evok

I would not under-estimate the EU as an economic zone when compared to the US. For the most part, no borders, common currency, and english is the business language. There are more product choices for the consumers in Europe than the US to go with the 150 million more people than the US. Side by Side facts: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States

Mercury as a brand is irrelevant. Mazda outsells Mercury in the US using global product. KIA outsells Mercury - the market has spoken. But I have heard the idea that the M in L-M could turn into Mazda. To me that seems like a viable option for Ford to investigate. Jaguar is another story but LR sell app 200k vehicles globably at $50k+. Lincoln does not have the reputation to command the pricing of LR or Jaguar. For that reason, sharing the AL platform is most likely not viable. That is more vehicles than Lincoln and a little less than Cadillac. GM wishes they could sell 200k Escaldes and Hummers. And PAG generates 30 Billion dollars and is 1/2 of Fords total European operations. PAG is about premium pricing - it has nothing to do with only selling 280k in the US. And by the way - The Europe is the largest vehicle market in the world.

As enzl said - Jaguar is the problem - therefore PAG is negative. But Volvo has been and LR should be profitable this year. Bare in mind LR just invested a lot of money into new product and upgrading operations. LR and Volvo generate the bulk of the revenue at PAG just on sheer volume and pricing. Minus Jaguar - PAG should be adding close to a billion dollars to the bottomline.

Land Rover is on the cusp of profitability last I looked at the finacials. It also needs to be pointed out, PAG contributed 30 Billion in revenue to Ford which is equivalent to Ford of Europes contribution to Ford. In NA there are about 250 Jaguar and 300 LR dealers.

Yet your comments I responded to were related to the euro marks and were not accurate. As for Mercury, much like Olds it became irrelevant to the public many many years ago. Nasser should have axed in the late 1990s when he had the chance and built up Lincoln which was the plan. This article has no focus and it is pointless without the numbers. In other words - it is Girsky's opinion. I just double checked Girsky's numbers - and they do not paint the whole picture. In other words he is full of crap in his analysis. That is not to say consolodation on the dealer level for the big 2.5 may or may not be good, but the numbers used in the article paint a very distorted picture and do not factor into the equation any of the dealer brand consoldation of the past decade. i.e. On average dealers that sell Chevrolet trun over app. 550 vehicles/year. The problem with his analysis is that dealers today even within a manufacturer are not exclusive. The franchise might average that 550 number but what about the other GM brands that dealer sells? i.e. GM has app 14k franchises and yet on app 3,000 are exclusive and carry one brand. i.e. Chrysler Group has app 9000 Jeep, Dodge, Chrysler franchises but yet there are app. 3000 dealers selling the three brands under one roof. i.e. His analysis did not factor in certified used vehicles from the OEM. i.e. Most importantly, what were the dealership number 5, 10, 15 and 20 years ago.

Have you ever thought or considered these vehicle brands might have a global presence and I focus my comments on Volvo, Mazda and LR. The are a lot bigger than you might think.BTW - Mercury will be euthenized as soon as Lincoln can pick up the lost retail volume.

Sorry but there is a simple answer and that is how TMC groups their dealer data. I have personally asked TMC about this.Finally - This is just sales data by dealer group. Maybe it should be grouped by model year also instead of vehicles sold in the year. I am sure it would shed more light on the domestics problems to the public than your Scion issue. But the OEMs do not break it down by MY and instead use CY because this is based upon the transaction. BTW - LM has been combined in the sales release for as long as I can remember. Even today Ford takes the trouble to add two colums. This is just symantics. You seem to know how to add. It does not appear to be an issue because TMC does present the data. By the same token - maybe GM and the other domestic will present an itemized profit or more likely loss for each brand division instead of an consoloidate automotive table in their 10k. That to me is a little more important then how toyota motors arranges their Toyota and Scion Division and counts their sales.

My bad - I got caught up in the Roger Smith era ephoria. That will die in a couple years. So I have that much longer until I can celebrate.

Not sure about the Sierra. I always thought the same thing. Why was Lutz looked over. He had about 5 years left before hitting 65.

Lutz could not have done the LX cars at Chrysler, or the orginal CTS or the Taurus. Just look at Chrysler for his track record once they veil is pulled away. He is a myth not a legend. But he does Vipers and concept cars really well. GM has better people than Lutz.

ROTFLMAO - I guess all that education is no substitute for bowel control after seeing that but I take comfort that I know it came out the correct end. Unlike some!

Look at the bright side, at least GM's W bodies will be out of production by the end of the year. The number 4 automaker in the US in January 2007, "FORD" is still producing the panthers. Wagoner gets until Jan 2008.

No more Hughes No more EDS No more Ross Perot No more BOC/CPC No more Delphi No more Oldsmobile No more plastic Saturns and when the last W falls off the assembly line after 20 years of production, the loss, of 20 points of marketshare, hundreds of thousands of jobs and billion of dollars - The Roger Smith Era will finally be closed.

Thank you - I have been saying that since his arrival at GM. It is comfort to see others beginning to see that as well. The recent and soon to be new product is great, there is no doubt about that. But did it go far enough to capture to hearts and minds of the import public and get them in the showroom to at least try them out or put them on their radar. For the most part I am on the fence. Lutz can do Vipers and Solsti - but has trouble with the average public.

Just read in an AN article earlier this week, Ford's market share on Long Island is down to 10%. I suspect that the NE market is looking very similar to the CA market at this point in time.

Toyota Division is the Sales and Marketing Division that includes the Toyota/Scion dealer network. Toyota breaks out their based upon NA production. Maybe the domestics should do that as well. Just as Ford has historically reported out on their Lincoln/Mercury Division. It is not out of consiteration that GM may eventually combine thier BPGMC retail division when they report those sales.

The Outlook is world class all around. Here is what I posted back in October on the Aura:

The biggest issue is, I or anyone can not walk into a GM motors dealership. I walk into a brand or multi-brand franchise to buy a vehicle that is manufactured by GM. This is not to say that GM is wrong is promoting the GM corporate umbrellla but they must avoid another layer of confusion with the public. GM can not be hip. The brands themselves need to convey their distict appeal. It should be easier to turn around a brand than a company. It is also easier to disassociate the company from the brands as they have done an excellent job with Saturn and Saab. Years ago it was brand management where the focus was the models, now it appears in many ways since LaNeve's tenure there is a lot of focus on GM as a brand. That is a mistake. Since this thread is about hip, I highly doubt anyone would say Toyota, Lexus or Honda is exactly hip. I rarely see them use celebrity promos to endorse the product. What comes to mind in Ed Bagley Jr. promoting the Prius on his own time not the other way around. Personally I would rather GM take the Green Peace of Environment Responsiblity Award (if there is such a thing) or clean house on a Consumers Report reliability study. That would go a long way toward changing the corporate image and selling cars than have a photo op with DJ Jazzy Jeff and the Fresh Prince.

I agree with you for the most part. I said this at the time, the tiny GM badges they threw on the vehicles were idiotic and I pulled mine off as soon as I got my vehicle. First off because it was tacky and reminded me of the Chrysler Pentastar prior to DCX. And secondly because to 80+% of the retail market (based on retail market share) it sort of stands for a "kick me sign." Even this a mistatement that you elluded to: "GM managed an image turnaround before, when once-stodgy Cadillac became Hollywood's hip-hop brand of choice with the Escalade SUV. Even the most astute marketing maven couldn't have predicted that. Now GM hopes to duplicate that success with other products." Cadillac did not become HIP - The Escalade and CTS became hip vehicles but not the brand. And they became hip inspite of GM's marketing efforts at the time. In the end - GM is not a brand as much as LeNeve and company want to waste money thinking it is. GM is a company and an umbrella for many sick brands that need marketing support. Ford Motor Company is not a brand either but it has the rub off effect because of the car division. PS - Do you ever wonder why you rarely if ever see DaimlerChrysler associated with Mercedes Benz? Something to think about!

Higher transaction price for GM than normal. But one would also have to factor in the development and marketing of three vehicles compared to the one Honda the situation might change a bit. The GMC starts at 29k and the Buick 32k, but if we factor in the almost 40k starting price for the MDX and app. 80k sales/ year. The story is that much clearer. In summary - I think the new Lambda products are the best GM has ever built in their day and arguably the best in class and price. In the end, they are going to have to fight for each sale. I highly doubt if we had this conversation next year this time, the Honda volume will be down sharply and the GM volume will be much past 150k.

GM is only on planning on selling app. 150k lambdas between the three vehicles. Given that the price points for the entry level Saturn is on par with the Honda, it takes three to equal Hondas one.

Personally, I could care less. The Honda Pilot sold over 150k copies last year. The three lambdas combined will have a tough time attaining those numbers. In GM lingo the spam email the exec forwarded is called KUDOS. Bla bla bla Now lets's have a reality check. The Volt is theory and GM admits to the reality the Volt is not possible or may not be possible anytime soon. GM just testified before congress as much this week on the issue of government funded research into advanced battery technology. Without the batteries the Volt concept is just a reasearch vehicle. Unless it is destined for production with a practical and at most loses very little money, the Volt wows on stage where the Prius is making an impact on real people and creating good will with the press and green peace crowd. Currently for a small fee, there are companies that are currently converting the Prius to a plug-in hybrid. That is today not "maybe" 2010 or 2012 or "if" the lithium-ion battery is ready, or the federal government subsidizes the development. GM has had dozens of ground breaking concepts over the years. They do nothing on a platform if real people can not buy them. "A technological breakthrough required to make this concept a reality is a large lithium-ion battery. This type of electric car, which the technical community calls an “EV range-extender,” would require a battery pack that weighs nearly 400 pounds (181 kg). Some experts predict that such a battery – or a similar battery – could be production-ready by 2010 to 2012. " http://media.gm.com/servlet/GatewayServlet...amp;docid=31656

I have been saying that for years. Oldmobile, Buick, Pontiac, Chevrolet and Cadillac have to overcome a "negative" image in the average buyers minds eye. For good or bad - there are still sterotypes associated with each of the aforementioned brands. As for Saturn - It is still a differen type of company that still is on the tops of sales satisfaction survey with a great dealer network and good will. As you point out, the Saturn product might foster a non-opinion, but the brand itself has a lot of good will left. It is easier to overcome a nuetral opinion than a negative one riddled with sterotypes. Come this fall, Saturn might not be the plastic body small car experiment it was originally intended to be, but it will have the most well thought out, cohesive line up at General Motors and because of the positives associated with the brand, and the lack of association with GM, this brand does have a bright future.

Ignor the cheerleaders - many forget the motto of the site contains the word critic. I read a number of your posts and thought they were a fair critique.

Exactly: http://www.jdpower.com/corporate/news/rele...pdf/2006277.pdf and I guess according to this: http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...mp;#entry245482 the numbers will drop once the limited addition Ion goes away to be replaced by the even more expensive and limited addition Astra. Saturn is a differnt type of car from a differnt type of division of GM.