Alternative Fuels & Propulsion RANDOM

[G. David Felt]

9 hours ago, ocnblu said:

Well, it's California government, there is no reason or logic involved.

There is logic, you just do not want to read or dig into the details to understand. Logic is a multi year plan for clean water, air and quality of life. Nothing is free, unlike the only care in some areas in the midwest and especially east coast is making a dollar at the expense of human life. Especially the ground water pollution and air quality destruction of  the coal states.

Eventually we will get everyone educated.  

[balthazar]

2 hours ago, riviera74 said:

Not true.  According to this article here, 70% of all automotive air pollution is caused by Class 8 trucks (think tractor-trailers and the like).  The mandate starts in 2024 but the mandate is not 100% until 2045.

^ So the NBC piece was erroneous in it's title by 21 years.
'Journalism'.

We'll see if the CA mandate holds the closer they get to '45.
'24 is only 3 model years away and so far there are zero production class 8 EV trucks. Hard to meet a quote with no hardware.

[G. David Felt]

Here is the FAQ on the EV fleet info for California.

https://www.pge.com/pge_global/common/pdfs/solar-and-vehicles/clean-vehicles/ev-fleet-program/PGE_EV-Fleet_FAQ_Distribution-Delivery.pdf

The Following companies have Class 8 Electric / Hybrid trucks available for purchase.

• Daimler - Heavy and Medium duty Electric trucks. https://www.mercedes-benz.com/en/vehicles/trucks/eactros-heavy-duty-electric-truck/
• Freightliner - Both heavy Class 8 and Medium Duty trucks. https://freightliner.com/e-mobility/
• Fuso - eCanter line of trucks. https://www.fuso-trucks.de/content/eu/germany/en/models/ecanter.html
• Dana - http://www.danaelectrified.com/ Used in conversions.
• Kalmar Ottawa - https://kalmarottawa.com/
• Lion - https://thelionelectric.com/en/ Been doing electric buses, but have moved into electric Class 8, 6 and below trucks.
• Run with the Bull Meritor - https://www.meritor.com/products/epowertrains/ currently used in conversions, but working to expand into OEM truck builders.
• Motiv - https://www.motivps.com/ EV Chassis solution supplier to customer built medium and Heavy duty truck builders. They will also build custom orders.
• Nikola - Pre-Order
• Tesla - Pre-Order
• Orange EV Trucks - Conversion trucks
• Peterbilt - https://www.peterbilt.com/electric-vehicles 3 Class 8 available for purchase

Per FTR in tracking the Class 8 orders everything is greatly down.

https://www.ftrintel.com/news/latest-orders/index.php

For those that are not in the know of what classification of trucks is, here is the full chart.

Class 8 EV details from the GOV by state.

https://search.usa.gov/search?utf8=✓&affiliate=afdc.energy.gov&query=class+8+EV

Here is the EV Fleet site to help companies get the info they need and purchase EV medium and heavy duty trucks. PG&E seems to run this working with various states as needed. 

https://www.pge.com/en_US/large-business/solar-and-vehicles/clean-vehicles/ev-fleet-program/ev-fleet-program.page?WT.mc_id=Vanity_evfleet

 

[balthazar]

29 minutes ago, dfelt said:

The Following companies have Class 8 Electric / Hybrid trucks available for purchase.

• Daimler - Heavy and Medium duty Electric trucks. https://www.mercedes-benz.com/en/vehicles/trucks/eactros-heavy-duty-electric-truck/
• Freightliner - Both heavy Class 8 and Medium Duty trucks. https://freightliner.com/e-mobility/
• Fuso - eCanter line of trucks. https://www.fuso-trucks.de/content/eu/germany/en/models/ecanter.html
• Dana - http://www.danaelectrified.com/ Used in conversions.
• Kalmar Ottawa - https://kalmarottawa.com/
• Lion - https://thelionelectric.com/en/ Been doing electric buses, but have moved into electric Class 8, 6 and below trucks.
• Run with the Bull Meritor - https://www.meritor.com/products/epowertrains/ currently used in conversions, but working to expand into OEM truck builders.
• Motiv - https://www.motivps.com/ EV Chassis solution supplier to customer built medium and Heavy duty truck builders. They will also build custom orders.
• Nikola - Pre-Order
• Tesla - Pre-Order
• Orange EV Trucks - Conversion trucks
• Peterbilt - https://www.peterbilt.com/electric-vehicles 3 Class 8 available for purchase

I'm not going to check them all but;
Lion, Tesla, Nikola - not in production currently
Daimler - 20 customers currently running test units. Not in production.
Techcrunch states Nikola will "eventually produce" their truck. What that means is anybody's guess.

Peterbilt's truck is only good for '90 to up to 200 miles' [depending on model] but there's no MSRP or manner to build/order/purchase currently. That means NOT available for purchase.

'Pre-orders' is not 'in production' nor does it incorporate 'purchase' as defined by 'taking ownership of'. It's improper to state it otherwise. Sure, the IDEA is for that to transition, but that always takes longer than intended. Tesla opened pre-orders for the Model 3 in the end of May 2016- took them 16 months to deliver the first one, and that was a small sedan.

[ocnblu]

Dreamworld is still dfelt's reality, I'm afraid.

[G. David Felt]

12 minutes ago, balthazar said:

I'm not going to check them all but;
Lion, Tesla, Nikola - not in production currently
Daimler - 20 customers currently running test units. Not in production.
Techcrunch states Nikola will "eventually produce" their truck. What that means is anybody's guess.

Peterbilt's truck is only good for '90 to up to 200 miles' [depending on model] but there's no MSRP or manner to build/order/purchase currently. That means NOT available for purchase.

'Pre-orders' is not 'in production' nor does it incorporate 'purchase' as defined by 'taking ownership of'. It's improper to state it otherwise. Sure, the IDEA is for that to transition, but that always takes longer than intended. Tesla opened pre-orders for the Model 3 in the end of May 2016- took them 16 months to deliver the first one, and that was a small sedan.

Never seen any Class 8 truck maker listing MSRP for any of their products. Daimler, Peterbilt, Fuso, Freightliner are selling the trucks in both heavy and medium duty models. You can purchase through one of their dealers and order up an EV truck.

The main point is there is product available now, product coming and it works with the goal of changing the market place from the current status of today to what and when they want a cleaner emission setup in the future. This has all come online in the last 6 to 12 months with 2020 being the start of shipping these products. 

The pandemic has delayed building / shipping but that does not mean it is not a real product for these OEMs or the companies that have already placed orders.

[balthazar]

1 hour ago, dfelt said:

Daimler, Peterbilt, Fuso, Freightliner are selling the trucks in both heavy and medium duty models. You can purchase through one of their dealers and order up an EV truck.

The main point is there is product available now

Here's the link to Daimler's HD truck site, read the block next to the 3rd picture (viewing thru the windshield):
https://www.mercedes-benz.com/en/vehicles/trucks/eactros-heavy-duty-electric-truck/
The EV daimlers are in a 2-yr beta testing; I can't go into a dealer and buy one Monday morning.

[balthazar]

daimler-trucksnorthamerica.com
https://daimler-trucksnorthamerica.com/innovation/
states the 'eCascadia' is "PLANNED to enter productiong in late 2021".

That's far from "now".

Edited June 27, 2020 by balthazar

[balthazar]

And that's my problem- some states (CA) are forcing manufacturers' hands, like there's huge lots of these already built, tested, and approved, along with thousands of hi-zip charging stations operational but padlocked... and manufacturer's refuse to release them.
That's succinctly illustrated by this : 

[G. David Felt]

18 minutes ago, balthazar said:

And that's my problem- some states (CA) are forcing manufacturers' hands, like there's huge lots of these already built, tested, and approved, along with thousands of hi-zip charging stations operational but padlocked... and manufacturer's refuse to release them.
That's succinctly illustrated by this : 

Charging in the West Coast with High Speed DC chargers are very common. So I would disagree that this image represents the EV commercial trucks. We are at the starting of a change in commercial freight movement. The Semi Truck makers just need to deliver beyond big pre-orders of start ups or existing OEM truck builders.

[balthazar]

Again; "at the beginning of a change" is not NOW.
It's disingenuous to state that list of EV trucks is available "now".

BTW- in response to "Never seen any Class 8 truck maker listing MSRP for any of their products", here's the first 'Peterbilt MSRP' link google returned :

 

I'll note that some sources are projecting a price for the Nikola semi at $350K.
You could buy a brand new Peterbilt and $185K worth of fuel.

Edited June 28, 2020 by balthazar

[ocnblu]

5 hours ago, dfelt said:

Charging in the West Coast with High Speed DC chargers are very common

And are they accessible to giant trucks, with acres of clearance to maneuver in and around?  Truckstop style?

[oldshurst442]

5 hours ago, ocnblu said:

And are they accessible to giant trucks, with acres of clearance to maneuver in and around?  Truckstop style?

Im guessing that they will be...and not only in California (Im going back to Cali Im going back to Cali Im going back to Cali)  but all across the USofA.  (We went dancing across the USA. On that crazy king's highway. Too much passion, too much play. We went dancin', dancin', dancin' across the USA)  

Eventually.    As I understand it, it took God 6 days to create the universe, (and on the 7th day, he rested) (Oh, you can kiss me on a Monday A Monday, a Monday is very, very good. Or you can kiss me on a Tuesday A Tuesday, a Tuesday, in fact I wish you would. Or you can kiss me on a Wednesday A Thursday, a Friday and Saturday is best.  But never, never on a Sunday A Sunday, a Sunday, 'cause that's my day of rest)  But since all we are is just mere mortals, His creations,  and we are not all that perfect, it will take just a tad longer than 6 days to create an EV infrastructure universe.  But it WILL be made. And then maybe we could all take Sundays off again. Just like He intended for ALL of us to do...

https://cleantechnica.com/2020/02/11/chargepoint-launches-1-billion-effort-to-add-ev-chargers-across-rural-america/
 

Quote

 

February 11th, 2020 by Kyle Field 

ChargePoint has partnered with the National Association of Truck Stop Owners (NATSO) to launch a massive new $1 billion initiative to add EV charging to deploy DC fast charging and level 2 EV chargers at more than 4,000 NATSO member locations, travel stops, and fueling locations across the country.

Did you catch that? ChargePoint and NATSO are planning to spend $1 billion dollars to add charging to truck stops across the country. The move is a significant step towards creating a robust, cohesive network of EV charging stations across the center of rural America. The newly minted National Highway Charging Collaborative will support not only truck drivers, but travelers forging a path across, up, down, or around the United States.

 

 

Oh...but YOU want it done NOW! 

I get it...

The thing is, the first truck stop in the world DID in fact originate in the States. But the first one opened up its doors in the 1940s as a result from WW2.  

Also...oil companies opened up truck stops as well to create this large network that we have today.  Just like they did with regular gas stations for regular cars.

Give it a chance, man.  Its easy to deny ANYTHING EV in 2020. It will be easy to deny  anything EV in 2021 and 2022 and even in 2023. But I promise you, the landscape will be a lot different in 2024.  

Maybe...

Covid really phoqued things up in many areas. 

But if you wanna discuss things rationally. Many economic reports state that China is gonna emerge a stronger economic player than the US after this Covid thing goes away in a year or two from now and the planet recovers economically from it...

And we all know that CHINA is PUSHING HARD for EVs...  We will see what will happen, but dont kid yourself.  EVs are being PUSHED HARD by just about every governing and economic controlling entity. Im afraid even you, in Lancaster, wont have a choice, eventually.  

 

Edited June 28, 2020 by oldshurst442

[G. David Felt]

12 hours ago, balthazar said:

Again; "at the beginning of a change" is not NOW.
It's disingenuous to state that list of EV trucks is available "now".

BTW- in response to "Never seen any Class 8 truck maker listing MSRP for any of their products", here's the first 'Peterbilt MSRP' link google returned :

 

I'll note that some sources are projecting a price for the Nikola semi at $350K.
You could buy a brand new Peterbilt and $185K worth of fuel.

Correction, this is NOT a Truck OEM, it is a Dealership and yes I could go out to Dealerships and see what they list trucks for. I was pointing to the OEM.

[ocnblu]

22 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Correction, this is NOT a Truck OEM

OMG the MSRP is listed directly above the dealer price!

[G. David Felt]

Seems Auto Collectors are warming up to conversions of their classics to EV. Aston Martin and Volkswagen have joined Jaguar, Lunaz and MW Motors out of Czech Repulic in offering conversions to EV on their auto's.

This company tailors to the rich 1%, but very nice to see these old sexy auto's out and about running.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1128661_classic-jaguar-bentley-rolls-ev-conversions-no-gasoline

Sexy XK120 would love to own if I could fit. Doing conversions on 1955 to 1965 XK 120 and XK140 models. These get two electric motors for a combined 316 HP and 516 lb-ft of torque. Moves the Jag from 0 to 60 in 5 seconds. 80 Kilowatt battery pack good for 250 miles of range.

Imagine how quiet and sexy this is now with an EV power train. Lunaz does EV conversions on Bentley Continental S2 Flying Spurs, Rolls-Royce Cloud and Rolls-Royce Phantom V

[ocnblu]

A travesty

[balthazar]

^ I think the above cars are junk and I still agree.

[riviera74]

The truly sad part is this: if these owners wanted an EV, then buy a Tesla.  There will be more EVs in the next couple of years, so why radically alter cars that are north of 50 years old?

[ccap41]

Classic cars turned into EVs does nothing for me. 

[G. David Felt]

2 hours ago, riviera74 said:

The truly sad part is this: if these owners wanted an EV, then buy a Tesla.  There will be more EVs in the next couple of years, so why radically alter cars that are north of 50 years old?

I understand what you are saying, but Tesla is so butt ugly. Those old classics are far better looking than any Tesla.

1 hour ago, ccap41 said:

Classic cars turned into EVs does nothing for me. 

Take your favorite auto you have fond memories of and think if it was your personal auto with electrical power train. Giving you more room and quiet.

[ccap41]

3 hours ago, dfelt said:

I understand what you are saying, but Tesla is so butt ugly. Those old classics are far better looking than any Tesla.

Take your favorite auto you have fond memories of and think if it was your personal auto with electrical power train. Giving you more room and quiet.

But part of my reason for loving either my 04 GT or 03 Mach 1 were the sounds of the 4.6L. I don't have memories of wanting just a basic-a$$ vehicle where the extra room and quieter drivetrain would be beneficial. 

[G. David Felt]

13 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

But part of my reason for loving either my 04 GT or 03 Mach 1 were the sounds of the 4.6L. I don't have memories of wanting just a basic-a$$ vehicle where the extra room and quieter drivetrain would be beneficial. 

I can respect that, I loved the sound of the custom built 402 in my suburban, yet also as I have gotten older, I do not care for the loud sound any more. I would rather have the quiet with the space and room. As to why my 1994 GMC SLE suburban is my project auto that will eventually have the ICE power train ripped out and electric put in.

Just like @Drew Dowdell loves his old car, some of us would rather have an old auto that is quiet as an EV.

I would expect more older auto's to end up getting converted to EV than to modern ICE.

[balthazar]

That proportion [repowering vintage to EV vs modern or rebuilt IC] will NEVER invert- won’t ever even come close.
 

”Hey, I was thinking my classic hoopdie would be nicer if it were quieter and had a lower tunnel in the center.”
”We can do that by cutting out & fabricating new floors, and replacing the powertrain with electric motors.”
”That’s really cool!! How much would that cost on my ‘85 Mustang LX?”
”Only $53,000!”
“B-but my car is only worth like $5,000...”
-shrugs indifferently-

[G. David Felt]

13 minutes ago, balthazar said:

That proportion [repowering vintage to EV vs modern or rebuilt IC] will NEVER invert- won’t ever even come close.
 

”Hey, I was thinking my classic hoopdie would be nicer if it were quieter and had a lower tunnel in the center.”
”We can do that by cutting out & fabricating new floors, and replacing the powertrain with electric motors.”
”That’s really cool!! How much would that cost on my ‘85 Mustang LX?”
”Only $53,000!”
“B-but my car is only worth like $5,000...”
-shrugs indifferently-

How is that any different than someone that takes that same 85 Mustang LX and puts in a role over cage, new suspension and a powerful ICE power train so they can race.

People make changes all the time to low cost old auto's. Just now we have the options of doing it with electric power train. Crate motors exist now that can change out the ICE engine with an Electric motor connected to the Transmission and you just add battery pack and controller.

Options, that is what we are getting more of.

[ykX]

The sound of V8, straight 6 engines can't be replicated and it is not just loud noise, it is music to the ears of any automotive enthusiast worth anything

I am all for EVs and some cars can be cool as restomods but taking old beautiful cars and gutting them just doesn't seem right to me.

[G. David Felt]

India Tata motors has brought to market an $18,000 EV. 194 miles of range for the FWD EV.

https://electrek.co/2020/06/29/indias-18000-tata-nexon-ev-points-to-global-ev-affordability/

Peugeot reveals their electric commercial van. Two battery options for a choice of 143 miles or 205 miles of range.

https://chargedevs.com/newswire/peugeot-reveals-e-expert-electric-commercial-van/

3 minutes ago, ykX said:

The sound of V8, straight 6 engines can't be replicated and it is not just loud noise, it is music to the ears of any automotive enthusiast worth anything

I am all for EVs and some cars can be cool as restomods but taking old beautiful cars and gutting them just doesn't seem right to me.

Personal choice and CHOICE is the key here. I have no problem with you having your ICE auto. There should also as is finally happening choices to go EV on older auto's for those that do not want to build their own project.

I AM an Automotive Enthusiast and I AM worth it and still I like the sound and way EVs drive and work.

[G. David Felt]

The USA #2 largest Natural Gas producer has filed for Bankruptcy protection from creditors.

Chesapeake Energy Corporation filed for protection due to their high debt load and the ill timed move into Oil production just before the pandemic hit. Low Oil and Gas prices with high debt load made it impossible to repay the loans and as such forced the company into Chapter 11.

https://electrek.co/2020/06/29/egeb-natural-gas-bankruptcy-chesapeake-energy-corporation-dutch-wind-farm/

 

[ykX]

1 hour ago, dfelt said:

Personal choice and CHOICE is the key here.

Choice is good, and I am all for choice, but taking a Rembrandt painting and painting over it modern art is not a choice, but a criminal act ?

Just my personal opinion

[G. David Felt]

7 minutes ago, ykX said:

Choice is good, and I am all for choice, but taking a Rembrandt painting and painting over it modern art is not a choice, but a criminal act ?

Just my personal opinion

Yea, I understand that, but his art does nothing for me, so paint away I say.  

To each their own, that is why options are the best. I would take a sexy Jaguar E-Type conversion that they are doing. This sexy body on a modern electric powertrain zipping along.

 

 

[balthazar]

2 hours ago, dfelt said:

How is that any different than someone that takes that same 85 Mustang LX and puts in a role over cage, new suspension and a powerful ICE power train so they can race.

Are you at all familiar with the concept of money?
- - - - -
EDIT :: (posts link to EV Jag that costs $370,000)

That's what I thought! ?

BTW- EV Type E was cancelled late last year. It's dead, Jim - going to have to build it yourself.

Edited June 29, 2020 by balthazar

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

Are you at all familiar with the concept of money?
- - - - -
EDIT :: (posts link to EV Jag that costs $370,000)

That's what I thought! ?

BTW- EV Type E was cancelled late last year. It's dead, Jim - going to have to build it yourself.

They said it was delayed, not dead yet. Once the Camaro was dead too.

Yes, some people do crazy things when they live in the 1% club.

For me and you, much like other auto enthusiasts, we work over time on our projects to make them happen. Still spend money just decide how and when we spend on our project.

[oldshurst442]

I never really liked the E-Type.  I could see how people see it as the "most beautiful" car design ever, but I certainly dont think it is.  I even think its ugly actually...  

 

I dont have any negative views regarding how classic cars are restored.  As long as somebody has the money, the energy and most importantly, the passion, to restore the classics and make them roadworthy so they could be driven again.  

So called heretic powertrains?  Im all for that!!!   Of course I do have biases, so in order for me to be really impressed with heretic powertrains, the powertrains will have to fit the "persona" of the vehicle and in the style that the vehicle is being restored.  

Anyhoo...to those that didnt like the idea of an EV powertrain in that classic Jaaaaaag.  Here is an idea...

https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/classic-cars/a32979753/jaguar-reproduction-xk-straight-six-engine-block/

If not...the tried and true LS swap classic never gets old.   ???

 

[balthazar]

^ Link keeps using the term 'block' - pics didn't work for me; is it literally just the engine block? For $18,000???? If so, that's HILARIOUS!!  FOR WHAT?
A repro of an engine block that stock developed a walloping 265 gross HP? For $18K?

[oldshurst442]

 

It looks like its only the block.  Which I missed when I first read the article 2 days ago.  I thought you got pistons and cams and everything else that makes an engine an engine for 18 Gs. 

[ note to self ]  I must learn to read more good.   

 

[G. David Felt]

28 minutes ago, balthazar said:

^ Link keeps using the term 'block' - pics didn't work for me; is it literally just the engine block? For $18,000???? If so, that's HILARIOUS!!  FOR WHAT?
A repro of an engine block that stock developed a walloping 265 gross HP? For $18K?

But they say you can use that engine block for a fancy table.

You also get a 12 months warranty on the block.  

[G. David Felt]

Very cool updated videos of Rivian truck off road.

 

 

[ccap41]

I REALLY hope Rivian has their sh!t together because that truck seems like an extremely compelling product. I also hope they've gotten the attention of people with money who want EV trucks so they don't fold in 5 years because I think they have the kind of products to enter the market and make a name for themselves.

Edited June 30, 2020 by ccap41

[G. David Felt]

10 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I REALLY hope Rivian has their sh!t together because that truck seems like an extremely compelling product. I also hope they've gotten the attention of people with money who want EV trucks so they don't fold in 5 years because I think they have the kind of products to enter the market and make a name for themselves.

The CEO is far better educated than Musk and seems to have his shit together as he was unwilling to sign with GM for $1 billion to an exclusive contract for his technology platform. Ford signed and Amazon. As such, we will see where this goes. I honestly right now am really liking their truck and suv and if I can fit with someone my size behind me inside the auto, am leaning towards their product.

I think they will last as Amazon has a long term contract for inner city and suburban delivery vans from them and has an open agreement to buy more once deliveries start. Amazon has stated they would like to use the vans globally.

[balthazar]

OMG- I can buy a reinforced, all aluminum Buick V8 block, improved oiling, able to take much more in overboring, dual-pattern trans capability, can easily handle 1000 HP, for $6200.

Edited June 30, 2020 by balthazar

[ccap41]

20 minutes ago, dfelt said:

The CEO is far better educated than Musk and seems to have his $h! together as he was unwilling to sign with GM for $1 billion to an exclusive contract for his technology platform. Ford signed and Amazon. As such, we will see where this goes. I honestly right now am really liking their truck and suv and if I can fit with someone my size behind me inside the auto, am leaning towards their product.

I think they will last as Amazon has a long term contract for inner city and suburban delivery vans from them and has an open agreement to buy more once deliveries start. Amazon has stated they would like to use the vans globally.

That's another thing I like about them. They seem to have set themselves up for guaranteed orders for a handful of years so they should have a steady flow of revenue, hopefully covering a lot of costs and not being in the red even if their consumer vehicles aren't taking off right away because, let's be honest, it'll be difficult to move a ton of all electric trucks from a brand new company to those who aren't in-the-know like us enthusiasts. 

14 minutes ago, balthazar said:

OMG- I can buy a reinforced, all aluminum Buick V8 block, improved oiling, able to take much more in overboring, dual-pattern trans capability, can easily handle 1000 HP, for $6200.

Buuuuut, it's not a Jaguar. 

That's just like saying you can buy a 460hp Camaro SS for 40k or a  380hp 911 Carerra for 100k. 

Different strokes for different folks.. But, without a doubt, the 18k block sounds absurd. 

Edited June 30, 2020 by ccap41

[G. David Felt]

14 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

That's another thing I like about them. They seem to have set themselves up for guaranteed orders for a handful of years so they should have a steady flow of revenue, hopefully covering a lot of costs and not being in the red even if their consumer vehicles aren't taking off right away because, let's be honest, it'll be difficult to move a ton of all electric trucks from a brand new company to those who aren't in-the-know like us enthusiasts. 

Buuuuut, it's not a Jaguar. 

That's just like saying you can buy a 460hp Camaro SS for 40k or a  380hp 911 Carerra for 100k. 

Different strokes for different folks.. But, without a doubt, the 18k block sounds absurd. 

Agree, for a new company, while they have been grey with specifics on how many people have pre-ordered the Truck and SUV, at least they have Amazon and Ford production to get them into the black. He is a smart cookie that RJ, CEO of Rivian.

So true about the different strokes for different folks. Also that V8 block is not name brand that is desired by badge fans. I am sure someone will buy the overpriced block from Jaguar. People like SMK who are all about the badge. Wonder if AMG is stamped on the blocks of the AMG auto's or is it just Mercedes-Benz?

[ccap41]

44 minutes ago, dfelt said:

So true about the different strokes for different folks. Also that V8 block is not name brand that is desired by badge fans. I am sure someone will buy the overpriced block from Jaguar. People like SMK who are all about the badge. Wonder if AMG is stamped on the blocks of the AMG auto's or is it just Mercedes-Benz?

I also think it has to do with the people wanting original equipment in their rebuilds. FWIW, I don't know how original the 18k block is or if it's been slightly modified. 

[balthazar]

People absolutely are buying that block- it's not from Buick but a Buick-only dedicated aftermarket company. Buick hard core fans support it fully.

[G. David Felt]

Nissan seems to know their stockholders are pissed. So Monday the Nissan CEO at the annual shareholder meeting covered their turn around plan starting with their first all new auto. The Nissan Ariya Crossover EV.

Nissan says this goes to where the buyers are, CUVs with Tesla fighting performance, battery range and Nissan ProPilot Hands-off automated driving system. Electrification and Autonomy at a reasonable price. What that price is, we do not know yet, but further details to come at the reveal of the auto set for July 15th online.

Have to say that while 2,500 attended last years shareholder meeting, only a few hundred attended this year. Yet they had lots to say.

Quotes:

one shareholder criticized the board’s decision not to cut the compensation of outside, non-operational directors.

Another shareholder slammed French partner Renault, which owns 43.4 percent of Nissan, as deadweight in the alliance because French people “excel at art” but are “weak” in technology.

Another said that Nissan’s recovery from slumping sales and plunging profits has been too slow because the new management is fragmented, indecisive and uninspiring.

One said Nissan still suffers from a credibility problem, more than a year after the arrest and ouster of Ghosn for alleged financial misconduct, because of the way the scandal was handled.

Uchida insisted that the midterm plan he unveiled in May plots a path to achievable recovering within four years. The plan calls for restoring operating profit margin to 5 percent and increasing global sales about 9 percent to 5.38 million vehicles for a 6 percent world market share.

https://www.autonews.com/automakers-suppliers/nissan-ariya-electric-crossover-debut-july-15

So a 4yr plan to turn the company around with new product, sales growth for a 6% share of the global market.

I have to question if they can do that due to the Pandemic and the competition coming from various other new auto startups that plan to have new auto's out from 2020 to 2021.

It would seem that Nissan is still not realizing how fast they need to move. Hopefully they have other new auto's to come out both EV and ICE over the next 12 months as I fear they could end up as Road Kill in the global market place.

[G. David Felt]

Very cool Old truck updated with modern electric motor hidden in a hollowed out V8. Very cool story on the 1936 electric truck here: https://www.thedrive.com/tech/33258/hot-rodders-hybrid-1936-pickup-hides-an-electric-motor-inside-a-chevy-small-block-v8

 

 

[riviera74]

47 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Nissan seems to know their stockholders are pissed. So Monday the Nissan CEO at the annual shareholder meeting covered their turn around plan starting with their first all new auto. The Nissan Ariya Crossover EV.

Nissan says this goes to where the buyers are, CUVs with Tesla fighting performance, battery range and Nissan ProPilot Hands-off automated driving system. Electrification and Autonomy at a reasonable price. What that price is, we do not know yet, but further details to come at the reveal of the auto set for July 15th online.

Have to say that while 2,500 attended last years shareholder meeting, only a few hundred attended this year. Yet they had lots to say.

Quotes:

one shareholder criticized the board’s decision not to cut the compensation of outside, non-operational directors.

Another shareholder slammed French partner Renault, which owns 43.4 percent of Nissan, as deadweight in the alliance because French people “excel at art” but are “weak” in technology.

Another said that Nissan’s recovery from slumping sales and plunging profits has been too slow because the new management is fragmented, indecisive and uninspiring.

One said Nissan still suffers from a credibility problem, more than a year after the arrest and ouster of Ghosn for alleged financial misconduct, because of the way the scandal was handled.

Uchida insisted that the midterm plan he unveiled in May plots a path to achievable recovering within four years. The plan calls for restoring operating profit margin to 5 percent and increasing global sales about 9 percent to 5.38 million vehicles for a 6 percent world market share.

https://www.autonews.com/automakers-suppliers/nissan-ariya-electric-crossover-debut-july-15

So a 4yr plan to turn the company around with new product, sales growth for a 6% share of the global market.

I have to question if they can do that due to the Pandemic and the competition coming from various other new auto startups that plan to have new auto's out from 2020 to 2021.

It would seem that Nissan is still not realizing how fast they need to move. Hopefully they have other new auto's to come out both EV and ICE over the next 12 months as I fear they could end up as Road Kill in the global market place.

Nissan would be better off liquidated and sell off the assets for cash and return cash to the shareholders.  Nissan/Infiniti have a math problem and a leadership problem and a product problem all at once.

[Robert Hall]

Nissan produced almost 5 million vehicles globally last year..not trivial.  About the same as Ford globally.

[G. David Felt]

Just now, Robert Hall said:

Nissan produced almost 5 million vehicles globally last year..not trivial.  About the same as Ford globally.

That there shows that they are worth trying to turn around as that is allot of jobs to loose and the 3rd party companies working with Nissan, lots of hardship if the company fails.

Thank you for posting that info Robert. Good to know.

[Robert Hall]

2 minutes ago, dfelt said:

That there shows that they are worth trying to turn around as that is allot of jobs to loose and the 3rd party companies working with Nissan, lots of hardship if the company fails.

Thank you for posting that info Robert. Good to know.

And those numbers are off from 2017...in 2017 Nissan was #6 globally, behind Ford and ahead of Honda.   I see variation depending on the criteria for ranking, this list has them at #9 and Ford at #8.  Must be financial and not volume, since it has Tesla at #7.

https://www.bizvibe.com/blog/automobiles/top-10-automobile-companies-in-the-world/

Edited June 30, 2020 by Robert Hall