Chevrolet News:2018 Chevrolet Corvette To Sport A 6.2L DOHC V8

[hyperv6]

22 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

The Corvette has been front engine, rear drive and 2 seats since 1953.  It has had a pushrod V8 since 1955 (save for a couple years of ZR1 in the early 90s).  They used a 5.7 liter V8 from 1972 to 2005.  The Corvette is the poster child of sticking to the formula.  And it is a formula that works.

The Datsun Z cars, RX7, MR2 X2, MG's, Alfa, Triumph, Austin, Jaguar and many more stuck to their formula and their models only lasted 5-10 years in many cases some even less.

Today it is even more important to keep raising the bar as if you remain the same and stagnate you will be history such as the present Viper that is now going out of production as a lost cause now.

Todays markets and sports cars are like a virus and it and to mutate and adapt to survive in this tough market. Those who play it safe die and fade into history.

What keeps the Miata relevent is the limited production and the fact it appeals to many women. The Vette has no such luxury as while some women like it they are a small percentage of buyers.

The Vette has relied on Baby Boomers and now that many are in their 60's and older the Corvette needs to find and appeal to younger and up coming buyers. These buyers are not generally brand loyal and can be drawn in if you make a compelling car to attract them.

You see the same crap going on in the bike market now. Harley has own the V twin market for decades. They were the poster bike for the V twin. The Asian companies made better bikes but they survived the assault.  The time has now come American makers Indian and Polaris are now in the game and both are taking sales from Harley. Harley is now working hard on new models to attract buyers that are no longer brand loyal. 

Poster childs fade from the limelight if they sit back and do not go to the market. You must go to where they are at not wait for them to come to you or you will fail..  

These young buyers in the Vette price range are now buying a wide range of things. In my parking lot at work I see everything from Lotus to Slingshots. The Sling Shot owner drives it daily from Erie Pa 2.5 hours to work in Ohio. Even in the rain. We have a good number of them moving to Cadillac ATS now as they are getting great buys and they are fun to drive. Then we also have are large groups of GTI and M cars along with a major group of Tuner cars that many have more in than a new Vette. 

One of the dumbest things to do is just sit back and keep doing the same thing in today's market. Things today are changing faster than ever and if you do not change with it you will be left behind posting post that show how out of touch one can be. 

 

[hyperv6]

30 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

The M-B SL was not a track car?

You mean this one?

Or do you mean this one?

 

Because the latter was a tube framed race car turned into a gentleman's GT road car and the former was a gentleman's GT road car first and then was made into a race car...either way...the first and last editions of the SL were in fact race cars...

Im surprised you wanted to go with that argument SMK...

also...I have mentioned to you and then Hyper that Cadillac as NO racing heritage....it has dabbled in it once or twice in the beginning of the last  century and in this century they seem to have gone all out but in either century...not too successful....

But Mercedes Benz has a rich history...

 

I said this before and Hyper has backed me up....

SMK, Cadillac does not NEED a sports car or race car...M-B does...

Cadillac needs a V16 type car..

 

 

 

 

Well you are very accurate on no need for a Sports Car right now. 

But no V16 cars and no nearly 10 year old show cars. 

They only right now need to get their present car line up fixed with cars so compelling that they will make people willing to break from their own brands to give them a chance. 

The SUV products that are coming need to be focused on the market and not just upgraded normal GM models. This means some RWD based SUV models that are smaller than what they have now. GM can do SUV models better than anyone and it is time for Cadillac to show it. 

But Cadillac needs a sports car now like a hole in the head. Once they get their line up in place and want to attract attention to it then you do like Benz and do a limited run sports model at a high price and get the PR from that to show the entire line off. See me in 2025. 

[oldshurst442]

Well...I did say V16 TYPE car....not exactly a V16 or the show car from a decade ago...

But a stately sedan and/or coupe or an SUV higher than the Escalade for that matter...

A top tier offering is what I meant that is NOT a sports car...

But yeah...what you said Hyper in quoting me...

And most definitely a sports car later on...later later on...like in 2025 like you said...

 

[smk4565]

1 hour ago, dfelt said:

No different than the ancient old G wagon from MB then!  

It ain't broke so they don't fix it.  Although there is an all new G-wagen coming for 2018, I guess they figured 40 years was enough time.   And I think they had to get weight out and downsize the engine since 12 mpg or whatever it gets  doesn't really work anymore.

[smk4565]

To OldsHurst, I was talking more about these SL's  No the SLR or SLS or anything like that.

Not exactly the Nurburgring killers there, they are touring cars.

Mercedes has won three F1 championships in a row, their racing legacy is in pretty good shape.  They build the fastest race car in the world, nothing can beat a W07 Hybrid around a track.

[oldshurst442]

9 minutes ago, smk4565 said:

To OldsHurst, I was talking more about these SL's  No the SLR or SLS or anything like that.

Not exactly the Nurburgring killers there, they are touring cars.

Mercedes has won three F1 championships in a row, their racing legacy is in pretty good shape.  They build the fastest race car in the world, nothing can beat a W07 Hybrid around a track.

Yeah...but...

The SL lineage STARTED as a race car...and the 2nd one to the right is EXACTLY that car...except that one in the pic was sold to the public as a gentleman's GT car, but its skeleton is of a pure bred race car.

Then the next gen came along and then the SL became a GT car, that your pic depicts perfectly as the consequent generations were only boulevard cruisers but the last gen SLS went back to its roots from a visual perspective and a vocational one too...as a race inspired retro car car that actually had the goods to race...

[oldshurst442]

On ‎2016‎-‎12‎-‎25 at 11:07 PM, Wings4Life(BANNED) said:

Olds.

you're the best.. Love you like a Greek brother man.  I swear we are far more alike than you think. And that's not the 7 Star Metaxa talking either, haha.  I too hosted Christmas dinner, and everyone is gone home now and my feet are up, watching Sulley that I just rented and coffee black and hot beside me.  

Now lets talk shop......

Nobody appreciates and loves Detroit iron more than me, no how, no way.  My dad built Cadillac's in the 60's and 70's and he did all his own repairs and I was right there by his side long before I found girls interesting. I have busted my own knuckles on enough of them as well,  restoring them or just hot rodding them.  So I can certainly appreciate the sound of a 426 hemi, or Boss 302, or just  healthy SBC.

 

But let's compare apples to apples. Any V8 sounds great with big pipes and low restriction deep base exhaust.  Assuming you can live with the droning, it is music to my ears too, both OHV and OHC. Take a minute and listen to the end of this video where they add a simple 3" cat back system and Magnaflow mufflers.  Fast forward to the end, and you will see what I mean.  A DOHC sounds good revving, but it really needs to be heard under load.  It is a mechanical symphony. Obviously it is a subjective statement, but come on man.....it is glorious.  And that is not even with a G350 5.2L, just an everyday coyote.  

 

 

Now compare to a cat back Camaro SS.  Let me know if you still feel the same way.  

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

1. What the hell did you to get yourself banned?

A little vigil song for you my Greek brother. Ill be doing a zebekiko in your honour.

2. To answer your question. That coyote sounds fantastic.

Sorry though...pushrod V8 sounds is how I prefer them.

 

[hyperv6]

49 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

Yeah...but...

The SL lineage STARTED as a race car...and the 2nd one to the right is EXACTLY that car...except that one in the pic was sold to the public as a gentleman's GT car, but its skeleton is of a pure bred race car.

Then the next gen came along and then the SL became a GT car, that your pic depicts perfectly as the consequent generations were only boulevard cruisers but the last gen SLS went back to its roots from a visual perspective and a vocational one too...as a race inspired retro car car that actually had the goods to race...

Yawn zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!

Touring? No status symbols for old women in Rancho Santa Fe.

Mercedes also nearly killed racing in the crash in 1955.

Hey if you can be pointless I can too.

But to make a real point Benz was a real leading edge company till 1955 then they went into moderate mode. They have never reached the level they once were. Today F1 is all about just hiring the right designer, engineer and drivers. It has little to do with real customer cars any more.

[oldshurst442]

14 minutes ago, hyperv6 said:

Yawn zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!

Touring? No status symbols for old women in Rancho Santa Fe.

Mercedes also nearly killed racing in the crash in 1955.

Hey if you can be pointless I can too.

But to make a real point Benz was a real leading edge company till 1955 then they went into moderate mode. They have never reached the level they once were. Today F1 is all about just hiring the right designer, engineer and drivers. It has little to do with real customer cars any more.

 

 

 

Edited January 3, 2017 by oldshurst442

[balthazar]

3 hours ago, smk4565 said:

The Corvette has been front engine, rear drive and 2 seats since 1953.  It has had a pushrod V8 since 1955 (save for a couple years of ZR1 in the early 90s).  They used a 5.7 liter V8 from 1972 to 2005.  The Corvette is the poster child of sticking to the formula.  And it is a formula that works.

• 99% of all vehicles out there are front engine- that doesn't define the Corvette.
• Tons of vehicles are RWD- - that doesn't define the Corvette.
• 2-seats, I'll give you that one. But most every mid-engined car ever conceived is a 2-seater also.
• 5.7L / 350 first appeared for 1968, but it also had a 265, 283, 305, 327, 346, 364, 376, 396, 400, 427 and 454. Some of the most valuable & coveted ones are the 7.0Ls- displacement doesn't define the Corvette.

There's no reason it cannot continue to evolve with a mid-engined variant. 

[oldshurst442]

50 minutes ago, balthazar said:

• 99% of all vehicles out there are front engine- that doesn't define the Corvette.
• Tons of vehicles are RWD- - that doesn't define the Corvette.
• 2-seats, I'll give you that one. But most every mid-engined car ever conceived is a 2-seater also.
• 5.7L / 350 first appeared for 1968, but it also had a 265, 283, 305, 327, 346, 364, 376, 396, 400, 427 and 454. Some of the most valuable & coveted ones are the 7.0Ls- displacement doesn't define the Corvette.

There's no reason it cannot continue to evolve with a mid-engined variant. 

Exactly.

Those 396,427 and especially 454 Vettes were muscle cars rather than sports cars...

I said that earlier. And what I meant to say was that had the Vette not transformed itself into a muscle car in the mid to late 1960s unto the early 1970s to become a muscle car, it be dead since muscle cars were all the craze back then and quite frankly, the mid sized muscle cars and pony cars would just destroy the Vette in quarter mile times and THAT was the performance metric to go by at that point in time...

And like I said earlier...Mr. Duntov wanted mid-engine for the Vette from the early 1960s...

Maybe at that point in time it was best that the Vette stayed the way it was and still is...

But in 2017...it needs to evolve again...

The Vette always got with the times. It changed and shifted its image...

From roadster only to coupe and roadster, to muscle car persona to abandon its roadster image to recapture its roadster image to become a GT car etc...

Now, that image may have to shift again...to become mid-engined...but it aint as if the Vette did not have experimental cracks at it either...and almost from the get go...from the 2nd generation(like the pic I posted)....and then the 3rd generation...and then the 4rth generation...

A 5th generation too was conconcted as a maybe mid engine Vette show car...(I dont feel like posting all the experimental CERV cars and other mid engined show car Vettes)

 A mid-engined 7 generation would have been a reality if it werent for a bankruptcy...so we wait for that reality to come to fruition in the 8th generation...

But that is 7 generations of Corvette of GM and Chevrolet toying with that idea...that would be 50 some odd years of Chevy thinking about it...

Therefore...mid-engine Vettes are practically a Vette formula anyway you wanna slice it...deny it or accept it SMK.

So I dont know what the problem is for nay sayers  when it comes to mid-engined Corvettes...

 

Edited January 3, 2017 by oldshurst442

[Cmicasa the Great]

Found it interesting upon reading about the Cadillac’s Prototype DPi-V.R. It is said to have 600HP Naturally Aspirated from a 6.2L

[smk4565]

Would make sense if they are developing the engine for race use that a version is made for road use.  Spread out the cost on it.  Most 100 hp per liter naturally aspirated engines aren't high on torque, usually they are high revvers, I could see it revving to 7,000 rpm, unless the race series has a limit.

[Cmicasa the Great]

13 hours ago, smk4565 said:

Would make sense if they are developing the engine for race use that a version is made for road use.  Spread out the cost on it.  Most 100 hp per liter naturally aspirated engines aren't high on torque, usually they are high revvers, I could see it revving to 7,000 rpm, unless the race series has a limit.

Its not far fetched. My LT1 with no internal changes is putting out 500 at the fly at a flash and some "on the top" mods. I could easily see GM engineers capable of doing the same thing that the race builders did to get to 600HP for street specs. Point was that the DOHC design coming will probably be in the 700-800HP range if a forced induction is employed.. still allowing for a low maintenance engine and a cost not in the hemisphere of needing to win the Mega Millions to afford 

[El Kabong]

(didn't read first seven pages because lazy. Shoot the messenger if I say redundant things. I'm good for it)

The LT5 is an interesting development. It has the displacement of an LT smallblock, but if it's based on the LS architecture then how much, if any, did they modify the block?

Is it earmarked for Cadillac as well?  If so, what do we do with the rumoured 4.2 TT V8?

There is no indication that it a forced-induction engine.  But that doesn't mean it can't be a series hybrid.

How hard did GM work on minimizing the sizes of the cylinder head and intake?  Will it fit under the hood of a Stingray, or is it for a mid-engine?  Will it screw up the C of G?

Whatever it winds up in, it's going to be something both special and distinctive.  If it's a front engine, non-hybrid application it's appeal will likely be subjective, like Ford's 5.2L V8.  But if it's a mid-engine, hybrid (or both?), it's probably gonna destroy.

 

[hyperv6]

I have not seen the spec on the new Cadillac race engine but I expect it to be same one used in last years Daytona Corvette prototype racers that ended ther class last year for the new prototype class we have this year. 

The goal is to get the class to where the cars can run LeMans again.

it also nearly the same engine in the Pratt and Miller Corvettes.

Note they generally use restrictors to limit power. 

Ther really no need to compare this to the street engine. 

Cadillac is doing this car smart over their last adventure. This time it is a proven Dellara chassis and appears to be a proven engine so other than some aero learning the should be competitive right out of the box.

Don't just assume this engine is what will be in anything coming as a variation may or may not have this engine. It is production based but with a lot of work even restricted. 

Note I had heard they were fastest at Daytona practice so they may get hit with BoP changes before the race. They need to use care in testing to not stink up the show and pace themselves or they will run into more weight, fuel and restrictor changes.