mystik

Agreed with whats already been said...100 less HP, a much uglier appearance inside and out. The exterior looks like an Expedition with braces, the interior looks like it was taken out of a 1970's microwave. The old Escalade has a previous gen SILVERADO interior and it still outsold the Navigator. Lincoln has brought a knife to a gun fight.

I like "rebirth". Mainly because it'd stand for a lot more than just the Camaro...

Charger competitor maybe?

So does that mean the GTO is definitely getting canned? If so...does that mean that GM wants the Camaro, and only the Camaro, to hold down the fort for GM in this segment?

Its a relief reading all of that for sure...makes me believe it will be out sooner than later...

A topic that hasn't been touched on a lot is the interior of the Camaro, and something that has sort of worried me since I first saw it. The interior is of course, unorthodox, and its a love it or hate it design. Plenty of people were turned off by it, saying it was too radical for a car of this caliber. Some loved it for its retro cues. So I wanted to ask what everyone here actually thought of the interior, how much will be changed? Should a lot be changed? I myself like it with the exception of the long orange trim around the inside dash and doors. Will it be toned down and tame like the Challengers?

Did Josh just say the car was going to be ready in 2007? If that were the case, I dont think I could hold in my joy....

Yup. Im sure everyone else who's considering a Camaro is also considering only a GM vehicle...

Well regardless of what's been said, GM should know better than to wait that long. I don't want this car rushed any more than anyone else does, but 3 years is an awful long time for people to wait for a car they want to go out and buy now. Example. I need a car soon, within the next year or two. So I was set on an Avalanche. Then I saw the Camaro, and started rethinking. So then it was Camaro or Avalanche? But if this car is coming out until 2009, I simply cant wait that long. Which is the case for a lot of people. They want this car now. GM needs this car now. Especially at the peak of the fuel price wars and what not, having a 400 HP car that can advertise 30 MPG is insane. I just dont think the sheer number of people who want this car NOW can get any bigger...it can only get smaller. I'd still want it when it came out, but then I'd already have a car that I'd still be paying off. Which is I'm sure the case for a lot of people...but then again the way GM has been doing things lately, maybe it will come out earlier. 2008 MY is a pipe dream I guess...

Geez...4Q 2008?? Thats 3 freaking years from now. Somewhere Ford designers and engineers are giving out a collective sigh of relief...

I understand, and yes its hard to have a sensible opinion without driving both. Hell, I havent even seen the new Silverado. But this is one segment where GM and Ford are king. And no one else is even remotely close. So it's going to be hard pressed to say the this new Tundra will steal market share. Whats not to say that the new Silverado will not REGAIN market share from the Tundra, Titan, F-150 and Ram? Lets face it, the Silverado was snubbed by a lot of buyers for its lower stance and crummy interior. So when the new one comes out, wouldn't it be safe to assume that it will once again be considered with the upper level of the truck stratosphere? Or maybe we will see when the TOTY competitions are held, and see which one comes out on top. Because even that makes me nervous. The Silverado could be incredible but the magazines would not hesitate to pull the trigger on the opportunity to make a Toyota beat a flagship GM vehicle at its own game. And what kind of publicity would THAT be for GM. I think loyalties are not as strong as they used to be in the car segment (look at Cadillac. Standard of the world before, now its trying to regain its former glory). But I still think brand loyalty in trucks is as strong as ever. Trucks, unlike cars, are more "Tried and true". We'll see later on in the year though, and am still waiting to figure out when the Silverado will debut? If they're making us wait this long...it has to be good.

How do you figure? Oh thats right...because the new Tahoes are not moving at all without incentives and at a profit. Right? Everyone, especially Toyota, needs to realize that GM has changed. And every single car coming out is aimed at Toyota's throat. The Enclave is a straight shot at one of their biggest cash cows, the RX. The Tahoe is a much worthier SUV than the Sequoia or 4 Runner. The Saturn Aura looks to be a great Camry/Corolla fighter...but all of these market segments are not dominated by any one make or model. They arent. Except for trucks, which are dominated by Chevy and Ford. Nissan released the Titan a few years back, into the heart of the GMT-800 Silverado's campaign. Did they lose sales? No. They did not lose sales against a superior truck, with a better interior and "more reliability". Why is that? Because Americans love American trucks. And Americans like the idea of imported cars. GM wasnt going to stand still and tread mud forever. So people think that his new Tundra is going to give the Silver-freaking-rado, GM's cash cow, GM's flagship, the single vehicle line that has kept the Chevy name at the top of the charts for God knows how many years now, a run for its money? Please. Not going to happen until GM itself caves. Because unlike the car industry, it doesnt matter what magazines or editors say, or anyone else. In the full size truck market, Toyota is bottom of the barrel. And has a long way to go before they even begin trying to climb to the top.

Well the Z06 is already the best performing sub 100k car in the country. No one cept for the Viper is even close. Interesting that the XLR-V should be caught up in all of this. Make this new Vette a super vette, have 3 levels of Corvettes (C6, Z06, ZL-1) and have the XLR-V on even keel with the Z06? Never really suspected them of doing that. Could happen. The XLR-V is already a high priced and high caliber number, doing respectable 0-60 times. What's the next powerplant going to be in the next CTS-V? It'd be neat if they put the 7.0 L in that thing.

Nice read. You pointed out a good X-factor that that really helps put things into perspective about this truck. Toyota's climb to the top of the automotive pantheon came at a time where its #1 competitor was going through a transition phase. Toyota gained market share because GM had nothing on the horizon, nothing going for it, and had the interiors of early 90's trucks and cars. So if the new Tundra was going up against the 06 Silverado, then yes, it is a better truck, and would have gained market share. Only now its different. Its not the same GM that Toyota grew accustomed to taking market share from. This one is different now. America has obviously fallen in love with the new Tahoe. The idea of getting a beautiful truck or SUV with a Chevy badge is something that hasn't really happened before. Toyota has gotten accustomed to getting to the market first. This way they are assured of stealing sales. But it's just not the case this time. When the new Silverado comes out, the Toyota team will look befuddled again and say "Now what?" Which is exactly what they should be asking. Because unlike before, the Silverado and Tundra are coming out at the same time. And one is breaking the previous incarnations downfalls, even though it remained the best selling vehicle for God knows how many years. So what stands to break more ground? A truck that barely sold getting signifcantly improved, or a domestic icon getting obscenely improved? This isn't a Toyota bash, just a realization. I'll eat my words if this new Tundra turns out to be a market hit, though there is a much higher chance that it will not. Why would it? It's not like its a 300C, a VW Beetle or a Toyota Prius. It's not something a biased market desperately needs. People have a different image of trucks than of cars. And in that stance, Toyota is setting themselves up for dissapointment again. Again, I bring up the Nissan Titan. The truck that was supposed to steal sales from the domestics and climb up the truck ladder. Initial sales pointed that way, only to bottom out and flatten. And it has stayed there. Similar to the bias that a good luxury car is made from a foreign brand, a good truck is made by domestics. This Tundra, even though better than the original, does not even begin to try to change that. It is not THAT much better. It's just better.

You can actually make out the grille in the first pic, and it looks noticeable smaller than the Yukon's grille. That thing looks straight up enormous. Cant wait to see the official pics...

Yeah your right. Image and marketing. Nissan was on a roll...here came the Titan. Oh man this was it. The first REAL Japanese full size entry. Watch out Detroit, its like a Japanese F-150. Hell, I heard a lot of people talk about them. But when it comes down to purchase, people go with the domestics. The Tundra will sell more than the previous model, it wont sell more than the Titan, and only in Toyota's wildest most obscene dreams can the Tundra begin to claw at the bottom of the domestic truck barrel. Titan sales flattened after the first few months, when the initial reaction was gone. If, IF, the Titan had never been released then I wouldnt disagree with you. But it was, and it was one hell of a Japanese entry. And look at it. Image and marketing from who? Magazines? Saying the Tundra will one day compete with the American Full-Sizes in sales is as short sighted as saying the Mustang will be released in Japan and start stealing sales away from Nissan and Honda cars.

This thing wont sell. Why would it? They said the Nissan Titan would take market share away from the big 3...and it really hasn't. This thing is loads better than the last Tundra, which looked like the Tacoma's slightly older brother. It does look a bit like the Ram, and thats probably the buyer that it will appeal to. I think Americans, as much as foreign cars have made the climb, will never ever take to Japanese trucks. Cars=refinement. Trucks=durability/ruggedness. Thats the association. Thats why American cars are neck and neck with the foreigns, and American trucks dominate the market. This truck looks better than the previous version, looks worse than a Titan however. It'll still be last of the pack.

Take a look at the truck in black...whoo wee....looks nice.

Looks great in the first pic with the Tahoe and Suburban, I assume it shares the same interior. Cant help but wonder what this thing would look like cladded...this will still be my next vehicle.

How does the Tahoe look nice to some people but the Avalanche is ass ugly? The old Avalanche, as cool as it was, with cladding looked only good in darker colors. Pewter, Dark Gray, and Black. Anything else made it look wierd. The claddingless Avalanche looked like a Silverado, and looked a LOT wimpier than the GMT-900 Avalanche. I was dissapointed to see that this thing shares a lot with the Tahoe front end. I hope to God that the Silverado does not and has a different one, but we will see. Its not like the Tahoe has a BAD front end. Geez...people want to rag on every single freaking thing.

I remember seeing the truck sales in September. The Silverado/Sierra combined significantly outsold the F-150. But the Silverado alone was behind.

Heh...the guys over at the Chevy Avalanche Fan Club all despise this thing. They think it looks like a Ridgeline because the cladding got done away with and it now looks refined. Im really confused at how some people actually prefer the interior of the older models. Cant wait to see one in person.

Though unsurprising, it is consistent. It looks great. Figures that it would look like the Tahoe, as it shares more components with the SUVs than with the trucks. This will probably be my next vehicle, even though Id really like a Camaro...is the 6.0L available in this beast? I wonder if the trucks will also share this front end...Im kind of hoping not because then they would ALL look the same. But I guess you cant be too picky...Im glad they look this good.

Sweet. This whole GM thing is really starting to come together nicely. The new Tahoe, Escalade, Lucerne, Enclave, Aura, Sky, Solstice and Camaro really represent a new GM. Funny thing is, what car does Toyota have in response to this? They have everything covered except for the one category...the soul-filled, car lover's enthusiast sports car. I want this car so bad..

I went to the Auto Show today with low expectations. Didn't think the Camaro would be there. There was a considerable amount of people there however. The new Escalade was there to meet you at the front door, drawing a moderately large sized crowd. As we walked through, finally getting to the Chevy exhibit, and looking through the new Tahoes that were out on the floor. Then I saw the 5 projection screens that said "Camaro". And all I said was "Theres no way..." So ignoring everything, I ran over there. Needless to say, it was the single largest crowd of the day gathered around this beast. You could hear mumbles from the crowd "Man that car is beautiful" "Why would I get a Mustang?" "30 miles to the gallon!" "Wow...." made my way through the crowd and there it was, in all of its glory. It is so freaking nice. Its just breathtaking. The interior couldn't be seen, most of it was covered, but it was the exterior that everyone was enchanted with. My dad even came away saying "Thats the next car I want." It's just so perfect. Here are some pictures of the Camaro, in red, at the Auto Show. Im going again on Friday, to take one last look at it. Im smitten.