Alternative Fuels & Propulsion RANDOM

[G. David Felt]

First big Sale by LordsTown Motors, new owners of the old Cruze plant.

To quote the story: Northeast Ohio’s Voltage Valley: Akron, Ohio-based FirstEnergy, an electric utility that serves over 6 million customers, has agreed to buy 250 Endurance electric pickup trucks from Lordstown Motors.

https://chargedevs.com/newswire/ohio-utility-orders-250-lordstown-endurance-electric-pickups/

[G. David Felt]

GKN just built and delivered their 1 millionth EV compact power train unit for cars/cuvs and is now developing it's next generation unit which will cover 80 -155 kW power and 2,000 to 5,800 NM or for us Standard peeps, that is 107 to 207 HP and 1,475 to 4,277 lb-ft or Torque depending on controller used with the motor.

https://chargedevs.com/newswire/gkn-developing-new-versions-of-edrive-technology-as-sales-increase/

[riviera74]

That BMW i4 concept is UGLY AF!  Even the new Silverado trucks are not this freaking UGLY.

[G. David Felt]

Three months into open reservations and the first year of the 2021 model Mach e is sold out.  That is 50,000 auto's sold. 

You can get all the details here at the Corporate Ford site. With additional info here at the Ford Sales site. Links take you right into the Mach e info. Yet Green Car Reports already took their Media kit and the News Release from those two sites and broke the multiple pages down nicely.

1. The sales are NOT a California Bubble as Ford released a nifty map showing the Mach e sold in every state of the Nation and by the most popular color. Map at the end.
2. Three-quarters of the Mach e sold are  AWD in every state except Connecticute, Maine, Massachusetts and New Hampshire where the Ratio is 90%.
3. 30% of the Mach e sold are the AWD High-performance GT edition.
4. Ford is not releasing at this time what percentage is the First Edition Model nor how many exact units sold in each state only listing where the units have been reserved sold with the $500 deposit.

Like the Interior, but would want it in one of the two tone colors rather than all black.

I REALLY HOPE they have Dark Mode for that huge screen.

[G. David Felt]

GM announced that in support of their employees move to EVs that they will add 3,500 charging spots across Canada and the US for their employees to park in and charge while at work.

https://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/home.detail.html/content/Pages/news/us/en/2020/mar/0303-ev.html

GM is wanting to support their employees making it as convenient as possible for their employees to enjoy the rewards of EV ownership.

GM also confirmed in this announcement that Hummer by GMC will be out at the beginning of the 2022 model year or first quarter of 2021 and Cadillac will have their first of many EVs out at the start of the 2023 model year or first quarter of 2022.

Be interesting to see how this all goes for GM. The LG/GM battery plant is under 24/7 construction.

[oldshurst442]

@dfelt

How many of us have been saying about the right EV product (SUV/CUV) with the right combination of range, price, esthetics, dimensions, utility WILL sell well!!!   (referring to the Mustang Mach-E) 

Thanx for posting. 

Now...hopefully Ford actually hits those performance numbers as promised. 

[G. David Felt]

32 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

@dfelt

How many of us have been saying about the right EV product (SUV/CUV) with the right combination of range, price, esthetics, dimensions, utility WILL sell well!!!   (referring to the Mustang Mach-E) 

Thanx for posting. 

Now...hopefully Ford actually hits those performance numbers as promised. 

Mach e is on our list along with the Rivian and the Hummer by GMC. 

I totally agree with you, full size, right combo of feature functions, range, price, etc. etc. etc. they will sell. 

Bulk of Humanity hates service on auto's and EVs are a fraction of ICE. Humanity will move once all the right pieces are in place.

[balthazar]

^ What is the fraction?

[G. David Felt]

3 minutes ago, balthazar said:

^ What is the fraction?

Service of an EV is a fraction or much less than that on an ICE auto.

[balthazar]

Let me re-phrase ; what is the fractional difference?

And isn't a fraction by definition; "much less" that a whole?

Edited March 4, 2020 by balthazar

[G. David Felt]

12 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Let me re-phrase ; what is the fractional difference?

And isn't a fraction by definition; "much less" that a whole?

Here are some sites that have reviewed EV versus ICE ownership.

https://www.2degreesinstitute.org/reports/comparing_fuel_and_maintenance_costs_of_electric_and_gas_powered_vehicles_in_canada.pdf

Charts and various deeper dive info, but they studied 3 difference research studies on the comparison of near equal EV to ICE auto's and the average ended up being that EV's were 47% less to maintain and operate than an equal like ICE auto.

https://www.energysage.com/electric-vehicles/costs-and-benefits-evs/evs-vs-fossil-fuel-vehicles/

Energy Sage is an independent think tank looking at the cost of ownership per year of ICE versus EV.

One of the studies they list as used to review costs had this to say and I quote: A 2018 study from the University of Michigan's Transportation Research Institute found that electric vehicles cost less than half as much to operate as gas-powered cars. The average cost to operate an EV in the United States is $485 per year, while the average for a gasoline-powered vehicle is $1,117. 

They do state that the largest expense in an EV is the Battery pack. Yet they also state that every year costs have gone down while longevity has gone up.

Now this is by an EV pro web site, but I had to crack up laughing as they use the image of the Maytag repair man as it covers the cost of an EV over the first 100,000 miles.

https://insideevs.com/news/317307/ev-vs-ice-maintenance-the-first-100000-miles/

I like this as they take it from the approach of a service file covering in details that I think can resonate with many people.

Tires: both EV and ICE will need tires and rotations, based on rotation every 7,500 miles you have 13 trips in your first 100,000 miles for both types of auto's.

Oil Change: Older auto's used to be 3,000 miles, newer ones run from 3,000 to 7,500, they took 5,000 miles on average, meaning 20 oil changes for ICE over 100,000 miles. Cost $400 to $800. EV = None

Automatic transmission: generally recommended service every 100,000 miles. $30 to $100 for ICE and is more if done at garage or dealer. EV = None

Coolant: Generally 150,000 miles and you do have to check on it through out the life of the ICE auto. EV, if they have a thermal management system like the Chevrolet Bolt, you will have similar checks.

Fuel: ICE they used 12,750 miles a year which would equal 400 trips to the gas station for the first 100,000 miles based on 28 mpg @$3.50 per gallon equal $12,500. EV's plugged and unplugged daily with 90% of charging done at your home based on cost of 3.5 cents per mile equals $3,500

Spark plugs and wires: Usually 100,000 service, DIY $60, Shop $200 EV's = none

Muffler: Location and driving  determines the life of the muffler and catalytic converter. Short stop n go driving shortens life compared to long trips Muffler $100 to $250, Cat $500 to $1,000. EV's = none

Brakes: Depending on the auto, they figure at least 2 trips in the first 100,000. They average $200, $400 over the life, but I know that is more like $400 each time and $800 for the two trips in 100,000. With regenerative brakes, this is cut in half, so $200 or what I believe is $400.

Big 100,000 miles service: from Timing belts to water pumps, tune up, etc. They are quoting $900 to $1,100. I can honestly say I think it is more inline with $1,000 to $2,500 depending on the ICE auto. EV's you might have battery issues to deal with which can run $5,000 unless you go refurbished. Yet batteries are getting stronger and better so this is becoming a much smaller issue for most EVs. In reality as they say, you can keep driving an EV even with a reduced battery life, but an ICE with engine issues has a stronger chance of leaving you stranded.

Over all, I think the cost of ownership for EVs is half that for the ICE.

[G. David Felt]

Tesla today started to allow folks to add on a new $5,500 option. TRACK PACKAGE that also included new 20" tires with sticky Pilot rubber and software that totally changes the power train. This is for those not concerned about battery range in comparison to performance at the track.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/tesla-model-3-track-package-electric-sedan-order/

Only model 3 Performance packaged auto's will get the update as long as their file shows they also purchased the rest of the hardware. This being tires and rims along with Performance Brake pads.

[G. David Felt]

CNN is reporting that Ford has announced they will sell an All Electric Ford Transit cargo van here in the US. To me sounds like they could be using the Rivian platform as the Amazon vans will come in the same configuration options as the Ford.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/03/cars/ford-electric-transit-cargo-van/index.html

To quote the story and Fords info:

The electric Transit van will be made available in a variety of body styles, including three different lengths and three different roof heights. Ford will also offer chassis cab configurations in which there's just a bare chassis behind the van's passenger cabin. Chassis cab models are often used as the basis for creating specialized vehicles like shuttle buses and campers.

[balthazar]

Quote

Oil Change, Automatic transmission, Coolant, Spark plugs and wires, Muffler, Brakes, Big 100,000 miles service

• I change oil about every 7 months (about every 6K miles). Do it myself; a good opportunity to check out underneath. 10 qrts oil plus filter : $55. If I went by the oil life monitor, it'd go 8500 miles between changes. That'd be 17 oil changes in 151K miles.
• No plugs, no wires.
• No muffler costs; I haven't replaced (or needed to) a muffler or pipes over the last 300,000 miles of driving 2 different vehicles.
• Brakes last roughly 75K miles, so I've done them twice on the current truck. I know the rears are due now. I do them myself- that service will be cheaper than an EV, whom no owners will do the work themselves. Regenerative brakes may go longer between changes, but the replacement job has to be more expensive.
• No timing belt or timing chain : gear drive- never needs service. Just replaced alternator a few months ago (original), still has everything else motor-wise original @ 197K. No DEF either.

Fuel is a difference, but fuel isn't 'service'. These comparisons always lump fuel in with the maintenance question.

 

Edited March 4, 2020 by balthazar

[G. David Felt]

2 hours ago, balthazar said:

• I change oil about every 7 months (about every 6K miles). Do it myself; a good opportunity to check out underneath. 10 qrts oil plus filter : $55. If I went by the oil life monitor, it'd go 8500 miles between changes. That'd be 17 oil changes in 151K miles.
• No plugs, no wires.
• No muffler costs; I haven't replaced (or needed to) a muffler or pipes over the last 300,000 miles of driving 2 different vehicles.
• Brakes last roughly 75K miles, so I've done them twice on the current truck. I know the rears are due now. I do them myself- that service will be cheaper than an EV, whom no owners will do the work themselves. Regenerative brakes may go longer between changes, but the replacement job has to be more expensive.
• No timing belt or timing chain : gear drive- never needs service. Just replaced alternator a few months ago (original), still has everything else motor-wise original @ 197K. No DEF either.

Fuel is a difference, but fuel isn't 'service'. These comparisons always lump fuel in with the maintenance question.

Your also not the Normal auto owner. Many here do their own maintenance. Looking at the bigger picture of most people who drive their auto and treat it like an appliance. They go to the dealer or some service shop when the auto needs attention.

As such, the EVs for the bulk of society are going to be lower cost due to the less maintenance on the auto.

Regenerative braking is from within the electric motor, not actual brakes. Full details can be found here with pictures. https://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/brakes/brake-types/regenerative-braking.htm

To Quote:

In a traditional braking system, brake pads produce friction with the brake rotors to slow or stop the vehicle. Additional friction is produced between the slowed wheels and the surface of the road. This friction is what turns the car's kinetic energy into heat. With regenerative brakes, on the other hand, the system that drives the vehicle does the majority of the braking. When the driver steps on the brake pedal of an electric or hybrid vehicle, these types of brakes put the vehicle's electric motor into reverse mode, causing it to run backwards, thus slowing the car's wheels. While running backwards, the motor also acts as an electric generator, producing electricity that's then fed into the vehicle's batteries. These types of brakes work better at certain speeds than at others. In fact, they're most effective in stop-and-go driving situations. However, hybrids and fully electric cars also have friction brakes, as a kind of back-up system in situations where regenerative braking simply won't supply enough stopping power. In these instances, it’s important for drivers to be aware of the fact that the brake pedal might respond differently to pressure.

[G. David Felt]

GM looking to the Future with their 100 year celebration of Futurama.

 

[ocnblu]

$3.50/gallon is a dollar more per gallon than normal.  So that comparison only works where gasoline taxes are murderous.  And we can guess which states those are.

[ccap41]

14 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

@dfelt

How many of us have been saying about the right EV product (SUV/CUV) with the right combination of range, price, esthetics, dimensions, utility WILL sell well!!!   (referring to the Mustang Mach-E) 

Thanx for posting. 

Now...hopefully Ford actually hits those performance numbers as promised. 

I've been saying it for awhile, but I think them(anybody, not just Ford) targeting performance and naturally efficiency with an EV will be key. "Everybody" has tried the whole small car EV thing and they don't do too well.  I believe making a fun and capable EV will make them much more desirable. 

12 hours ago, balthazar said:

Let me re-phrase ; what is the fractional difference?

And isn't a fraction by definition; "much less" that a whole?

7/5 is a fraction as well so it could be more by just saying "fraction" but people don't commonly think of 'greater than 100%' when saying "fraction". 

Buuuut, looking at the dictionary definition, it has to be less than 1. 

[ccap41]

11 hours ago, dfelt said:

CNN is reporting that Ford has announced they will sell an All Electric Ford Transit cargo van here in the US. To me sounds like they could be using the Rivian platform as the Amazon vans will come in the same configuration options as the Ford.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/03/cars/ford-electric-transit-cargo-van/index.html

To quote the story and Fords info:

The electric Transit van will be made available in a variety of body styles, including three different lengths and three different roof heights. Ford will also offer chassis cab configurations in which there's just a bare chassis behind the van's passenger cabin. Chassis cab models are often used as the basis for creating specialized vehicles like shuttle buses and campers.

It would be smart to partner for that, as well. That Rivian van/truck seems like the real deal and you'd only have to buy-in instead of a ground up build.. But, they sell a lot of them so maybe the costs to build your own would pay off. 

[ccap41]

11 hours ago, balthazar said:

• I change oil about every 7 months (about every 6K miles). Do it myself; a good opportunity to check out underneath. 10 qrts oil plus filter : $55. If I went by the oil life monitor, it'd go 8500 miles between changes. That'd be 17 oil changes in 151K miles.
• No plugs, no wires.
• No muffler costs; I haven't replaced (or needed to) a muffler or pipes over the last 300,000 miles of driving 2 different vehicles.
• Brakes last roughly 75K miles, so I've done them twice on the current truck. I know the rears are due now. I do them myself- that service will be cheaper than an EV, whom no owners will do the work themselves. Regenerative brakes may go longer between changes, but the replacement job has to be more expensive.
• No timing belt or timing chain : gear drive- never needs service. Just replaced alternator a few months ago (original), still has everything else motor-wise original @ 197K. No DEF either.

Fuel is a difference, but fuel isn't 'service'. These comparisons always lump fuel in with the maintenance question.

 

Anecdotal isn't factual. Just because you don't do it 1: doesn't mean most don't and 2: it shouldn't be done.

4 hours ago, ocnblu said:

$3.50/gallon is a dollar more per gallon than normal.  So that comparison only works where gasoline taxes are murderous.  And we can guess which states those are.

It probably accounts for vehicles requiring 89 and 91 octane, as well. 

[G. David Felt]

Major Battery play is coming from a California start up called Enevate. They have had $111 million invested in them from LG Chem, Samsung and Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi.

Enevate has in their 4th generation of battery technology developed an XFC Silicon Lithium battery. 

• XFC = Extreme Fast Charging
• Silicon a very common material and easy to produce in a lab as the new Anode material replacing graphite anodes causeing the use of rare earth elements.
• Battery storage density is 10 times that of current Lithium-ion cells.
• Batteries available in 2024-2025 model year EVs.

Enevate went revolutionary rather than evolutionary like Tesla, Panasonic, etc. has done with keeping the graphite and adding silicon to increase density. Enevate went with a silicon layer, then copper, then silicon building what is believed to be the current dense's anode around.

If your a nerd interested in the deeper details of the battery tech, read the full story here:

https://chargedevs.com/features/enevate-says-its-silicon-dominant-anode-technology-is-ready-for-ev-production/

Have to say this is exciting as this will help deliver the power density for range and feature functions that people want in full size auto's.

[ccap41]

10 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Battery storage density is 10 times that of current Lithium-ion cells.

YES. 

With that added density, you could halve the weight of a current battery and still add range. 

This and the increased rate of charge are where the game changing points occur. 

[G. David Felt]

April 2nd we get to see the Cadillac EV unveiling.

Cadillac Lyriq EV

Not so sure about the name, but like the Cadillac logo on the grill.

 

 

[balthazar]

2 hours ago, ccap41 said:

Anecdotal isn't factual. Just because you don't do it 1: doesn't mean most don't and 2: it shouldn't be done.

True, of course.

Just commenting on how these ‘comparisons’ are also anecdotal.

[ccap41]

11 minutes ago, balthazar said:

True, of course.

Just commenting on how these ‘comparisons’ are also anecdotal.

I would only assume they are going by services that are supposed to be done via the service manuals. 

It's about the only apples to apples comparisons, using ICE manuals and EV manuals and recommended service intervals per the manufacturers. 

[balthazar]

Maybe. I've never seen a muffler service/replacement interval recommendation tho.
- - - - -

Quote

these types of brakes put the vehicle's electric motor into reverse mode, causing it to run backwards, thus slowing the car's wheels.

So; what's the 'slippage' component between the transmission-less electric motor and the forward-rotating wheels? Is it merely 'forward-rolling resistance'? If so, I would think manual braking is still required 100% of the time... but I don't know.

Edited March 4, 2020 by balthazar

[ccap41]

16 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Maybe. I've never seen a muffler service/replacement interval recommendation tho.
- - - - -

So; what's the 'slippage' component between the transmission-less electric motor and the forward-rotating wheels? Is it merely 'forward-rolling resistance'? If so, I would think manual braking is still required 100% of the time... but I don't know.

https://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/brakes/brake-types/regenerative-braking.htm

"­In a tr­aditional braking system, brake pads produce friction with the brake rotors to slow or stop the vehicle. Additional friction is produced between the slowed wheels and the surface of the road. This friction is what turns the car's kinetic energy into heat. With regenerative brakes, on the other hand, the system that drives the vehicle does the majority of the braking. When the driver steps on the brake pedal of an electric or hybrid vehicle, these types of brakes put the vehicle's electric motor into reverse mode, causing it to run backwards, thus slowing the car's wheels. While running backwards, the motor also acts as an electric generator, producing electricity that's then fed into the vehicle's batteries. These types of brakes work better at certain speeds than at others. In fact, they're most effective in stop-and-go driving situations. However, hybrids and fully electric cars also have friction brakes, as a kind of back-up system in situations where regenerative braking simply won't supply enough stopping power. In these instances, it’s important for drivers to be aware of the fact that the brake pedal might respond differently to pressure. The pedal will sometimes depress farther towards the floor than it normally does and this sensation can cause momentary panic in drivers."

[G. David Felt]

BIG NEWS BIG NEWS BIG NEWS

GM's annual Investor, Analyst and Dealers meeting in Detroit, GM showed off their newest modular platform with a new battery, motors, etc. This new platform will suppor 13 new auto's as GM steps up to compete with Tesla.

https://www.usnews.com/news/business/articles/2020-03-04/gm-shows-13-electric-vehicles-as-it-tries-to-run-with-tesla

This new battery pack will allow GM to support a 400 mile range in their Hummer by GMC truck and offer other sizes across SUV/TRUCK/CAR models.

Starting with the Cadillac Lyriq to be shown April 2nd we will also get a new Chevrolet BOLT CUV, Hummer by GMC pickup as GM moves forward to have out by 2024 as 2025 models the following:

• 3 Cadillac SUVs, Luxury Car
• Chevrolet Midsize SUV along with the Bolt compact SUV and full size truck.
• 2 Buick SUVs
• GMC Hummer Truck and SUV
• Cruise Origin, autonomous electric shuttle

GM plans to sell 1 million EVs by mid decade

[balthazar]

1 hour ago, ccap41 said:

https://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/brakes/brake-types/regenerative-braking.htm

"­In a tr­aditional braking system, brake pads produce friction ....

You double-posted the same passage I was asking the question on.

My question was - if the electric motor is direct drive to the wheels, what's the mechanism that allows the electric motor to suddenly run in reverse while the wheels are still rotating forward (if they are directly coupled)? It's fine if you don't know.

- - - - -
Actually, what I assume is happening is the polarity is reversed, loading the motor in reverse rotation, but it's not actually turning in reverse. Only way it makes sense to me without a torque converter-type coupler.

Edited March 4, 2020 by balthazar

[ccap41]

16 minutes ago, balthazar said:

You double-posted the same passage I was asking the question on.

My question was - if the electric motor is direct drive to the wheels, what's the mechanism that allows the electric motor to suddenly run in reverse while the wheels are still rotating forward (if they are directly coupled)? It's fine if you don't know.

- - - - -
Actually, what I assume is happening is the polarity is reversed, loading the motor in reverse rotation, but it's not actually turning in reverse. Only way it makes sense to me without a torque converter-type coupler.

Did you click the link and read it though? I guess it seemed to cover it pretty well there.. 

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, balthazar said:

You double-posted the same passage I was asking the question on.

My question was - if the electric motor is direct drive to the wheels, what's the mechanism that allows the electric motor to suddenly run in reverse while the wheels are still rotating forward (if they are directly coupled)? It's fine if you don't know.

- - - - -
Actually, what I assume is happening is the polarity is reversed, loading the motor in reverse rotation, but it's not actually turning in reverse. Only way it makes sense to me without a torque converter-type coupler.

Decided to post this https://www.quora.com/How-the-motor-gets-reversed-in-regenerative-braking

Engineering speak as to me it is the simplest way to explain this:

In dc motor during regenerative baking, the rotation does not change. When regenerative braking is applied,the supply to the armature(rotor) is cut off and supply is given only to the field winding(stator).

Due to this,the rotor conductor cuts the stator magnetic field and produce an voltag(emf),this is fed back to the source.

The motor will come to stop when the inertia is equal to the emf produced.

[ocnblu]

Haha, I knew the Cadillac Lyriq would be music to dfelt's ears.  Now whether that translates to anyone else is the perilous part of GM's awful plan to finish off Cadillac.

[riviera74]

24 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

Haha, I knew the Cadillac Lyriq would be music to dfelt's ears.  Now whether that translates to anyone else is the perilous part of GM's awful plan to finish off Cadillac.

Perilous, or necessary?  One day, governments might decide to essentially BAN the ICE in favor of BEVs.  Sounds like Cadillac (and GM in general) are looking ahead to that (admittedly distant) possibility.

[ocnblu]

5 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

Perilous, or necessary?  One day, governments might decide to essentially BAN the ICE in favor of BEVs.  Sounds like Cadillac (and GM in general) are looking ahead to that (admittedly distant) possibility.

Then those governments should be told "NO".

[balthazar]

This the same Gov’t that, after 50 years of a planetoid of evidence, still hasn't banned cigarettes?

[oldshurst442]

23 minutes ago, ocnblu said:

Then those governments should be told "NO".

Im afraid...its not only the US government that needs to be told "NO" as you put it.  The whole bloody planet's governments are doing this.  

I dont know if and when  the Americas are gonna do this (North, South and Central) but many countries in Europe are in motion of banning ICE engines in their city cores and probably everywhere else in their respective countrys eventually soon. Ditto for the Asian continent too.  

The thing is...the rest of the planet's population are not exactly against this as feverishly as some Americans are...

And THAT poses mucho problems not only for the USA (we could discuss this how if the whole world wants to do away with ICE and adopts EVs, how does THAT phoque up the American way of life, because its an interesting discussion)  but for American car companies such as GM, Ford. (FCA is gonna be further entrenched with Europe) (We could discuss that because THAT is interesting too as GM and Ford are counting on China's market and China is one of these countries that are pushing EVs harder than anywhere else. Other than Norway.)

32 minutes ago, balthazar said:

This the same Gov’t that, after 50 years of a planetoid of evidence, still hasn't banned cigarettes?

Ah...but they HAVE banned cigarettes...   Im assuming the US is like Canada and smoking cigarettes is limited to a few designated areas around public spaces... 

No total ban...because money is to be made.  That and criminalizing ciggies and ciggie smoking will just end up in disaster...kinda like prohibition did way back when...  And...I KNOW that jails are overflowing with soooo many criminals that they dont know what to do with them anymore. Incarcerating smokers for such a petty crime wont make any sense.  Will cost too much.   

So yeah...smoking is tolerated by law...

As far as EVs go...

One thing that EV lovers should take heed is that all these online updates that they love soooo much may end up screwing them.  Tesla records data. Data like speed and distance traveled and that data will be used against the user. It will be monetized to Tesla's, insurance's and especially the government's favour.   Taxing the mileage one drives and insurance quotas based on your speed and mileage driven and the like... 

Be careful what we wish for...

So Im aware of all the shyte that is going on.  Im for EVs. But certain things that go with EVs as a package...Im very weary about. 

 

 

 

 

[G. David Felt]

More GM Details on their EV product line. Some very cool stuff!

GM actually showed off a number of beta EV's or test mules as we call them in the old ICE lingo. EV's will have Alpha, Beta, RC and finally GA builds.

Alpha is the first swing, usually clay models.

Beta is the actual builds out on the roads to test everything and find the bugs.

RC or release candidate is the last builds for testing with pretty much all final work in place, just flushing out the final code bugs.

GA is General Availability when the public can buy it.

Hope this helps those that do not understand 21st century tech.  

So per this story which I found duplicated by just about everyone, GM seems to have held off allowing folks to talk about what they saw till tonight after the dog n pony show.

https://electrek.co/2020/03/04/ama-gm-bev-event-ev-hummers-huge-cadillacs-new-bolts-e-uvs/

Gonna cut n past as that will be fastest to quote:

GMC Hummer EV truck

Fun-looking vehicle with Hummer heritage and large format. Inside and out matched rugged looks.

GMC Hummer EV SUT

Pretty much the same, but more like an SUV.

Cadillac Lyriq 

This is the SUV we’ve seen images of before, and it will be the first car on GM’s BEV3 platform. The interior was gorgeous and to be honest the first Cadillac that I’ve ever seen that I’ve lusted after. We’ve seen the outside.

Cadillac Celestiq

This is an out-there kind of luxury station wagon with an extremely futuristic look. It’s quite large yet looks like it could also be incredibly fast. The model didn’t have a finished interior, so obviously more to come here.

Bolt EV 2021

I talked about Bolt EV in my post linked above, but it really did address all of the complaints I had in 2017. But it’s now 2020, and the BEV 2 platform is showing its age.

Bolt EUV

The long-rumored longer Bolt EV with Supercruise. How does it stack up? More info in the link above.

Buick SUVs

These were clay models but looked like they follow the Lyriq format with a downmarket interior.

So Station Wagon fans get a luxury one in Cadillac. Not feeling the names yet, Lyriq and Celestiq makes me think Marvel.

So replacement BOLT and a BOLT EUV with supercruise. Very cool. I wonder if it will have the same features or a reduced feature set?

Seems Badge engineering to me for Buick of the Cadillac EVs.

Full details here on the Bolts. Seems GM is bringing wireless Android and Apple play to all their auto's. That is very cool.

https://electrek.co/2020/03/04/2021-chevy-bolt-revealed-significant-redesign/

Seems according to GM, The New Bolts will roll out this fall into select markets before being GA across the US in January 2021.

GM has gone with USB-C in their auto's moving forward that are far more powerful than the current 5w usb ports. So be interesting to see how much more powerful.

Shifters are GONE! RND is now the 3 buttons you have on the dash to use in EVs.

Interesting slide from the GM dog n pony show.

Have to say this is an interesting read on the Hummer by GMC SUV EV.

https://www.caranddriver.com/gmc/hummer-ev-suv

Loving this full size SUV EV.

Have to say that GM could finally give Jeep a run for it's money.

[G. David Felt]

Seems some additional images have finally been released by GM for public consumption. 

https://www.autoblog.com/2020/03/04/cadillac-celestiq-lyriq-gmc-hummer-chevy-bolt-euv-electric-cars-gm/

Autoblog says the Cadillac Celestiq is going to be an Ubber Luxury car and the outline image they approved for release is this:

Would not say this is a Station Wagon, more of a hatchback. Kinda reminds me of that stretch car at Chevrolet they sold for a few years with a big sky window over the rear seat but I cannot remember the name.

Some on other web sites say this gives them an Aston Martin DBX vibe.

Autoblog says the Cadillac Lyriq CUV is about the same size as the Cadillac XT5. 

Have to say the details that Autoblog shares about the new grills, cadillac lighted logo and interior dash and space is exciting.

[balthazar]

Quote

Hope this helps those that do not understand 21st century tech.

That's not 'tech'; that's semantics.

Quote

We've seen the outside

 

Quote

kind of luxury station wagon

1. A silhouette is not 'seeing the exterior'.
2. that silhouette is the Lyriq, not the Celestiq.
3. The Celestiq is reputedly a liftback sedan, not a 'station wagon' or an SUV.

Edited March 5, 2020 by balthazar

[ccap41]

10 hours ago, dfelt said:

Have to say that GM could finally give Jeep a run for it's money.

They have the tools now. Look at the ZR2. They just don't build anything with that kind of technology. The ZR2 is up there with the best factory off-roaders. They don't "need" another brand to do so, just apply the same strategy they did with the ZR2 to an SUV, the half-ton twins, and/or the HD.  

9 hours ago, dfelt said:

Autoblog says the Cadillac Celestiq is going to be an Ubber Luxury car and the outline image they approved for release is this:

Would not say this is a Station Wagon, more of a hatchback. Kinda reminds me of that stretch car at Chevrolet they sold for a few years with a big sky window over the rear seat but I cannot remember the name.

It gives me a lifted Panamera vibe. I've always thought that was an awkwardly shaped vehicle but plenty of people like them. 

[Robert Hall]

Lyriq, Celestiq....hmmmm.    How about Majiq, Majestiq, Mystiq,Chroniq, Iconiq, Ironiq, Taconiq, Moroniq...

Edited March 5, 2020 by Robert Hall

[G. David Felt]

Latest on Ford F150 EV Truck and for the most part the renderings based on insider info will have it looking just like the rest of the family except for the Frunk and solid front end grill.

https://electrek.co/2020/03/05/ford-f150-electric-render-inside-info/

Personally I think it is one of the better Ford pickups I have seen.

Renault has brought to market it's ultra cheap K-ZE Crossover to the European & Chinese Market under the Dacia brand and at an amazing price point for a 4 person auto with 155 miles of range.

Cost $9,000 US. 

https://electrek.co/2020/03/03/renault-k-ze-cheap-electric-crossover-europe-dacia-spring/

Electric is a great place for Mopeds and so it seems that this next bike created and built out of Texas has officially launched. The SCOOT MOPED was seen out and about in LA last summer, but official production did not start till December 2019. As such we now have them available for Global purchase.

https://electrek.co/2020/03/05/bird-unveils-new-scoot-moped-a-seated-electric-scooter-with-big-potential/

Your basic SCOOT comes with the following:

• Large Volume tires
• Dual Rear Suspension
• Two Vertically mounted mirrors
• Hydaulic disc brakes
• Top rated speed of 20 mph or 32 km/h

Scoot is not available to buy but to rent. SCOOT is available in multiple cities around the world and has both the moped which must be parked like a normal motorcycle and their Scoot Kicks electric scooter.

Current cities are San Francisco, Barcelona, Santiago, Austin, etc.

The company believes the future of mobility is shared mobility.

https://scoot.co/#splash-modal

[riviera74]

Hard Pass on "shared mobility".  If I want shared mobility, I will get a bus pass or take a train.

[Robert Hall]

I don't do buses, but I do like trains and light rail...but none of the rail around here is in my suburb or convenient enough to use...so to go places around the metro area I drive myself in my SUV or I Uber it..

Now when I lived in Denver back in the oughts, I used the light rail all the time because I lived in walking distance of a train station out in the burbs.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Robert Hall

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, riviera74 said:

Hard Pass on "shared mobility".  If I want shared mobility, I will get a bus pass or take a train.

Having had years of seeing all the Shared Mobility auto's in Seattle, be it the BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Subaru via Zip Car, etc. they are all trashed as no one really cares cause they do not own it. I had driving around in a damaged or dirty auto.

Bus pass as the company I work for pays for it and will use it to get to and from work till 2024 when the lite rail opens in the north end here and then my express bus will be replaced by the lite rail trains.

Everything else is my own private auto's.

Liking this AI version of Goodyear tires. Very cool concept, now if they can actually deliver on it in maybe 100 years.

 

[oldshurst442]

6 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

Lyriq, Celestiq....hmmmm.    How about Majiq, Majestiq, Mystiq,Chroniq, Iconiq, Ironiq, Taconiq, Moroniq...

We could add Horrifiq to the list, non?

What about  Mis-Teeq as a spelling?

 

Then there is soniq

 

Metalliq   

   (LOVE the song and the melody and the guitars. HATE the lyrics)

 

 

 

Edited March 5, 2020 by oldshurst442

[G. David Felt]

Seems GM is releasing more details after their closed door meeting on their EV product line.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/general-motors-chevy-buick-gmc-hummer-cadillac-electric-vehicles/

Quote on the Battery info:

The 'Ultima' energy-storage solution

Powering this massive EV push is GM's new Ultima battery technology. With a unique chemistry and a special design, they promise greater energy density, easier packaging and lower cost.

A lithium-ion design, Ultima mixes the internal chemistry up a bit, incorporating nickel, manganese, cobalt and aluminum, among other elements into its cathode side, so-called NMCA chemistry. A potential breakthrough, engineers have reduced the cobalt content of these batteries by around 70%, a material that's both pricey and difficult to obtain these days. They've managed to substitute it with aluminum, which is cheaper and far more readily available.

The plan is to offer Ultima batteries in packs with capacities ranging from 50 to 200 kilowatt hours. This is projected to give vehicles an estimated maximum driving range of up to 400 miles. Depending on vehicle type, this can enable acceleration from 0 to 60 mph in as little as 3 seconds.

Level II and DC fast-charging are both supported. Most of GM's upcoming EVs will feature battery packs that operate at 400 volts, however, its truck platform will run at twice that much and support 350-kW fast charging.

 

[Robert Hall]

3 minutes ago, dfelt said:

  Depending on vehicle type, this can enable acceleration from 0 to 60 mph in as little as 3 seconds.

Maybe the Camaro will be reborn as a performance EV coupe and convertible...and Cadillac will get a plaid-mode EV-series performance sedan to take on the Model S.  I know GM is fixated on CUVs, SUVs and trucks, but with this shift to EVs they need variety...

Edited March 5, 2020 by Robert Hall

[oldshurst442]

Beating a dead horse...( but I could do this ALL night)

Romantiq 

(I had a hard time choosing which song Id post...so Ill post both!)

Talking in your sleep would be the first song I heard and liked from them but I like both songs equally)

 

 

Chiq 

Some Disco and Cadillac is now complete and well represented! 

 

[G. David Felt]

26 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Maybe the Camaro will be reborn as a performance EV coupe and convertible...and Cadillac will get a plaid-mode EV-series performance sedan to take on the Model S.  I know GM is fixated on CUVs, SUVs and trucks, but with this shift to EVs they need variety...

I loved the fact that the Trucks will get the 800 volt system for XFC or extrem fast charging of the battery pack. Not sure why they will not do the 350 kW XFC charging on everything right from the start. That is a head scratcher for me. ?