Chevrolet News:Corvette C8 Almost Sold Out Already

[surreal1272]

11 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Another angle to the no manual detail is they didn't want to a hole in the tunnel...also read there were packaging issues.   Also it's cheaper to only have to engineer one transmission.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/autos-sports/the-real-reason-the-new-c8-corvette-isnt-available-with-a-manual-transmission/ar-AAF1wMm

It doesn’t make much financial sense at all to offer a manual at all since there are only five or six people that can drive a stick these days lol. Once companies like Ferrari and Porsche were cutting them out, the writing was on the wall for cars like the Corvette. 

[G. David Felt]

@Robert Hall @surreal1272 After having searched for and posted the follow up info especially GM's own post about this design from the begining was built with ICE, Hybrid and EV in mind plus with no engine in the front, it left far more room for folks over 6' tall to easily get into and out of, I have to say I am EXCITED ? to actually go and sit in one and maybe even take it for a test drive. If all 6'6" 300 lbs of me can fit, who knows I might just have my first sports car ever.

In response to all the aches and pains we have in our body, as a past life body builder and power lifter, my C1 to C6 are bone on bone and I was given two options, fuse and limit my quality of life, or workout and stay strong for life as to why I am a daily work out man in the GYM. I can still ski and pretty much do everything I want as long as I keep my CORE strong. 

I can tell when I take more than a day off from lifting so for me lifting / cardio is 5 to 6 days a week with a single down day for recovery.

I do not plan to ever retire in the baby boomer sense of retirement, but am sure I will have a different type of job by the time I am 70. Hope I can have a sporty ride in those silver years, that would be very cool.

I have to say that my favorite corvette was the Stingray from Corvette Summer, the movie 1978.

But now I am really liking this C8, grows on me more and more every day. I can understand why it would sell out especially if they end up going hybrid / EV, then these first few ICE models will be real collectors editions.

 

[ocnblu]

3 hours ago, dfelt said:

I can understand why it would sell out especially if they end up going hybrid / EV, then these first few ICE models will be real collectors editions.

Oh, once it loses its soul, sales WILL taper off.

Edited July 31, 2019 by ocnblu

[ccap41]

13 hours ago, surreal1272 said:

Again, in case you missed it the first time, it is a Corvette, regardless of the aftermarket job on it, so it is not irrelevant to discussions about the  Corvette. The same would apply to the Escape if it something brought up on a thread about the Escape. You’re just grasping at straws for some reason and making up your own criteria for what you find interesting (like your C8 example. It doesn’t make the mention of an EV C7 any less irrelevant. The point here is that this is a Vette article and it is not irrelevant to bring up other Vette models, aftermarket or otherwise. 

To each their own. I find it completely irrelevant and that's okay. You find it relevant and that's okay. 

13 hours ago, Robert Hall said:

Also it's cheaper to only have to engineer one transmission.

There it is. It's CHEAPER. 

[G. David Felt]

@Robert Hall @surreal1272 I honestly would NOT say it is cheaper to do a Manual transmission any longer, but that form of transmission is so inefficient and the lack of interest by the bulk of society to drive a manual with the advent of paddle shifters thanks to F1 driving has moved society to want something that is even faster.

I rarely have seen manuals at the drag strip here in washington any more, usually more of an older sports car on open day when folks can drag their auto against anyone. There is also real talent needed if you were to drive a paddle shift corvette just like a manual. I think many who feel you have to have a manual transmission just have not had a chance to really learn to drive paddle shift auto's.

I relate this to those that felt putting a manual on the floor was a terrible idea compared to the 3 on the tree design that I first learned to drive on. The more technology changes, the better things get, clinging to the past is how one dies early in the business world.

I honestly doubt other than a few I can count on one hand that the bulk of folks here at C&G would want to drive a modern day auto with 3 on the tree or a 4 speed manual especially if you live in a city of hills like San Francisco. 

[Robert Hall]

I've never experienced a column shift manual, but learned to drive with a typical '80s 5spd floor shift manual.  I've owned cars w/ 4 and 5 speed manuals,  would like to own something with a modern 6 speed manual...I still enjoy driving w/ a manual on occasion.   But in the real world grind an automatic is fine.  Never got into the flappy paddle thing, my Jeep has them but I don't see any point.  Maybe a sports car with a DCT and flappy paddles could be fun, though. 

Edited July 31, 2019 by Robert Hall

[Drew Dowdell]

5 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

I've never experienced a column shift manual, but learned to drive with a typical '80s 5spd floor shift manual.  I've owned cars w/ 4 and 5 speed manuals,  would like to own something with a modern 6 speed manual...I still enjoy driving w/ a manual on occasion.   But in the real world grind an automatic is fine.  Never got into the flappy paddle thing, my Jeep has them but I don't see any point.  Maybe something with a DCT and flappy paddles could be fun. 

Functionally, a DCT is just a really fast automatic. 

[Robert Hall]

1 minute ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Functionally, a DCT is just a really fast automatic. 

But different from an ordinary automatic w/ flappy paddles.  

[Drew Dowdell]

Just now, Robert Hall said:

But different from an ordinary automatic w/ flappy paddles.  

not really, just faster at shifting. 

I wonder what ever happened to GM's "No Lift Shift" that they had on the Cobalt, ATS-V, and CTS-V?  I wonder if the CT4-V and CT5-V will have it. 

On the manual shifter on the C8, I think they expected the take rate to be very low that they didn't want to bother with the engineering and certifications. 

 

[riviera74]

RIP to the manual transmission.  Died because of lack of interest by car buyers.

[Potluck]

Because they want to text and drive. 

[ccap41]

52 minutes ago, dfelt said:

There is also real talent needed if you were to drive a paddle shift corvette just like a manual.

Bull. Sh!t.

Not even comparable.

[G. David Felt]

8 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Bull. Sh!t.

Not even comparable.

Agree to disagree, you should try racing someone and see how you drive it and hit redline shifting up and down. Driving takes skill period and to drive a manual or paddle shifting to optimize power, torque and turn in a consistent time, does take skill.

[ccap41]

I've driven both and there is absolutely no way it takes the same level of skill to drive an auto as a manual. 

I actually didn't think I would ever see the day where somebody would actually say that it takes the same amount of skill to flip a paddle as it does to bang through gears in a manual transmission. 

[ykX]

Driving fast well takes a lot of skill, driving fast with manual transmission takes more skill than with automatic, period.  Try to do all the correct steering and brake inputs while correctly doing heel and toe shifting...

Having said that, and being a big manual fan (I drive manual daily too), I think it was a good decision to make C8 auto only.  Not only from financial stand point and the hull integrity point, but also as a high level performance car that is going to compete with exotics but cost enough for many people to actually take it to a track. 

The good news is IMO, that it comes with DCT, which I think is the best compromise between manual and auto transmissions.  I think it is probably the future for sports cars.

Edited July 31, 2019 by ykX

[Drew Dowdell]

1 hour ago, dfelt said:

Agree to disagree, you should try racing someone and see how you drive it and hit redline shifting up and down. Driving takes skill period and to drive a manual or paddle shifting to optimize power, torque and turn in a consistent time, does take skill.

Now try doing all of that with two feet and three pedals instead of one foot and two pedals.  It definitely takes more skill and coordination to do.  I can drive a stick, but I'm not as good on the track with one as I am with an auto. 

[G. David Felt]

14 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Now try doing all of that with two feet and three pedals instead of one foot and two pedals.  It definitely takes more skill and coordination to do.  I can drive a stick, but I'm not as good on the track with one as I am with an auto. 

I get what you all say and yes 2 feet, 3 pedals will always challenge humans. Yet there is more to driving than just that and paddle driving brings in a different way of driving is all I am saying and still shifting up and down while driving will always offer challenges along with so many other inputs.

[Drew Dowdell]

28 minutes ago, dfelt said:

I get what you all say and yes 2 feet, 3 pedals will always challenge humans. Yet there is more to driving than just that and paddle driving brings in a different way of driving is all I am saying and still shifting up and down while driving will always offer challenges along with so many other inputs.

Sorry... but just no.  The extra coordination required is why the automatic has taken over from the manual.

[FAPTurbo]

6 hours ago, Potluck said:

Because they want to text and drive. 

amateurs. i learned to text and drive with a manual just fine. 

[ocnblu]

1 hour ago, FAPTurbo said:

amateurs. i learned to text and drive with a manual just fine. 

What's the name of the manual, "Driving And Texting For Dummies"?

[Robert Hall]

I learned to drive before cell phones or cupholders.  In olden days, i remember trying to drink coffee and eat a bagel while driving in a car w/ a manual..

[smk4565]

Manuals are dead, automatics shift faster, get better gas mileage, etc.  Total waste of money to engineer a vehicle to take a manual, and to design a manual transmission to put in it. 

[surreal1272]

8 hours ago, dfelt said:

Agree to disagree, you should try racing someone and see how you drive it and hit redline shifting up and down. Driving takes skill period and to drive a manual or paddle shifting to optimize power, torque and turn in a consistent time, does take skill.

Yeah, I’m with the others here. It takes far more hand/foot to eye coordination to sling a manual around the track than literally any other transmission currently made. Paddle shifters are literally child’s play compared to manuals and I also have driven both while literally being raised on a manual. 

[G. David Felt]

I hear ya all, paddle shifters and automatics are no more challenging to each other and manual is still even more challenging than that, got it.  

[ykX]

10 hours ago, smk4565 said:

Manuals are dead, automatics shift faster, get better gas mileage, etc.  Total waste of money to engineer a vehicle to take a manual, and to design a manual transmission to put in it. 

Technically that might be true, but changing gears by yourself while driving on a curvy road on a nice sunny day in a nice sports car is one of the greatest pleasures a car ENTHUSIAST can have. 

Only a small fraction of sports car buyers actually take their cars to a track or care about extra couple seconds.  There is a reason why Porsche, BMW and some other sport car manufacturers go back to offering manual transmission at least on some of their models.

[Robert Hall]

31 minutes ago, ykX said:

Technically that might be true, but changing gears by yourself while driving on a curvy road on a nice sunny day in a nice sports car is one of the greatest pleasures a car ENTHUSIAST can have.  .

Yes..I remember the joys of driving a manual in a past life on winding, twisting hilly Ohio roads and winding, twisting Colorado mountain roads.    It's not about 0-60 or lap times---the numbers mean nothing, it's enjoying the interaction w/ your car and the road. 

[Drew Dowdell]

1 hour ago, ykX said:

Technically that might be true, but changing gears by yourself while driving on a curvy road on a nice sunny day in a nice sports car is one of the greatest pleasures a car ENTHUSIAST can have. 

Only a small fraction of sports car buyers actually take their cars to a track or care about extra couple seconds.  There is a reason why Porsche, BMW and some other sport car manufacturers go back to offering manual transmission at least on some of their models.

There are some cars that need a good manual to really enjoy properly. The BR-Z/86 is one, the Miata/Fiata would be another. I'm sure the Porsches in a similar vein would be also. 

[smk4565]

3 hours ago, ykX said:

Technically that might be true, but changing gears by yourself while driving on a curvy road on a nice sunny day in a nice sports car is one of the greatest pleasures a car ENTHUSIAST can have. 

Only a small fraction of sports car buyers actually take their cars to a track or care about extra couple seconds.  There is a reason why Porsche, BMW and some other sport car manufacturers go back to offering manual transmission at least on some of their models.

Enthusiasts don’t drive the market or determine what gets built.  Crossover buyers and government regulations do.  

Another reason to kill the manual is electric cars are going to replace ICE anyway, government regs will force that in time.

[ccap41]

I truly believe their sales will dip once the bulk of buyers who have been waiting for one get theirs because of the lack of a manual transmission. 

The most recent total sales number breakdown for Corvettes was 2018 model year(as 2019 isn't over yet)

2123 manual transmission sales - 21.9%

7563 auto transmission sales - 78.1%

9686 total 2018 model year Corvettes sold(not sales in 2018). 

https://www.corvetteblogger.com/docs/2018CorvetteFINALYearEnd.pdf

 

[ykX]

46 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Enthusiasts don’t drive the market or determine what gets built.  Crossover buyers and government regulations do.  

Another reason to kill the manual is electric cars are going to replace ICE anyway, government regs will force that in time.

We are talking about sports cars, not crossovers.  You hardly can buy a regular car or crossover with manual transmission now anyway.  Enthusiasts with different budgets buy cars like Miata and 911, so if automaker does make cars like that (and some choose not to, or simply can't afford to) than the automaker has to listen to the enthusiasts.

[smk4565]

Chevy made the right call to go automatic only.  Manual would add to the price, add to the engineering budget then they have to pay to certify it , and then they would sell 50 of them a year and have to discount them when they sit on dealer lots.

[ccap41]

Read above numbers.

The last two entire model years they sold 22% Corvettes with manual transmissions. I'll let you look up 2017. 

If they sold 20% with manual transmissions, that's roughly 3000-6000 per year for the last ten years. 

[ccap41]

Chevy sells more 2-3X more Corvettes with a manual transmission than Mercedes sells AMG GTs in a year. 

Maybe they should get rid of the AMG GT because they sell so few. 

Edited August 1, 2019 by ccap41

[ccap41]

Chevy sells 2-3X more** 

[smk4565]

22 hours ago, ccap41 said:

Chevy sells more 2-3X more Corvettes with a manual transmission than Mercedes sells AMG GTs in a year. 

Maybe they should get rid of the AMG GT because they sell so few. 

I bet the AMG GT outsells the ZR1 that is equal money.  Probably still less money since an AMG GT can go to $200k.

[ccap41]

Chevy has sold 1636 ZR1's to private parties and the car has only been on sale/produced since MARCH. . 

So no, Chevy will still sell more ZR1 trimmed Corvettes than Mercedes will sell AMG GTs.

https://www.corvetteactioncenter.com/specs/c7-corvette/corvette-zr1-registry/

Also, 30% of which are manual transmission. 

As much as I love the AMG GT, the new Vette will whoop it sales-wise and I'd wager money that id would whoop it on a race track as well. 

[ccap41]

On 8/2/2019 at 11:31 AM, ccap41 said:

that it would whoop it on a race track as well. 

Typo correction. 

[G. David Felt]

CNN Just broke with the first pictures of the hard top convertible and I have to say I like what I see. Should also sell well for GM.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/02/cars/2020-corvette-convertible/index.html

I do have to wonder how many dealers will bring in actual base models to have a $59,999 version on the lot. Most dealers seem to bring in mid to fully loaded models only.

[riviera74]

It would be a lot easier and better if customers would order the Corvette of their choice and have it delivered to their nearest Chevy dealer.

[Robert Hall]

I wonder what percentage of Corvette buyers order one vs buy from dealer stock.   

[Robert Hall]

I wonder if the convertible will be available w/ the roof and roof cover pods in body color.  Would look better than the black w/ some colors, IMO. 

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, Robert Hall said:

I wonder if the convertible will be available w/ the roof and roof cover pods in body color.  Would look better than the black w/ some colors, IMO. 

That is a good question as I agree, while Black might look good with the Orange, if I had a green or just possibly any color really some customers might want everything color matched or monochromatic approach.

It also brings up the question, how much of the exterior / interior parts will be natural carbon fiber? I can see from a money making standpoint that they would have a carbon fiber option kit that could replace the wing, the folding hard top and those vent highlights and I am sure other parts with a lite carbon fiber part.

I know some hate the carbon fiber, but I can see a option kit like that.

[Robert Hall]

4 minutes ago, dfelt said:

That is a good question as I agree, while Black might look good with the Orange, if I had a green or just possibly any color really some customers might want everything color matched or monochromatic approach.

It also brings up the question, how much of the exterior / interior parts will be natural carbon fiber? I can see from a money making standpoint that they would have a carbon fiber option kit that could replace the wing, the folding hard top and those vent highlights and I am sure other parts with a lite carbon fiber part.

I know some hate the carbon fiber, but I can see a option kit like that.

Yes, I could see that as an option...lots of customizability is a good thing.   I loathe the look of carbon fiber, but I know some would like it.    If I had a C8, I'd want that brown/bronze w/ a tan interior, monochromatic exterior trim.   Or the dark green w/ a tan interior.   I like subtle dark colors, not Skittles colors.

Edited October 4, 2019 by Robert Hall

[G. David Felt]

10 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

Yes, I could see that as an option...lots of customizability is a good thing.   I loathe the look of carbon fiber, but I know some would like it.    If I had a C8, I'd want that brown/bronze w/ a tan interior, monochromatic exterior trim.   Or the dark green w/ a tan interior.   I like subtle dark colors, not Skittles colors.

I could go with either of those two colors but Tan shows up too much dirt for me, I think I really want the two tone Mocha brown interior. Nice and warm yet not the all black or all tan interior GM has done in the past. Mocha brown with some natural wood accents would be nice IMHO.

[G. David Felt]

@Robert Hall This is a good starting point, just take it up to luxury level for me on a Cadillac truck or SUV.

This is close the Cadillac Kona interior, I just hate the all black dash.

[ccap41]

The Convertible is cool but having a targa top standard is perfect and I'd never consider the convertible. 

On 8/2/2019 at 11:31 AM, ccap41 said:

Chevy has sold 1636 ZR1's to private parties and the car has only been on sale/produced since MARCH. . 

So no, Chevy will still sell more ZR1 trimmed Corvettes than Mercedes will sell AMG GTs.

https://www.corvetteactioncenter.com/specs/c7-corvette/corvette-zr1-registry/

Also, 30% of which are manual transmission. 

As much as I love the AMG GT, the new Vette will whoop it sales-wise and I'd wager money that id would whoop it on a race track as well. 

@smk4565 

Just because I can. ?

[smk4565]

2 hours ago, ccap41 said:

The Convertible is cool but having a targa top standard is perfect and I'd never consider the convertible. 

@smk4565 

Just because I can. ?

Of course the Corvette will outsell the AMG GT, the Corvette is half the money.  As far as racetrack goes, we will see, and the next Generation GT is pretty deep in development, they have some weight savings and I think all wheel drive coming, so we’ll see when they get on track.  I think it would be cool if Mercedes made a mid-engine car that wasn’t $3 million though.

[ccap41]

31 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

Of course the Corvette will outsell the AMG GT, the Corvette is half the money.  As far as racetrack goes, we will see, and the next Generation GT is pretty deep in development, they have some weight savings and I think all wheel drive coming, so we’ll see when they get on track.  I think it would be cool if Mercedes made a mid-engine car that wasn’t $3 million though.

The ZR1 is far from half the money. The ZR1 actually starts MORE than the AMG GT.

ZR1: $123,000

AMG GT: $115,900

It's okay, the C8 is out anyway and ready to put cars twice its price in its rear view mirror. 

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, smk4565 said:

Of course the Corvette will outsell the AMG GT, the Corvette is half the money.  As far as racetrack goes, we will see, and the next Generation GT is pretty deep in development, they have some weight savings and I think all wheel drive coming, so we’ll see when they get on track.  I think it would be cool if Mercedes made a mid-engine car that wasn’t $3 million though.

Are ya sure it is deep in development? Daimler seems to have been stopping everything to reassess if it makes sense to continue selling. I am willing to bet a number of these low volume performance auto's get killed or existing versions are drawn out for awhile to reduce expenditures.

GT is special, but not like the Corvette.

[smk4565]

10 hours ago, ccap41 said:

The ZR1 is far from half the money. The ZR1 actually starts MORE than the AMG GT.

ZR1: $123,000

AMG GT: $115,900

It's okay, the C8 is out anyway and ready to put cars twice its price in its rear view mirror. 

I meant the C8 is half the money.  I think the C8 is great value to get a mid engine car with that level of performance for that price is fantastic.  And if the yet get the top trim the interior seems pretty good with a lot of tech too, not like it is Porsche/Mercedes level interior but Acura level which compare the C8 to an NSX that is double the money and you see why no one buys the NSX.

The issues I would have with the Corvette are Chevrolet dealership/service experience, Chevrolet build quality, Chevrolet brand image.

And Corvette is good at performance but not luxury.  When Mercedes makes a sports car it can’t just go fast, it has to be luxurious and high tech also, if the Corvette was more luxurious than an Escalade Platinum and had Super Cruise where would that price go?  Corvette to AMG GT or 911 is an apples to oranges comparison.