyota caught plenty of flak for their crap too lest we forget the floor mat/UA issues 15 years ago. And company “arrogance” aside (what company hasn’t blamed customers first, I’ll wait lol), they addressed those issues in 2002, not even a year after a bulk of the reported issues. https://www.autosafety.org/toyota-broadens-sludge-repair-program/ Just saying, sometimes we see only what we want to see and I’m just going to leave it at that.