Cadillac News: Welcome to the New Standard of the World! Cadillac CELESTIQ

[ForzaJersey]

I've been a Cadillac fan my entire life. As much as I'd want to fanboy the Celestiq, I find it hard to be enthusiastic based on the garish and cheap looking Cadillac EV grille that won't age well, the bland side profile, and a fastback rear that belongs on the rear of a Honda civic, not a flagship ultraluxury sedan.  The EV powertrain is simply outclassed by Lucid. The Celestiq will be valuable to collectors since it won't likely be produced very long.

[G. David Felt]

4 hours ago, ForzaJersey said:

I've been a Cadillac fan my entire life. As much as I'd want to fanboy the Celestiq, I find it hard to be enthusiastic based on the garish and cheap looking Cadillac EV grille that won't age well, the bland side profile, and a fastback rear that belongs on the rear of a Honda civic, not a flagship ultraluxury sedan.  The EV powertrain is simply outclassed by Lucid. The Celestiq will be valuable to collectors since it won't likely be produced very long.

I would have to disagree with you on every point you made including the Lucid comment. 

Yes, Lucid has done a nice job, but they are nowhere near what an ultra-luxury hand built auto this will be compared to them.

In regard to the cheap, garish looking EV grille, that could be said about all EVs. Tesla, Mercedes EQ is just awful and even Lucid which can leave one wanting. Style after all is very subjective.

[Drew Dowdell]

So I drove the EQS AMG and I'm pretty meh about it.  Sure it's fast and it has pillows on the headrests, but a lot of the stuff you don't normally touch feels really down market.  The steering wheel is downright confusing with a combination of buttons, touch controls, dials, and buttons inside of dials that do the same thing.  The infotainment screen is way oversized and distracting as well as impossible to intuitively operate.  Some controls are on the steering wheel, some are on the center console, some are in both locations but operate differently.

Is it more comfortable than a Tesla? Yes.. but so is just about everything else on the market.  It is fast? Also yes, but so is a Tesla. Is it good looking? No, it's a CLS that someone left out in the sun too long.  Is it big like an S-Class? No, it's E-Class roominess inside along with having terrible rear visibility.

The EQS and EQE both feel, from the inside, as they are one size class down from their ICE letter equivalent.

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, Drew Dowdell said:

So I drove the EQS AMG and I'm pretty meh about it.  Sure it's fast and it has pillows on the headrests, but a lot of the stuff you don't normally touch feels really down market.  The steering wheel is downright confusing with a combination of buttons, touch controls, dials, and buttons inside of dials that do the same thing.  The infotainment screen is way oversized and distracting as well as impossible to intuitively operate.  Some controls are on the steering wheel, some are on the center console, some are in both locations but operate differently.

Is it more comfortable than a Tesla? Yes.. but so is just about everything else on the market.  It is fast? Also yes, but so is a Tesla. Is it good looking? No, it's a CLS that someone left out in the sun too long.  Is it big like an S-Class? No, it's E-Class roominess inside along with having terrible rear visibility.

The EQS and EQE both feel, from the inside, as they are one size class down from their ICE letter equivalent.

Your last statement is a bit of a shock as I would think that being an EV they would have focused to make them inside equal, but I see tonight that others have also stated in their reviews that the EQ autos are smaller than their ICE auto's.

This is a trend that would not make me think "The Best or Nothing"

Thank you for letting us know on what it was like.

[ccap41]

13 hours ago, David said:

Yes, Lucid has done a nice job, but they are nowhere near what an ultra-luxury hand built auto this will be compared to them.

He only mentioned the powertrain and I'm not really sure how it can be disputed. Lucid's range, power, and charge times are all top tier currently. 900v charging, 1111-1200hp, 520 miles of range. 

The vehicle as a whole isn't anywhere near as luxurious as the Caddy but, the powertrain/batteries seem superior. 

13 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

The steering wheel is downright confusing with a combination of buttons, touch controls, dials, and buttons inside of dials that do the same thing.  The infotainment screen is way oversized and distracting as well as impossible to intuitively operate.  Some controls are on the steering wheel, some are on the center console, some are in both locations but operate differently.

I watched a video review of the EQS SUV (I assume most everything inside is the exact same) and the whole captive "buttons" everywhere seems like a complete train wreck. Caddy got so much flack for that a decade ago. 

[Drew Dowdell]

1 hour ago, ccap41 said:

I watched a video review of the EQS SUV (I assume most everything inside is the exact same) and the whole captive "buttons" everywhere seems like a complete train wreck. Caddy got so much flack for that a decade ago. 

But wait, there's more! Not only are there capacitive buttons on the steering wheel, they are simultaneously physical buttons too.  So for example, swipe up or down for volume, but press for mute... all in the same button.  I accidentally brushed a steering wheel button with my hand while turning and it changed the screen on the infotainment.   There are dials on the steering wheel too. The right one changes the sport/normal/eco modes, but you can also press the button inside the dial to do the same thing. Two controls, literally inside each other, that do the same function.  I dunno, maybe they're programmable or something, but they certainly aren't intuitive.

[ccap41]

31 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

But wait, there's more! Not only are there capacitive buttons on the steering wheel, they are simultaneously physical buttons too.  So for example, swipe up or down for volume, but press for mute... all in the same button.  I accidentally brushed a steering wheel button with my hand while turning and it changed the screen on the infotainment.   There are dials on the steering wheel too. The right one changes the sport/normal/eco modes, but you can also press the button inside the dial to do the same thing. Two controls, literally inside each other, that do the same function.  I dunno, maybe they're programmable or something, but they certainly aren't intuitive.

OMG, I hate all of that so unbelievably much. SOME of those style buttons are "okay" but they REALLY need to be used and placed correctly for me to not hate. 

Come to think of it, I think the GLB and GLC loaners that we've had have had those for the steering wheel controls. They were "okay" at best. I don't think either of us accidently changed anything while driving but I know my left hand (while sitting in the passenger seat) definitely hit something in the middle that muted or turned the volume way up and we had no clue how/what had happened. I think I had ever-so-slightly brushed the infotainment control in whatever way made those changes. 

This reminds me, I think I just read VW is getting rid of those buttons for real buttons on their GTI (and/or other models) because the steering wheel captive buttons are soooo hated. Good on them. 

36 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Two controls, literally inside each other, that do the same function.  I dunno, maybe they're programmable or something, but they certainly aren't intuitive.

This was actually one reason the in-laws went got an older(2017) GL over a GLS. There was way too much going on for them to try and figure out and they just wanted the vehicle to work for them. There's already a lot in a 2017 GL but the newer GLS and pretty much everything newer Merc, has too much going on for the "boomer" age group. 

My parents have a 2020 RAV4, or maybe 2021, and just a few weeks ago I showed my mom the auto function for the climate control. A lot of people just want their cars to freakin work. There are too many complexities in a lot of new vehicles. 

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, ccap41 said:

OMG, I hate all of that so unbelievably much. SOME of those style buttons are "okay" but they REALLY need to be used and placed correctly for me to not hate. 

Come to think of it, I think the GLB and GLC loaners that we've had have had those for the steering wheel controls. They were "okay" at best. I don't think either of us accidently changed anything while driving but I know my left hand (while sitting in the passenger seat) definitely hit something in the middle that muted or turned the volume way up and we had no clue how/what had happened. I think I had ever-so-slightly brushed the infotainment control in whatever way made those changes. 

This reminds me, I think I just read VW is getting rid of those buttons for real buttons on their GTI (and/or other models) because the steering wheel captive buttons are soooo hated. Good on them. 

This was actually one reason the in-laws went got an older(2017) GL over a GLS. There was way too much going on for them to try and figure out and they just wanted the vehicle to work for them. There's already a lot in a 2017 GL but the newer GLS and pretty much everything newer Merc, has too much going on for the "boomer" age group. 

My parents have a 2020 RAV4, or maybe 2021, and just a few weeks ago I showed my mom the auto function for the climate control. A lot of people just want their cars to freakin work. There are too many complexities in a lot of new vehicles. 

You have hit the one issue that many companies FAIL to understand. 

Technology is supposed to make life easier, not harder through complexity.

This is also where I believe Mercedes is going to FAIL big time. They are sticking to the same formula of ICE with an Electric power train. This will hurt them when you have Tesla leading the way in Mega Casting. GM has already started this with their EVs and I would not be surprised based on news from Ford if the new EV Platform that they are moving to next year is based on Mega Casting.

This is also where Toyota / Subaru has failed.

Interesting times we live in.

[ccap41]

3 minutes ago, David said:

Technology is supposed to make life easier, not harder through complexity.

EXACTLY and this is one reason I think Tesla has been so successful. Their entire network of products all work together seamless and effortlessly by the user. One doesn't not need to be a tech savvy 25 year old to operate their car and charge it publicly. Every review of every other company dogs the public charging system and how their vehicles are matching up to the chargers. Teslas appear to be flawless charging publicly. 

[Drew Dowdell]

27 minutes ago, David said:

You have hit the one issue that many companies FAIL to understand. 

Technology is supposed to make life easier, not harder through complexity.

This is also where I believe Mercedes is going to FAIL big time. They are sticking to the same formula of ICE with an Electric power train. This will hurt them when you have Tesla leading the way in Mega Casting. GM has already started this with their EVs and I would not be surprised based on news from Ford if the new EV Platform that they are moving to next year is based on Mega Casting.

This is also where Toyota / Subaru has failed.

Interesting times we live in.

The EQS is such a weird beast. Is it a $150k car? With its performance and the amount of tech... yeah, probably.  But that doesn't mean it has a desirable amount of tech.  It is WAY overboard and there is way too much going on with the screens in front of the driver.  It's brash and intrusive and I feel like I'm piloting the Enterprise (NCC-1701-E).  Some may like it, but it isn't what I would be looking for in a luxury car.  I did drive another EV the same day from a competing brand... I'm not saying which because I'm working on a story/video of it, but it was roughly half the price and yet a far more satisfying car. Enough so that I texted a picture to Albert and told him it could be the EV that replaces his 300C.

[ccap41]

...Half the price of an EQS, luxury, good size.. Lyriq. 

[G. David Felt]

Have to say I am very impressed with the Hyundai Ioniq 5 as I parked next to this matt finished EV which was new from the dealership. 

[smk4565]

On 10/24/2022 at 8:13 PM, Drew Dowdell said:

So I drove the EQS AMG and I'm pretty meh about it.  Sure it's fast and it has pillows on the headrests, but a lot of the stuff you don't normally touch feels really down market.  The steering wheel is downright confusing with a combination of buttons, touch controls, dials, and buttons inside of dials that do the same thing.  The infotainment screen is way oversized and distracting as well as impossible to intuitively operate.  Some controls are on the steering wheel, some are on the center console, some are in both locations but operate differently.

Is it more comfortable than a Tesla? Yes.. but so is just about everything else on the market.  It is fast? Also yes, but so is a Tesla. Is it good looking? No, it's a CLS that someone left out in the sun too long.  Is it big like an S-Class? No, it's E-Class roominess inside along with having terrible rear visibility.

The EQS and EQE both feel, from the inside, as they are one size class down from their ICE letter equivalent.

I have only sat in an EQS, but I think the S-class is nicer and roomier on the inside.

The EQE is as big as an E-class, I think 1-2 inches longer actually, being electric they should be able to make it roomier.   But from what I have seen or read it isn't like the Taycan or Audi e-tron GT are big cars inside either.  But looking at an EQE or an E-class, I'd pick the E-class and I'd prefer an EV if I were buying a car today.

I think what a lot of these car companies will find is people don't want mega screens, they will want buttons, volume knobs and conventional stuff.  I heard the hyper screen equipped cars have like a 1 year back log, so there are some techies out there that want that, but I suspect the bulk of the market is not that, and I suspect Mercedes will get customer feedback wanting "traditional" Mercedes that are EV.  

[smk4565]

On 10/25/2022 at 9:44 AM, ccap41 said:

He only mentioned the powertrain and I'm not really sure how it can be disputed. Lucid's range, power, and charge times are all top tier currently. 900v charging, 1111-1200hp, 520 miles of range. 

The vehicle as a whole isn't anywhere near as luxurious as the Caddy but, the powertrain/batteries seem superior. 

I watched a video review of the EQS SUV (I assume most everything inside is the exact same) and the whole captive "buttons" everywhere seems like a complete train wreck. Caddy got so much flack for that a decade ago. 

The Lucid Air is also sized like an EQE or Taycan.   The Celestiq is like 18 feet long, way bigger than a Lucid.  I couldn't find the actual length, but I imagine it is longer than an Escalade.

The Lucid might become like the next Fisher Karma, a lot of flash and hype, then they don't sell any and the company is gone.

[smk4565]

On 10/25/2022 at 11:23 AM, ccap41 said:

OMG, I hate all of that so unbelievably much. SOME of those style buttons are "okay" but they REALLY need to be used and placed correctly for me to not hate. 

Come to think of it, I think the GLB and GLC loaners that we've had have had those for the steering wheel controls. They were "okay" at best. I don't think either of us accidently changed anything while driving but I know my left hand (while sitting in the passenger seat) definitely hit something in the middle that muted or turned the volume way up and we had no clue how/what had happened. I think I had ever-so-slightly brushed the infotainment control in whatever way made those changes. 

This reminds me, I think I just read VW is getting rid of those buttons for real buttons on their GTI (and/or other models) because the steering wheel captive buttons are soooo hated. Good on them. 

This was actually one reason the in-laws went got an older(2017) GL over a GLS. There was way too much going on for them to try and figure out and they just wanted the vehicle to work for them. There's already a lot in a 2017 GL but the newer GLS and pretty much everything newer Merc, has too much going on for the "boomer" age group. 

My parents have a 2020 RAV4, or maybe 2021, and just a few weeks ago I showed my mom the auto function for the climate control. A lot of people just want their cars to freakin work. There are too many complexities in a lot of new vehicles. 

Yeah, good move on VW to go to regular buttons.  And the Mercedes at the end of the COMMAND era or Gen1 MBUX with the clicky-wheel (or track pad but clicky wheel I think is better) and the touch screen but still having regular buttons is better.  The capacity touch and haptic feedback seems bad, and that was always a hallmark of Mercedes is how a switch clicked or felt when you pushed it.  I think you need to touch things to feel quality, whether it is a button in a car, furniture, fabric, whatever.  If everything is a screen, then there is no difference between a Rolls Royce and a Honda Civic as far as touching the controls.

[G. David Felt]

3 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

The Lucid Air is also sized like an EQE or Taycan.   The Celestiq is like 18 feet long, way bigger than a Lucid.  I couldn't find the actual length, but I imagine it is longer than an Escalade.

The Lucid might become like the next Fisher Karma, a lot of flash and hype, then they don't sell any and the company is gone.

If someone actually looked at the Cadillac website you would have seen in the specifications that the Escalade ESV is 229.6 inches long, Escalade standard is 211 inches long and CELESTIQ is 216 inches long. Yes, it is sized to the Escalade, but not the ESV version.

[smk4565]

2 minutes ago, David said:

If someone actually looked at the Cadillac website you would have seen in the specifications that the Escalade ESV is 229.6 inches long, Escalade standard is 211 inches long and CELESTIQ is 216 inches long. Yes, it is sized to the Escalade, but not the ESV version.

Thanks, I googled it and nothing.  But a Lucid is like 196, so not even close.  The Lucid is like an AMG E63, M5, RS6 competitor, mid-size sports sedan.

[Drew Dowdell]

30 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

The Lucid Air is also sized like an EQE or Taycan.   The Celestiq is like 18 feet long, way bigger than a Lucid.  I couldn't find the actual length, but I imagine it is longer than an Escalade.

The Lucid might become like the next Fisher Karma, a lot of flash and hype, then they don't sell any and the company is gone.

 

24 minutes ago, David said:

If someone actually looked at the Cadillac website you would have seen in the specifications that the Escalade ESV is 229.6 inches long, Escalade standard is 211 inches long and CELESTIQ is 216 inches long. Yes, it is sized to the Escalade, but not the ESV version.

So the CELESTIQ is 10 inches longer than at CT6… which sounds right for a $300k flagship.

[oldshurst442]

The Lucid Air is a sports sedan.  The Tesla Model S is also a sports sedan. 

These high performance cars need the range because the more speed in acceleration and high speed hijinks one does, the more power required and hence more juice you use...

I dont know where the Mercedes EQS is on the luxury spectrum, but the Celestiq and the Rolls Royce Spectre EV coupe are for quiet, leisurely jaunts.  These are not even daily drivers.  300 mile ranges is more than enough to get where you wanna go.  The event you are going to in these vehicles dont start unless you have arrived.  And  then you go back home when everybody sees you owning these.   Meaning, these are going to be event only machines.

Dont get me wrong, I was kinda wishing Cadillac was showcasing 500 plus miles in these, to showcase the best of the best the Ultium platform and batteries and the Celestiq have to offer,  but in reality, it aint necessary to have 500 plus miles.    

 

[oldshurst442]

On 10/19/2022 at 9:11 AM, ccap41 said:

That Rolls I linked seems like a direct competitor and it doesn't have a disgusting rear 1/4 of a vehicle. 

No..the Rolls is disgustingly ugly 380 degrees all the way through.   Yeah...380.    Its not only ugly all around, but shall  add another 20 degrees because you gotta do a double take to make sure you really did see an ugly POS... 

Call the ugly 1/4 rear of the Celestiq a MAJOR upgrade over the Rolls?    I know you can do that.  Because nobody in their right mind would say the rear 1/4 Celestiq is uglier than the whole Spectre car...

On 10/18/2022 at 10:57 PM, smk4565 said:

 

3D printing doesn't do anything for me.  

Cool and all, but it IS the way some automotive parts  are to be manufactured in the not so distant future...

Many cars right NOW use 3D printing...  Maybe you dont get all to excited by it, admittedley it aint that exciting. But I have a sneaky suspicion that you aint too excited by 3D printing is because Cadillac mentioned it. Had it been Mercedes mentioning it, you'de be shyttin' your pants with glee...

On 10/19/2022 at 9:21 AM, ccap41 said:

 

Nobody buys a car because they found an efficient way to manufacture the vehicle. 

You gotta be kidding, right?

Maybe trolling?

Because I doubt you are clueless...  I KNOW you are not...  So, perhaps playing that sheriff game you like to call @surreal1272 up on?

Here, let me post a couple of pics to call you out on that dumb remark...

 

That led to this

The led to these adverts...

 

Oh...if those are too old for you and antiquated. Anmd you are a Mercedes fanboy to boot...

Something along the lines of...engineered like no other...

 

I saw these posts a week ago... I refrained from answering. 

 

Its annoying as phoque reading this kinda shyte...

The semantical bullshyte analysis. The fake gotcha moments...  

 

 

 

Edited October 29, 2022 by oldshurst442

[smk4565]

2 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

 

So the CELESTIQ is 10 inches longer than at CT6… which sounds right for a $300k flagship.

It's about the size of a Maybach S-class, a little bigger than a Flying Spur or Ghost, smaller than a Phantom.  But any of those cars are more in the chauffeur driven class, no one else is making anything like that ICE or EV really.

[G. David Felt]

On 10/28/2022 at 6:53 PM, smk4565 said:

It's about the size of a Maybach S-class, a little bigger than a Flying Spur or Ghost, smaller than a Phantom.  But any of those cars are more in the chauffeur driven class, no one else is making anything like that ICE or EV really.

? Really, you used to compare the S-Class to these as well as you have mentioned in the early days before the EQS actually started to ship that it would be in this class, now because Mercedes does not have anything to compete, you try to play it down. 

Just accept that Cadillac is getting here first ahead of Mercedes. 

END OF LINE!

[G. David Felt]

On 10/18/2022 at 7:57 PM, smk4565 said:

3D printing doesn't do anything for me.  

But it should since Mercedes is saying the same thing about 3D printing that they say they have used for the last 30 years which I find weird and hard to understand since 3D printing has not been around that long, but according to them it has and they have been using it all along.

Mercedes-Benz replacement parts from the 3D printer.

Mercedez-Benz restarts classic cars with 3D printed parts - 3D Printing Industry

Mercedes-Benz Turns to 3D Printing for Plastic Spare Parts | Additive Manufacturing

Mercedes Vision EQXX features directly and indirectly 3D printed parts (3dprintingmedia.network)

Mercedes-Benz Trucks Rolls Out First Metal 3D Printed Part: An Aluminum Thermostat Cover for Older Truck Series - 3DPrint.com | The Voice of 3D Printing / Additive Manufacturing

Daimler Buses implements 3D printing to produce bespoke Mercedes-Benz parts - 3D Printing Industry

So how do you justify it not being a cool or important thing in auto building when Daimler / Mercedes-Benz says they have been doing it anywhere from 30 years ago to 10 years ago using it on trucks and buses?

[G. David Felt]

FYI - My Cadillac dealership is almost done with the new building as they tore down the old 1950's Cadillac,Buick,Oldmobile,GMC dealership as it still had sandblasted windows with all 4 logos. 

I wonder if anyone thought to save the glass, probably not, but a modern Showroom will be open on November 17th for a by invitation only grand opening and they will have a couple LYRIQs on the show room for people to check out and more from GM according to my invite. I have already RSVP's for the wife and I. 

Yes, I am going mainly to try my large frame in the LYRIQ and see if I can fit in the back also with the front seat set for me. Will take pictures.

It is much farther along than this from during the summer.

[ccap41]

On 10/28/2022 at 5:46 PM, smk4565 said:

but I imagine it is longer than an Escalade.

I believe I read that it is longer than an Escalade. 

On 10/28/2022 at 8:38 PM, oldshurst442 said:

No..the Rolls is disgustingly ugly 380 degrees all the way through.   Yeah...380.    Its not only ugly all around, but shall  add another 20 degrees because you gotta do a double take to make sure you really did see an ugly POS... 

Call the ugly 1/4 rear of the Celestiq a MAJOR upgrade over the Rolls?    I know you can do that.  Because nobody in their right mind would say the rear 1/4 Celestiq is uglier than the whole Spectre car...

Cool and all, but it IS the way some automotive parts  are to be manufactured in the not so distant future...

Many cars right NOW use 3D printing...  Maybe you dont get all to excited by it, admittedley it aint that exciting. But I have a sneaky suspicion that you aint too excited by 3D printing is because Cadillac mentioned it. Had it been Mercedes mentioning it, you'de be shyttin' your pants with glee...

You gotta be kidding, right?

Maybe trolling?

Because I doubt you are clueless...  I KNOW you are not...  So, perhaps playing that sheriff game you like to call @surreal1272 up on?

Here, let me post a couple of pics to call you out on that dumb remark...

 

That led to this

The led to these adverts...

 

Oh...if those are too old for you and antiquated. Anmd you are a Mercedes fanboy to boot...

Something along the lines of...engineered like no other...

 

I saw these posts a week ago... I refrained from answering. 

 

Its annoying as phoque reading this kinda shyte...

The semantical bullshyte analysis. The fake gotcha moments...  

 

 

 

TLDR

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, ccap41 said:

I believe I read that it is longer than an Escalade. 

TLDR

Yes as I posted, standard Escalade is 211 inches long, CELESTIQ is 216 inches long. Escalade ESV is 229.6 inches long.

CELESTIQ will fit in between the two options of Escalade.

[oldshurst442]

2 hours ago, ccap41 said:

TLDR

It dont surprise me...

That is how YOU misinform yourself on many things.  You troll or you willfully ignore info because it does not suit your ideologies...

You do you.  

 

[ccap41]

2 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

You do you.  

Will do, thanks. 

[oldshurst442]

1 minute ago, ccap41 said:

Will do, thanks. 

Sure...

But your opinion would be wrong, tho.  Just sayin'. 

[ccap41]

5 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

your opinion would be wrong

That's a little ironic considering what an opinion is. 

[G. David Felt]

@oldshurst442 @ccap41 Come on guys, we all do not like trolling, but at the same time, freedom of speech is freedom of speech. Let this water flow under the bridge and move on with the Discussion of the Awesome Cadillac CELESTIQ and how it will push the boundaries of Standard of the World.

Agree to disagree and move forward.

While we have the expected Battery compartment leakage in the Hummer so a stop sell on them and awaiting a fix for the gasket seal issue, I do find it interesting how various news outlets and even some people have stated this is a death nell for GM and EVs. 

Like all new technology, the whole reason for the very expensive 1% crowd ownership is their ability to spend money on helping get the technology to full real world use ready.

Tesla had these problems also in the early days, so like Tesla, GM as well as all Legacy Auto companies that are moving into the EV space will have issues they have to iron out before mass adoption is done.

Better to have a few hundred Hummers find a problem like a bad gasket design than a few 100,000 customers.

[ccap41]

12 minutes ago, David said:

Discussion of the Awesome Cadillac CELESTIQ and how it will push the boundaries of Standard of the World.

Speaking of trolling... ?

14 minutes ago, David said:

Agree to disagree and move forward.

I do believe I said that at one point..but that's not good enough.

14 minutes ago, David said:

While we have the expected Battery compartment leakage in the Hummer so a stop sell on them and awaiting a fix for the gasket seal issue, I do find it interesting how various news outlets and even some people have stated this is a death nell for GM and EVs. 

I certainly do not think it is the death of EVs or GM, it is a really bad look when you're trying to convince people EVs are the future, while there is already a lot of resistance to EVs. 

15 minutes ago, David said:

Tesla had these problems also in the early days, so like Tesla, GM as well as all Legacy Auto companies that are moving into the EV space will have issues they have to iron out before mass adoption is done.

Tesla was a startup though and issues are expected with a startup. GM/Ford have been building cars for centuries. IMO, it looks worse when the legacy companies have issues with cars than a startup. 

I expect Rivian to have teething issues. I do not expect similar issues with Ford/GM/Toyota/etc.

[G. David Felt]

6 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Speaking of trolling... ?

I do believe I said that at one point..but that's not good enough.

I certainly do not think it is the death of EVs or GM, it is a really bad look when you're trying to convince people EVs are the future, while there is already a lot of resistance to EVs. 

Tesla was a startup though and issues are expected with a startup. GM/Ford have been building cars for centuries. IMO, it looks worse when the legacy companies have issues with cars than a startup. 

I expect Rivian to have teething issues. I do not expect similar issues with Ford/GM/Toyota/etc.

I chalk up the gasket thing to being no different than all the little nit-picky things ICE autos have when a new auto is released. Look at all the issues Ford has had with the Bronco or GM had with the tick tick sound of the engines in the most current trucks and SUVs.

Yes, I agree it is a bad look, but I also get it that they will have overlooked small issues in their initial EV startup. Yes, I would have expected something like this to show up in the test mules rather than the customer rides. This is not the end and I think GM will be just fine.

[surreal1272]

1 minute ago, David said:

Yes, I agree it is a bad look, but I also get it that they will have overlooked small issues in their initial EV startup. Yes, I would have expected something like this to show up in the test mules rather than the customer rides. This is not the end and I think GM will be just fine.

This and any overreaction to this is just that, overreaction. Fools who think this is a dead end road for GM have their own agendas backing their "opinions" and folks shouldn't be too concerned about those certain opinions.

 

[ccap41]

15 minutes ago, David said:

I chalk up the gasket thing to being no different than all the little nit-picky things ICE autos have when a new auto is released. Look at all the issues Ford has had with the Bronco or GM had with the tick tick sound of the engines in the most current trucks and SUVs.

Yes, I agree it is a bad look, but I also get it that they will have overlooked small issues in their initial EV startup. Yes, I would have expected something like this to show up in the test mules rather than the customer rides. This is not the end and I think GM will be just fine.

Oh definitely, it isn't exactly an EV-specific (while technically it is, but it's just a gasket) issue. 

GM certainly will be fine over this. It's more or less just something the anti-EV crowd will fuel over.