chevrolet z28 Could the next Z28 be an EV CUV?

[G. David Felt]

According to MotorTrend, fords Mach e while pissing off the mustang faithful has already sold out all production for America and Europe for the first year. As such with GM having a flexible EV platform and considerable new EVs coming over the next 3 years, this begs the question of Could GM produce a Camaro EV CUV and call it the Z28? With the first nine auto's off the EV platform to be a Cadillac, one has to wonder how GM might fit the sporty performance into their product line and having a performance CUV Camaro could be the magic ticket.

To quote the MotorTrend story: we'd expect a Chevy Camaro electric SUV to at least match the 255 horsepower Ford is targeting for the base Mustang Mach-E. For higher-trim variants, Chevy would likely have to adopt a dual-motor all-wheel-drive setup to stay competitive with the 332-hp, 417-lb-ft Mach-E 4 and 459-hp, 612-lb-ft Mach-E GT.

https://www.motortrend.com/news/chevrolet-camaro-e-28-renderings/

[riviera74]

That would be completely consistent with the Mustang v Camaro rivalry that dates back to 1967.  I do wish GM had the guts to actually do just that.

[G. David Felt]

@riviera74 Totally agree with you that this would fit in the rivalry. I actually believe Chevrolet could add Camaro CUV to the name and do well.

[daves87rs]

As long as they do it different...maybe give it a bit of a retro flair....inside and out. Remind folks that it is still a car and not an appliance.....

[ocnblu]

If it's an EV, it is an appliance, no way around it.

[oldshurst442]

3 hours ago, ocnblu said:

If it's an EV, it is an appliance, no way around it.

Correction:

If its a CUV, regardless if its EV or ICE,  its an appliance, no way around it...

[oldshurst442]

On 4/24/2020 at 8:50 PM, riviera74 said:

That would be completely consistent with the Mustang v Camaro rivalry that dates back to 1967.  I do wish GM had the guts to actually do just that.

 

12 hours ago, dfelt said:

@riviera74 Totally agree with you that this would fit in the rivalry. I actually believe Chevrolet could add Camaro CUV to the name and do well.

 In order for Chevy to completely be consistent with the Mustang v Camaro that dates back to 1967, Chevrolet needs to KEEP the coupe alive with a replacement car as well. 

There is still no word on what the future holds for a Camaro car.  

I am down with an EV Camaro. Car and CUV.   

What I am NOT down with is if there is no Camaro car but CUV Camaro instead regardless if the CUV Camaro is EV.

Camaro still sells well.  Just looking at Camaro numbers,  they are on a decline, sure, but Camaro still sold 50 000 units in 2018 year and 48 000 units in 2019.  Those are respectable numbers for a niche car. 

When looking at the competition, we always look at Mustang and Challenger and their sales.

Why dont we look at the other competition?

Nissan 370Z. 

 From 2010, this sports coupe has gone from 10 000 units sold and has declined to 7000 units to 5000 units to just 3000 and 2000 the last two years. 

Toyota Supra 

In the last 8-9 months this coupe has been on sale, it has sold 4000 units.  Yes yes...coronavirus and all.

BUT...this coupe is ALL NEW for 2019 and had 6 months in 2019 to rack up the sales. BEFORE coronavirus hit. And it didnt...do anything in the marketplace.  Camaro as funny as it may seem, sold TRIPLE of those amounts in the same time frame as the Supra.  I understand the Supra has a 40% higher price difference, over the Camaro and even the 370Z, but still.  The Corvette which has an EVEN MORE higher price tag  than the Supra sold 17 000 units on an older platform in 2019 and sold out immediately on the new platform which topped out at 50 000 units? 60 000 units? 70 000 units? I dont know how many units,  but there is no excuse for low low Supra totals as the Supra is an icon in the sports car world. 

Mazda Miata

Not direct competitor as the Miata and Camaro are two different types of sport cars,  but the Miata still falls in the 2 door, sports car, starting price @  $25 000  realm.  

11 000 , twice 9000 and 7000 units the last 4 years. And we all say that the Miata is well loved in the marketplace...

All to say...48 000 units in 2019 on a now, old platform is amazing. There IS an audience for a Camaro coupe car, and I would think the car IS profitable. If it aint, THAT would be more of a GM engineering/product development problem rather than a Camaro not selling problem. Because the Camaro is still loved by Americans and the sales numbers PROVE that.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 26, 2020 by oldshurst442

[G. David Felt]

@oldshurst442 @riviera74 Chevrolet has shown and proven that a EV Camaro Coupe can still inspire and hold it's own at the Race track.

Add a SS Inspired CUV like my Trailblazer SS as an EV to the family I believe could truly be different and yet inspiring to those that do not care about cars. This would keep many customers happy with an AWD SS Camaro CUV EV.

 

[oldshurst442]

24 minutes ago, dfelt said:

yet inspiring to those that do not care about cars.

But THAT is my point...

Close to 100 000 Camaros have been sold in 2 years.  Internal combustion engined Camaros... 

The other 3 Japanese sports cars COMBINED dont even amass to one year of Camaros sales. 

Camaro STILL appeals to peoples.  Mustangs and Challengers...and Camaros, all three are 2 door sport car coupes STILL appeal to peoples. 

There is no need to try to inspire folk to buy cars...at least THESE cars.  Sales of these cars are great for what is going on in the world regarding what sedans are going through with their CUV counterparts.  

I applaud Ford with the EV CUV and calling it a Mustang. I think that was a brilliant move both in regards in competing with Telsa AND making sure the Mustang nameplate DOES in fact remain relevant for the FAR future. At the same time KEEPING and maintaining the coupe for the near future.

Chevrolet...SHOULD copy Ford and making the Camaro an EV CUV to compete with Tesla, and with Mustang Mach E BUT Chevrolet should ALSO keep the car coupe BECAUSE Ford WILL keep the Mustang car coupe. 

I wanted to show that Camaro sales are THERE so Chevrolet SHOULD NOT kill the car coupe. It be foolish for them to do so. 

THAT is how Chevrolet will KILL the Camaro nameplate and the Camaro CUV will NOT sell...

The possible EV CUV Camaro and CUV Mustang EVs NEED their car coupe so the CUV pony car namesake COULD relate to car people.  

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 26, 2020 by oldshurst442

[balthazar]

^ excellent post.

I’ve said it before; because it’s ‘General Motors”, even an article about the Camaro seemingly MUST involve sales numbers in some degree of damning light. Like the Camaro should be selling 250,000/yr in order to be a ‘success’. Read an article on any of the other sports cars mentioned above and you just won’t find the same tone directed toward them.

IMO, the Camaro could sell 5000/yr and I’d still vote for it to continue production.

Edited April 26, 2020 by balthazar

[ocnblu]

Well, the Supra is a hybrid, which has bred contempt for it.  The "Mustang" CUV, regardless of motive power, is a fundamentally bad idea.  Any "Camaro" CUV would be dead in the water, and a very cynical move on GM's part.

A Mustang is a Mustang.  A Camaro is a Camaro, a Challenger is a Challenger, same as ever, same forever.

[ocnblu]

Chevrolet has shown and proven that a EV Camaro Coupe can still inspire

Well it didn't inspire anyone to bid on it when it went up for a much-ballyhooed auction, where it was expected to bring $500k.  Zero interest.

Edited April 26, 2020 by ocnblu

[oldshurst442]

I really think the styling is doing in the Camaro. When it was on the Zeta platform, it was big and heavy and most enthusiasts were bitching about that, but the sales figures were on par to the Mustang's.  It was a bunker inside  but the sales were very Mustang-like. THAT was not a deterrent...

The Challenger had what camaro sales have now. Actually, the Challenger sales only grew to a smaller amount. But that is because of really crazy horsepower top end Challengers fueling the lower end Challenger sales...and the addition of AWD to the V6 base version making a pony car available to those that want one in snowy States and Provinces. But, like I said, the Challenger sales only grew a tiny bit. NOT that a growth in Challenger sales mean that a decline in Camaro sales are related. Its more like Dodge's marketing with an AWD V6 base and being first to introduce crazy high HP numbers with awesome marketed Hellcat and Demon names and ad campaigns made sure that the Challenger sold in decent numbers for the years to come as a new platform is nowhere near to come.

Back to Chevy. 

They made the Camaro smaller, more in line as a Mustang...and the sales were there as well.  

Its just that historically, the Mustang almost always surpassed the Camaro's in sales. But, in 2016, the switch to Alpha in sales was high. Not as high as the Zeta Camaro...but that has NOTHING to do with it being smaller, nor the interior being a bunker, nor the price tag, BUT because the STYLING has NOT changed since 2010...

 

And now we are in 2020.

And really, the first time we saw a 1969 inspired, retro new Camaro was in 2008 when the movie Transformers came out. In 2016 when Chevy introduced a new generation, the SAME 1969 inspired retro Camaro was kept that was first introduced in 2008 and made into production in 2010...

Not to mention the Alpha Camaro refreshes are not exactly mind blowing as compared to what Dodge has done to their even older platformed Challenger...

2008 "Bumblebee" as a concept at the Detroit NAIAS.  Then the movie came out in 2009. 

2010 production Camaro

2015 Camaro. Last year for the Zeta.

 

and the Alpha Camaro

2018 side profile

 Again, versus the Zeta platform

 

In now...a decade...literally, the changes are small. 

The Challenger has got mind blowing marketed Hellcats, Demons and refreshes that are beautiful to augment their sales slightly.  The Camaro has stumbled. But yet, STILL sell 50 000 units per year or more since 2016.  On the decline, but nothing that a new styling direction cannot fix...

The Mustang is just the benchmark in sales that both the Challenger and Camaro have ALWAYS been chasing and the Pontiac  Trans Am and Plymouth  'Cuda STOPPED chasing...

 

[ocnblu]

olds, what I stated about the e-COPO is true, it got no bids.  Why the downvote on facts?

https://www.thedrive.com/news/29764/chevrolets-tire-shredding-ecopo-camaro-fails-to-sell-at-auction

[oldshurst442]

10 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

Well, the Supra is a hybrid, which has bred contempt for it.  The "Mustang" CUV, regardless of motive power, is a fundamentally bad idea.  Any "Camaro" CUV would be dead in the water, and a very cynical move on GM's part.

A Mustang is a Mustang.  A Camaro is a Camaro, a Challenger is a Challenger, same as ever, same forever.

Contempt for it or not that it has bred not, the Supra has outsold the BMW version.  

But THAT just proves MY point even more. 

BMW fanbois and Toyota fanbois could cry all they want about how one fanbase says the car is a BMW underneath and the other says its not a real BMW...the Camaro sells comfortably well... 

And again, the Mustang Mach E has EQUALED the Camaro sales...and sold out... 

Only cynical in YOUR small minded view of the world...

YOU are kinda like those Supra fanbois... 

wah wah wah

2 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

Chevrolet has shown and proven that a EV Camaro Coupe can still inspire

Well it didn't inspire anyone to bid on it when it went up for a much-ballyhooed auction, where it was expected to bring $500k.  Zero interest.

And yet, a Mustang Mach E has sold as many Camaros ICE coupes...

The Camaro EV not selling as YOU put it is because of SEVERAL reasons.

1. NOT a PRODUCTION Camaro. Its a CONCEPT one off.  No REAL substance there

2. NO MARKETING push for it.

3. GM's marketing sucks anyway. They couldnt sell a legit Covid19 vaccine to a Covid19 dying victim to save their sorry ass.

But keep that dumb narrative alive while you think you got something going on based only on your narrow view of the world while always ignoring the BIGGER picture...

[ocnblu]

Entertaining, and very easy to wind up.  ❤️

[oldshurst442]

That is all you do. That is all you ever do.

That is all you got.  

Believe in a narrative. Push a narrative. Lecture us all about this narrative. Ignore everything else. Continue to believe in the narrative. (I dont fault you there...its the internet after all)...but your relentless pushing of your narrow minded narrative and your dissing the other points of view and your continual whining and the hypocrisy of it all is tiresome... 

1 minute ago, ocnblu said:

Entertaining, and very easy to wind up.  ❤️

So...now...you admit to trolling...

Along with politics...THAT is also AGAINST THIS site's policies.

Like I said, your hypocritical posting is tiresome at best... 

[ocnblu]

There has to be a counterpoint to all the continual Pollyanna dreamworld stuff.  Just because I don't keep it to myself, don't believe I am the "only one".

[oldshurst442]

1 minute ago, ocnblu said:

There has to be a counterpoint to all the continual Pollyanna dreamworld stuff.  Just because I don't keep it to myself, don't believe I am the "only one".

Yeah...I know.

But...the irony is that...you live in a dream world where I come from.

Problem is...

You dont discuss ANYTHING.

When you get pushed into a corner to vocalize and actually defend your side...you dont...

You just punch up the old laughy voting thingy and ignore all other discourse.

Proof again in THIS post.

Im waiting to see your rebuttal when I called you out on the SEMA E COPO Camaro auction failure. 

I got a few counterpoints to counter you with. Im quite a few steps ahead in waiting.

What do you do though?

You laugh it up. 

You post a clowney Pinocchio while laughing at me calling me a clown in not so many words and then you tell me  quite frankly that YOUR point of view is TRUTH while mine is fantasy...

6 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

There has to be a counterpoint to all the continual Pollyanna dreamworld stuff.  Just because I don't keep it to myself, don't believe I am the "only one".

Yet no rebuttal of any substance...

You trolled me, you called me a clown.  You didnt show me ANY evidence of why a SEMA auction failure is THE WORD of EV failure.

I used logic but I got rebuttals lined up for you to back up my logic.

You are just laughing at me. 

No rebuttals.

Same thing with the political talks.

But you will whine about it though. 

So...why did you make fun of me?

Are YOU the only one to be able to PHOQUE this website's rules?

You hate EVs...

Get the phoque out of this thread and stop trolling it if you are not going to discuss this rationally. 

Stop the derailing and the trolling. 

 

[ocnblu]

Difference is I can be crystal clear in a heck of a lot fewer words.  I'm not about posts that are miles long.  You know that.  Save your ammunition.  Shoot when it counts.  You're not changing my mind, I'm not changing yours.  dfelt's not changing his, and that's OK.  I'm not going to stop laughing though, if something strikes me as funny.  I thought it was funny that the green media/EV champeens were ballyhooing that auction, using it as a harbinger, predicting stratospheric bids, and it fell flat on its face, for reasons that are clear.

Pinocchio is not a clown, he's a puppet turned into a real boy.  It was one of the earliest movies I remember seeing when I was a real boy, the Disney version.  I also saw Lady & The Tramp, and Jungle Book in original theater runs.  All classics.  Just like you, my dear.

Edited April 26, 2020 by ocnblu

[oldshurst442]

again...

1. making fun of me

2. trolling me

3. not responding to the content nor giving a rebuttal

 

Whatever dude.

 

 

[balthazar]

I don't have a problem with the Mach E- AS LONG AS the Mustang coupe/covert remain, and remain IC.
I'm going to scope out the Mach-E (not to buy) when it finally comes around.

Likewise, I'd be fine with a CUV Camaro AS LONG AS the coupe/convert IC core models remain. In the past I would've cried 'heresy!' but perhaps the Camaro / Mustang just aren't that close to my automotive heart.

[ocnblu]

Then you might be interested in a Silverado 2500 HD hatchback with FWD and a 1.3L Ecotec.  Unibody.  With 4.5 inches ground clearance.

6 hours ago, balthazar said:

Camaro / Mustang just aren't that close to my automotive heart.

 

[USA-1]

Not sure if anyone on this thread stated the following already, I didn't feel like reading every post especially with short story novel writer olds on here ?

 

GM already has this with the "new" Chevy Blazer and that rendering of the Camaro EUV looks almost identical to a Blazer besides the Camaro taillights. Chevrolet decided around 5 yeas ago to riff on the Camaro front-end design with the Malibu and Cruze then with the new Blazer so it's pretty much already been done. No reason to call it a Camaro Z28-E or whatever it would be and I don't think GM would go that route anyway. Just build a Blazer EUV model on the new BEV3 skateboard platform and park it next to the Blazer ICE CUV on the lot and there ya go. Next.

[ocnblu]

5 hours ago, USA-1 said:

Not sure if anyone on this thread stated the following already, I didn't feel like reading every post especially with short story novel writer olds on here ?

 

GM already has this with the "new" Chevy Blazer and that rendering of the Camaro EUV looks almost identical to a Blazer besides the Camaro taillights. Chevrolet decided around 5 yeas ago to riff on the Camaro front-end design with the Malibu and Cruze then with the new Blazer so it's pretty much already been done. No reason to call it a Camaro Z28-E or whatever it would be and I don't think GM would go that route anyway. Just build a Blazer EUV model on the new BEV3 skateboard platform and park it next to the Blazer ICE CUV on the lot and there ya go. Next.

That would be WAY too obvious though, RIGHT?

[Robert Hall]

They could call it the 'CamEro'... with the 'E' for EV, and capitalizing on the common misspelling.

[G. David Felt]

Seems the Camaro EV is a real thing if comments and pic are to be interpeted correctly from GM. They are fast tracking not only the Hummer EV and Cadillac EV but a 3rd not shown EV that did not make it to the EV day  at GM.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1128140_gm-has-fast-tracked-its-electric-vehicle-program-in-pandemic-slowdown

[USA-1]

20 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Seems the Camaro EV is a real thing

Stop with the EV propaganda!  Maybe a Camaro EV, but very doubtful a Camaro EUV.

Edited May 13, 2020 by USA-1

[G. David Felt]

18 minutes ago, USA-1 said:

Stop with the EV propaganda!  Maybe a Camaro EV, but very doubtful a Camaro EUV.

Ya know you want a Camaro EUV as much as a Ford Mach-e.  

[frogger]

9 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Ya know you want a Camaro EUV as much as a Ford Mach-e.  

Somehow I'm thinking they will build it, and it will have side windows the size of my phone and enough cargo space to fit a laptop.

[ocnblu]

Boy that Mach (er) E is an ugly thing.  It looks like a tenth grader car nut drew it up and then put Mustang stickers (taillights, pony emblems) on it.  It's really pathetic.

[G. David Felt]

5 hours ago, ocnblu said:

Boy that Mach (er) E is an ugly thing.  It looks like a tenth grader car nut drew it up and then put Mustang stickers (taillights, pony emblems) on it.  It's really pathetic.

Way better looking than most of the current pathetic style at Chevrolet.

[ocnblu]

4 hours ago, dfelt said:

Way better looking than most of the current pathetic style at Chevrolet.

And the Mach (er) E interior is just as off-putting as a Tesla.  There's like NO style, just boxes and I-pads stacked together.  Zero imagination what.so.EVER.

[G. David Felt]

2 hours ago, ocnblu said:

And the Mach (er) E interior is just as off-putting as a Tesla.  There's like NO style, just boxes and I-pads stacked together.  Zero imagination what.so.EVER.

To each their own of what they like. It is way better interior than a Tesla. I like it and am excited by the EV. But then you knew that!