MT Calls Out "Insular, Paranoid" Ford PR

[El Kabong]

Motor Trend recently ran a compact-car comparo, in which the Chevrolet Cruze was the only entrant from Detroit. The Dodge Dart is on it's way out, so fair 'nuff. But why no Ford Focus? MT pulls no punches:

"An increasingly paranoid and insular Ford PR department refused to participate. Again. Rental options failed to meet our demanding specifications, but be warned, Ford: Next time we’re taking whatever beater Hertz has to offer."

Some time ago I cited a piece on Mark Fields where he claimed he hated GM and their success. Now we have a major car magazine openly putting shots across the bow of their PR department. At the time I had a PM discussion going where I opined that Ford was being run in a peevish, unprofessional manner. Based on this, I see no reason to change my assessment.

Read for yourself here:

http://www.motortrend.com/news/compact-cars-big-test-3-missing-players/

Edited July 14, 2016 by El Kabong

[Drew Dowdell]

My interactions with Lincoln's PR department have been..... less than positive. In fact, one time it was insinuated that I was trying to steal an MKC at an event where journalists are invited to drive cars from all participating manufacturers (of which, Lincoln was one) and my badge was more than clear.

[El Kabong]

I remember many moons ago when John Phillips did a review of a Saturn coupe. In the middle of it he basically hit the pause button and unloaded a broadside against GM for building half-assed cars. Thing was, he was right, and now Saturn doesn't exist anymore.

Motor Trend's praise of recent GM products and criticism of recent Ford products isn't because MT has an axe to grind. It's because GM is on a roll and Ford isn't. And a peevish PR department isn't going to help the situation.

[El Kabong]

And the downvotes just go to show that the troll apples don't fall far from the haterade tree. It's unfortunate because it's now pretty clear that they're based almost exclusively on blind hatred for what many folks in the auto biz are talking about openly: Ford isn't really doing that well as far as product appeal goes.

Oh well. My opinion is justified, and that's all that matters.

Edited July 15, 2016 by El Kabong

[surreal1272]

The funny part of it all was seeing all the anti-GM crowd burst into flames after seeing their MT pro-GM talk get thoroughly debunked.

[El Kabong]

If someone is able to put forth a good case and not resort to name-calling in the process then I'm not too concerned. But MT has a bad case of trolls in their comment section. The good thing is that they're so stupid that they actually make GM look good.

[Suaviloquent]

I would agree, but then again, in a luxury crossover test that was Cadillac's to win resulted in a Lincoln upset and a Mercedes victory.

 

Cadillac had no excuse to not send a vehicle, because I was thinking they would win.

 

But judging by how the Focus stands next to it's peers, there's no reason to believe it would win, so I'm not so riled up about it not being in a comparison, where it would have probably been near the bottom.

I remember many moons ago when John Phillips did a review of a Saturn coupe. In the middle of it he basically hit the pause button and unloaded a broadside against GM for building half-assed cars. Thing was, he was right, and now Saturn doesn't exist anymore.

Motor Trend's praise of recent GM products and criticism of recent Ford products isn't because MT has an axe to grind. It's because GM is on a roll and Ford isn't. And a peevish PR department isn't going to help the situation.

 

The Focus isn't a half-assed car, it's just old and the refresh doesn't change that.

[regfootball]

Part of why GM's stock has risen is it's advertising and PR and willingness to throw cars up for the ungrateful car press to devour.

 

There is lots in the news in terms of PR with GM and electrics, ride services, autonomous, etc.  I always see stuff pop up in Google and Facebook where Mary Barra is on some PR mission and it's portrayed in a great light.

 

Ford's product rush was 2011-2013, they just need to get new products going again, but getting an actual PR department that works may be of great service to them.

 

Still doesn't mean the buff books and buff sites aren't stupid rags, and their posters too.  So many pimple faces that probably don't even have licenses and live in their parents' basement.

 

Give it two years and Cruzes will be at the bottom of comparos again too.

Edited July 17, 2016 by regfootball

[William Maley]

Seeing Motor Trend's comment on this isn't that much surprising. I have heard similar stories from a few other folks.

I swear it is easier to pull teeth from a lion than trying to get a media loan from Ford. I have been bugging them for the past few months to try a couple of their vehicles such as the Focus, Mustang, and some Lincoln vehicles. I haven't gotten a response back at all. 
 

[El Kabong]

It's certainly no way to get favourable buzz around your product. And it eventually becomes self-perpetuating: the company refuses to play nice with the media, the media begins to wonder why they don't want to play nice. It doesn't help matters when the PR department has been caught writing checks the product can't cash.

[El Kabong]

...I mean, if I paid 56 grand for a Shelby GT350 and couldn't beat the 0-60 and lateral G numbers of a 42 grand Camaro I guess I'd be a bit salty too

:D

[oldshurst442]

...I mean, if I paid 56 grand for a Shelby GT350 and couldn't beat the 0-60 and lateral G numbers of a 42 grand Camaro I guess I'd be a bit salty too

:D

You know how I would be salty?

 

If I paid 42 grand for a Camaro thinking I was all cool and macho and the first day I took delivery of it I came upon a couple of my neighbor's kids in these:

 

And then, the very next day, Im stopped at the red light and this phoking dufus pulls alongside me:

 

 

So yeah...Id be a bit more salty....Id change my jock strap for panties for sure!

 

Edited July 17, 2016 by oldshurst442

[El Kabong]

You may not like it, man... but GM's movie and toy tie-ins are going to pay dividends down the road... my niece has one of those electric Escalades. In fifteen years she won't be looking to buy no Navigator, I'll tell you that.

[oldshurst442]

Yeah...but....there is a problem EL K...

 

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2016/05/camaro-sales-april-2016-sales-numbers-results-figures/

 

 

The Mustang kicks its ass in sales...

 

YTD 2016 in the USA

 

Camaro

26 038

 

Mustang

42 862

 

and you know what is EMBARRASSING?

That the outdated, old, slow Challenger is at 22 451 units...

ONLY 4000 units lower than the Transformer BRAVADO CAMARO....

 

The Mustang..is still the first in the segment...MOPAR guys will refuse to acknowledge that, but the segment is called the Pony Car segment...

As long as the Mustang is being made by Ford, the Camaro will ALWAYS play second fiddle...

Sure it will have some better years in sales from time to time....but it is the Mustang....

 

PS: That IS a fire breathing Phoenix affectionately known as a Screamin' Chicken as my avatar...kind of a badge engineering car to the Camaro....so yeah....my loyalties fall with GM on this segment more often than not....including my love for a Camaro....its just that GM heavily relies TOO much on product placement on it....

 

Add all the Smokey movies (3) and the Knight Rider thing and that is still  less crap thrown at us than the Transformer BS....

Even Burt Reynolds knew when to quit....

Watch Cannonball Run again....Burt is wondering what car to enter, he looks at the camera when he mentions Trans Am and nods NO... and says" done that already"... and goes with the ambulance...

 

 

YOU SAY IT WILL PAY DIVIDENDS IN THE FUTURE???!!!

I SAY PONTIAC DOES NOT EXIST ANYMORE!!!

Edited July 17, 2016 by oldshurst442

[surreal1272]

Yeah...but....there is a problem EL K...

 

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2016/05/camaro-sales-april-2016-sales-numbers-results-figures/

 

 

The Mustang kicks its ass in sales...

 

YTD 2016 in the USA

 

Camaro

26 038

 

Mustang

42 862

 

and you know what is EMBARRASSING?

That the outdated, old, slow Challenger is at 22 451 units...

ONLY 4000 units lower than the Transformer BRAVADO CAMARO....

 

The Mustang..is still the first in the segment...MOPAR guys will refuse to acknowledge that, but the segment is called the Pony Car segment...

As long as the Mustang is being made by Ford, the Camaro will ALWAYS play second fiddle...

Sure it will have some better years in sales from time to time....but it is the Mustang....

 

PS: That IS a fire breathing Phoenix affectionately known as a Screamin' Chicken as my avatar...kind of a badge engineering car to the Camaro....so yeah....my loyalties fall with GM on this segment more often than not....including my love for a Camaro....its just that GM heavily relies TOO much on product placement on it....

 

Add all the Smokey movies (3) and the Knight Rider thing and that is still  less crap thrown at us than the Transformer BS....

Even Burt Reynolds knew when to quit....

Watch Cannonball Run again....Burt is wondering what car to enter, he looks at the camera when he mentions Trans Am and nods NO... and says" done that already"... and goes with the ambulance...

 

 

YOU SAY IT WILL PAY DIVIDENDS IN THE FUTURE???!!!

I SAY PONTIAC DOES NOT EXIST ANYMORE!!!

Funny you mention Knight Rider when they used a Mustang for the horrible reboot.

[oldshurst442]

 

Yeah...but....there is a problem EL K...

 

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2016/05/camaro-sales-april-2016-sales-numbers-results-figures/

 

 

The Mustang kicks its ass in sales...

 

YTD 2016 in the USA

 

Camaro

26 038

 

Mustang

42 862

 

and you know what is EMBARRASSING?

That the outdated, old, slow Challenger is at 22 451 units...

ONLY 4000 units lower than the Transformer BRAVADO CAMARO....

 

The Mustang..is still the first in the segment...MOPAR guys will refuse to acknowledge that, but the segment is called the Pony Car segment...

As long as the Mustang is being made by Ford, the Camaro will ALWAYS play second fiddle...

Sure it will have some better years in sales from time to time....but it is the Mustang....

 

PS: That IS a fire breathing Phoenix affectionately known as a Screamin' Chicken as my avatar...kind of a badge engineering car to the Camaro....so yeah....my loyalties fall with GM on this segment more often than not....including my love for a Camaro....its just that GM heavily relies TOO much on product placement on it....

 

Add all the Smokey movies (3) and the Knight Rider thing and that is still  less crap thrown at us than the Transformer BS....

Even Burt Reynolds knew when to quit....

Watch Cannonball Run again....Burt is wondering what car to enter, he looks at the camera when he mentions Trans Am and nods NO... and says" done that already"... and goes with the ambulance...

 

 

YOU SAY IT WILL PAY DIVIDENDS IN THE FUTURE???!!!

I SAY PONTIAC DOES NOT EXIST ANYMORE!!!

Funny you mention Knight Rider when they used a Mustang for the horrible reboot.

 

Because the Trans Am was dead...

Pontiac was dead.

 

The Camaro was  alive though.

I wonder why they never went with a Camaro?

 

The Super Snake was just released then though....maybe Ford got product placement frenzy too?

Edited July 18, 2016 by oldshurst442

[oldshurst442]

But...lets be honest...

 

The coolest movie star product placement cars are..well, I wont post any pics, but I guarantee you that Bumblebee is DEAD LAST on the list...

 

Even Starsky and Hutch's red tomato Ford wobbling and bobbling along is waaaaay coooler...on anybody's list, not just mine...

IRONY....

 

HERBIE..the ORIGINAL Bumblebee is cooler that the Camaro Bumblebee...

Edited July 18, 2016 by oldshurst442

[El Kabong]

The Mustang V6 was intended from the get-go for fleet sales. They can have 'em.

The Mustang has (possibly) one more variant to come. The Camaro has two.

If the Mustang doesn't sell, the platform doesn't sell. If the Camaro doesn't sell, the Alpha platform sells... and, as we now see with the CT6, evolves.

And your low opinion of Michael Bay movies notwithstanding, the Bumblebee Camaro is pretty cool.

[ccap41]

I walked my local ford dealer last week and there were 3 V6's, 2 ecoboosts, and 2 5.0s.

Well.. The Alpha platform kind of sells.. Great cars that just don't sell well.

[oldshurst442]

The Mustang V6 was intended from the get-go for fleet sales. They can have 'em.

The Mustang has (possibly) one more variant to come. The Camaro has two.

If the Mustang doesn't sell, the platform doesn't sell. If the Camaro doesn't sell, the Alpha platform sells... and, as we now see with the CT6, evolves.

And your low opinion of Michael Bay movies notwithstanding, the Bumblebee Camaro is pretty cool.

Nah....it aint cool...

 

Well, this Bumblebee Camaro is cool

 

And...like CCAP has pointed out...the Camaro doesnt sell.

You say the Camaro dont sell, no worries, the Alpha platform sells?

No. No it doesnt....the ATS is practically a sales flop...

Great platform...it just does not sell...

 

The Mustang is a one-off platform?

Could very well be....and its a sales success...

 

Sorry EL K.

Maybe Ford's PR department is salty towards media types...I aint arguing that....

Maybe the Mustang falls short on the performance metrics when compared to the Alpha Camaro...but the people have spoken..

They dont care about Michael Bay's and Mary Barra's Alpha Camaro....

Edited July 18, 2016 by oldshurst442

[El Kabong]

And that's all well and good to say.

But again: the kids love these movies, and these cars. And when the time comes when they want to buy, they will buy the version that has learned the lessons gleaned from this car.

That is the kind of PR that you just can't get when you stick your fingers in your ears and say "I can't see you!" to third-party reviewers.

I'm telling you. Ford would be better off eating the humble pie now, because this isn't going to get any easier for them going forward. Ultimately, they just need to make good product. But short of that, they should at least grow up and take a few shots.

It worked for GM.

[oldshurst442]

Like I said...

Trans Am is dead.

Pontiac is dead.

 

Camaro died once before...

[ccap41]

"Ultimately, they just need to make good product."

 

They do.. 

 

Do they make the absolute best performance car in the segment? No. But there are plenty of shortcomings of both cars that make people buy or not buy one of them. They're 2+2 coupes and A LOT of people daily drive these and sometimes you have to sacrifice some things for the greater good of the customer. As enthusiasts it kind of sucks but it's a reality the engineers HAVE to put into consideration because the car HAS to sell. 

[G. David Felt]

Sad when a Company PR department is run with FEAR! 

[Drew Dowdell]

"Ultimately, they just need to make good product."

 

They do.. 

 

Do they make the absolute best performance car in the segment? No. But there are plenty of shortcomings of both cars that make people buy or not buy one of them. They're 2+2 coupes and A LOT of people daily drive these and sometimes you have to sacrifice some things for the greater good of the customer. As enthusiasts it kind of sucks but it's a reality the engineers HAVE to put into consideration because the car HAS to sell. 

 

Agreed, they do make a good product.  The difference in brand quality these days is so miniscule as to be nearly irrelevant.  It primarily comes down to personal taste and comfort level. 

[ccap41]

 

"Ultimately, they just need to make good product."

 

They do.. 

 

Do they make the absolute best performance car in the segment? No. But there are plenty of shortcomings of both cars that make people buy or not buy one of them. They're 2+2 coupes and A LOT of people daily drive these and sometimes you have to sacrifice some things for the greater good of the customer. As enthusiasts it kind of sucks but it's a reality the engineers HAVE to put into consideration because the car HAS to sell. 

 

Agreed, they do make a good product.  The difference in brand quality these days is so miniscule as to be nearly irrelevant.  It primarily comes down to personal taste and comfort level. 

 

Thank you!

Some just see one tenth here or there and call it an ass whoopin.. Minute differences means it's a driver skill battle.

 

Also, in my opinion, I think they should be more alone the lines of the softer slightly more "daily-able" Mustang in their SS and GT trims because they have the 1LE/ZL1/GT350®/GT500 for the hardcore crowd. Make the lesser, sub ~40k trims a little more docile and livable and turn the wick up on the track variances. These all just need to sell if we want them to stick around. It's all good and dandy to have the quickest car but that costs the company more to engineer and produce and to keep these cars around...they have to make money off of them. 

[Frisky Dingo]

Ford has been called out for this numerous times over the last few years. Opting out of comparos for who knows what reason. Idk if they're just stubborn, or afraid to lose a shoot out or what. I really hate that kind of behavior, though. It's what turns me off so much about the Ferrari brand. I have a friend who had an FF, and his stories about Ferrari's attitude and treatment towards him are just despicable. 

 

Meh, one more reason to like GM and Porsche. 

[Suaviloquent]

It only matters if you live and die by the magazines.

 

And if you do, be sure to drink it ALL in. 

[El Kabong]

The magazines exist for those who prefer their driving to be enjoyable. There's nothing wrong with regarding driving as a task, but if you do then you're probably not the type who should be getting excited about Ford's thrashing in MT anyways, right?

And yet some will insist on quibbling, because OF COURSE they want Ford to build fun stuff. Problem is, except for Ford of Europe nobody at Dearborn is really answering the bell right now.

[oldshurst442]

The magazines exist for people to dream a little dream.

The magazines exist for internet bravado and arm chair racing.

 

The magazines exist for fanboys to cheer when the magazines say good things about their favorites.

The magazines exist for fanboys to cry home to mommy when the magazines say bad things about their favorites.

 

The magazines exist and are biased as hell.

The magazines exist and forget their biases whenever it suits their agenda for that particular purpose.

 

Magazines are full of shyte in other words...

[Frisky Dingo]

The magazines exist for people to dream a little dream.

The magazines exist for internet bravado and arm chair racing.

 

The magazines exist for fanboys to cheer when the magazines say good things about their favorites.

The magazines exist for fanboys to cry home to mommy when the magazines say bad things about their favorites.

 

The magazines exist and are biased as hell.

The magazines exist and forget their biases whenever it suits their agenda for that particular purpose.

 

Magazines are full of shyte in other words...

 

 

Nothing's perfect, and I certainly don't believe that means there's no merit in these comparos. I don't put too much stock in finishing orders- especially if they're close- or in some of the super subjective thoughts, but at the same time, if every outlet out there is proclaiming a car to be the best or worst in it's segment, there's prolly something to that.

[Cmicasa the Great]

Why are Camaro sales so relevant to this conversation?

 

The Camaro's price and avail lower models is the issue. When one can go get a Mustang GT for the same price as a Camaro 4cyl or one can't even find those Camaro 4cyls then you know the Mustang is going to be the sales leader. Simple logic.

There is no LS trim, not to mention a $1200 higher starting price over the base Mustang. No cash incentives outside of a lease or 0% finance deal. The 2016 Mustang has $1,750 on the hood or 0% APR and $1,000 cash incentive. Add that to the $1200 price discount over the Chevy and the reason is seen . The backseat thing is out from left field. And the Camaro is not and has never been a family car. I say this as I have lived thru all 6 generations and not once can I remember anyone of my family saying, "hey we are driving to Martha's Vineyard, let's all 5 of us pile into the Camaro (or Mustang) for a long comfy ride." 

People are getting ridiculous and they found one small thing to harp on to try an explain why a more expensive car, that is selling 8% (very Mustang 31%) rental, isn't selling in the same numbers as it's cheaper competition. It's official I need to lay off the Crazy Hater Pills

BTW from. CAMARO6 website: 

Fleet (i.e. Rental) Sales (%) YTD:
Mustang 31%
Challenger 24%
Camaro 8% (may be left over 2015's - I haven't seen a single 2016 for rent)

Average Transaction Price (ATP) after rebates and incentives
Mustang $34k
Challenger $36k
Camaro $38k

Retail sales of :

Mustang: 43,446 YTD
Challenger: 26,302 YTD 
Camaro:*34,338 YTD

[ccap41]

 

The magazines exist for people to dream a little dream.

The magazines exist for internet bravado and arm chair racing.

 

The magazines exist for fanboys to cheer when the magazines say good things about their favorites.

The magazines exist for fanboys to cry home to mommy when the magazines say bad things about their favorites.

 

The magazines exist and are biased as hell.

The magazines exist and forget their biases whenever it suits their agenda for that particular purpose.

 

Magazines are full of shyte in other words...

 

 

Nothing's perfect, and I certainly don't believe that means there's no merit in these comparos. I don't put too much stock in finishing orders- especially if they're close- or in some of the super subjective thoughts, but at the same time, if every outlet out there is proclaiming a car to be the best or worst in it's segment, there's prolly something to that.

 

I agree with both of you. Magazines are about selling..magazines and getting people to click on their links. It is still a business after all that has to be funded to do their job. 

 

Consistently finishing towards the bottom or top is more respectable as it seems harder for everybody to be on the same page so if the all are they it seems like a winner. Buuuuuuut theres a huge "but"... everybody has different needs out of their vehicle. 99% of people never take their cars to a track..ever.. Which is where all of the arm chair racing from the fanboys comes from. And most consumers don't really care about how sporty of a chassis is under a car which is why the Mazdas still just don't sell that well. Very good cars and they seem to win a lot of magazine praise but they still aren't for everybody. 

 

People forget through magazine test numbers that numbers don't make a car magically suit every body's needs. 

[oldshurst442]

@ Frisky originally and CCAP because he chimed in after I posted this by mere seconds.

 

Yes!

 

Your post is the flip side to my post.

When a compare is done, and the automotive journalists/drivers report honestly without any hidden agendas, yes, ABSOLUTELY there is merit.

 

But because cars today are so close competitively, those kinds of reviews are too few and far between.

Edited July 19, 2016 by oldshurst442

[surreal1272]

Why are Camaro sales so relevant to this conversation?[/size]

 

The Camaro's price and avail lower models is the issue. When one can go get a Mustang GT for the same price as a Camaro 4cyl or one can't even find those Camaro 4cyls then you know the Mustang is going to be the sales leader. Simple logic.[/size]There is no LS trim, not to mention a $1200 higher starting price over the base Mustang. No cash incentives outside of a lease or 0% finance deal. The 2016 Mustang has $1,750 on the hood or 0% APR and $1,000 cash incentive. Add that to the $1200 price discount over the Chevy and the reason is seen . The backseat thing is out from left field. And the Camaro is not and has never been a family car. I say this as I have lived thru all 6 generations and not once can I remember anyone of my family saying, "hey we are driving to Martha's Vineyard, let's all 5 of us pile into the Camaro (or Mustang) for a long comfy ride." [/size]

People are getting ridiculous and they found one small thing to harp on to try an explain why a more expensive car, that is selling 8% (very Mustang 31%) rental, isn't selling in the same numbers as it's cheaper competition. It's official I need to lay off the Crazy Hater Pills[/size]BTW from. CAMARO6 website: [/size]Fleet (i.e. Rental) Sales (%) YTD:[/size]Mustang 31%[/size]Challenger 24%[/size]Camaro 8% (may be left over 2015's - I haven't seen a single 2016 for rent)[/size]Average Transaction Price (ATP) after rebates and incentives[/size]Mustang $34k[/size]Challenger $36k[/size]Camaro $38k[/size]Retail sales of :[/size]Mustang: 43,446 YTD[/size]Challenger: 26,302 YTD [/size]Camaro:*34,338 YTD[/size]

My question is why are they having so much trouble making lower trim models available? That makes no sense almost a year later.

[FordCosworth]

Why are Camaro sales so relevant to this conversation?

 

The Camaro's price and avail lower models is the issue. When one can go get a Mustang GT for the same price as a Camaro 4cyl or one can't even find those Camaro 4cyls then you know the Mustang is going to be the sales leader. Simple logic.

There is no LS trim, not to mention a $1200 higher starting price over the base Mustang. No cash incentives outside of a lease or 0% finance deal. The 2016 Mustang has $1,750 on the hood or 0% APR and $1,000 cash incentive. Add that to the $1200 price discount over the Chevy and the reason is seen . The backseat thing is out from left field. And the Camaro is not and has never been a family car. I say this as I have lived thru all 6 generations and not once can I remember anyone of my family saying, "hey we are driving to Martha's Vineyard, let's all 5 of us pile into the Camaro (or Mustang) for a long comfy ride." 

People are getting ridiculous and they found one small thing to harp on to try an explain why a more expensive car, that is selling 8% (very Mustang 31%) rental, isn't selling in the same numbers as it's cheaper competition. It's official I need to lay off the Crazy Hater Pills

BTW from. CAMARO6 website: 

Fleet (i.e. Rental) Sales (%) YTD:

Mustang 31%

Challenger 24%

Camaro 8% (may be left over 2015's - I haven't seen a single 2016 for rent)

Average Transaction Price (ATP) after rebates and incentives

Mustang $34k

Challenger $36k

Camaro $38k

Retail sales of :

Mustang: 43,446 YTD

Challenger: 26,302 YTD 

Camaro:*34,338 YTD

 

 

You might want to edit you " no cash incentives " on 2016 Camaro's.

 

A search says much different than what you claim.

[Drew Dowdell]

A few of the new Camaro are in the rental fleets, but not many.  I've already had 3 Mustang EB convertibles, and had a selection of colors to choose from.

[surreal1272]

Don't know about other locations but the only Camaro deals on Chevrolets website is for special financing deals but no cash back. Any cash back deals are coming only from select dealers from what I've seen.

http://m.chevrolet.com/current-deals.html?vehicle=&zipcode=85345

[G. David Felt]

Don't know about other locations but the only Camaro deals on Chevrolets website is for special financing deals but no cash back. Any cash back deals are coming only from select dealers from what I've seen.

http://m.chevrolet.com/current-deals.html?vehicle=&zipcode=85345

 

Here is the offers in my zip code 98034 and no cash on camaro, but cash on Corvette and SS.

 

[oldshurst442]

Ah...CASA....

 

That YTD post was for me...

 

My link was from April/May....yours is a couple of months after that...cool.

 

What does Camaro sales have to do with anything?

 

Ask EL K who says that future dividends will be paid out...

In the now...the Mustang is winning...and for the future...like I said...The Trans Am is dead...Pontiac the brand is dead...The Trans Am died before Pontiac died...and...Camaro also died once...

Plus... even with your figures, Camaro sales lag behind Mustang sales...

 

Lets us all cut the bullshyte about incentives and fleet sales...

No spin doctoring anything...

 

Ford's PR department might be pissy at the moment.

Boo freakin hoo.

 

This reminds me of the Montreal media going ape shyte because the Montreal Canadiens Hockey Club wouldn't divulge ANY information about their number 1 goalie superstar Carey Price's injury last season.

 

The Montreal Media were inventing stories because the Montreal Hockey Club had nothing to report...and when the Hockey Club told a couple of reporters to stop feeding the public lies....these journalistic idiots said that it was the Hockey Club's fault for them speculating flasehoods and that it is their duty...to lie, in essence...

And they said its the Hockey Club's duty to divulge their secrets to them...

How narcissistic can you get?

And I aint talking about the Habs....and I CANT STAND THE HABS!!!

 

Motor Trend is pissy that they said that they will rent a beater from Avis or Hertz next time if Ford refuses to give them a car...

 

YO Motor Trend...

 

YOU THINK I, AS A READER OF YOUR PISS POOR MAGAZINE, WILL BELIEVE YOUR "JOURNALISTIC" REVIEW IF THAT IS THE CASE???

YOU THINK THAT MAKES YOU MORE OR LESS CREDIBLE?

ESPECIALLY IF ITS A SCATHINGLY NEGATIVE REVIEW!!!

 

Like I said...magazine's words sometimes are worthless...

Edited July 19, 2016 by oldshurst442

[surreal1272]

Don't know about other locations but the only Camaro deals on Chevrolets website is for special financing deals but no cash back. Any cash back deals are coming only from select dealers from what I've seen.http://m.chevrolet.com/current-deals.html?vehicle=&zipcode=85345

 

Here is the offers in my zip code 98034 and no cash on camaro, but cash on Corvette and SS.

 

July2016PNW-Offers.jpg

That's the exact same "deal" they are running on Camaros here. Proof can be a powerful thing as opposed to just saying it's so.

[El Kabong]

The magazines exist for people to dream a little dream.

The magazines exist for internet bravado and arm chair racing.

 

The magazines exist for fanboys to cheer when the magazines say good things about their favorites.

The magazines exist for fanboys to cry home to mommy when the magazines say bad things about their favorites.

 

The magazines exist and are biased as hell.

The magazines exist and forget their biases whenever it suits their agenda for that particular purpose.

 

Magazines are full of shyte in other words...

Says the Ford fan.

I rest my case.

[El Kabong]

...also, the Mustang and Camaro, in GT and SS trims especially, are not terribly close in performance. This is why the Camaro is COTY and the Mustang is not.

Nope. Ford's PR department is feeling the pain, and they're having a hissy fit.

[FordCosworth]

...also, the Mustang and Camaro, in GT and SS trims especially, are not terribly close in performance. This is why the Camaro is COTY and the Mustang is not.

Nope. Ford's PR department is feeling the pain, and they're having a hissy fit.

The Camaro beat out the Mustang for COTY?

[FordCosworth]

 

The magazines exist for people to dream a little dream.

The magazines exist for internet bravado and arm chair racing.

 

The magazines exist for fanboys to cheer when the magazines say good things about their favorites.

The magazines exist for fanboys to cry home to mommy when the magazines say bad things about their favorites.

 

The magazines exist and are biased as hell.

The magazines exist and forget their biases whenever it suits their agenda for that particular purpose.

 

Magazines are full of shyte in other words...

Says the Ford fan.

I rest my case.

I hope you're not basing your case on Olds being a Ford Fan.

From what I gather, he is one of the least biased of anyone.

Edited July 19, 2016 by FordCosworth

[G. David Felt]

Interesting at the COTY for Europe is the Opel / Vauxhall Astra for 2016

 

http://www.caroftheyear.org/winner/2016_105/coty

 

Here is the history list starting with 2016 for COTY from Motor Trend and the Camaro is listed as the 2016 winner.

 

http://www.motortrend.com/news/car-of-the-year-winners-2/

 

Ford Wins:

 

2010 for the Fusion.

2002 Thunderbird

2000 Lincoln LS

1994 Mustang

1993 Probe GT

1990 Lincoln Towncar

1989 Thunderbird SC

1987 Thunderbird Turbo

1986 Taurus LX

1974 Mustang II

1970 Torino

 

GM Wins:

 

2016 Camaro

2014 Cadillac CTS

2011 VOLT

1998 Corvette

1997 Malibu

2008 Cadillac CTS

1992 Cadillac Seville

1991 Chevy Caprice LTZ

1988 Pontiac Grand Prix

1984 Corvette

1982 Camaro Z/28

1980 Citation

1979 Buick Riviera S

1977 Caprice

1975 Monza 2+2

1973 Monte Carlo 

1971 Vega

 

This is how it has gone since 1970 but you guys can look at the rest of the list on your own. INTERESTING I will say.

[surreal1272]

The magazines exist for people to dream a little dream.

The magazines exist for internet bravado and arm chair racing.

 

The magazines exist for fanboys to cheer when the magazines say good things about their favorites.

The magazines exist for fanboys to cry home to mommy when the magazines say bad things about their favorites.

 

The magazines exist and are biased as hell.

The magazines exist and forget their biases whenever it suits their agenda for that particular purpose.

 

Magazines are full of shyte in other words...

Says the Ford fan.

I rest my case.

How exactly is he a Ford fan? Good grief man. Why be an ass about everything?

[ccap41]

I think what he was insinuating was that the Mustang was not in the competition for Car of the Year. Therefore it did not directly beat it. The Mustang was not there because it was not new for 2016 model year therefore it was not even in the running for COTY, if I remember correctly. 

[surreal1272]

...also, the Mustang and Camaro, in GT and SS trims especially, are not terribly close in performance. This is why the Camaro is COTY and the Mustang is not.

Nope. Ford's PR department is feeling the pain, and they're having a hissy fit.

The Camaro beat out the Mustang for COTY?

He never said that. It's easy to deduce what is meant here is that the year before, the Mustang did not get COTY while the Camaro did the next year.

[ccap41]

 

 

The magazines exist for people to dream a little dream.

The magazines exist for internet bravado and arm chair racing.

 

The magazines exist for fanboys to cheer when the magazines say good things about their favorites.

The magazines exist for fanboys to cry home to mommy when the magazines say bad things about their favorites.

 

The magazines exist and are biased as hell.

The magazines exist and forget their biases whenever it suits their agenda for that particular purpose.

 

Magazines are full of shyte in other words...

Says the Ford fan.

I rest my case.

How exactly is he a Ford fan? Good grief man. Why be an ass about everything?

 

I thought the same thing.. 

 

OLDs of all people is quite open minded about vehicles he likes and why he likes them/they suit his needs. He's been pretty open about liking a lot more older Camaros and Pontiacs than Mustangs. I mean his freakin' name and pic are of GM products! 

 

This is the biggest reason I cannot stand Mr. Bong. Complete ignorance but he saw a brand/person-humping-said-brand get slightly insulted and takes literal offense to it.. And he has class to refer to other people as "children".