....

[regfootball]

We all know the Epsilon II platform is growing in size so that might explain why this seems too large for a Malibu.

those pics are hot. the epsilon platform is not the only thing growing in size.......

[regfootball]

i hope this thing is not lacking in girth like the current Epsilon. Width does matter, and the current Epsilon just lacks it in a big way.

[nzr]

Looks uninspiring and boring. This is not what GM needs.

[wildcat]

With its slightly Buick-looking rear, is it reasonable that the NG LaCrosse (on Epsilon II LWB) will be somewhat similar to the Malibu? So far the Aura and Malibu have that same side look (high beltline, slab doors), so will the NG LaCrosse likely have it, too? Or will it be more rounded, a la Enclave?

[loki]

Looks uninspiring and boring.  This is not what GM needs.

hopefully some color and a bit of chrome can spice it up. just try to remain optimistic nzr.

looks promising... that's all i'm saying right now

[nzr]

hopefully some color and a bit of chrome can spice it up. just try to remain optimistic nzr.

looks promising... that's all i'm saying right now

i suppose, but I remember reading about how people have seen the next gen impala and saying how it looked so reminiscent of the ones from yesteryear. and how the next-gen malibu looked spectacular/curvey/audi/nothing-like-gm.

this looks like neither of those.

Edited June 5, 2006 by nzr

[wildcat]

and how the next-gen malibu looked spectacular/curvey/audi/nothing-like-gm.

When they said that, had we seen the Aura yet? This Malibu and the Aura are clearly siblings, IMHO. Based on what we can see here, it's true they both look nice, but I believe in more styling differentiation. So will the NG G6 look like this body, but simply with the G6 front and and rear? I hope not, but I bet so. And will the NG LaCrosse look like this Malibu but with a Buick grille and rear? I hope not, but bet so. Something needs to stand out to make each one r-e-a-l-l-y different from the others, after all this talk about eliminating overlap and brand identity and style is back and GM gets it (blah-blah-blah-blah). So prove it, GM!

[balthazar]

How many vehicles are on these roads of the proving grounds at any one time?  How long of a time period do they spend on those roads, before they move to public streets?  How many miles of roads are we talking about within the GM compound?

Undoubtedly the number of vehicles constantly varies.

Milford Proving Grounds dates back to 1924. In 1955, acreage was about 3,900 and it contained about 44 miles of road. I have not seen anything that suggests acreage has increased since then (I've seen numerous ariel pics thruout it's existance), but total miles of road has definately increased since. This pic is from 1999:

Milford Proving Grounds

The borders should be obvious: one big vertical rectangle with the NE corner sliced off. The triangular track in the center is a 3.8 mile curcuit, and I believe that's the approximate one-way length of the long straightaway to the far left. There are inclines of 60% and banked turns at 77%. That huge perfect circle was added later-on, tho I can't tell you when; one pic I have has irregular road courses there instead.

I would pay cash money to be able to run my '59 there for a day...

[wildcat]

Balthazar: Thank you for responding to my question, including some background and an image. Very interesting, and I appreciate the trouble you went to!

I tried zooming in on the map to spot some future cars, but the only thing I saw looked like Harley Earl's hat with camouflage -- or a tire tread -- on it.

Edited June 5, 2006 by wildcat

[balthazar]

No prob, esp. for a fellow Buick man!

Looked for a bit more; saw in a GM blog that Milford has "over 100 miles" of road now!

[Sixty8panther]

Who even cares about this? The only purpose this car will serve

will be to keep syphoning away a few sales from the Camry &

Accord, any true car nut or pretty much anyone with a sensible

bone in their body will be lusting after the Zeta cars. :wink:

This will eb the forgoten child between the Cobalt & Impala.

[Matt276]

Can this be Epsilon II? Looks good, I see a bit of CTS in the design. I hope it has the 3.6L 6-speed as powertrain.

[Supremus]

For the sake of comparison, Aura Spy Shot:

http://www.thecarconnection.com/zoom-image.../9618_image.jpg

And our Mistery Car:

http://www.thecarconnection.com/zoom-image...DBPZEZCFPSB.jpg

Very similar.

[evok]

Hah, you go to all the trouble of buying some big piece of land miles from anyone and next thing you know there are houses all around it. Of courser it's also been suggested there are certain spots they drive past when they're ready to be seen. One wonders if they have someone watching to make sure there is a photographer at the time.

There are big signs up on the grounds as you head over to certain tracks that say:

IIRC

Vehicle should be in Camo, vehicle may be visible to outside photographers.

[!!!TED!!!]

I have looked closely at the Saturn Aura and the new Commodore, and I can say with some certainty that this prototype is a Malibu.

The clues:

Nipple water squirters on the hood:

Aura has them. This car has them. Commodore does not.

The location of the gas cap:

The Commodore's is located higher up on the bodyline. This car and the Auras looks to be in the same spot.

The location of the rear quarter window post:

The Commodore's is located at almost the mid-point of the rear door handle.

The Aura's is at the leading edge, and that appears to be the case with this car too.

The area between the front door cutline and the front wheel:

The Commodore has a space that is at least 3 times wider than this car.

This cars space is identical to the Aura's. (meaning this car is FWD Josh )

The horizontal cutline on the A-pillar:

This cars (as well as the Aura) is lower on the pillar than the Commodore's.

Although at first glance, this car does appear to be a VE Commodre, the only thing it shares is the styling language IMO.

EDIT: And look at that spy pic of the Aura posted by Supremus. :AH-HA_wink:

[boblutzfan]

The space between the front door and front wheel well indicate that these are two different vehicles. If all the inside information is correct then this is in fact the 2008 Malibu that will be the last sedan developed on the Epsilon I platform. This will come out no later than next fall. If GM did this right - it would be out next spring or summer so that the current Malibu could die. As to it being larger than the current Malibu. The current size of the Malibu and Impala is a problem for Chevy. The Malibu is too small to compete with the Camcord and the Impala is just a little too big. From all the rumors and posts over the past year or so - this is what I have gathered about GM's Chevy sedan plan: The Malibu will grow to compete in size with the segment leaders and the next Impala will retain its current size - but switch to a RWD platform to take on the Charger.

The biggest threat to the next generation Malibu will be the Saturn Aura. It will be interesting to see how these are priced relative to each other.

[boblutzfan]

Can this be Epsilon II? Looks good, I see a bit of CTS in the design. I hope it has the 3.6L 6-speed as powertrain.

Since this is a chevy product I don't expect to see the 3.6L V6. I believe that GM is going to focus their DOHC efforts at Saturn and Buick. I would expect a new high tech 3 valve VVT AFM 3.9L V6 mated to the new six speed auto matic. This would tie in the OHV heritage that chevy has built with their trucks and the corvette. Expect either the 2.4L I4 or 3.5L VVT V6 (or both) as base engines. If they can get the gas mileage up to par - then this would be one way to build in brand heritage with the Chevy Malibu.

[evok]

Another couple of questions, out of curiousity.  How many vehicles are on these roads of the proving grounds at any one time?  How long of a time period do they spend on those roads, before they move to public streets?  How many miles of roads are we talking about within the GM compound?

There are not as many vehicles on the track as you may think at any one time. IIRC the durability vehicle fleet only records about 15,000 miles between tear downs. That probably has changed. A lot of testing can be done on shaker tables these days.

http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.asp...milford%7cMI%7c

fyi

IIRC most of the spyshot are taken in the south loop area (lower left) heading toward south circle (lower center)- Just under the lower left, kidney track which is is the Belgian block track.

Edited June 5, 2006 by evok

[bcjohnso99]

Okay children.  Stop bickering and get back on topic.

Amen...

Not only does it look good but it looks unique, especially with it's giant Chevy crossbar.

Looks like an Aura with a Chevy grill. I was really hoping for something interesting... maybe along the lines of the SS concept. Maybe GM's not quite done with rebadging...

[evok]

I would pay cash money to be able to run my '59 there for a day...

MPG really is not that big a deal.

[wpbharry]

I like how Doane is a spy photographer yet all of a sudden (well for the past 5 months anyway) in the "know" on every vehicle program from every manufacturer. Interesting, isnt it?

That being said, I saw pictures today of the Holden LWB VE Commodore and this looks to be a dead ringer of the images I saw of the Zeta Commodore.

My "take" (and it is just that).......It's something RWD but it aint a Chevy.

Oh honey, are you sure the Malibu hasnt been SHELVED!?!?!?!?

[CSpec]

and how the next-gen malibu looked spectacular/curvey/audi/nothing-like-gm.

I had forgotten about those articles written after the design dome tour. I remember the writers saying the next Malibu looked very refined and "Audi-like", but from what I can see here the front looks like the Outlook, the back looks like the Lucerne, and the greenhouse is straight from the Avalon. So far, it's not something I would be gushing over.

And to clarify, this is the GMX386 Malibu on Epsilon I, due out next summer.

[boblutzfan]

And to clarify, this is the GMX386 Malibu on Epsilon I, due out next summer.

Correct. We will see this car on the auto show circuit this coming spring. GM has kept this under wraps better than most of their new cars lately. GM has plans to shock the world this winter with a new CTS, BRX, Malibu, GMT-900 Trucks and some seriously cool prototypes. The Malibu and GMT-900 trucks will be Chevy's new bread and butter.

With the Lambda's going on sale this fall, the GMT-900 SUVs now on the market, an updated SRX and the Lucerne gaining traction - GM is headed in the right direction and is laying the ground work for a stellar 2007!!

[sciguy_0504]

The front end and sides look mysteriously Camry-like but that may just be the camo. I am not a fan of the grille. I understand what you guys are saying about the four round taillights but I also think they look like the Lucerne's with camo. The rear definately looks Buick, especially with the badge. Overall, it looks way better than the current Malibu but like someone else mentioned, that's not saying much. I am excited to see the real deal.

[CSpec]

GM has plans to shock the world this winter with a new CTS, BRX, Malibu, GMT-900 Trucks and some seriously cool prototypes.

You're a bit optimistic here--the BRX doesnt go into production for another 3 years.

[wildcat]

evok: Thank you for the additional information about the Milford Proving Grounds, including vehicle traffic, testing procedures, and the area where most of the spyshots are snapped.

CD/BP: How competitive between photographers is it to get one of the prime shooting spots? Does anyone ever "hog" those prime spots, or are you on a friendly basis with "competitors"? I imagine you all know where the best locations to take photos are, but is it first-come, first-lucky? Just luck as to what day, time, etc. a car appears and who happens to have their camera ready? How do you know when to hang out around Milford or, instead, be out driving on public roads - all by chance, or whatever hits your fancy that day? Thank you for all the time you must invest in order to get some good spyshots. It must be very satisfying when you do get a good shot and sell it!

[GMan]

[wildcat]

Yes, that's true. Be ready if and when opportunity knocks. May you have luck on your side always, and lots of bottled water handy when in Death Valley!

C&G is fortunate to have you as one of its participants.

Now, more photos of vehicles with a tri-shield logo enclosed in a circle!

[Guest YellowJacket894]

I don't know. For some reason, I'm seeing a bit of the BLS in the side profile as well as the Aura.

Even if it is a rebadged Aura, it still looks good. And, like the G5 which will (hopefully) go away and become unqiue when the next-generation Deltas are revealed, it's just a stop-gap.

[regfootball]

So far, it's not something I would be gushing over.

yeah but for a Malibu its a HUGE improvement worth cheering about.

[Supremus]

I think just the fact that it was mistaken for a Zeta is worth cheering.

[regfootball]

As to it being larger than the current Malibu.  The current size of the Malibu and Impala is a problem for Chevy.  The Malibu is too small to compete with the Camcord and the Impala is just a little too big.  From all the rumors and posts over the past year or so - this is what I have gathered about GM's Chevy sedan plan: The Malibu will grow to compete in size with the segment leaders and the next Impala will retain its current size - but switch to a RWD platform to take on the Charger.

The current BU is too small, even if for some its right sized. It needs to be a physical clone of Camry in H/W/L. The big problem with most Epsilons are lack of real width.

The current Impala is large in size, but lacks rear seat room and could use a bigger trunk. The Impala sorely needs repackaging.

[turbo200]

just read the whole thread.....don't have much time lately for this, but i laughed out loud when wpharry came into it all.

back to the program at hand. this malibu looks good from what I can see. I especially like the curvy rear end. We should all be reminded even the grille is most likely not in final production form here. But it could be. And it looks good regardless.

The added length in the rear is what is making this car look so large. The wheelbase is the same length still, but the rear has that added overhang look to mimic the last Impala and for that large car feel.

[sciguy_0504]

Thanks, GMan. Now that I could live with. Perhaps the current-gen Malibu designs were fired?

Just to confirm, are we sure this is not on the "LWB" Epsilon platform like the G6? By looking at the sides in the picture, I can imagine the G6 front window dip and it just looks longish.

[thedriver]

so why does chevy get two dips in the epsilon I pool?

this is like the original gm-10s, there were two generations of lumina to one of everything else...

[C.H.U.D.]

The added length in the rear is what is making this car look so large. The wheelbase is the same length still, but the rear has that added overhang look to mimic the last Impala and for that large car feel.

I'm pretty sure it shares the LWB Epsilon this time around. The rear door is big enough to eat two of the current-gen's rear doors.

[balthazar]

MPG really is not that big a deal.

It's not the facility... it's the history. Some of the greatest automotive creations known to man have run there.

[I hope GMRULES again]

Click on the link again and you will see the CARConnection has updated the story because so many people wrote to tell them this was the NG Malibu and not the Impala.

[BuddyP]

I know this is pretty much all said and done, but just thought I'd note that the car is 100% for sure the Malibu.

[CreativeVision]

It's pretty competitive. Death Valley is the worst, there can be 6-8 different spies from different outlets working the area. Some are friendly, others aren't.

A lot of it is luck. But luck is often when knowledge of what/who you're going after and preparedness collide.

So are you your own boss and how did you fall into this line of work? Or is this just a hobby for you? Photography and cars, two of my favorite things and yet I had never thought to make it a career.

[daves87rs]

Intresting...It is the new Bu'.

Let's just say someone out of town who works at GM got wind of this site.

He looked at and was surprised to see it on there.

P.S gotta to love it when people visit other plants....

[daves87rs]

You're a bit optimistic here--the BRX doesnt go into production for another 3 years.

He's right-you'll see it at the auto shows..trust me. :AH-HA_wink:

[avant1963]

[Matt276]

Does this car have round tail light? Cause I think Chevy should bring them back for its sedans.

[guionM]

Look at the side "vents" in the top picture, and look at the location of the side "vents" in the bottom picture.

It's RWD.

Actually look at the front overhang & the distance between the front door and the wheels.

It's FWD.

It's the Malibu that's moving up in size to fill in for the Impala.

Edited June 6, 2006 by guionM

[mightymouse]

No time needed, any darn guy can tell that these aren't the same cars.

[greg_nate]

For the sake of comparison, Aura Spy Shot:

And our Mistery Car:

Very similar.

That's the best comparison shots I've seen yet. I think you nailed it. These cars are sharing the same greenhouse. The similarities are striking.

[pow]

Man, I'm excited. I can't wait for it to come out... hopefully it'll be a very, very early '08 model.

[ehaase]

Having the 2008 Malibu be an Aura with a Chevy grille and tailend doesn't bother me at all. Ever since the 1988 W body coupes, GM has tried hard to differentiate its vehicles, only to see sales continue to drop. I prefer a good looking Malibu with a lot in common with the Aura to the boring dud they sell now.

[FUTURE_OF_GM]

Wow... Whatever it is, it looks good!

Although, I'm sure it won't be good enough for the media... The Camry OBVIOUSLY looks better and all