Chevrolet News:GM Is Ready To Lose Close To $9,000 On Every Bolt Sold

[surreal1272]

S 

1 hour ago, A Horse With No Name said:

You are absolutely right about the pace of advancement, which will eventually doom current electric cars and current ICE cars.

The one variable to consider here is human behavior...small slow change and a slow adaptation to electric is the best thing, as humans do not deal well with rapid change.

And we are looking at this with the completely bass akward paradigm...we (myself included) have raked our domestics over the coals for a decade here about not keeping up, not investing in the latest technology, not showing a sense of fight and desire for market share.

Our domestics are now doing the best they have done in terms of building competitive product (both ICE and electric) at any time since the Beatles still sang together and we were still trying to put a man on the moon....

...and yet all I seem to hear on this site is complaining.  Dammit man...I love foreign cars also...how ironic is it that the guy here who has more passion for foreign cars is the one who has more pride in our domestics right now than many of our domestic guys? Could we please give both Ford and GM one hell of an atta boy for getting things really really right?

I say this not so much directly to Hyper, but to the whole board....

Well said. Unfortunately some here only really want success from one company and screw everyone else. They are not and should not ever call themselves "car fans".  

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

14 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

The eight year warranty kills your 4-5 year replacement claim. That was the point of me mentioning it. Talk about ignorance is bliss. 

Let me make something very clear to you. If you want to debate, fine. I'm always game but if you want to do it while telling to "Man THE f@#k up or STFU" then quite honestly you can take a leap off the tallest building in Detroit. Take your own advice and man up and stop being such a whiny pussy because someone simply has an opinion different from yours. 

 

And my examples and and analogies are spot on. It's not my fault that you are ignorant to history and facts so much that you have to lash out and post like a twelve year old in response. 

 

Maybe you can just send me another harassing PM like you always do when you don't get your way. 

 

One last thing. You are telling to admit to your stance about Ford EVs. Why would I do that when Ford hasn't done hardly jack in the EV world compared to GM? I don't care what you have to say about Ford in this regard so you know exactly where you can stick that presumptuous little attitude of yours. All I know is I must be doing something right to elicit such an "adult" and colorful response by someone claiming to be a 51 year old man. Pure comedy gold!

You know, I have read endless snipes from you toward me for months now, and said nothing. Quite frankly, they are nonstop. I kept my mouth shut to avoid this BS in threads that you SOOOO often are the root cause of, but no more. NO FREAKING WAY!! From now on, I will throw it in your face every time you tell a lie, which is exactly what you did that got my attention.  I called  you out!!!  There was no simple ‘opinion’ that you had that I disagreed with here, no not at all.  You made up a bunch of lies, and got called out by me.  BAM! And I am looking forward to doing it again, the minute you lie.

 

And this all started because of a lie by the OP for something never said, masked as a quote, who admitted wrong and corrected.  I am good with that.  I don’t care if you thought that it was just an opinion.

 

Also, who whines to mods about one sentence in one single PM about you causing a closed thread.

You do. Clearly.

 

Looking forward to more edification. Just say the word(s).

[surreal1272]

7 minutes ago, Wings4Life said:

You know, I have read endless snipes from you toward me for months now, and said nothing. Quite frankly, they are nonstop. I kept my mouth shut to avoid this BS in threads that you SOOOO often are the root cause of, but no more. NO FREAKING WAY!! From now on, I will throw it in your face every time you tell a lie, which is exactly what you did that got my attention.  I called  you out!!!  There was no simple ‘opinion’ that you had that I disagreed with here, no not at all.  You made up a bunch of lies, and got called out by me.  BAM! And I am looking forward to doing it again, the minute you lie.

 

 

 

And this all started because of a lie by the OP for something never said, masked as a quote, who admitted wrong and corrected.  I am good with that.  I don’t care if you thought that it was just an opinion.

 

 

 

Also, who whines to mods about one sentence in one single PM about you causing a closed thread.

 

You do. Clearly.

 

 

 

Looking forward to more edification. Just say the word(s).

 

"Said nothing"? You're kidding me right? I guess all of your passive aggressive remarks in your status updates (of which you are banned from doing Mr Nothing is ever my fault) are being willfully ignored here? Let me sum this up for you because I know where this is headed. You seem to think that in order for me to be right about EVs, that you have to agree with me. Well, that is just not the case. Your support is not requirement nor is it a prerequisite for me to be right. You need to get that through your head Mr. "Don't make this about me Dfelt" (just a few pages ago by you) and move on with your life. The fact is that I could say that everything Ford touches is gold and you would still find something negative to say, not because of what was said but who said it. Get over yourself and as you just said, "Man the f@#k up". 

 

Oh and if you think I closed that thread, then I have a bridge to sell you. Btw, get some help for that obvious narcissism you are exhibiting here.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

surreal,

I am still waiting for proof of FUD by me.

What did I say that was not accurate.

 

Waiting......

[ccap41]

17 hours ago, dfelt said:

You watch the interview and interpret how you take it.

Do you have a linky to the interview?

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

 

Come on…..lets debate and discuss.

Don’t go crying to mods for help, challenge me.

Come on surreal.

Waiting.

[surreal1272]

I've said all I needed to say and I stand by it. That is all.

 

 

So, back to the Bolt. This would be the ideal solution for my weekly commute and around town adventures. It's just an added bonus to not have to deal with volatile gas prices and the associated mess with all of that.

4 minutes ago, Wings4Life said:

 

 

Come on…..lets debate and discuss.

 

Don’t go crying to mods for help, challenge me.

 

Come on surreal.

Waiting.

You are not a challenge. 

 

Moving along...

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

45 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

The eight year warranty kills your 4-5 year replacement claim. That was the point of me mentioning it. Talk about ignorance is bliss. 

 

 

4-5 year replacement for ICE starting battery was reference that batteries degrade, and also that the cost is much less ($100) than a BEV battery.

 

Try again.

5 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

I've said all I needed to say and I stand by it. That is all.

 

 

So, back to the Bolt. This would be the ideal solution for my weekly commute and around town adventures. It's just an added bonus to not have to deal with volatile gas prices and the associated mess with all of that.

You are not a challenge. 

 

Moving along...

Man, I have been missing out on all this.

 

Come on, give me something, you gave me nothing so far

8 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

Do you have a linky to the interview?

It's the bloomberg link in the original post.

[surreal1272]

Oh the irony of someone complaining about others going to the mods (I'll simply refer to the Fiesta thread as proof here). 

[ccap41]

24 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

So, back to the Bolt. This would be the ideal solution for my weekly commute and around town adventures. It's just an added bonus to not have to deal with volatile gas prices and the associated mess with all of that.

I actually met somebody who has a Leaf and they freakin' love the thing. I was talking to the husband but it's his wife's car. She actually commutes about 25 miles each way to work which isn't the shortest distance for a car that doesn't have a ton of range but he said they save a ton with it. If people were practical and actually ran the numbers I'd wager pretty good money that 100 miles of range would cover 95% of people's daily activities which makes the Bolt look even better. People criticize over range anxiety(myself included) when there are such rare instances that you would need to drive over 200 miles at a single stint anyway.

Whenever I have a house of my own, I will absolutely own a Volt(which will be a cure for my range anxiety). Most of my days are driving 10-20 miles and a charge at night I'd almost never use gas. I would likely have to not charge it every once in awhile so the gas doesn't go bad.

[A Horse With No Name]

46 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Moving along...

The ignore function works well here at C and G....!

18 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I actually met somebody who has a Leaf and they freakin' love the thing. I was talking to the husband but it's his wife's car. She actually commutes about 25 miles each way to work which isn't the shortest distance for a car that doesn't have a ton of range but he said they save a ton with it. If people were practical and actually ran the numbers I'd wager pretty good money that 100 miles of range would cover 95% of people's daily activities which makes the Bolt look even better. People criticize over range anxiety(myself included) when there are such rare instances that you would need to drive over 200 miles at a single stint anyway.

Whenever I have a house of my own, I will absolutely own a Volt(which will be a cure for my range anxiety). Most of my days are driving 10-20 miles and a charge at night I'd almost never use gas. I would likely have to not charge it every once in awhile so the gas doesn't go bad.

Owen, one of my fellow  adjunct debate coaches at the university where I work, has a Volt.  He very rarely buys fuel and saves $35-60 a week in gas.

Very nice car as he has very small children....he and his wife love it...makes a great road trip car as well.

[surreal1272]

18 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I actually met somebody who has a Leaf and they freakin' love the thing. I was talking to the husband but it's his wife's car. She actually commutes about 25 miles each way to work which isn't the shortest distance for a car that doesn't have a ton of range but he said they save a ton with it. If people were practical and actually ran the numbers I'd wager pretty good money that 100 miles of range would cover 95% of people's daily activities which makes the Bolt look even better. People criticize over range anxiety(myself included) when there are such rare instances that you would need to drive over 200 miles at a single stint anyway.

Whenever I have a house of my own, I will absolutely own a Volt(which will be a cure for my range anxiety). Most of my days are driving 10-20 miles and a charge at night I'd almost never use gas. I would likely have to not charge it every once in awhile so the gas doesn't go bad.

I'm getting ready to use some equity on my house and have been seriously considering a Volt. It would solve my weekly commute and no visits to the gas station and for long drives to Tucson and Flagstaff, I'll have ICE as a welcome back up. The log drives to Flagstaff would be the one thing keeping me out of a Bolt but the range is getting better by the year on EVs and soon that will not be an issue. 

3 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

The ignore function works well here at C and G....!

Owen, one of my fellow  adjunct debate coaches at the university where I work, has a Volt.  He very rarely buys fuel and saves $35-60 a week in gas.

Very nice car as he has very small children....he and his wife love it...makes a great road trip car as well.

Yes it does but it doesn't solve everything because I can still see quotes in other posts and it definitely doesn't stop the harrasing PMs. 

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

25 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Oh the irony of someone complaining about others going to the mods (I'll simply refer to the Fiesta thread as proof here). 

 

In the Fiesta thread, Drew said to “stop”, and you agreed and your very next post was a complete thrashing on me.  I countered.  Pretty simple, but I did it in the thread for all to see. I did not PM a mod like a chick.  I ‘manned up’ and threw it back at you. Both posts got deleted. Mission accomplished.  And you always do that BTW, mods ask to stop like they will no doubt do here very soon, and then you take another final snipe…..right after agreeing to do so. LMAO.  So yeah, I will man up every time, from now on. I could care less about the repercussions.  You need to stop your constant focus on people, instead of topics.

[A Horse With No Name]

2 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Yes it does but it doesn't solve everything because I can still see quotes in other posts and it definitely doesn't stop the harrasing PMs. 

Think of it like being a high school senior and having an eighth grader run his mouth because he wants attention from an older boy. Best thing you can do is ignore the kid and he will go away.

Do not wish to say any more, but surreal I do enjoy your content and wish for you to hang around.

[surreal1272]

4 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Think of it like being a high school senior and having an eighth grader run his mouth because he wants attention from an older boy. Best thing you can do is ignore the kid and he will go away.

Do not wish to say any more, but surreal I do enjoy your content and wish for you to hang around.

I'm not going anywhere. I occasionally take little breaks from the action but no one will run me off, least of all those eighth graders lol!

[A Horse With No Name]

Just now, surreal1272 said:

I'm not going anywhere. I occasionally take little breaks from the action but no one will run me off, least of all those eighth graders lol!

Good.....!

Back to discussing actual cars.

Really like the Volt, and glad that the Volt is picking up in sales even though fuel is cheap.

[surreal1272]

10 minutes ago, Wings4Life said:

 

 

In the Fiesta thread, Drew said to “stop”, and you agreed and your very next post was a complete thrashing on me.  I countered.  Pretty simple, but I did it in the thread for all to see. I did not PM a mod like a chick.  I ‘manned up’ and threw it back at you. Both posts got deleted. Mission accomplished.  And you always do that BTW, mods ask to stop like they will no doubt do here very soon, and then you take another final snipe…..right after agreeing to do so. LMAO.  So yeah, I will man up every time, from now on. I could care less about the repercussions.  You need to stop your constant focus on people, instead of topics.

 

Read your last sentence again and understand the pure hypocrisy of what you just said. You have made it about me for the last page and a half. You can debate with yourself though from here on out because I don't debate with brick walls and employees of automakers. I will say that if you want to think that's how it happened on the Fiesta thread, knock yourself out but I know for a fact that is not the truth, your "chick" insult aside. Guess it never occurred to you that it was your buddy who reported me lol!

 

Back to the Bolt...

 

 

Edited December 8, 2016 by surreal1272

[ccap41]

12 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

I'm getting ready to use some equity on my house and have been seriously considering a Volt. It would solve my weekly commute and no visits to the gas station and for long drives to Tucson and Flagstaff, I'll have ICE as a welcome back up. The log drives to Flagstaff would be the one thing keeping me out of a Bolt but the range is getting better by the year on EVs and soon that will not be an issue. 

I'm not sure if you're interested in the used marker but there are first gen Volts for sale in the 13-15k range with very very reasonable miles. That's where I will likely look.

You're also fortunate enough to live in a climate which is almost optimum for EV batteries. ..or maybe not as 100+ degree days is rough on them as is temps down to the teens.. But I see both of those in the nasty mid west.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

35 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I actually met somebody who has a Leaf and they freakin' love the thing. I was talking to the husband but it's his wife's car. She actually commutes about 25 miles each way to work which isn't the shortest distance for a car that doesn't have a ton of range but he said they save a ton with it. If people were practical and actually ran the numbers I'd wager pretty good money that 100 miles of range would cover 95% of people's daily activities which makes the Bolt look even better. People criticize over range anxiety(myself included) when there are such rare instances that you would need to drive over 200 miles at a single stint anyway.

Whenever I have a house of my own, I will absolutely own a Volt(which will be a cure for my range anxiety). Most of my days are driving 10-20 miles and a charge at night I'd almost never use gas. I would likely have to not charge it every once in awhile so the gas doesn't go bad.

My coworker drives a C-Max PHEV.  Wife loves it, he claims.  He stated that he does not plug in at all, unless gas is more than $2.50 per gallon (currently around $2.15).  That is the break-even point, according to his calculations. He is a smart man and I don’t doubt his calculations, but I was completely shocked to hear that.  He has calculated it down the penny, it seems, based on his (our) electricity rates.  I wonder if other PHEV users experience similar break-even points. Of course, some may just do it to feel good, thinking zero emissions, but emissions happen somewhere, just not at a tailpipe.

2 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Read your last sentence again and understand the pure hypocrisy of what you just said. You have made it about me for the last page and a half. You can debate with yourself though from here on out because I don't debate with brick walls and employees of automakers.

 

Back to the Bolt...

 

 

Yes, I have made it about you here.  And I will continue, until you stop starting this crap about others.

[ccap41]

11 minutes ago, Wings4Life said:

 

 

In the Fiesta thread, Drew said to “stop”, and you agreed and your very next post was a complete thrashing on me.  I countered.  Pretty simple, but I did it in the thread for all to see. I did not PM a mod like a chick.  I ‘manned up’ and threw it back at you. Both posts got deleted. Mission accomplished.  And you always do that BTW, mods ask to stop like they will no doubt do here very soon, and then you take another final snipe…..right after agreeing to do so. LMAO.  So yeah, I will man up every time, from now on. I could care less about the repercussions.  You need to stop your constant focus on people, instead of topics.

 

You might as well make them PMs because Drew will delete all of these as soon as he gets here anyway. You know he hates this sh!t.

[A Horse With No Name]

Just now, ccap41 said:

I'm not sure if you're interested in the used marker but there are first gen Volts for sale in the 13-15k range with very very reasonable miles. That's where I will likely look.

You're also fortunate enough to live in a climate which is almost optimum for EV batteries. ..or maybe not as 100+ degree days is rough on them as is temps down to the teens.. But I see both of those in the nasty mid west.

The only thing that killed the Volt for us last time over the TDI is back seat room.  Since my 6' 2" son is 2400 miles away as a Freshman at Pacific Lutheran, that is no longer as much of an issue.

[G. David Felt]

1 hour ago, ccap41 said:

Do you have a linky to the interview?

Hi CCAP, the link was in my original post here but I will also include it here. 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-12-02/ford-open-to-making-deals-with-trump-on-keeping-jobs-ceo-says

You can also go to bloomberg and they have the transcript online for the hearing impaired or at least they did the last time I was there.

Enjoy, plenty of double speak and I stand by my take on the interview.

[surreal1272]

10 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I'm not sure if you're interested in the used marker but there are first gen Volts for sale in the 13-15k range with very very reasonable miles. That's where I will likely look.

You're also fortunate enough to live in a climate which is almost optimum for EV batteries. ..or maybe not as 100+ degree days is rough on them as is temps down to the teens.. But I see both of those in the nasty mid west.

That is the only thing I'm considering. I will not buy a brand new car because they are terrible investments right off the bat. A first gen Volt with reasonable miles is what I'm considering. I will say this. I've talked to several EV owners and even the extreme heat hasn't been a big deal or range killer save for those early Leaf models. 

Edited December 8, 2016 by surreal1272

[G. David Felt]

5 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

I'm not sure if you're interested in the used marker but there are first gen Volts for sale in the 13-15k range with very very reasonable miles. That's where I will likely look.

You're also fortunate enough to live in a climate which is almost optimum for EV batteries. ..or maybe not as 100+ degree days is rough on them as is temps down to the teens.. But I see both of those in the nasty mid west.

 

4 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

The only thing that killed the Volt for us last time over the TDI is back seat room.  Since my 6' 2" son is 2400 miles away as a Freshman at Pacific Lutheran, that is no longer as much of an issue.

The VOLT is an awesome auto for those under 6' tall. For me at 6'6" tall I could not fit in the back seat and barely fold myself up into the front seat. Awesome auto for many people just not us big people.

Have either of you played with the BOLT configurator on the web site? Lots of fun, Plus the BOLT owners manual is a blast to look through as it is well done, but I have to say the minimal maintenance schedule is something to love by anyone not wanting to deal with the maintenance of an ICE.

[A Horse With No Name]

Just now, dfelt said:

 

The VOLT is an awesome auto for those under 6' tall. For me at 6'6" tall I could not fit in the back seat and barely fold myself up into the front seat. Awesome auto for many people just not us big people.

Have either of you played with the BOLT configurator on the web site? Lots of fun, Plus the BOLT owners manual is a blast to look through as it is well done, but I have to say the minimal maintenance schedule is something to love by anyone not wanting to deal with the maintenance of an ICE.

Right now with kids in college my budget would be more amenable to a used Volt....but I need to play with the Bolt configuration tool on the web site...

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

21 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

You might as well make them PMs because Drew will delete all of these as soon as he gets here anyway. You know he hates this sh!t.

I am all for PM's to air out differences, to avoid this sort of thing, but it is frowned on here.

Edited December 8, 2016 by Wings4Life

[ccap41]

10 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

That is the only thing I'm considering. I will not buy a brand new car because they are terrible investments right off the bat. A first gen Volt with reasonable miles is what I'm considering. I will say this. I've talked to several EV owners and even the extreme heat hasn't been a big deal or range killer save for those early Leaf models. 

There are already second gen Volt's for sale in the low-mid 20's.

Used Volts seem like one hell of a bargain if you ask me. Unless you need a lot of space.. They just seem great.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

11 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Hi CCAP, the link was in my original post here but I will also include it here. 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-12-02/ford-open-to-making-deals-with-trump-on-keeping-jobs-ceo-says

You can also go to bloomberg and they have the transcript online for the hearing impaired or at least they did the last time I was there.

Enjoy, plenty of double speak and I stand by my take on the interview.

It's totally fine to have your own take and believe what you want regarding what was said, but your words were that it was "clearly stated" which it obviously was not.

In fact, not even close.

[surreal1272]

3 minutes ago, ccap41 said:

There are already second gen Volt's for sale in the low-mid 20's.

Used Volts seem like one hell of a bargain if you ask me. Unless you need a lot of space.. They just seem great.

That is my biggest single gripe, space. I like versatility and some folks here can say what they, but my old Magnum was the best car I've ever owned in terms of said versatility. I have thrown more junk into that car than most people have with their Suburbans. Just mulling over whether or not the space sacrifice is worth it. 

[A Horse With No Name]

1 minute ago, surreal1272 said:

That is my biggest single gripe, space. I like versatility and some folks here can say what they, but my old Magnum was the best car I've ever owned in terms of said versatility. I have thrown more junk into that car than most people have with their Suburbans. Just mulling over whether or not the space sacrifice is worth it. 

I hear ya....

Would love to actually be able to afford a pickup as a third vehicle...

[surreal1272]

11 minutes ago, Wings4Life said:

I am all for PM's to air out differences, but one little PM is too much for some girls to handle and they cry.

So is accepting responsibility for your own actions. Case and point, this^^. You were not trying to "air out differences" in that PM. You were sniping me and accusing me of getting that thread closed. You'd do well to understand the difference or just stop talking to me altogether because your current path is going to find you in the same place you were in last year, as the live member of the quitters group. 

 

That is the the last thing you will hear from me directly so either you can actually be a man and move on or you can bitch later about why you were dealt with. 

[surreal1272]

40 minutes ago, A Horse With No Name said:

Think of it like being a high school senior and having an eighth grader run his mouth because he wants attention from an older boy. Best thing you can do is ignore the kid and he will go away.

Do not wish to say any more, but surreal I do enjoy your content and wish for you to hang around.

Thanks a bunch Horse. That means a lot. You bring a lot to the table here too so keep it up!

[A Horse With No Name]

Just now, surreal1272 said:

Thanks a bunch Horse. That means a lot. You bring a lot to the table here too so keep it up!

You betcha!

[ocnblu]

did you just call him a betch

[G. David Felt]

 ^

[Drew Dowdell]

21 hours ago, Wings4Life said:

So some quick math on a 100K plus BEV vehicle that degraded to 80% or less, you then can factor in another 70-80% effect in the winter months.  So that 200 mile brand new BEV drops to 160 range after 100K in the summer, and about 115 mile range in the cold winter months.  And it never stops degrading.  So hot summers and cold winters only degrade it faster yet.

 

 

Except.... that's not the experience of Model S owners. 

[A Horse With No Name]

2 hours ago, ocnblu said:

did you just call him a betch

You betcha 

39 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Except.... that's not the experience of Model S owners.

Exactly...

[surreal1272]

14 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Except.... that's not the experience of Model S owners. 

There are quite a few Tesla S cars in Phoenix and I have talked to three owners who have all said that their range is just as good now as it was when they first bought them (two of them were first year S models). Also, they have said that they literally lose maybe a few miles of range in the summers here (mostly due to heavy use of the A/C) so we can debunk this excess heat non sense when Phoenix drivers are saying something completely different. The only car here that has been known to take a sizebale hit due to the heat here has been the Leaf but this has been well discussed as to the reasons for this.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

7 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

There are quite a few Tesla S cars in Phoenix and I have talked to three owners who have all said that their range is just as good now as it was when they first bought them (two of them were first year S models). Also, they have said that they literally lose maybe a few miles of range in the summers here (mostly due to heavy use of the A/C) so we can debunk this excess heat non sense when Phoenix drivers are saying something completely different. The only car here that has been known to take a sizebale hit due to the heat here has been the Leaf but this has been well discussed as to the reasons for this.

Debunk physics and chemistry facts, based on a few people you talked to?

Got it.

[surreal1272]

Here's a link from a Tesla owners site regarding that very thing. They all have the same consensus about the range in the heat and the FUD spreaders are not going to like it.

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/tesla-and-summer-heat.58329/

 

Now cold winter months are a bigger issue but even that is not as bad as some are making it out to be and the fact of the matter is that most of this country doesn't experience the type of harsh winters that would negatively affect these EVs. Furthermore, most of these owners probably have a second car so they could just not drive an EV as much in the cold winter months to compensate for it.

[surreal1272]

9 minutes ago, Wings4Life said:

Debunk physics and chemistry facts, based on a few people you talked to?

Got it.

Its called real world ownership experiences as opposed to useless paper stats and maybe you should refer to the link above regarding other owners experiences. Which would one believe more? Paper stats or real world ownership experience? Hmmmm. It doesn't take an engineer to figure that one out but I'm not here to convince you of a damn thing anymore so take that for what it's worth.

 

 What the hell do I know though. I just happen to live in the hottest part of the country and see these things riding around everyday.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

I talked to Tesla owners too, and they said mileage went up.

I swear.

Oh, and I saw several driving by, so I know too

[surreal1272]

I am looking forward to some real world tests and experiences on the Bolt. While it is still a niche car, it could be a potential game changer for GM.

[surreal1272]

48 minutes ago, Wings4Life said:

I talked to Tesla owners too, and they said mileage went up.

I swear.

Oh, and I saw several driving by, so I know too

Good for you. The difference here is (and the reason why I brought it up in the first place) is that seeing them around town in the Phoenix heat encouraged me to ask some of those owners (at the many charging stations around here although one was a friend of my boss) about their experiences with their Teslas. Understand the context now or is being a baby about it easier for you because of who said it?

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

19 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Good for you. The difference here is (and the reason why I brought it up in the first place) is that seeing them around town in the Phoenix heat encouraged me to ask some of those owners (at the many charging stations around here although one was a friend of my boss) about their experiences with their Teslas. Understand the context now or is being a baby about it easier for you because of who said it?

And good for you too. 

Newsflash: Winters are harder on BEV than summer.  

20 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Good for you. The difference here is (and the reason why I brought it up in the first place) is that seeing them around town in the Phoenix heat encouraged me to ask some of those owners (at the many charging stations around here although one was a friend of my boss) about their experiences with their Teslas. Understand the context now or is being a baby about it easier for you because of who said it?

Sadly it won't, GM will continue to lose money hand over fist, as they have been doing with Volt, not unlike pretty much all EV manufacturers.

[surreal1272]

6 minutes ago, Wings4Life said:

And good for you too. 

Newsflash: Winters are harder on BEV than summer.  

Sadly it won't, GM will continue to lose money hand over fist, as they have been doing with Volt, not unlike pretty much all EV manufacturers.

And if you look at my earlier post you will see that I mentioned that winters are harsher. 

 

Good grief. 

 

Dont worry. Ford will join the party soon enough. 

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

8 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

And if you look at my earlier post you will see that I mentioned that winters are harsher. 

 

Good grief. 

 

Dont worry. Ford will join the party soon enough. 

yeah, I am still not excited about Ford continuing their electrification dominance over GM.  BEV's for years, hybrids for decades.  I am glad that GM finally gets to update their brochure though.

[G. David Felt]

Ford does seem to think it is time to invest 4.5 Billion in true EV auto's.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/ford-announces-4-5-billion-investment-in-electrified-vehicles-by-2020/

 

[surreal1272]

76 mile range Focus EV-$30K for a stripper model

238 mile range Bolt-$37K but very well equipped and three times the range. 

 

Yeah GM sure has some catching up to do there. 

14 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Ford does seem to think it is time to invest 4.5 Billion in true EV auto's.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/ford-announces-4-5-billion-investment-in-electrified-vehicles-by-2020/

 

So they'll be minimum three years late to the real range EV party. Good for them. 

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

16 minutes ago, dfelt said:

Ford does seem to think it is time to invest 4.5 Billion in true EV auto's.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/ford-announces-4-5-billion-investment-in-electrified-vehicles-by-2020/

 

Thanks for the year old article. But actually, Ford started their next electrification progression 2 years ago.  Which means they are about 1.5 years from starting to roll it all out.  I just hope they find a true value path to BEV that does not rely soley on massive and costly batteries.  New 115 mile Focus  BEV can get a 75% charge in only 30 min and costs $10K less than Bolt. That's a nice start, but they have a way to go. 

And I will continue to say it, PHEV is the way to go.

Edited December 9, 2016 by Wings4Life