Frisky Dingo

That would be awesome. That engine with ~350hp and a manual would be incredible. And might very well render the V superfluous.

Which really means nothing because- 1) Again, those times can't be duplicated by someone with even good driving skills, let alone the average owner. 2) The Z06 cannot sustain laps at that pace even if they could. 3) Most people will easily go faster in the GT-R, despite absolute capability. 4) Track events aren't pitting drivers against one another in a race anyway, so it's a moot point.

There are 4 engines ranging from 200hp to 464hp, 3 transmissions, and AWD or RWD...... what do you see is missing? An engine that compares favorably to the N55 at least, let alone the upcoming B58. That and the other two Germans' blown V6's. And the 2.5 just needs to be dropped. Kind of unwarranted. The 2016 ATS gets 8-speed autos standard with the 2.0T and a new 3.6L V6 with 335 hp. See above. Also, the V6 needs to be available with an MT.

What it really needs is a more impressive drivetrain.

Awesome car. I love the front 3/4 view, but like Olds, the back is a major turn off for me. It's arguably the best looking from the front, but easily the worst looking from the rear.

Let me preface my post by saying you can't really go wrong with any of these cars. But the AMG is the least desirable to me. It puts up the numbers sure, but I just doubt it's ability to stand up to repeated tracking like the other two. The V8 is great and all, and the interior (minus the stuck-on tablet) is gorgeous, but it takes more than that to captivate me. The C63 seems like it was built more to the next-class-up's criteria. And I find it somewhat funny that they had to release a higher strength model right from the get go to compare favorably to it's rivals. For 90K, I'd expect it slaughter the other two, and it doesn't. I'd love to see how the standard car would fare. Moving on to the Caddy, I give props to GM for making such a focused car. They obviously labored over the driving dynamics, and it shows. Unfortunately, I think they may have compromised in other areas because of that. There's nothing wrong with the interior per se, but I still don't think it's quite on the level of the Germans'. And they definitely are a bit behind in terms of overall powertain aspects. If all you value is outright performance, this is admittedly your car. I'd only want one in 7MT form, though. No interest in the 8AT. That leaves the BMW. To nobody's shock I'm sure, it'd still be my pick by a long shot. Numbers and subjective criteria within spitting distance of the Caddy, and more room, nicer interior, and richer heritage/tradition to go along with it. For pretty much the same coin. I like it's looks better, I'm positive you'll have better dealership experience, and it has a tremendous amount of aftermarket support already. Add to that the enthusiast owner's base, and it's a package deal imo. I still think it's the bar for the segment in terms of incorporating everything so well into one package. In short, I think it's the best small sport luxury sedan for TODAY. But I couldn't fault anyone for preferring something else. It'd be a boring world if we were all the same. Besides, we can all agree Lexus sucks. True to all that. And the C63 has the best interior, best turning circle, largest trunk and somehow the best EPA fuel economy rating, best passing power. I also would skip the carbon brakes and save $5,400. The Nissan GT-R can hammer a Corvette in a 0-60 sprint and beat it on a race track, yet I doubt the Corvette fans here would buy a GT-R just because it is has a good Nurburgring time and video game launch control. Cadillac has put the performance in the ATS-V, but all three of these cars are basically the same (imagine if the Lexus IS-F was in that test, it would be have been embarrassed). But the same issues the base ATS has with interior space, interior trim, CUE, etc are all still there. Really I think all 3 of these cars are $5-10,000 over priced, the base models of all these are like $35,000 and these cars are near $80,000. One point of contention: a $100k Z06 would DESTROY a $100k GT-R on a track. In fact, Motor Trend ran a 1:25.00 at willow springs with a Z06 manual and a 1:25.7 with a $150,000 GT-R Nismo. That's a stretch. First off, because the average owner isn't going to come anywhere near to duplicating that time as they would the GT-R's, and because the Z06 can only do it for one or two laps, anyway.

The Trax IS sub-compact, and the Equinox IS compact.

An Equinox is NOT 22K. A decent one is 27K. Just like only stripper Traverses are 31K. 36K is about as cheap as you can actually find them, and there's far more 40K+ ones out there.

This is a very smart move on GM's part. The Equinox is too large and inefficient right now. That combined with the fact that the Traverse is the largest three-row CUV on the market makes this a no-brainer, imo. Make the Equinox a hair smaller than it is, drop some weight, up the MPG's, and give some modern powerplants, lower the price, and it'd be a good ride. As it stands, idk why the hell so many people buy them. The only thing I'll say is I think GM is missing a share of the market by not offering a true SUV based on the Colorado's platform.

As usual with these types of threads, this one is rather humorous.

Thanks. I'll try and get some pics up soon. And I'll add updates as necessary.

You're about half the price range it's going to come in at......

So as you all may know, I bought a 2014 4Runner Trail Edition Premium a few months ago. I gave some first impressions and thoughts on it when I got it, but this is going to be a look at what I've experienced over the last few months, what I like, and what I don't. Let me start by saying I'm still glad I bought it, and I'm still enjoying it. It really takes a lot of stress off me over keeping it clean and immaculate at all times like I did my BMW. That's not to say I trash it, but I got Weathertech mats, so I don't mind to get in with dirty shoes. I don't care if there's bugs splattered on the front, or water spots after it rains. I don't feel the urge to wash it every 3 days, because I know it's going to get dirty again soon, and sometimes intentionally. Expanding on that, my favorite thing about it is still using to get to places I would have never gone or couldn't have gone in the BMW. Living in SE Missouri, there's no shortage of dirt trails, state parks, and farm roads to take it down. And after experiencing some moderate flooding the last few weeks, it's taken me through some pretty deep spots of standing water that kept me from having to take lengthy detours. I enjoy actively taking it out and getting it dirty/muddy. People who don't venture off the pavement in these things are really doing themselves a disservice. It's truly a blast to tear down sandy farm roads in. It stays very composed and controllable over big whoops, ruts, and even small jumps. And with everything shut off, it's even fairly easy to toss around bends with some rotation. I've been a little more hesitant when it comes to mud and rugged trails because of my relative lack of experience, fear of getting stuck alone, and knowing that there is still room for improvement over stock to tackle such tasks better than it can now. It does good in mud, gravel, soft dirt, and what not, but I can tell the factory tires are a liability. They simply aren't aggressive enough. A few more inches of clearance would help, too. I plan to rectify both as soon as these tires wear out- they have about 50% left now. With those two things addressed, I'd be much more comfortable getting really down and dirty with it. Taking the discussion back to on-road manners, it's a mixed bag. The high points are the ride, refinement, and features. I love being able to simply steam roll speed bumps, potholes, and just road imperfections in general. I've gone from remembering every flaw in my town's road surfaces to not caring. It's just a non-issue. And it's a luxury you don't realize you have until having something like my 335. It will take such obstacles with no drama in the way of body quivering, rattles, or squeeking. No drama is coincidentally about the best way you could describe it's handling too, for better or for worse. You won't mistake this thing for Porsche, or even an Accord, but it goes where you tell it to with no fuss. The steering I feel is appropriate for such a vehicle- right weight, right quickness, etc. That's not to say it bristles with feedback, because it doesn't, but you're aware of what's going on, nonetheless. It should go without saying that there is considerable body roll, however, and it's coupled with some pretty heavy brake dive. Said brakes are where I take quite possibly greatest issue with the entire vehicle. They're super soft and vague, to the point of being at-best infuriating and at-worst almost-accident-inducing in stop-and-go traffic. In everyday driving, it's only the softness that rears it's head. But after spending a week in Austin and New Orleans crawl-along-at-5mph-for-5 yards-then-stop-again traffic, it's a major complaint. Your right foot will live in the last inch of brake pedal travel- the only place you get meaningful retardation of forward progress. My right foot was actually getting tired from it. I will actually be looking into upgraded pads, rotors, and fluid in hopes that it will rectify the issue. The other sore points are to be expected, and one's I knew would exist. One is mileage, which averages around 16 for 90% in town driving is rather poor. On the way down to Austin, I averaged between 20-21 at 75mph. About what it's rated at, but still a tough pill to swallow compared to the 28 I'd get in the BMW. The other, as you may have guessed, is power. It's fine around town and when off-road generally, but it really leaves you wanting at higher speeds such as on the highway and such. Even an extra 50hp would go a long way. 75-100 would be great. If they offered a V8, I'd trade mine in tomorrow. Lastly, the headlights suck. Like bad. The low-beams are embarrassingly dim. An HID upgrade will be happening soon. On the upside, the factory stereo is pretty good, I love the all-power up/down windows (rear included), the rear power outlet is surprisingly handy, and the A/C will freeze you on the hottest days. The seats are pretty comfortable, and putting rear child seats in the back is a breeze. And of course it has XM, bluetooth, all the normal stuff. Overall ergonomics are pretty good. I do miss proximity key/push-button start and dual-zone climate, though. Overall, the vehicle has proved to be a fun tool for enjoying some time off road away from the hustle, but not at the expense of being able to faithfully serve daily needs. It's opened up a form of vehicular fun I was previously ignorant to, and it's a welcome change. I would say it's really the last of it's kind, and would argue it's the only choice for anyone who wanted a fully enclosed, mid-priced SUV that would be regularly seeing off-road use. That's the 4Runner's primary mission statement, and I think it fulfills that role rather well. It'll be interesting to see if Toyota stays dedicated to this thing in a market increasingly straying from such vehicles, and if they do, how it will adapt. Thanks for reading. I'll also happily take questions on anything I may have left out.

I just don't like these cars. They drive okay, but I never was a fan of the looks, and the 2.0T is underpowered. And 38K?!? Lol, they're nuts. You can buy a really nice Avalon or Impala for that. I'd buy a Charger RT, personally.

I thought the truck was okay already, but I like this more. The grille is great.

Good. We need more unique vehicles on the road. At least this thing doesn't look like every other CUV on the market. I actually really like them in Trailhawk guise.

Welcome buddy. Was just in Austin last week, love it there.

I saw a Lamborghini Miura for the first time ever in Austin last week while on vacation. It was pulled over by a cop. A bright aqua blue color. Impossibly gorgeous. Also saw a beautiful Suzuka Grey R8 V10 Spyder. A silver i8 which was stunning. A few 458's. Several super clean 300ZX's. Saw a yellow C7 Z06 for the first time. The BMW dealer in Austin had a new X5 M in Long Beach Blue that looked amazing. No pics, sorry.

Except GM doesn't have a 700hp car period, and the Hellcats' power makes for nothing more than good burn outs. I for one applaud BMW on realizing how stupid this power war is. I'd much rather them focus on making their cars lighter and more involving than chasing outright horsepower. The funny thing is the haters complain either way. When their cars aren't tops-in-class in handling/steering, people say they focus on speed too much, and they're too soft. When they try to adjust their philosophy on the next car, people decry them for complaining about the lack of increase of power. It's a lose-lose. Hating on BMW is just the cool thing to do these days, and people will always find a way to jump on the bandwagon somehow. Nevermind that BMW offers manuals in probably more cars than any other maker. I don't hate BMWs.... can't hate something that bores me so much. The distance between a 650hp Z06 and 700hp Z06 is just an underdrive pulley away. The 7-speed manual can handle it. I'm not sure what manuals have to do with anything. Like I said, BMW offers manuals in more of it's vehicles than just about anyone. Also, 700hp in an M5/M6 is just a tune away. What's your point?

I'm a little late to the party on this one, but I just went to the configurator, and then did the same for it's 2 primary rivals, the M5 and E63. I will say that I don't think it's overpriced. But considering Cadillac's sales numbers of their other vehicles that enjoy a healthy price advantage, I'm not sure how much buyers in this market will actually care. I built a CTS-V out for $99,210. Surprisingly, the AMG was only 9K more at $108,985. The M5 came in the most expensive at $113,795. The BMW's price was mostly on account of having to get the Executive Pkg to get ventilated front seats, which is stupid. It does add other things like adaptive LED lights and whatnot, though. Still, for the money that these cars cost, I could easily overlook a 14% higher price tag to get what I feel is a better looking, and better built car. I'm also a little reluctant to believe the LT4 will perform flawlessly in this car after the stories of Z06 owners. I like that the M5 offers more options in terms of colors and interior leather. The fact that the M5 offers a true DCT is a big plus for me, as well. Also, the M5's aftermarket is killer. That said, I obviously couldn't fault someone for going with the Cadillac. To each their own. What I would REALLY do with this kind of money, however, is buy a 650 Gran Coupe. I built one that came in @ 108K, with everything I could possibly want, including Individual ext paint, leather, and interior trim. The sexiest looking sedan on the market imo, and it's power deficit can be almost entirely overcome with just tuning. Add to that the exclusivity and that's the route I'd go.

The Supra is still coming. It will be the byproduct of Toyota's collaboration with BMW. That has been the plan all along. The mashup will spawn a new Supra, and a Z4 replacement for BMW. But that car is still a few years off. This car slots above the Supra just as the original SC did. It'll be more lux, cost more, and have higher powertrain options. This isn't too hard to figure out guys.

Except GM doesn't have a 700hp car period, and the Hellcats' power makes for nothing more than good burn outs. I for one applaud BMW on realizing how stupid this power war is. I'd much rather them focus on making their cars lighter and more involving than chasing outright horsepower. The funny thing is the haters complain either way. When their cars aren't tops-in-class in handling/steering, people say they focus on speed too much, and they're too soft. When they try to adjust their philosophy on the next car, people decry them for complaining about the lack of increase of power. It's a lose-lose. Hating on BMW is just the cool thing to do these days, and people will always find a way to jump on the bandwagon somehow. Nevermind that BMW offers manuals in probably more cars than any other maker.

This car is painfully sexy. I have a feeling even the base model will be out of my price range though, lol.

That is not an attractive car. It looks like a cross between an Infiniti M and a Kia Optima. I'm sure it'll go like stink, but hard pass. I'll take any of the other players in the segment.

Awesome. I would do terrible things for one of these. Even the old one.