evok

Go read some of you recent comments in the SRX/CTS wagon thread.

My expectations based upon some forecast models is that GM is in the process of getting out of fleet with both the Malibu and Impala within reason of course. Without exact numbers those two vehicles do about 250k retail. From those models I would expect the two Next Gen vehicles to sell about 250 - 300 retail with about 25k - 50k retail sales shifting to the Malibu from the Impala. The catch is - the vehicles will not be fleeted like they are today to keep the plants operational because of UAW agreements. Therefore, total sales for these vehicles will be about 250 - 300k vehicles. This compares to about 450k today. Right now - GM can cut back on Malibu Fleet from last year because the Aura is in production and can pick up the slack in sales and keep the plant up and running. That is some of the reason why we have seen a drop in Malibu year-to-year sales. But - if this new product does not hit these retail targets (which I think they should because they are so modest), GM better hope they get a new cost structure with the UAW next September or you can throw all of the above out the window. Remembering currently it is cheaper to fleet than to lay off workers because of the current labor agreement. Or I should say, loose less money at fleeting 50% of Malibu and Impala sales than to shut the plants down to control inventory and pay laid off workers. The catch 22 is this - these fleet sales have helped GM stay ahead of Toyota globally. So how does GM bite the PR bullet of being numero 2.

Actually that is not correct. It was not the public that forced GM to change their policy on ABS but Uncle Bob Lutz. One of his first cost cutting moves was to begin to option and repackage the vehicles. And that resulted in ABS being optional as opposed to standard which if I remember correctly ABS was standard on just about every GM vehicle in the US prior to that Lutz decision. But, when Lutz did this, he lowered the base price on vehicles that no longer offered ABS as standard. This happened early in Uncle Bob's tenure at GM. In hindsight we see that it did not help GMs sales numbers in the US or their bottom line. But in the next few years when Stabilitrack/ESC becomes standard as GM has announced - ABS will become standard on every vehicle all over again.

Someone pass that bit of info onto Turbo200 - SRX did not do to bad either. Impala did not have a bad month either. I just am still wondering how GM is going to swap the volume between the Impala and the Malibu when the Impala goes RWD. But for the most part - all the new product including the Aura had a pretty good month. Even the CTS is still strong at 4800 units. Just a quick look I would say the sales look very good for the company overall. I just have no idea how the Buick and Pontiac brands are going to survive until their new product arrive. But they managed to do it with both Cadillac and now Saturn.

From the perspective of creating new niches or segment buster i.e. the next minivan, I am not sure what is left for them to fill. About the only thing left is a Chevy and Ford Ridgline and possibly bringing to the US some of the Euro product like the Meriva, Galaxy and Zaphira. So I am not sure where Flint was going with those statments. Even the RWD market will be saturated really fast. The NG Impala should be very profitable but the volume will be a fraction of the current vehicle. And what happens when the rest of the OEMs follow suit. Just saw in the paper today 2007 Chrysler 300 sales for under $20K. The secret to the Japanese success was consistency delivering good product that built a loyal following over many years. Let us see how GM follows up the NG CTS. Couple days now! Should be a first step in knowing if GM at least gets that.

That is a very true thought and that is reflected in that recent leaked GM memo the Detroit News just wrote about. What amazes me is that GM is just waking up to that fact: http://www.cheersandgears.com/forums/index...showtopic=14396 I have been saying for years now - if the Big 2.5 do not wake up they will become irrelevant. They might be on that cusp at the moment. And why... Lincoln has not seriously updated their flagship Town Car in 25 years and Cadillac is still selling fwd Deville/DTSs on a 12 year old platform with a 7 year old design and still using a 4 speed transmission. Personally I do not aspire to that sort of vehicle. Hell, all but a few domestic models appeal to me. I can understand why many buyers do not consider domestics. That is one of the few reasons why GM is investing money into Saturn - because it is not associated in peoples minds with GM. And that gives GM a chance to grow the brand. Pontiac, Buick, Chevrolet have negatives associated with the brand name, especially with cars, it may take years to reposition the brand image in peoples minds. I would not have a problem driving a Tahoe - but in many ways I could drive a Hyundai Sonata before even the new 08 Malibu.

I would check some facts prior to make such bold statement. First off: 50% of SRX sales are the V8 model and the demand for the vehicle is swayed to the awd model. That means the average transaction price for the vehicle is well over $45k. Though the base price for the vehicle has dropped to app. $37k, Cadillac has controlled demand and the product mix and is commanding premium pricing for the vehicle such that it is not a loss leader. It appears that intentionally they are sacrificing entry level sales volume and making money on the product at the high end. Secondly: The new interior would never substancially increase sales dramatically at this point in the life cycle of the product without an external refresh. What it most likely did was raise the average transaction price of the vehicle because of the improved quality. And Third: The MSRP is a problem for mass market sales. As I will state once more, this vehicle is a vehicle that can not be categorized much like the MB R and Infinit RX which have not sold in high numbers either. Those vehicles have suffered because of price and confused styling. But as I have stated above, Cadillac is not attempting to go after mass sales at this point in time with the vehicle and is going after the quality of the sale. Jim Taylor recently said as much about the Escalade hurting SRX sales. I happen to agree which goes back to price. People perceived the SRX as a CTS based product priced along side the Escalade. And you miss a typical GM marketing blunder at launch. Cadillac still does not know how to market it. Just go to their website and see SRX (Crossover) whatever that means. The market was aweful.

Price killed the SRX at launch. At launch back in 03 - the product mix was so swayed to the V8 awd the vehicle was over $50k. As croc stated even to this day you add a few options and awd the SRX V6 is 45k. Compared to the Lexus and Acura the SRX is more expensive even with the reduced price for the base. Now factor in the original interior, and a similar priced Escalade with the rebates the SRX could not compete. And to address your comments about the Escalade interior - What other options were there for consumers in the market for such a vehicle? Now compare that to the SRX competition. If the SRX was priced along with the CTS there would be less overlap with the Escalade. V6 starting in the low 30s and the V8 in the low 40s we would probably not have this discussion. Remember the CTS tops off where the SRX begins on price. The styling yes awkward is no more bizzar than an RX and FX - the only other vehicles in that same class. The MDX, M, BMW are for lack of a better description are SUVs.

I have seen better analysis from BM or at The Truth About Cars - This is just bunk journalism.

ding ding ding - we have a winner New front fascia - and relaunch the vehicle - and Cadillac might be ahead of the curve in the station wagon/crossover/however you define it game these days. It does - especially in black.

No problem - I had a long one in the works yesterday but was like why bother. But I just had to this morning after his last reply to your definitive reply on fleet sales in the industry. To back up your earlier post - App. 10% of Camry sales are to Fleet. That equates to 40,000 vehicles per year. This compares to about 60,000 - 70,000 Grand Prix that are sold to fleet this year alone or about 70% of the total production. So in summary - fleet is a natural part of the automotive business and is not detrimental as as long as it is not reliant upon fleet for sales. LOL I don't know - Following that same logic the Universe revolves around the Earth but we know Galileo was proven to be correct after the Church accused him of being a heretic.

It is a shame - since driving wise, packaging and now with the new interior, the vehicle IMO is the best thing they have in the showroom, especially given the market transition to more crossovers. The BRX might get the styling and packaging right, but driving dynamics will not match the SRX especially in 2 wheel drive configuration. Drive a Lexus RX back to back with the SRX and the Cadillac makes the Lexus feel exactly what it is, a tarted up Camry. I just wish GM spent some more money on a more aggressive nose in line with the 08 CTS for the 07 MCE.

Yes they are. I would even go out on a limb and say the 900s have more in common than the 800s. If what I was told was correct, even the suspension tuning for the 900s are the same including shocks and springs. This time around - the execution is a lot better, leading to a better perceived differentiation between the 900s. i.e. The 800 Escalade I/P is as different from the 800 Tahoe as the 900s. It just does not look it to the casual observer.

No, you made a limited observation and thought to extrapolate that as a wider fact. Which as enzl has already pointed out is not the case. Need I remind you, your post was riddled with "P.S. - I hate Toyota...whenever I see one of them on the road I get angry - I do not do anything - not a vigilante...I just want to slap the owners some times." and "The Camlee" and "I did not have to endure the Toyota POS's." Which I might add poisoned your question to any intelligent reader.

yes and for that reason I will get a CTS wagon... What I saw of the BRX it was not small but I could be wrong.

Yes - The NG sigma based SRX has been shelved in favor of the TE BRX or whatever they will call it and the CTS coupe and wagon late in the decade. It makes me wonder what LGR will build since CTS products should fill the plant?

Exactly - minimum investment and tuning unlike a SRX like sportwagon.

I know when the SRX goes bye bye - I will not be getting a fwd based BRX or a truck based Escalade - the CTS wagon it will have to be. Personally - I would prefer a real CTS based NG SRX sports wagon along the lines of an X5 instead of a "station wagon", but with the BRX in the line up it makes no sense. PS: CTS wagon sales in the US and globally will be modest.

The Euro/US side NCAP barrier is different than the IIHS and is conducted at a lower speed IIRC. The IIHS barrier is taller driving head protection. For those vehicles test w/o head protection in the IIHS test, there is almost no way for them to get much above a marginal. By comparison, US Side NCAP does not measure head injuries, and the Euro NCAP may not either. But in reality those smaller barriers all but bounce off the vehicle and a thorax bag may be sufficient.

My bad - you don't need me to tell you they will build this and the Intercpter.....someday.

I should have said mulitple personality disorders. LOL

OK - Finally had the chance to finish my post.

Here is my list of 5 and it is not in any order: Croc Satty* Balthazar Camino Razor When it comes down to it - we are car buffs - and I just think it would be fun to remove the chatroom veil and hit a major autoshow with these guys. It would be fun to have the real time feedback and not wait for the written translation. *Note: Multiple personalites included.