Recalls a time for Toyota to shine.

[toyoguy]

My dad's mitsu's trans blew up and would've cost more to repair than the car was worth. He junked it at 75K. His subsequent LeSabre ran flawlessly to 135K by the time he upgraded to a newer one.

My dad's just dying to return to japanese vehicles.

We can play this dumb-ass game all month.

We can all play this dumbass game and assume Mitsubishi is the equivalent of Honda and Toyota, even though no reliablity survey (JD or CR) ranks them on the same level. Nor does any review testing their competance. But since they are all Japanese...

Oddly there is a correlation where GM and Mitsubishi sell less cars, and Toyota and Honda coincidently report gains every month.

And oddly enough GM and Mitsubishi cars surveyed reliablity are below those of Toyota and Honda. And oddly GM and Mitsubishi rarely win a auto review compared to there Toyota or Honda counterparts.

Edited June 13, 2006 by toyoguy

[toyoguy]

BFD, it still far too expensive to run and maintain and $$$/yr. basis.

fuel (does the Honda use premium?)

No, Honda doesn't need premium and is 10-15cents more per gallon that much?

exhorbitant Honda dealer maintenance costs

only if you want to pay them, most necessary services are cheap via online coupons

example on my Toyota done by dealer:

$22 oil change (top off fluids)

$40 coolant change

$100 tranny flush

$150 complete brake job (turn all 4 rotors)

$15 air filter replacment

I believe a walmart battery was ~$40

I had a friend change my spark plugs for $40 + $50 for the stock platinums

MSRP +

The Odessey is sold at invoice

never good financing rates

assuming it's financed, my next car won't be, neither was my current car.

[toyoguy]

A very well  equipped Grand Caravan SXT that lists for 28 will sell for 21.

If the Caravan holds to even 46% of MSRP after 3 year that = 12880.  21,000-12,880 = 8120.

If the equivalently equipped Odyssey is priced out its at 30,000, and that's what the morons pay for it.  To be kind, I will say 29,000.  If we say it holds 54% after 3 years (which is being generous) that's 30,000 x .54 = 16,200. 29,000-16,200= 12,800 plus even more on sales taxes, insurance and maintenance.

So even if you think they can justify your yuppie/Honda desire by saying its financially sound to get the Honda, its not.  Even in the first years, even facotirng better resale percentages, the Honda still is too much money.

Your prices are off.

Those parents ought to be ashamed to dump all that extra money on the Honda when it could go into their kids college fund or their own 401k's.....

Those parents like mine switched over to Toyota/Honda have had far less maintance costs, payed for my school and my brother's. They will retire comfortably.

They could have paid less and purchased an Intrigue, (or some other POS) instead of my Camry and given it to me. But after driving a friend's Intrigue, Maxima, Galant, Jeep GC, Pathfinder and a brand new Taurus rental I'm sure as hell glad they didn't. Yup my car doesn't hold up like $h!, have tons of steering play and a creaking suspension. To be fair my friend's newer lower mileage Maxima doesn't squeak, neither did the new Taurus but both drove pathetically.

I also know that two 125k+ mi Camry's (one driven totally city, the other previously owned by a construction contractor passed to his kid), drove a lot like mine which btw is solid, minus some additional suspension wear. I've also driven a 3rd gen Camry and I was highly impressed w/how well assembled it was.

I've driven my friend's TL (75kmi) and an older TL, both drove solid as a rock.

Now ideally a car should be built like my friend's 1st gen all city driven LS400 w/150k+ mi...if I could only afford the LS460.

No one buys Honda for value.  You buy one to stroke your own yuppie stir-fry ego.

My uncle had a Carvan, now drives an Odyssey.

He also had a Neon, replaced by an RX330.

And he has a 1993 Camry, his first non-Toyota/Honda vehicle.

Perhaps you could say he is yuppie, he trades in cars like every 10yrs, and his avg income places him in a similar bracket as LS430 owners.

My brother still owns his Accord cpe my parents gave him, I guess he's a yuppie too even though he's now a $150k+ ER doctor and owes nobody financially. Though he does have a high stripper affinity which might explain where his money goes.

My friend who owns the Pilot is a yuppie too, he now drives a Civic and traded his TL in for a fully loaded Pilot he gave to his recently married wife.

My Civic driving cousin is a Yuppie as well, even though he's 32 and pulls at least $500k yearly. Now I worked for him in Manhatten and, I'd actually estimate he makes closer to $750k. He owns a 2002 5er he never drives (i've seen it sit totally sedentary for over 2months), mainly cause the seats are hard as a rock, and the transmission tunnel crams his legs in. I've driven it, even though he doesn't, I do really enjoy rwd and extra seat bolstering. It's solid, minus the HID ballasts that have failed on multiple occasions, and the suspesnion components which have simply worn out. Outside of the poor quality leather/mismatched wood veneer w/bubbles, sterile interior, and crappy ass audio, its a superbly built machine.

Now one of the other Camry's I drove belongs to a friend, he is a yuppie as well. He owns his own business that probably pulls close to $150k. Never set foot in college other than DeVry. Busts his ass at 24/7 at work and DeVry university, and he's about 25yrs old. I guess he's a yuppie too.

Personally I enjoy stir-fry dishes. The only Japanese consumer electronics I own are my Onkyo reciever and a Yamaha DVD player. Now if I could afford ML or Krell components I would, but I can't. Mass produced equipment is what I'm stuck with. I don't own a TV, my laptop is an HP, my cell is a Motorola, and I probably should get a digital camera. I've never been to Japan and won't for recreational purposes.

Anyways my next car certainly will be built by Toyota or Honda, and I'll hold on to it for at least 10yrs. I'll gladly pay extra for superior quality parts and engineering. In the long run it actually saves me money since I will actually enjoy my car after 50k mi, where anything else would drive so poorly I'd be forced to replace it.

You can call me and my friend's yuppies, based on what we drive all you wish if that makes you feel better.

[Cory Wolfe]

Let me teach you my ways... you don't buy from just certain brands you like. That makes you ignorant and close-minded. You buy what you like, but because "Toyota and Honda are just better". Now, if you honestly like the vehicle... okay then, but you wouldn't say "my next car certainly will be built by..." if that's the case. So... I'm just saying...

*Gets ready to hop into his Import*

[balthazar]

We can all play this dumbass game and assume Mitsubishi is the equivalent of Honda and Toyota, even though no reliablity survey (JD or CR) ranks them on the same level.  Nor does any review testing their competance.  But since they are all Japanese...

Right: I can't explain it either. Let's ask the media to explain it- there has to be some reason they turn a shoulder to reality.

Oddly there is a correlation where GM and Mitsubishi sell less cars, and Toyota and Honda coincidently report gains every month.

Actually, GM is selling about the same volume of vehicles over a long period of time- percentages can indeed be wildly misleading.

And oddly enough GM and Mitsubishi cars surveyed reliablity are below those of Toyota and Honda.  And oddly GM and Mitsubishi rarely win a auto review compared to there Toyota or Honda counterparts.

There are no "GM" vehicles, tho there are individual marques. Some of those have ranked higher than toyota numerous years, a few you may have heard of: 'Cadillac' and 'Buick'. Thank you for tossing the good apples in with the fuzzy ones and calling the whole basket bad... Edited June 14, 2006 by balthazar

[siegen]

Some of those have ranked higher than toyota numerous years, a few you may have heard of: 'Cadillac' and 'Buick'. Thank you for tossing the good apples in with the fuzzy ones and calling the whole basket bad...

Oh yeh Cadillac, who's base model vehicle starts at 30 grand. They better be more reliable than the thousands of sub $20,000 vehicles Toyota and Honda sell every year.

I think it's safe to say the majority of people who own a Buick (specially a new one) are older and retired. I could probably look up a study to prove that, but I think it's pretty obvious. They put far less miles on their car than the average Civic owner.

[Flybrian]

I think it's safe to say the majority of people who own a Buick (specially a new one) are older and retired. I could probably look up a study to prove that, but I think it's pretty obvious. They put far less miles on their car than the average Civic owner.

Less mileage, but they're far more picky and quicker to complain about any little thing wrong in owner surverys and the like. Think about it - you're 75, retired, and on your fifth LeSabre. What else do you have to do but find things wrong with it because it surely can't be as good as the '62 you bought new from a nice young fellow who was the son of your ex-Army Lieutenant buddy from back in the 62nd Scout Battalion when you were stationed outside Einsiedlerhof right after the airlift and you guys used to go out every Tuesday to the bierhaus and raise quite a ruckus before the...

[aaaantoine]

Less mileage, but they're far more picky and quicker to complain about any little thing wrong in owner surverys and the like. Think about it - you're 75, retired, and on your fifth LeSabre. What else do you have to do but find things wrong with it because it surely can't be as good as the '62 you bought new from a nice young fellow who was the son of your ex-Army Lieutenant buddy from back in the 62nd Scout Battalion when you were stationed outside Einsiedlerhof right after the airlift and you guys used to go out every Tuesday to the bierhaus and raise quite a ruckus before the...

The year was nineteen-dickety-two! We had to say "dickety" back then because the Kaiser stole our word for "twenty"...

[roopull]

Wow... lots of folks trying to make excuses for why their favorite brands score poorly on dependibility studies... even lumping Mitsubishi in with Honda & Toyota to make Honda & Toyota look bad. Until recently, wasn't Mitsu part of Chrysler? Whatever... the BS stops when you reach the top.

For those of you with bad eyesite, it goes something like this:

Lexus Porsche Lincoln Buick Caddy Infiniti Toyota Mercury Honda Acura BMW Ford Chevy Crysler... anything below where Chrysler sits is 'below average' and in my book, unworthy

That being said, I love my Hondas. I've had great experiences with them & have suffered very little in the way of maintainance woes. So, I'm most likely sticking with Honda. If GM wants to earn more loyal customes, they have to figure out how to stay at the top of this list & others like it... and figure out how to get ALL of their brands up there...

[CARBIZ]

Roo, just so that we can be sure your eyesight isn't off, the difference between your beloved Honda and Chevrolet is 1.1 to 1.24 problems.

WOW! A TENTH OF A PROBLEM PER VEHICLE!!!!!!!!

I'm going to get rid of my Malibu right now!

Incidentally, Honda's problems dropped 83% in one year and Chevrolet's dropped 87% in one year - which in of theirselves poses a problem for me. How can problems drop in HALF in one year?

OH, and that is spread across 24 Chevy models (10 cars, 6 pick ups, 5 SUVs, 2 passenger vans, 1 cargo van) versus 10 Honda models.

How hard can it be to juggle 10 models versus 24?

As we have seen over at Toyota, as they unveil more and more models, they are running into troubles (breaking suspensions on their SUVs/trucks, tranny problems on their new Camry, etc). It is harder to juggle 24 balls than to juggle 24.

And nobody is trying to make excuses for their favorite brand; we are only trying to figure out how a brand like Hyundai can go from the bottom (where it has been for years and years) to the top, and how Buick can go from near the top to near the bottom - in a single year! There are statistical anamolies, to be sure.

[siegen]

Is that J.D. survey the 3 year one or the initial quality one?

[roopull]

Roo, just so that we can be sure your eyesight isn't off, the difference between your beloved Honda and Chevrolet is 1.1 to 1.24 problems.

Hey, I'm not making excuses for Honda... read around a bit... I've given plenty of props to Caddy & Buick for their accomplishments.

  Incidentally, Honda's problems dropped 83% in one year and Chevrolet's dropped 87% in one year - which in of theirselves poses a problem for me.  How can problems drop in HALF in one year?

Are you referring to this study, the VDS, or the stupid Initial Quality Study?

  OH, and that is spread across 24 Chevy models (10 cars, 6 pick ups, 5 SUVs, 2 passenger vans, 1 cargo van) versus 10 Honda models.

  How hard can it be to juggle 10 models versus 24?

You know, that's a point many of us have been making about GM... Honda has been very slow & careful in expanding its line-up. The recent problems over at Toyota, I believe, are an example of what happens when a company tries to expand too quickly... glad to see we agree...

,,,we are only trying to figure out how a brand like Hyundai can go from the bottom (where it has been for years and years) to the top, and how Buick can go from near the top to near the bottom - in a single year!  There are statistical anamolies, to be sure.

I'm assuming you're referring to the IQS, which essentially measures how happy NEW owners are with their NEW cars. The study is rather meaningless, IMO, but one can understand how Hyundai slapping some cheap leather in an SUV that stickers for $17K would really impress the folks who buy those cars.

The study I posted is the VDS & Buick, Caddy & Lincoln are still right at the top... ABOVE Honda and Toyota. Tune in, buddy... I'm not the GM basher you might think I am.

Re-read my post & you might be surprised.

[xdre]

Until recently, wasn't Mitsu part of Chrysler?

Not exactly.

Although DCX (and previously, Chrysler) owned part of Mitsu they never controlled the company. There was plenty of parts-sharing and so on that went on, but Mitsu's quality problems (to say nothing of their other problems) can't be laid at the feet of Chrysler.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

What a surprise....

It's our friends the analysts blowing smoke up everyones asses again (No surprise there... Just look around you here)

Everything is fine with Toyota... Recalls, Safety Concerns, Bad business practices, Screwing employees, Being slow to enter segments, Producing lackluster products, Buying out websites to cut off bad PR, Promoting their superiority through mediocre products, Killing Detroit, Buying the media, Killing babies

It's all good.... That's Toyota's new saying!!!! Given to them by their HONORARY PR agency; the american media.

REMEMBER: This is an OPPORTUNITY for Toyota to deal out its "EXCELLENT" customer service experience (Much sarcasm implied)

Just like Buicks aren't rated higher than Lexi, Lexi owners are just more picky....LMFAO

Nice that they drag "Ford" and "Explorers" name through the mud stating false facts.

"Recalls have absolutely NO impact on future sales"

Yeah sure, unless the F***ing media hypes the hell out of it, then ties it in to your supposed "30 years" of $h!ty vehicles, then dwells on it in various supposedly "unbiased" publications and websites...

So... Sure, it doesn't effect sales of Japan Inc... But, then again, what does?!?!?! They're just... SO... DAMN.. PERFECT! (Sarcasm)

"It's almost as if when there is something so sensational as the Explorer rollovers... It kinda sucks the air out of the room for the next one"

Yeah.... Because there hasn't been another recall since the Explorer rollovers.... And what's with the continued DWELLING on that $h!?!?!?! Sounds like somone is trying to 1) justify import superiority or 2) attack SUVs

"Instead, Toyota can benefit from the recalls, Hass and others say, by being as transparent as possible and providing prompt, courteous assistance to recall customers -- a play the manufacturer has accomplished in the past by including extras such as servicing older vehicles that it wasn't required to by law."

Isn't that the POINT of a recall?!?!? It's not as if they're doing it by choice like this idiot would like you to think.

"Analysts also note that recalls from Toyota and other large manufacturers are likely to go up, as is the overall number of vehicles affected. "This is just the reality of the industry these days," says Joe Barkai, program director for automotive research with the manufacturing insights division of IDC, a Framingham (Mass.) global market-research firm. "When you consider the enormous pressure to get to market in less and less time -- down to 20 months from four or five years a decade ago -- it makes a lot of sense. There's just less time to discover these issues."

Funny that was NEVER mentioned during the 400,000,000 times we've heard "Those $h!ty detroit companies recall more of their crap"

"AHEAD OF THE PACK. Barkai contends the most effective way to measure a manufacturer's performance isn't the frequency of recalls or the number of vehicles affected. Rather, Barkai studies the amount manufacturers pay in warranty costs relative to their revenues. By comparison, Toyota outshines its major American competitors, spending a mere estimated 1.5%, vs. the domestic average of 2.5%. At the extreme end of the scale, General Motors (GM) spends 3%."

That's funny.... We never heard anything about that last year when the media was busy DESTROYING all of the progress GM had made in perception because of a damn tailgate cable.

"Indeed, Toyota still largely exceeds industry averages for initial quality in surveys conducted by organizations such as J.D. Power & Assoc. In Power's 2005 Vehicle Dependability Index study, Toyota maintained an 18% margin over the industry average. It's the only manufacturer besides BMW with two cars on Edmund's top 10 list of vehicles with the best residual value. And in Consumer Reports' annual car issue, published in March of this year, Toyota outranks Ford and Chrysler for long-term reliability."

So..... Being number 1 is no longer important when it's a Japtrap brand?!?!?! Exceeds average and other GENERIC disclaimers are all that count?!?!?!?!

"In admitting the fault, Toyota executives pointed to its internal mantra, kaizen, the Japanese term that means continual improvement. Ernest Bastien, Toyota's vice-president of vehicle operations, says the problem had already been addressed on the assembly lines, and that the company had come forward without being urged to by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration."

Give me a F***in' break..... :puke.gif:

"SHOCK ABSORBERS. "Nothing is more important than protecting our brand image,"

That's right, because THAT is the only reason your cars sell.

"Unless Toyota starts mishandling recalls, sales sag, or publications stop issuing praise, those snarky smiles will most likely fade from Detroit's face."

Yep... Make Detroit out to be the bad guy when Toyota is issueing the recall.... Toyota driver UNITE and TELL those EVIL domestic shreuds

"After all, as Barkai points out, "Toyota is better structured to fix these types of problems. They're very good at executing decisions, everybody falls in line. For domestic manufacturers, it still takes a long time to learn those lessons."

Wow!!!! Talk about arrogance.....

This is the kind of "slap in the face" that I'm always talking about... The media pushes the knife in and Toyota pours salt in the wound.. Shady ass business practices. It's a sad day in america when this $h! gets published as fact.

At the market close on May 31, American depositary shares of Japan-based Toyota Motor were down 80 cents at $107.02, or 0.44%. The sharpest drop-off came after the minutes were released from the latest Federal Reserve meeting, indicating the possibility of another interest rate hike in June.

LOL, even the Toyota fans are giving them hell for being biased... Of course, I'm sure all of the "educated liberal and conservative elite" (READ: Ignorant trash) will take this $h! hook, line and sinker.

As for me.... Well, it seems like I hear A LOT of slurping going on when I read this article.

[regfootball]

as lons as we're playing this stupid game... my pos 77 silverado's engine crapped out for no apparent reason just after i sold it. you'd think an engine would last for more than 377k miles.

duh my dad's vega had a ruined engine block and rusted all over duh his 78 silverado exploded in a mcdonalds drive in because some fat kid running out of the store with a fudge sundae ran into the side of it duhhhhhhhhh my dad's 81 electra diesel popped a head bolt........duh my sister's master cylinder gave out on her beretta duhhhhhhhh my 77 electra coupe needed to be overhauled twice duhhhhhhhhhh

my aztek has been defect free in 43000 miles. knock on cladding.

wanna talk TL transmissions?

Edited June 16, 2006 by regfootball

[regfootball]

We can all play this dumbass game and assume Mitsubishi is the equivalent of Honda and Toyota, even though no reliablity survey (JD or CR) ranks them on the same level.  Nor does any review testing their competance.  But since they are all Japanese...

Oddly there is a correlation where GM and Mitsubishi sell less cars, and Toyota and Honda coincidently report gains every month.

And oddly enough GM and Mitsubishi cars surveyed reliablity are below those of Toyota and Honda.  And oddly GM and Mitsubishi rarely win a auto review compared to there Toyota or Honda counterparts.

just an aside.....from mitsubishi forums .com

http://www.mitsubishi-forums.com/t12903-mi...mer-reports.htm

mar 14, 2006

Im not sure how many of you read consumer reports, but this is fairly good news.

Mitsu, who has usually been right around "average" (with some high and some low) reliability ratings over the years has now shot up to number 4 overall since 2004 in total reliability.

First is lexus, then toyota, then honda.

this is in north america

maybe someone with a CR subscription can verify this. i do know the endeavor and galant were both recommended and had very high scores from CR for reliability.

i.e. mits is not the land rover freelander you seem to want it to be. time to stop the untrue song

Edited June 16, 2006 by regfootball

[regfootball]

No, Honda doesn't need premium and is 10-15cents more per gallon that much?

only if you want to pay them, most necessary services are cheap via online coupons

example on my Toyota done by dealer:

$22 oil change (top off fluids)

$40 coolant change

$100 tranny flush

$150 complete brake job (turn all 4 rotors)

$15 air filter replacment

I believe a walmart battery was ~$40

I had a friend change my spark plugs for $40 + $50 for the stock platinums

The Odessey is sold at invoice

assuming it's financed, my next car won't be, neither was my current car.

when my friends bought their odyssey, all honda dealers were selling them at msrp or higher with dealer add on. this was right before the sienna came out. no new odys are being sold at invoice either. odysseys in large form have never been invoice vehicles. at least not around here.

90% of folks finance their cars. either you stole your money, have filthy rich parents, won the lottery, or are grossly overpaid.

[regfootball]

Your prices are off.

Those parents like mine switched over to Toyota/Honda have had far less maintance costs, payed for my school and my brother's.  They will retire comfortably. 

They could have paid less and purchased an Intrigue, (or some other POS) instead of my Camry and given it to me.  But after driving a friend's Intrigue, Maxima, Galant, Jeep GC, Pathfinder and a brand new Taurus rental I'm sure as hell glad they didn't.  Yup my car doesn't hold up like $h!, have tons of steering play and a creaking suspension. To be fair my friend's newer lower mileage Maxima doesn't squeak, neither did the new Taurus but both drove pathetically. 

I also know that two 125k+ mi Camry's (one driven totally city, the other previously owned by a construction contractor passed to his kid), drove a lot like mine which btw is solid, minus some additional suspension wear.  I've also driven a 3rd gen Camry and I was highly impressed w/how well assembled it was.

I've driven my friend's TL (75kmi) and an older TL, both drove solid as a rock.

Now ideally a car should be built like my friend's 1st gen all city driven LS400 w/150k+ mi...if I could only afford the LS460.

 

My uncle had a Carvan, now drives an Odyssey.

He also had a Neon, replaced by an RX330.

And he has a 1993 Camry, his first non-Toyota/Honda vehicle.

Perhaps you could say he is yuppie, he trades in cars like every 10yrs, and his avg income places him in a similar bracket as LS430 owners. 

My brother still owns his Accord cpe my parents gave him, I guess he's a yuppie too even though he's now a $150k+ ER doctor and owes nobody financially.  Though he does have a high stripper affinity which might explain where his money goes.

My friend who owns the Pilot is a yuppie too, he now drives a Civic and traded his TL in for a fully loaded Pilot he gave to his recently married wife.

My Civic driving cousin is a Yuppie as well, even though he's 32 and pulls at least $500k yearly.  Now I worked for him in Manhatten and, I'd actually estimate he makes closer to $750k.  He owns a 2002 5er he never drives (i've seen it sit totally sedentary for over 2months), mainly cause the seats are hard as a rock, and the transmission tunnel crams his legs in.  I've driven it, even though he doesn't, I do really enjoy rwd and extra seat bolstering.  It's solid, minus the HID ballasts that have failed on multiple occasions, and the suspesnion components which have simply worn out.  Outside of the poor quality leather/mismatched wood veneer w/bubbles, sterile interior, and crappy ass audio, its a superbly built machine.

Now one of the other Camry's I drove belongs to a friend, he is a yuppie as well.  He owns his own business that probably pulls close to $150k.  Never set foot in college other than DeVry.  Busts his ass at 24/7 at work and DeVry university, and he's about 25yrs old.  I guess he's a yuppie too.

Personally I enjoy stir-fry dishes.  The only Japanese consumer electronics I own are my Onkyo reciever and a Yamaha DVD player.  Now if I could afford ML or Krell components I would, but I can't.  Mass produced equipment is what I'm stuck with.  I don't own a TV, my laptop is an HP, my cell is a Motorola, and I probably should get a digital camera.  I've never been to Japan and won't for recreational purposes.

Anyways my next car certainly will be built by Toyota or Honda, and I'll hold on to it for at least 10yrs.  I'll gladly pay extra for superior quality parts and engineering.  In the long run it actually saves me money since I will actually enjoy my car after 50k mi, where anything else would drive so poorly I'd be forced to replace it. 

You can call me and my friend's yuppies, based on what we drive all you wish if that makes you feel better. 

BULL$h! MY PRICES ARE OFF

any dodge dealer here will sell you that van for what i said

[regfootball]

I've driven my friend's TL (75kmi) and an older TL, both drove solid as a rock.

Darn, fourth or fifth transmission?

Now ideally a car should be built like my friend's 1st gen all city driven LS400 w/150k+ mi...if I could only afford the LS460.

Yeah, cause so many salt of the earth folks need a Lexus LS

Perhaps you could say he is yuppie, he trades in cars like every 10yrs, and his avg income places him in a similar bracket as LS430 owners.

Yeah, cause that's like what everyone makes for a living.

My brother still owns his Accord cpe my parents gave him, I guess he's a yuppie too even though he's now a $150k+ ER doctor and owes nobody financially.  Though he does have a high stripper affinity which might explain where his money goes.

I thought only 25 year old girls drove Accord coupes anymore.

My friend who owns the Pilot is a yuppie too, he now drives a Civic and traded his TL in for a fully loaded Pilot he gave to his recently married wife.

Ah, the Pilot, the poster vehicle for men who got stuck driving the vehicle their wife made them get, or they wouldn't get laid anymore. Pilot drivers wait until everyone else leaves work so no one sees them scurrying to their Pilot and hastily leaving in shame at their loss of manhood. Its called GRAND CHEROKEE.

You can call me and my friend's yuppies, based on what we drive all you wish if that makes you feel better.

as i figured...yuppies no offense

Edited June 16, 2006 by regfootball

[roopull]

just an aside.....from mitsubishi forums .com

http://www.mitsubishi-forums.com/t12903-mi...mer-reports.htm

mar 14, 2006

maybe someone with a CR subscription can verify this.  i do know the endeavor and galant were both recommended and had very high scores from CR for reliability.

i.e. mits is not the land rover freelander you seem to want it to be.  time to stop the untrue song

I have a CR subscription & looking at their website, I can't see where they actually rank brands... that sounds more like the way JD Power does things. CR doesn't really even RANK their cars. They just give reviews, list reported trouble spots & say whether a car is recommended or not.

That being said, of Mitsu's 7 models, only two are recommended & one is listed as "promising."

By a quick glance, it would appear that the brands with the highest %age of recommended rides (in no particullar order) are: Buick, BMW, Acura, Honda, Lexus Subaru, & Toyota. I always get a chuckle out of seeing those high dollar Mercedes Benz models & seeing that none are ever recommended.

Keep in mind, CR doesn't ONLY base thier ratings on reliability. They factor in ride, luggage space, NVH, etc. For example, the Hummer H1 might be a fabulously reliable truck, but since it gets a half mile per gallon, is loud as a jet plane inside & hard to drive on roads, it's never going to be a recommended buy. On the other hand, a Mercedes S600 may get good mileage, be quiet as a library & be a wonderful thing to drive, but since they are absolute pieces of crap when it comes to reliability, they'll never get recommended, either.