CaddyXLR-V

Any product decision over $100M needs to be approved by the board appointed by the govt. That would be EVERY product decision. Don't underestimate Obama's desire to make the country more green to fit what the rest of the world wants.

But when GM couldn't afford to give it's core brands (at the time) products, why were they buying other brands like Saab? Couldn't a partnership have worked instead, or a minority stake like with Isuzu?

For the record, I have nothing against buying older GM vehicles. I will still own a 67 GTO one day, whether GM is still alive at that time or not. But when it comes to new cars, GM is no longer on my radar. My father also owned his own autobody shop, and I have seen dozens upon dozens of GM vehicles in my family. But that doesn't change the fact that GM currently is clueless, and is getting rid of a big piece of what made GM great in the first place.

If I could change my name on here, I would have already. I'm fine with my money going to Germany. I gave GM more than a fair chance to earn my money(what a concept, earning something) and they blew it.

I drove the Charger, and I didn't like it much. I didn't like the steering, how it handled, or the interior. It felt more like a Chevy than a Pontiac. It's how I would expect an Impala to feel. The G8, to me, is a notch above the Charger. I also feel like the Challenger would be a step down slightly from my GTO. I will just need to get used to spending more money on the cars I want, because I'll need to step up into luxury brands like BMW to get what I want.

If they get to the point I'm comfortable with, I will consider them. But I'm not convinced yet. My brother's 06 Charger had lifter problems with under 20,000 miles. I haven't crossed them off my list like I have with GM though, but other companies better fit what I like at this time.

BMW and Porsche have stayed true to their heritage. They are not trying to be like Toyota. I don't trust Chryslers reliability, and I don't like Fords styling. If I am ever in the market for a pickup though, it will be a Ford. I am going to buy what I like, simple as that.

I was being sarcastic. I am no longer buying American. I would consider Ford or Chrysler, but they don't have anything that interests me.

Exactly. My brands of choice will now be BMW and Porsche. I know they will stay true to what I value in a car.

I agree with most of that, but I think he needs to just cut the ties with GM, not continue to support GM. We have supported GM for so long, through so many decisions we didn't agree with, but this is finally the straw that broke the camels back. Camino, like myself, will feel much better once we move on to a company other than GM, that we feel will not let us down.

Be careful with that. Being passionate about a brand is frowned upon here. Other people here will think your behind the times or irrational, or your just not loyal.

It's already too late.

Money used to purchase the brand, and Saab hasn't turned a profit from the time GM took a stake in them. That was money that should have gone to Pontiac and Olds.

How so? I only cared about the rest of GM, because of Pontiac. Lets change your statement a little bit. That's like saying you're not going to be friends with your old buddy's parents after they killed your buddy, because he was eating into their finances, which took away from their drug money. Would you still care about them?

Yeah, because GM has been doing the opposite of what us former loyalists said they should do for years. Look where they are now. I doubt the loyalists wanted GM to waste money yearly on Saab, billions creating Saturn, and buying Hummer, all at the expense of Pontiac and Oldsmobile, just to see all 3 of them killed or sold for much less than used creating/purchasing them, and taking Olds and Pontiac down with them. GM never really had a handle on what's good for the company. They still don't. I suspect they never will.

Yep, that was from the same person who stated people who buy Pontiacs are "tricked" into thinking they are "EXCITEMENT!!!" As stated in the thread comparing the GTO to a Cavalier, everyone is allowed to have opinions. Allow Camino to have his.

I want to hear your arguement when GM has 3 brands and 12% marketshare.

Loyalty is a 2 way street.

Yep, because Hyundai means EXCITEMENT!!!! Funny how as little as 5 years ago, no one would be caught dead in a Hyundai, but now they're in comparisons with G35s. Those same people would by a Hyundai now but say Pontiacs image is redneck and can never be changed.

My business is going everywhere else, except GM. I now feel bad for all the times I have defended GM and convinced people to buy GM vehicles. Now, it is my mission to convince people to NOT buy GM.

The better question is, will Chevy even be standing 2 years from now?

That comment wasn't directed at you, just in general. It just seems as if anyone says anything good about Pontiac, 10 people come complain about how they lack excitement, or the GTO was a failure or looks like a Cavalier. More often than not, the person making those comments are people that would never buy a Pontiac, and are happy the brand is being cut.

I have heard someone say the new Camaro looks just like the new Mustang, but the Mustang looks a little better. Does that make it true? The GTO is great because it is a total package. It is not tacky like the retro Mustang, which I believe became stale the day it was released. The Camaro does look good, and I believe will age better than the Mustang, but given the choice I would still choose my GTO over it. The GTO is what Pontiac should have always been. The people complaining about the GTO are the same people who would never buy a Pontiac in the first place, and are happy to see the brand get killed.

That looks 90% like the 2005 GTO. Yes, I would like the GTO to come back looking like that.