What do you do with T.O.s'? "Turn-overs" at dealerships; not Toronto

[trinacriabob]

Just recently, I went to look at the fresh new car version of a car I have rented.  I wanted to see the sticker, sit in it, check visibility, yada yada.  The kid helping me was really nice and I didn't want to take up much of his time.  He added, "It sounds like you really want to drive this car."  I told him, "Not today."  We unlocked it, I sat in it, turned on the engine, and got a feel for the controls.  I also looked at the trunk.  That was all I needed.  I also took a brochure.

As I'm about to leave, he says, "If you've got a couple of minutes, there's someone I'd like you to meet."  *Cue to leave, in my book*  I told him that I didn't have the time and headed for the door.  It was an obvious turnover in the making.  If someone tries a turnover on me, I will not be buying a car from this individual in the future.  I just leave and it's a closed chapter.

Man, I hate going to the dealerships at night when the car doors are locked and you can't really get a feel for the car and I hate having to wait an entire year between auto shows so I can cut loose like a kid in a candy store, but also have to part with some coin for the hassle free privilege.  What do you do when you visit car dealerships out of curiosity and are subjected to a "turnover?"

 

Edited March 21, 2018 by trinacriabob

[Frisky Dingo]

First, you need to understand the salesman was just doing his job. You don't dictate his job, his Manager does. His Mgr is the one with the authority to discount prices, and he is the one who sets the sales process in place. Nearly every dealership has rules in place for the salesman to check in with management before letting a customer leave. Sometimes they involve the Mgr coming over to talk to you, sometimes they don't. Either way, the salesman has to follow the rules, just like you do at your work. If he doesn't, the Mgr may prevent him from taking any more ups, not give him leads, etc.

My only advice I can give is to tell them up front you are still in the early stages of your process, and that you don't plan on buying anything today. If the salesman needs to get the Mgr before you go, let him do his job. Politely reiterate what you told the salesman to the Mgr. At that point, you should not encounter any resistance in leaving. If you do, that dealer is not a place you want to do business.

If you don't like my suggestion, or the notion that you may have to speak to someone with more seniority than the salesman, than I suggest not going during business hours.

[oldshurst442]

7 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

than I suggest not going during business hours.

I agree 100% with ALL that you said...

Except that quote which I quoted you on...

I agree with the fact that the salesperson is doing his job.  I also agree that the dealership is there solely to sell cars, and that they need to sell cars any which way they see fit...

But...a dealership IS a store.

A dealership IS open DURING BUSINESS hours to ACCEPT POTENTIAL customers.

A POTENTIAL customer SHOULD be ABLE to VISIT a dealership DURING business hours...NOT before or AFTER business hours.

Yes...the salesman NEEDS to sell cars to live and he needs to do his job the way his boss tells him to. We discussed that.

As a potential customer though...

I NEED TO VISIT A DEALERSHIP WITHOUT THE CONSTANT HARASSING IF I WANT TO BUY THE CAR TODAY.

I NEED THE BREATHING ROOM TO SEE FOR MYSELF.

A SIMPLE NO THANX SHOULD BE ENOUGH...

If a dealership thinks that if a potential client leaves the dealership and that dealership equates THAT as a loss of a sale to another dealership...MAYBE THAT dealership should CHANGE the way they do business and leave the 1950s/1960s/1970s/1980s/1990s where they belong. IN THE PAST!!!

 

Yes. Yes. Yes.

I understand that there is a plethora of undetermined, uninformed morons out there that NEED this type of sales tactic even though they say they dont...

But...the salespeople and the managers NEED to IDENTIFY the differences between the many types of buyers...

The dealerships...should invest in TEACHING their salespeople HOW to sell to people in the 21st century.

The DEALERSHIPS need to get together ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY and CHANGE the INDUSTRY around...

INSTEAD OF FIGHTING with the PHOQUING customer...the PHOQUING INDUSTRY NEEDS TO CHANGE THIS! 

NO! Not the CUSTOMER...HE JUST WANTS TO BUY A PHOQUING CAR.

ITS THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE PHOQUING INDUSTRY TO CHANGE...

STOP BLAMING THE CUSTOMER AND PUTTING THE ONUS ON HIM!!! 

 

 

[Robert Hall]

Hadn't heard the term 'turnover' before in this context...when one salesman foists you off on another?      

My last car buying experience (last year w/ my Jeep) was very easy and smooth.  I searched the Phoenix area online for CPO GCs for a week after i decided I wanted to buy, found a couple specific ones at my closest dealer that were the price/mileage/color combo/equipment mix I wanted, went in on a Friday afternoon, pointed out the one I wanted to test drive, looked it over, test drove it, then bought it.   The 31st makes a year. 

[trinacriabob]

5 hours ago, Frisky Dingo said:

First, you need to understand the salesman was just doing his job. You don't dictate his job, his Manager does. His Mgr is the one with the authority to discount prices, and he is the one who sets the sales process in place. Nearly every dealership has rules in place for the salesman to check in with management before letting a customer leave. Sometimes they involve the Mgr coming over to talk to you, sometimes they don't. Either way, the salesman has to follow the rules, just like you do at your work. If he doesn't, the Mgr may prevent him from taking any more ups, not give him leads, etc.

My only advice I can give is to tell them up front you are still in the early stages of your process, and that you don't plan on buying anything today. If the salesman needs to get the Mgr before you go, let him do his job. Politely reiterate what you told the salesman to the Mgr. At that point, you should not encounter any resistance in leaving. If you do, that dealer is not a place you want to do business.

If you don't like my suggestion, or the notion that you may have to speak to someone with more seniority than the salesman, than I suggest not going during business hours.

Yes, I am aware that some dealerships are set up for a "T-O" while others are not.  Right, if these rules come from the top, then the "underling" (regular salesperson) has to follow them.  The timing is perfect here because, today, I looked at my VM and had gotten phone messages from both the salesperson and the sales manager.  The salesman was told that I was only looking, that I was passing through the general area (not that far, so feasible) from an appointment, and that I wasn't buying today.   I even declined driving the car.

I think that I've gotten sort of tired by this tactic.  The two on one pressure doesn't work for me.  I'd be writing the check and it's not a candy bar, so I tell them that.  Comments like "how would you like to drive off in this car today?" have never worked for me.  The absolute "winner" was when I was test sitting in a car in California, the salesman pulled a "T-O," and I got fairly heated with them since I was on vacation, the state in which I was domiciled had NO sales tax, and I asked them how they proposed to get the car to a DMV over the state line so I could purchase it free of  sales tax.   They didn't have a solution.  At this point, with vacation + living in a state without a sales tax combo, I felt I was in my right to tell them they were clueless and drive off.

5 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

As a potential customer though...

I NEED TO VISIT A DEALERSHIP WITHOUT THE CONSTANT HARASSING IF I WANT TO BUY THE CAR TODAY.

I NEED THE BREATHING ROOM TO SEE FOR MYSELF.

A SIMPLE NO THANX SHOULD BE ENOUGH...

 

This.  

I haven't bought many cars because I keep them for as long as I can but I always remember the salesperson who was courteous, informative, not cheesy, and "soft sell," and that's who I go back to give my business to when it comes time to purchase.

[trinacriabob]

2 hours ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

Hadn't heard the term 'turnover' before in this context...when one salesman foists you off on another?      

My last car buying experience (last year w/ my Jeep) was very easy and smooth.  I searched the Phoenix area online for CPO GCs for a week after i decided I wanted to buy, found a couple specific ones at my closest dealer that were the price/mileage/color combo/equipment mix I wanted, went in on a Friday afternoon, pointed out the one I wanted to test drive, looked it over, test drove it, then bought it.   The 31st makes a year. 

Yes, though "T-O" implies up a level in the pecking order.

With my current car, I found the car in the on-line inventory at a particular dealership, talked to the internet sales manager, and he quoted me a price right over the phone, which he stuck to.  The only glitch was that they wanted to sell me a different company's extended warranty while I wanted the one from General Motors.  They saw that the sale wouldn't go through unless it was the GM warranty product so they somehow managed to "find" the binder with the GM extended warranty information.  I never ended up using it.  Ditto with my previous GM car.  I guess that's good.

[trinacriabob]

14 hours ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

Hadn't heard the term 'turnover' before in this context...when one salesman foists you off on another?      

My last car buying experience (last year w/ my Jeep) was very easy and smooth.  I searched the Phoenix area online for CPO GCs for a week after i decided I wanted to buy, found a couple specific ones at my closest dealer that were the price/mileage/color combo/equipment mix I wanted, went in on a Friday afternoon, pointed out the one I wanted to test drive, looked it over, test drove it, then bought it.   The 31st makes a year. 

Did it have an advertised price that you knew of up front and that was in the ball park?  And was there are any unpleasant and prolonged haggling over the price? 

I think that the experience is always more pleasant when one is actively looking and ready to purchase, as you describe you were doing.

It's annoying when they want to push an information gathering episode into a candy bar impulse purchase, and when the person they're pushing is better at penciling through things than they are.  That's the rub.

[Robert Hall]

1 minute ago, trinacriabob said:

Did it have an advertised price that you knew of up front and that was in the ball park?  And was there are any unpleasant and prolonged haggling over the price? 

I think that the experience is always more pleasant when one is actively looking and ready to purchase, as you describe you were doing.

It's annoying when they want to push an information gathering episode into a candy bar impulse purchase, and when the person they're pushing is better at penciling through things than they are.  That's the rub.

They had the internet price, and then the price on the windshield which was higher.  I got it for the internet price, which was pretty spot on for a CPO '14 Limited 4x4 V6 w/ 25k miles--based on comparisons w/ others listed in Az and So Cal. 

[Frisky Dingo]

On 3/24/2018 at 6:07 PM, oldshurst442 said:

I agree 100% with ALL that you said...

Except that quote which I quoted you on...

I agree with the fact that the salesperson is doing his job.  I also agree that the dealership is there solely to sell cars, and that they need to sell cars any which way they see fit...

But...a dealership IS a store.

A dealership IS open DURING BUSINESS hours to ACCEPT POTENTIAL customers.

A POTENTIAL customer SHOULD be ABLE to VISIT a dealership DURING business hours...NOT before or AFTER business hours.

Yes...the salesman NEEDS to sell cars to live and he needs to do his job the way his boss tells him to. We discussed that.

As a potential customer though...

I NEED TO VISIT A DEALERSHIP WITHOUT THE CONSTANT HARASSING IF I WANT TO BUY THE CAR TODAY.

I NEED THE BREATHING ROOM TO SEE FOR MYSELF.

A SIMPLE NO THANX SHOULD BE ENOUGH...

If a dealership thinks that if a potential client leaves the dealership and that dealership equates THAT as a loss of a sale to another dealership...MAYBE THAT dealership should CHANGE the way they do business and leave the 1950s/1960s/1970s/1980s/1990s where they belong. IN THE PAST!!!

 

Yes. Yes. Yes.

I understand that there is a plethora of undetermined, uninformed morons out there that NEED this type of sales tactic even though they say they dont...

But...the salespeople and the managers NEED to IDENTIFY the differences between the many types of buyers...

The dealerships...should invest in TEACHING their salespeople HOW to sell to people in the 21st century.

The DEALERSHIPS need to get together ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY and CHANGE the INDUSTRY around...

INSTEAD OF FIGHTING with the PHOQUING customer...the PHOQUING INDUSTRY NEEDS TO CHANGE THIS! 

NO! Not the CUSTOMER...HE JUST WANTS TO BUY A PHOQUING CAR.

ITS THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE PHOQUING INDUSTRY TO CHANGE...

STOP BLAMING THE CUSTOMER AND PUTTING THE ONUS ON HIM!!! 

 

 

 

I'm not going to argue with you. Instead, I will reiterate my point-

 

If you do not like the idea of having to speak to someone who is doing their job, don't go while said person is there, ie- while the establishment is closed.

 

You can try to reason around that all you want, but if go to a place of business while they are open, employees there are going to do their job. That's just the way it is. If you can't accept that, don't go there while they are open.

[G. David Felt]

12 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

 

I'm not going to argue with you. Instead, I will reiterate my point-

 

If you do not like the idea of having to speak to someone who is doing their job, don't go while said person is there, ie- while the establishment is closed.

 

You can try to reason around that all you want, but if go to a place of business while they are open, employees there are going to do their job. That's just the way it is. If you can't accept that, don't go there while they are open.

I will say that I have always set the ground rules when I visit a dealership. I tell the salesperson right up front what I want to do, how I want to do it and the space I need to do it.

I no longer feel harassed as I make the rules very clear and if they break them, I move onto another dealership. Many options for buying an auto out there and if one dealership is a PITA, move on and give your money to the place that will respect you and earn it.

[Frisky Dingo]

2 minutes ago, dfelt said:

I will say that I have always set the ground rules when I visit a dealership. I tell the salesperson right up front what I want to do, how I want to do it and the space I need to do it.

I no longer feel harassed as I make the rules very clear and if they break them, I move onto another dealership. Many options for buying an auto out there and if one dealership is a PITA, move on and give your money to the place that will respect you and earn it.

 

Which is precisely what I advised in my first post. 

[ccap41]

On 3/21/2018 at 4:54 PM, trinacriabob said:

Man, I hate going to the dealerships at night when the car doors are locked and you can't really get a feel for the car and I hate having to wait an entire year between auto shows so I can cut loose like a kid in a candy store, but also have to part with some coin for the hassle free privilege.  What do you do when you visit car dealerships out of curiosity and are subjected to a "turnover?"

I couldn't agree with this any more! 

On 3/24/2018 at 6:07 PM, oldshurst442 said:

A SIMPLE NO THANX SHOULD BE ENOUGH...

It never is a a dealership..sadly.. I've almost never had a true "hassle free" experience at a car dealership. 

[trinacriabob]

The issue is that the ground rules have been stated (I state them upon beginning to speak to a salesperson) and they then proceed to break them because that's the way they've been trained or it's their protocol.  It sounds like a conflict of interests between what the customer wants and the dealership wants from the get-go. 

The absolute worst, as I mentioned above, is when you're out of town (and you tell them you're from out of town and just looking with no intention to buy) and you go into a dealership, perhaps near your hotel, and they pull this crap. 

[ccap41]

It's very difficult to sit in a car when the dealership is closed.. just say'n. 

[Frisky Dingo]

24 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

It's very difficult to sit in a car when the dealership is closed.. just say'n. 

 

Right, but the flip side to this is why do you need to sit in a car you have no interest in buying?

[ccap41]

Why wouldn't somebody want to sit in something they might buy in the next year?

 Instead of being like "most" people and not properly planning large purchases, one decides to plan out a 5 year, $20-50,000 purchase, and it's odd that they'd want to check something out ahead of time? 

Seems like they're trying to be responsible and instead are hassled because that's what dealerships do, most of the time. 

[Robert Hall]

I remember in olden days, car dealerships were closed on Sundays and you could drive around the lot after hours and look at cars up close...and in small towns, the used cars on the lot were often unlocked.    Nowadays, car dealers tend to be open 7 days a week and have gates so when they are closed, you can't drive on the lot. 

I do agree w/ being able to sit in and check out a vehicle up close if it's something you plan to consider buying.  As far as my GC purchase, I'd sat in the Wk2 GCs at new car shows in the past, studied them online quite a bit, rode in a coworker's '14, and having owned an older GC for almost 17 years, I knew pretty much I wanted another GC with some specific options (sunroof, CD player, nav, light leather interior, towing package, V6, 4x4, etc).

Edited March 26, 2018 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[Frisky Dingo]

1 minute ago, ccap41 said:

Why wouldn't somebody want to sit in something they might buy in the next year?

 Instead of being like "most" people and not properly planning large purchases, one decides to plan out a 5 year, $20-50,000 purchase, and it's odd that they'd want to check something out ahead of time? 

Seems like they're trying to be responsible and instead are hassled because that's what dealerships do, most of the time. 

 

If you are a year away from buying something, you have absolutely NO place on a dealer lot other than for service or to buy parts. Don't even try to pull that BS line as an argument. You don't have to worry about me pressuring you for a sale, anyone who tells me they are a year away from buying I cordially give them a card and tell them to have a nice day. I, and any other good salesman have less than 0 interest in wasting time with someone who is a year away from buying a car.

[ccap41]

2 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

 

If you are a year away from buying something, you have absolutely NO place on a dealer lot other than for service or to buy parts. Don't even try to pull that BS line as an argument. You don't have to worry about me pressuring you for a sale, anyone who tells me they are a year away from buying I cordially give them a card and tell them to have a nice day. I, and any other good salesman have less than 0 interest in wasting time with someone who is a year away from buying a car.

That's just a dick thing to even think. 

Somebody shouldn't go to a dealership unless they're looking to purchase immediately. GTFO with that crap. 

[Robert Hall]

4 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

 

If you are a year away from buying something, you have absolutely NO place on a dealer lot other than for service or to buy parts. Don't even try to pull that BS line as an argument. You don't have to worry about me pressuring you for a sale, anyone who tells me they are a year away from buying I cordially give them a card and tell them to have a nice day. I, and any other good salesman have less than 0 interest in wasting time with someone who is a year away from buying a car.

A salesman with a shitty attitude like that should just GFT...

[ccap41]

And they wonder why people hate salesmen? 

[Frisky Dingo]

40 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

That's just a dick thing to even think. 

Somebody shouldn't go to a dealership unless they're looking to purchase immediately. GTFO with that crap. 

 

See, in your haste to be defensive, you are now putting words in my mouth. Point to where I said you should only go if you are about to purchase immediately. I'll wait.

39 minutes ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

A salesman with a shitty attitude like that should just GFT...

 

It's not a shitty attitude. It's customers being shitty and wasting someone's time.

 

37 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

And they wonder why people hate salesmen? 

 

And customers wonder why salesmen hate them?

 

Two way street buddy.

[Robert Hall]

10 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

 

It's not a shitty attitude. It's customers being shitty and wasting someone's time.

 

Of what value is the salesman's time? They exist to serve customers.    And the customer's time is usually way more valuable than some sales resource...

Edited March 26, 2018 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[Frisky Dingo]

7 minutes ago, Cubical-aka-Moltar said:

Of what value is the salesman's time? They exist to serve customers.    And the customer's time is usually way more valuable than some sales resource...

 

That's a real shitty way of looking at something. And you want to make salesmen out to be bad guys. You don't even care about the fact you are wasting their time that they could be spending with a serious customer. And you know....getting paid. Which is why they have a job.

 

And the customer's time must not be that important, because it's a waste of it, too. 

[trinacriabob]

Two things:

1.  If told up front, the salesperson CAN give you a card, invite you to look around, ask if you have questions, and ask you for your business when you are ready to buy.  That said, I don't buy without having test driven what I intend to buy via a rental of at least 100 miles.  That's how it was with my last 3 cars. 

2.  I almost could see buying a place to live (#1 purchase) more quickly than buying a car (#2 purchase).  The amount of time required of the salesperson in #1 is a lot more involved than for #2 and they need to have passed a test to sell property.  Also, it probably won't depreciate.  As for a property, you can walk around the outside and almost preview the floor plan just from how the windows and doors are laid out.  The few times I've done it, I walked around and walked around the outside and got a good gut feel and, after seeing it inside, which was no surprise, that was it.

[ccap41]

1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

If you are a year away from buying something, you have absolutely NO place on a dealer lot other than for service or to buy parts.

There.

I also said 'in the next year' meaning maybe a month, maybe 6 months, or maybe a year.  You took that at the maximum the same way I took what you said at the extreme. 

[Robert Hall]

Personally, if I could arrange the financing and work out the terms w/ a dealer online and have the car delivered to my house, that would be ideal..   I admit, I generally don't like sales people..In my experience, they seem generally to be not knowledgable about the product and kind of sleazy.   I wouldn't talk to a sales resource when buying a refrigerator, washer, TV, computer, so why with a car...

Edited March 26, 2018 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[ccap41]

The salesmans' job is to literally serve the customer the same way a waiter is there to serve the customer at a restaurant. Too bad we can't tip car salesmen based on their performance. Instead they try and get as much from us as possible. 

You be a kiss ass because that's your job. If you don't like the service industry, get a different job. Otherwise, continue to kiss ass. 

[Frisky Dingo]

2 minutes ago, trinacriabob said:

Two things:

1.  If told up front, the salesperson CAN give you a card, invite you to look around, ask if you have questions, and ask you for your business when you are ready to buy.  That said, I don't buy without having test driven what I intend to buy via a rental of at least 100 miles.  That's how it was with my last 3 cars. 

2.  I almost could see buying a place to live (#1 purchase) more quickly than buying a car (#2 purchase).  The amount of time required of the salesperson in #1 is a lot more involved than for #2 and they need to have passed a test to sell property.  Also, it probably won't depreciate.  As for a property, you can walk around the outside and almost preview the floor plan just from how the windows and doors are laid out.  The few times I've done it, I walked around and walked around the outside and got a good gut feel and, after seeing it inside, which was no surprise, that was it.

 

1. That was my exact point. Any no reasonable person should expect someone to buy a car without having driven it. In fact, it is detrimental to the process, not an advantage. Your idea of renting one for a bit is an extremely good idea that more people should take advantage of. Even if you like the vehicle on a test drive, there could be some issue you discover after the fact that could possibly have been illuminated by renting such a car prior to purchase.

 

2. I'm not sure how this pertains to the topic. Of course they put in more time. There are much more documents, more things to be done, etc, etc. They are also much better compensated in general. All that said, I think just like with buying a vehicle, many people overthink home buying and make things more difficult than they need to be.

6 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

There.

I also said 'in the next year' meaning maybe a month, maybe 6 months, or maybe a year.  You took that at the maximum the same way I took what you said at the extreme. 

 

Yeah, in addition to being a prick today, you must have lost your ability to read, as I clearly said, "If you are a year away....."

 

I simply pointed out something that people do that is part of the problem they so readily complain about. You don't like salesmen, don't like dealerships, whatever, don't go to them until you're almost ready to buy! Wow, what a concept!

 

If you are a month away, that's totally different.

[Frisky Dingo]

7 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

The salesmans' job is to literally serve the customer the same way a waiter is there to serve the customer at a restaurant. Too bad we can't tip car salesmen based on their performance. Instead they try and get as much from us as possible. 

You be a kiss ass because that's your job. If you don't like the service industry, get a different job. Otherwise, continue to kiss ass. 

 

Being in the service industry is not about kissing ass. Regardless of it you are a waiter, a car salesman, whatever. 

You are either now just being hateful or, if that is truly your real outlook on people who hold these jobs, you're a fack1ng @ssh0le.

[ykX]

15 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

The salesmans' job is to literally serve the customer the same way a waiter is there to serve the customer at a restaurant. Too bad we can't tip car salesmen based on their performance. Instead they try and get as much from us as possible. 

You be a kiss ass because that's your job. If you don't like the service industry, get a different job. Otherwise, continue to kiss ass. 

I don't want a car salesman or for that matter a waiter to "kiss my ass".  I think that is a distorted point of view on their job. 

I just don't want them to try to screw me up in the case of a car salesman.  Unfortunately,  there is a fair amount of dishonest salesmen that cause  a bad perception of the general public.  But being in a service industry or just being in the job working with people is very tough. 

[ccap41]

14 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

Yeah, in addition to being a prick today, you must have lost your ability to read, as I clearly said, "If you are a year away....."

 

I simply pointed out something that people do that is part of the problem they so readily complain about. You don't like salesmen, don't like dealerships, whatever, don't go to them until you're almost ready to buy! Wow, what a concept!

 

If you are a month away, that's totally different.

And being forced to avoid them is a pretty big problem. Not wanting to deal with a dealership because the majority of salesmen are jackasses shouldn't be a thing we should have to deal with when preparing to spend tens of thousands of dollars AND put money in their pocket. 

 

9 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

Being in the service industry is not about kissing ass. Regardless of it you are a waiter, a car salesman, whatever. 

You are either now just being hateful or, if that is truly your real outlook on people who hold these jobs, you're a fack1ng @ssh0le.

1: I've been in the service industry and you do kiss ass plenty. 2: we're actually putting money in the pockets of the salesmen via commissions, maybe they should be a little less dickish and a little more kiss assish. 

Just because somebody isn't buying within a month doesn't mean you shouldn't try and buy that customers' attention and when they do purchase they have somebody they actually like and may refer somebody else to. 

Just now, ykX said:

I don't want a car salesman or for that matter a waiter to "kiss my ass".  I think that is a distorted point of view on their job. 

Then rephrase that as "not be a douche". 

[Frisky Dingo]

2 minutes ago, ykX said:

I don't want a car salesman or for that matter a waiter to "kiss my ass".  I think that is a distorted point of view on their job. 

I just don't want them to try to screw me up in the case of a car salesman.  Unfortunately,  there is a fair amount of dishonest salesmen that cause  a bad perception of the general public.  But being in a service industry or just being in the job working with people is very tough. 

 

Exactly.

 

When I go to a nice restaurant, I don't want my waiter to kiss my ass. I want GOOD SERVICE. Those are NOT the same things.

[Frisky Dingo]

7 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

And being forced to avoid them is a pretty big problem. Not wanting to deal with a dealership because the majority of salesmen are jackasses shouldn't be a thing we should have to deal with when preparing to spend tens of thousands of dollars AND put money in their pocket. 

 

1: I've been in the service industry and you do kiss ass plenty. 2: we're actually putting money in the pockets of the salesmen via commissions, maybe they should be a little less dickish and a little more kiss assish. 

Just because somebody isn't buying within a month doesn't mean you shouldn't try and buy that customers' attention and when they do purchase they have somebody they actually like and may refer somebody else to. 

Then rephrase that as "not be a douche". 

 

You are contradicting yourself.

 

Topic starts by essentially complaining about overbearing salesmen. 

 

I say I don't waste my time on someone who is a year away from buying. And that person shouldn't even be at a dealership yet. Because they are wasting their own time, too. And they are putting themselves in the very situation they claim to dislike.

 

You lose your mind.

[ccap41]

You also said to go when salesmen aren't around. How does one sit in a vehicle without a salesman around? Then they're not supposed to sit in something because they're wasting your time because you don't want to assist somebody who isn't buying within a month. 

Salesmen, generally, suck. Not all, but most. I've dealt with good ones and I've dealt with ones trying to add on everything and go back and forth on prices and talking to people and making it all a sh!t experience. 

[Frisky Dingo]

24 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

You also said to go when salesmen aren't around. How does one sit in a vehicle without a salesman around? Then they're not supposed to sit in something because they're wasting your time because you don't want to assist somebody who isn't buying within a month. 

Salesmen, generally, suck. Not all, but most. I've dealt with good ones and I've dealt with ones trying to add on everything and go back and forth on prices and talking to people and making it all a sh!t experience. 

 

Yes, I said to do that as a last resort. If you want a 100% guarantee you won't have to talk to a salesman, go when the dealership is closed. I don't think that's too difficult to understand.

Also, if you don't like talking to salesmen, don't go a year before you plan on buying. I didn't think that one would be hard to understand, either.

For anyone but those with the most hectic schedule, the car buying process should take no more than a few weeks at max. Decide what you can spend, what your needs/wants are, and do some research to see what vehicles fit the bill. Compile a short list of prospects, go look at them and drive them. Once you've done so, pick one you like the most. It's not freaking rocket science. 

If you are shopping cars 6-12 months before buying and/or going to look at a car multiple times- ie, once to see it, once to drive it, etc- and complaining about dealing with salesmen/managers, you are just making it difficult on yourself. 

[A Horse With No Name]

I find the phrase "I am just killing time here for twenty minutes until I pick up my wife" to work very well at letting a potential salesman know I am not interested in a car today.

I can politely decline telemarketers, people interested in sex (fewer than I would like for the purposes of ego), religious proselytizers, door to door people working to elect candidates, and any other request for whatever.  Just stating your intentions and not being a D$#% will work wonders.

Also, if you want...go when you know they are slow and if you want a salesman's time for questions they are generous.  Go look on a rainy Tuesday morning at the beginning of the month.  Chances are you will find a showroom full of bored sales people who will be more than willing to answer questions.

My only problem is finding people with decent project knowledge when I do go look.

[Robert Hall]

When I bought my Jeep, I went on the last day of the month, on a Friday.  The dealership was pretty busy, but that would be expected as it is the largest FCA dealer in Arizona.  I made it clear to the salesman I was there to buy that day and buy the specific vehicle I had the website open to on my phone.   Stating you intentions clearly up front helps as in any transaction.   Now if I had just been casually browsing, I probably would gone about 9 am on a Sunday (which I did a couple times before just to check out their Jeep selection).   

I had been thinking for a few months (after buying my house in Ohio and  while traveling back and forth moving) about buying another car, my old Jeep was on its last legs and probably wouldn't have made the drive to Ohio..so I really needed to buy something in a specific time window, before making my run from exile in the desert...I had spent a lot of time online researching GCs, CPOs, etc.  I didn't waste anytime asking the salesman any product specs or maintenance history questions because I had done my homework and had already pulled the CAR FAX and Chrysler build data sheet by VIN. 

 

Edited March 26, 2018 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[ccap41]

19 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

If you are shopping cars 6-12 months before buying and/or going to look at a car multiple times- ie, once to see it, once to drive it, etc- and complaining about dealing with salesmen/managers, you are just making it difficult on yourself. 

That's what shouldn't be difficult though. 

You're planning the next 5 years and tens of thousands of dollars, to piss down the drain, and it's being frowned upon to plan it all out and make sure you buy exactly what you want... 

[Frisky Dingo]

6 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I find the phrase "I am just killing time here for twenty minutes until I pick up my wife" to work very well at letting a potential salesman know I am not interested in a car today.

I can politely decline telemarketers, people interested in sex (fewer than I would like for the purposes of ego), religious proselytizers, door to door people working to elect candidates, and any other request for whatever.  Just stating your intentions and not being a D$#% will work wonders.

Also, if you want...go when you know they are slow and if you want a salesman's time for questions they are generous.  Go look on a rainy Tuesday morning at the beginning of the month.  Chances are you will find a showroom full of bored sales people who will be more than willing to answer questions.

My only problem is finding people with decent project knowledge when I do go look.

 

I would much prefer to hear someone say that than to tell me they are looking at cars and plan to buy entire seasons or years from now.

You're a car guy and just want to walk around and check stuff out, go for it. As long as we aren't busy, and you're cool, I might even might even shoot the breeze with you, open a hood, start something up, etc.

But if you are even remotely close to a year away from buying a car, you're wasting EVERYONE'S time, not just the salesman's. The used car isn't going to be there anymore, and the new car probably won't be the same price. Best case scenario. Barring that, you could die, get fired, win the lottery, or be the recipient of a million other factors that greatly change your buying window, what you spend, and what you spend it on.

I have people tell me they are looking for cars for when their 14yo turns 16, for cripes sake. That's just completely stupid.

 

 

And to touch on your bolded part, I know plenty of salesmen with projects!! Lol. 

5 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

That's what shouldn't be difficult though. 

You're planning the next 5 years and tens of thousands of dollars, to piss down the drain, and it's being frowned upon to plan it all out and make sure you buy exactly what you want... 

 

Oh, please. Nobody here is advocating buying something you don't want or even not putting careful consideration into what you buy. But all of your budgeting should have been done long before you ever step foot on a dealer parking lot. If it still takes you several months to pick out a car from there, then yeah, absolutely you are making it difficult for yourself. After all, you buyers' time is so much more valuable than salesmen's. 

[trinacriabob]

Buying a car can be completely random, though.  I like to plan it out in advance while sometimes you have to buy a car, either because you need to replace one immediately or your dream second car snuck up on you in a manner that you can't look the other way.  The latter is how my Dad, and thus my family, owned its first Pontiac. 

Being in sales in no way guarantees a 1:1 relationship between customer:closed sale.  That's why being in sales isn't for most people and they shouldn't have unrealistic expectations.  Also, the stronger the personality they're dealing with, the more likely the person they're pitching to is likely to walk away if the terms or the general situation doesn't suit them.

[oldshurst442]

1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

so much more valuable than salesmen's. 

That would NOT be the consumer's fault...

THAT would be how your PAY structure is formed...

Like I said, the industry needs to change. If you are getting paid ONLY if you sell a car...take it up with your industry. 

I read about the part where the conversation lead to the service industry...

YOUR job as a salesman IS to service everybody that comes in to your dealership. 

If I wanna take 1 year to look at cars THEN to buy....lit is MY right to do so as a consumer...

YOU say its a waste of time for a salesman to cater to folk like that?

If YOUR industry PAID you by the hour, if YOUR industry  PREPARED YOU to SELL cars PROPERLY, if YOUR industry COMPENSATED YOU like YOU deserve and NOT like a piece of meat, if YOUR industry TREATED YOU like a PROFESSIONAL than MAYBE consumers would TREAT YOU like professionals too...

Instead what we got...is salesmen looking at consumers like THEY are the problem like shyte you just told us...

1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

I have people tell me they are looking for cars for when their 14yo turns 16, for cripes sake. That's just completely stupid.

 

YEAH!

There are some cars that DO NOT change in 2 years...

Sure, the kid's opinions on what kind of car he like to own WILL change, but you know what? 

The more cars you see, the more you know what YOU LIKE!

A dealership IS A STORE!!!

FIRST AND FOREMOST!!!

Who are YOU to tell a consumer when he can or cannot visit?

I told you, do NOT put the onus on the consumer for the downfalls of YOUR industry...

1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

I would much prefer to hear someone say that than to tell me they are looking at cars and plan to buy entire seasons or years from now.

What difference does it make to a salesman what the consumer tells you?

If a consumer has his guard up...there is a REASON for him to be THAT defensive...

Maybe it is true that he is looking to buy 6 months from now...

Like I said...if YOUR industry gave salespeople ALL the TEACHINGS on HOW to sell properly, lessons on what the car you are selling, what features it has got...yes...real lessons, instead of just making the salesperson learn on his own, paid salespeople an hourly wage, a FAIR hourly wage, a recognition that car salespeople are professionals, that the industry itself BECOMES professional...then salespeople would NOT look at consumers like they are a problem...

Like how phoqued up is the phoquing industry when salespeople are looking at people coming into a store a when salespeople do NOT get the answer they are looking for...they view THAT as wasting time?

Wasting time?

1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

But if you are even remotely close to a year away from buying a car, you're wasting EVERYONE'S time, not just the salesman's. The used car isn't going to be there anymore, and the new car probably won't be the same price.

Yeah...lets tackle this...

Its a STORE!

A DEALERSHIP IS A STORE....

OPEN FOR BUSINESS.

 

And look....all those people...kicking the tires on all these products...

What is the point?

Technology changes every 6 months, right?

So why bother informing yourself?

yes, a used car that you like today will not be there tomorrow if you dont buy it now!

And yes...decisiveness IS a waste of time....BUT ITS A FACT OF LIFE IN YOUR INDUSTRY!!!

LIKE I SAID...LET THE INDUSTRY PAY FOR YOUR TIME...

No...you dont sell cars, your ass is gone. But maybe, if the industry ADAPTED its technique, maybe just maybe, consumers would be more sympathetic towards their salesperson...

 

[Frisky Dingo]

52 minutes ago, trinacriabob said:

Buying a car can be completely random, though.  I like to plan it out in advance while sometimes you have to buy a car, either because you need to replace one immediately or your dream second car snuck up on you in a manner that you can't look the other way.  The latter is how my Dad, and thus my family, owned its first Pontiac. 

Being in sales in no way guarantees a 1:1 relationship between customer:closed sale.  That's why being in sales isn't for most people and they shouldn't have unrealistic expectations.  Also, the stronger the personality they're dealing with, the more likely the person they're pitching to is likely to walk away if the terms or the general situation doesn't suit them.

 

I don't know of anyone that expects to have even 1:3 close ration. 1:4-1:5 is pretty stellar. Much of that is luck. But much of it is also on the customer and the salesman.

 

I can tell within the first 2 minutes how serious someone is. And in next 8-13, if they are still there, I know typically how good of a chance I have of selling them. Knowing those things takes years of practice and experience in what questions to ask, watching the customer's facial expressions and demeanor, etc, etc. You have to know how if you are going to get around the #1 thing most people say straight out of the gate- "I'm just looking."

[Frisky Dingo]

2 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

That would NOT be the consumer's fault...

THAT would be how your PAY structure is formed...

Like I said, the industry needs to change. If you are getting paid ONLY if you sell a car...take it up with your industry. 

I read about the part where the conversation lead to the service industry...

YOUR job as a salesman IS to service everybody that comes in to your dealership. 

If I wanna take 1 year to look at cars THEN to buy....lit is MY right to do so as a consumer...

YOU say its a waste of time for a salesman to cater to folk like that?

If YOUR industry PAID you by the hour, if YOUR industry  PREPARED YOU to SELL cars PROPERLY, if YOUR industry COMPENSATED YOU like YOU deserve and NOT like a piece of meat, if YOUR industry TREATED YOU like a PROFESSIONAL than MAYBE consumers would TREAT YOU like professionals too...

Instead what we got...is salesmen looking at consumers like THEY are the problem like shyte you just told us...

YEAH!

There are some cars that DO NOT change in 2 years...

Sure, the kid's opinions on what kind of car he like to own WILL change, but you know what? 

The more cars you see, the more you know what YOU LIKE!

A dealership IS A STORE!!!

FIRST AND FOREMOST!!!

Who are YOU to tell a consumer when he can or cannot visit?

I told you, do NOT put the onus on the consumer for the downfalls of YOUR industry...

What difference does it make to a salesman what the consumer tells you?

If a consumer has his guard up...there is a REASON for him to be THAT defensive...

Maybe it is true that he is looking to buy 6 months from now...

Like I said...if YOUR industry gave salespeople ALL the TEACHINGS on HOW to sell properly, lessons on what the car you are selling, what features it has got...yes...real lessons, instead of just making the salesperson learn on his own, paid salespeople an hourly wage, a FAIR hourly wage, a recognition that car salespeople are professionals, that the industry itself BECOMES professional...then salespeople would NOT look at consumers like they are a problem...

Like how phoqued up is the phoquing industry when salespeople are looking at people coming into a store a when salespeople do NOT get the answer they are looking for...they view THAT as wasting time?

Wasting time?

Yeah...lets tackle this...

Its a STORE!

A DEALERSHIP IS A STORE....

OPEN FOR BUSINESS.

 

And look....all those people...kicking the tires on all these products...

What is the point?

Technology changes every 6 months, right?

So why bother informing yourself?

yes, a used car that you like today will not be there tomorrow if you dont buy it now!

And yes...decisiveness IS a waste of time....BUT ITS A FACT OF LIFE IN YOUR INDUSTRY!!!

LIKE I SAID...LET THE INDUSTRY PAY FOR YOUR TIME...

No...you dont sell cars, your ass is gone. But maybe, if the industry ADAPTED its technique, maybe just maybe, consumers would be more sympathetic towards their salesperson...

 

 

If you want to take a year to buy a car, be my guest. I didn't say you don't have the right to. But I also have the right to not spend my time on you when the next guy is ready to buy a car today. If you understand that, you're just dense.

My greater point, which you and others are glossing over is that by shopping several months to a year out, you are wasting not just the salesman's time, but YOURS.

Call up a realtor and ask them to show you a house you may be interested in buying in a year. See how that goes for you. Or better yet, how would you like it if somebody came into your restaurant, asked about half the stuff on your menu, and then said they weren't hungry anyway and they weren't planning on eating there that day. Or even next week. If that person told you that up front, would you make the guy behind them wanting a burger right now wait so you could explain everything to the non-buyer?? And if you were the customer wanting to know everything about the menu, would you not expect the owner/server/waiter/whatever to either A) try to sell you something, or B) or be confused why you were there if you didn't want to eat at that moment??

Apply the same logic to YOUR line of work and try to tell me with a straight face it makes sense.

 

As for the people in the pictures you posted, if they aren't ready, or close to making a decision, on what to buy, then YES, they are wasting their time, too. Not that hard of a concept to grasp. Maybe I just don't understand going to look at things I am either incapable of, or not ready to, buy. Customers' time must NOT be more valuable than mine, because mine is sure as hell too valuable to do such a thing. I don't go look at clothes if I don't need/want clothes. I don't go look at cameras or phones if I don't need or want a phone. And I definitely don't get off on wasting someone else's time if I'm not interested in buying a product. 

But if those people want to waste their looking at things they have no intentions of buying, good for them. The person working at Best Buy isn't required to wait on them, and they don't get paid to make sales. Cell phone reps do, so stringing them along if you're just 'kicking tires' is effed up, too.

 

I could go into a tangent about how my industry pays and trains people, but that's a separate matter, and one that could easily be the topic of an entire thread itself. Salesmen are underpaid, and it starts at the top, with the MFR's. They rake in billions while everyone below the owner/GM level makes crap. But most professions are underpaid. I'm not going to complain about that, as it's a pandemic, and it's beyond my control, any way. 

Helping people is under my control, and how I choose to do so is up to me, not the consumer. I've flat out told people I don't want to sell them a car. That whatever I was making wasn't enough to put up with them. And my Mgr will back me up if I do so, because he trusts my judgement. Some people just aren't worth it. If you think a salesman's role is to bend over backwards for you at all costs and allow themselves to be subjected to disrespectful or condescending behavior, you have a very poor outlook. 

[A Horse With No Name]

I can undetstand casually checking things out a year in advance but spending a serious amount of time worrying about it probably puts one somewhere on the autism spectrum.  A Forrester vs. an Escape Vs. a Cherokee is not that tough.

I also don't understand people who buy brand new cars and then trade them in at a huge loss five thousand miles later either.

[G. David Felt]

22 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I also don't understand people who buy brand new cars and then trade them in at a huge loss five thousand miles later either.

But I will take a deal on that low miles CPO auto due to the idiot that did not do their homework and got an auto that did not meet their needs or life style or could afford the payment / Insurance.

I have seen plenty of people buy an auto and not once think about the insurance till afterwards and then find out due to their own history that they cannot get it insured.

Benefits to me.  

[oldshurst442]

24 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

If you want to take a year to buy a car, be my guest. I didn't say you don't have the right to. But I also have the right to not spend my time on you when the next guy is ready to buy a car today. If you understand that, you're just dense.

My greater point, which you and others are glossing over is that by shopping several months to a year out, you are wasting not just the salesman's time, but YOURS.

Call up a realtor and ask them to show you a house you may be interested in buying in a year. See how that goes for you. Or better yet, how would you like it if somebody came into your restaurant, asked about half the stuff on your menu, and then said they weren't hungry anyway and they weren't planning on eating there that day.

If I want to see what cars there are in this world...how is it a waste of my time?

I go into hardware stores all the time. Looking at tools. At these hardware stores, the drills are on display for the people to manhandle...

Drills, dont change as much as cars do...

If I tell a salesperson that I aint ready to buy now...the salesperson HAS NO CHOICE BUT TO TAKE MY WORD FOR IT!!!

THIS IS A RESPONSE TO THE ORIGINAL T.O. DISCUSSION...

If a dude is wasting your time, asking you not only what is under the hood of XYZ car, but trying to ask you on a date...then yeah...waste of time...I NEVER EVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT THAT.

However, it is in the nature of your "profession" to ASSIST every single consumer that enters your dealership. BUT...if they say no thanx, then NO THANX it is...as per the OP then no Turn Overs.

If a guy enters my restaurant and asks me a million and one questions about what ingredients my hamburger bread has got because of allergies in the middle of a lunch rush and monopolizes the time of  my cashier for 10 minutes and my cashier cant serve the literally 20-30 REGULARS...and then he just orders a coke, then changes that to a diet coke...then yeah. A WASTE OF TIME!

But...PART OF THE BUSINESS!

And...GREAT SERVICE ON THE PART OF MY CASHIER! And you know what...THAT customer is now a...REGULAR!

And THAT happens in MY restaurant. ALL. THE. TIME!

I had cashiers roll their eyes in the past when that happened when customers do that. I dont let my cashiers roll their eyes. I tell them to smile! I tell them to kiss ass. And you know what? Not only do these customers come back to my restaurant and eventually become regulars...even if its only a once a week or once a month regular, but these customers tip the tip jar quite well!

And...comparing a 10 dollar meal to a 30 000 dollar transaction is ludacrous!

But...its funny how MY customers DEMAND all the ATTENTION required and ALL THE ASS KISSING done by my staff and  myself  for a lousy 20 bucks, even if they dont plop that amount today and if its only for tomorrow...but for 20 000 bucks...its called waste of your time...

SHAKING MY HEAD IN DISBELIEF!

58 minutes ago, Frisky Dingo said:

Call up a realtor and ask them to show you a house you may be interested in buying in a year.

Oh...I have!

I bought two new houses in my lifetime brand new from the ground up. New construction. You dont know HOW MANY times I busted their balls (both houses in two different areas) BEFORE SIGNING... 6 months before signing.

My wife visited (both houses) the model house at least 50 times each. No joke. (several  model homes...to see what she liked)

When I sold my 1st house to buy and move in the 2nd house. That 1st house...I had a couple looking to buy my house come to visit me 5 times. Never made an offer. I had to even leave my house and let them be alone for 15 minutes. Never made an offer.

Waste of time?

Lets just say my realtor and their realtor were kissing their ass and smiling at them. What  could I do? Do the same...

In a year you said?

Trust me...realtors remember you.  They dont lose your number and they make sure you are taken care of. (the ones that have the drive to sell that is)   Mind you, that is with folk who wanna buy...

Fakers is one thing...YOU are talking about the fakers. Im not!

But as with fakers...its part of YOUR job to cater to them regardless. But it goes back to YOUR industry to COMPENSATE you for YOUR time...THAT WOULD BE YOUR INDUSTRY'S LACK OF RESPONSIBILITY TOWARDS YOU, NOT THE CONSUMER'S!!!

1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

As for the people in the pictures you posted, if they aren't ready, or close to making a decision, on what to buy, then YES, they are wasting their time, too.

No they are not...

Window shopping IS a thing. 

Actually, window shopping is what MAKES THE CAPITALIST MARKET GOING! ITS ALL TIED TO FREEDOM OF CHOICE AND IMPULSE BUYING!

Problem is...impulse buying an iPhone does less damage to your pocket than a $50 000 sports car...but that is the thing...

One one hand, the message is dont window shop but the other is, go ahead, impulse buy...

No! Dont  cross shop. Dont use MY numbers against me. Dont waste MY time. Dont bother me. Only bother me when you want to buy NOW. Dont lie to me. I will lie to you, but dont you dare lie to me.

Dont see another car.

Dont leave without seeing my manager

Dont Dont Dont

Dont come in when its busy. Come when we are closed.

Why do you want to sit in the car if you aint buying now.

Why arent you buying now?

OMG...you are not ready? Why?

You did not see in the car? Well, dont sit in the car unless you wanna buy now?

You got questions to ask me?

Are you buying today?

No?! Then you are wasting my time!

You dont have a budget?

You should know that cars cost between 10 000-100 000 dollars.

You should know what price you want to buy. 

You should know what kind of car you should be buying.

But dont tell me you are not ready so dont ask me  questions because you are wasting my time.

1 hour ago, Frisky Dingo said:

Helping people is under my control, and how I choose to do so is up to me, not the consumer. I've flat out told people I don't want to sell them a car. That whatever I was making wasn't enough to put up with them. And my Mgr will back me up if I do so, because he trusts my judgement. Some people just aren't worth it.

And herein lies the problemm...

YOU dont deem YOUR time is worth it...

But YOU want a person to fork over tens of thousands of dollars without a blink of an eye...

Like I said...YOUR industry is sick...

I say that to my clientelle for a lousy 5 dollar burger and I will close  my doors immediately...

[oldshurst442]

42 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I can undetstand casually checking things out a year in advance but spending a serious amount of time worrying about it probably puts one somewhere on the autism spectrum.  A Forrester vs. an Escape Vs. a Cherokee is not that tough.

I also don't understand people who buy brand new cars and then trade them in at a huge loss five thousand miles later either.

Yes...undeciseveness is deadly.

Its deadly in life. On the baseball field it will lose you the ballgame.

On the warfront, it will cost yours and your platoon's life...

In business with the public, its a a pisser. But in serving people...its a fact of life.

I have customers who cant decide between a french fry or Onion ring. A hotdog or hamburger...

So between a Forrester vs. an Escape Vs. a Cherokee may be anathema for some. And its understandable. And if you dont see the reasons why...especially when I gave you a little restaurant anecdote, then nothing I will tell you will make you understand...

Like I said. The dealership industry is sick. It needs more than chicken soup and a day at home to rest to fix.

When the people that sell view the people that buy as the problem, God help this industry...

[oldshurst442]

58 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

I also don't understand people who buy brand new cars and then trade them in at a huge loss five thousand miles later either.

Impulse buy for the most part Im guessing.

And that maybe 1 reason why some customers are defensive...are slow to buy...are indecisive.

 

[oldshurst442]

OK..

Now that I ranted.

I wanna make sure that everybody, especially Frisky, understands that I empathize with car salespeople. 

I understand the dilemna they go through.

I read this part of what Frisky wrote

2 hours ago, Frisky Dingo said:

I could go into a tangent about how my industry pays and trains people, but that's a separate matter, and one that could easily be the topic of an entire thread itself. Salesmen are underpaid, and it starts at the top, with the MFR's. They rake in billions while everyone below the owner/GM level makes crap. But most professions are underpaid. I'm not going to complain about that, as it's a pandemic, and it's beyond my control, any way. 

and I totally get what he is talking about.

But my rant and hatred of the industry is not directed towards the foot soldiers on the ground, the salespeople. 

Frisky's quote on top is understood. It was understood way before he even wrote that.  When I buy a new car, I make sure I am as forthright as I possibly could with the salespeople. Yes...I do visit multple dealerships (the cars that I wanna buy, not multiple dealerships of  the same brand to compare and contrast price quotes) to get a feel of what I wanna buy and own. I do make test drives. I dont buy right away.  This process will take a year to 6 months before I trade in my old car for the new one...

I have a plethora of cars in my mind at this point. I usually dont wanna talk to anybody at this point. 

But when I have decided what 2-3 cars I want, I only re-visit those dealerships when the time is near to buy. I dont talk price...I only ask what price the car starts at and at what price it ends approx. I do ask questions at a salesperson, but I tell him I aint buying yet. (Yes I get pressure sometimes...I deal with it as it comes...different solutions for different scenarios...)

But when I buy, I make sure I see the salesperson that I always talked to, and then I tell him its time. Today I buy. Then the price talk begins. Yes I haggle, but I dont haggle to the point it gets nauseating for him and for me. And I haggle on the price of the car that is in the showroom or in the parking lot...I make sure I buy what the dealership has got on the lot. The sales manager only comes to see me to  congratulate me on the purchase. On occasion they dont have the trim I want and only then does the manager use his computer on me, to locate the car that I am buying...

If I visited a Buick dealership and a Lincoln dealership and an Acura dealership and I made all 3 salespeople from their respected brands give me a small low down on the cars, gave me a test ride on them, and I bought the Acura...was it a waste of time for the Buick guy and the Lincoln guy that spent maybe an hour or two each with me over the course of 6 months?

This is where I was butting heads with Frisky.

That was the angle I was shooting from.

I understand his angle. And in no way do I mean any disrespect to him or to his profession.

 

 

Edited March 27, 2018 by oldshurst442