What does Cadillac mean to you?

[FordCosworth]

" CRUCIAL QUESTIONS FOR CADILLAC. "

http://www.autoextremist.com/

[balthazar]

PDL gets more 'rambling' as the years go by.

His 'point' that no one knows the name of a brand new Cadillac model…. that didn't replace a prior one is… a non-issue. No one "knew" what a 'Model S' was, now it's outselling the S-class. C'mon, give the auto consumer a bit of credit.

[surreal1272]

PDL gets more 'rambling' as the years go by.

His 'point' that no one knows the name of a brand new Cadillac model…. that didn't replace a prior one is… a non-issue. No one "knew" what a 'Model S' was, now it's outselling the S-class. C'mon, give the auto consumer a bit of credit.

My thoughts exactly. His bias was plain as day as well.

[William Maley]

" CRUCIAL QUESTIONS FOR CADILLAC. "

http://www.autoextremist.com/

A quote from this piece.

 

 

 

 The new XT5 shows promise, but it should have been called the Escalade S in order to capitalize on the Escalade’s name recognition and reputation.

I'm sorry what?! NO NO NO NO

I do think Peter does make some good points once in awhile. But they are buried in a mess of other words. To put it simply.

[surreal1272]

" CRUCIAL QUESTIONS FOR CADILLAC. "http://www.autoextremist.com/

A quote from this piece.

 

 

 

 The new XT5 shows promise, but it should have been called the Escalade S in order to capitalize on the Escalade’s name recognition and reputation.[/size]

I'm sorry what?! NO NO NO NO

I do think Peter does make some good points once in awhile. But they are buried in a mess of other words. To put it simply.

Exactly because then the trolls would be screaming "the FWD Escalade S deludes the Esclalade brand because of FWD der de der!"

[smk4565]

^ Ignored the question.

Do people know the 'CTS' name now or not?

 

How is introducing 'CT6' now any different WRT people learning what it refers to over time?

 

Did people get confused & think the mercedes 'GLC' was a rebadged mazda GLC?

Yes people know CTS now because they spent 15 years advertising it.  So they throw that away and spend 10-15 years advertising CT4 and then they'll throw that away and start over again.

 

GLK to GLC isn't that bad of a change, when there is already a similar looking C-class.  And they changed SLK to SLC even though it has nothing to do with the C-class chassis.  GLC sales up 84% in February and 97% in March.  GLC is on fire!

[El Kabong]

I find it amusing that the only real misstep Cadillac has made product wise is being late to the party with modern small SUVs. As DeLorenzo himself admitted, the Escalade remains both immensely desirable and profitable. It is the Eldorado that he (and me, to be fair) wishes still existed.

But the CT6 is a great car. The CTS is a great car. The ATS isn't as space-efficient as some would like, but still... great car.

They DO need more/better advertising tho

[smk4565]

Delorenzo has some good points, the CT6 marketing campaign is craptastic.  However the XT5 should not be called Escalade S or Escalade sport or anything like that.  Horrible idea when you are going to have at least 3 crossovers, you can't call them all Escalade-something.  

 

Interesting that Johan wants to get to an 11% operating margin in 10 years.  Audi is there now.   People want to say sales don't matter, margin does, well Cadillac margins must be terrible if they are 10 years away from getting to Audi's level, especially when you can platform and engine stare with other GM vehicles.

[oldshurst442]

I find it amusing that the only real misstep Cadillac has made product wise is being late to the party with modern small SUVs. As DeLorenzo himself admitted, the Escalade remains both immensely desirable and profitable. It is the Eldorado that he (and me, to be fair) wishes still existed.

But the CT6 is a great car. The CTS is a great car. The ATS isn't as space-efficient as some would like, but still... great car.

They DO need more/better advertising tho

If not the El Dorado, then the El Miraj.

For presumably for you and him and most definitely me. 

 

But, there has been many missteps in the product portfolio the last decade.

And yes, we shall go back a decade.

We have to.

 

Maybe a M-B CLS is not selling like Camrys, but its a product that gives recognition to the brand.

Maybe a M-B CLA is cheap and crappy in Cimarron proportions, but it gives M-B the volume sales to pad the pockets.

Maybe a GLK was ugly as sin, and cheap in Cimarron proportions but it paved the way for the GLC.

 and I could go on....but Ill stick to these 3, as these are all new models fro M-B and the oldest is just a tad older than a decade.

The other two are barely 8 years old....and all 3 are all household names....

In a decade's time, could we actually think of M-B WITHOUT a CLS, GLC and CLA?

 

Now...we will do Cadillac

 

What new awe-inspiring product has Cadillac brought out the last decade that blew people's minds like the CLS to draw attention to the brand?

What new entry level bullshyte car has Cadillac brought out the last decade to pad the coffers like the CLA has done?

What new CUV has Cadillac got....OK....the SRX which has become the XT5......

 

But...

CTS coupe....FAILURE

ELR....FAILURE

XLR.....FAILURE

 

AWESOME CONCEPTS THAT WOULD HAVE TURNED THE SHIP AROUND....

CIEL

EL MIRAJ

 

Cadillac V16....

 

Sure....lack of money that GM did not have hence the bankruptcy....

But...please EL K....

 

Dont say that there hasnt been any missteps.

The ELR was money thrown down the loo.

The CTS coupe should have had a successor...

It was bold, ugly, but bold.

Cadillac should have continued maybe with a 4 door coupe CTS on this new CTS platform....

Take another bloody chance!

PDL feels like there are many that are HUNGRY for a "REAL" Cadillac...

 

I feel the same way....

 

The CT6....restrained....

maybe for good reasons....but its a big Cadillac car.

Big Cadillac cars could never "take it too far"....

 

In fact, that is what big Cadillacs SHOULD be doing....taking it too far!

 

The ELR and the CTS coupe are small cars....

Edited April 29, 2016 by oldshurst442

[balthazar]

Delorenzo has some good points, the CT6 marketing campaign is craptastic.  However the XT5 should not be called Escalade S or Escalade sport or anything like that.  Horrible idea when you are going to have at least 3 crossovers, you can't call them all Escalade-something.  

You are aware PDL is an ex GM-copywriter who was 'slighted' in the early '80s and hasn't 'seen a GM ad he likes' since, right?

 

CT6 campaign so far has been very decent- has created nice aspiration & mood. FAR better than the mercedes 'disco chicken' ads.

 

I agree that 'Escalade S' is a poor suggestion. 

 

Interesting that Johan wants to get to an 11% operating margin in 10 years.  Audi is there now.   People want to say sales don't matter, margin does, well Cadillac margins must be terrible if they are 10 years away from getting to Audi's level, especially when you can platform and engine stare with other GM vehicles.

Mercedes & BMW are hoping to get to Audi's margins too, but they don't have a vast volkswagon part warehouse in which to make it work yet.

Audi A2 thru A6 : VW powertrains. For shame. 

 

[hyperv6]

De Lorenzo is starting to show his age. 

 

Cadillac for sure has a lot of work yet to do they now are just putting in the system to carry them into the future. Just count in the last how many years we had a  major turnover of leadership all GM insiders that followed marching orders because they were afraid to make changes. 

This shows in their cars as while they are very competitive cars they still lack the details that the others do not. The complaints of simple things like self dimming mirrors, better dashes and just higher quality items like door handles have been an issue that Mark Reuss has been fighting the board over since he took his position. 

He now has his South African Pit Bull that is not intimidated by the GM leaders and is willing to mash some toes to get the product over the top to where it needs to be. 

 

Now I for one know that few outside Cadillac really know what is going on inside. But we do know that the present leaders are fixing what they have as we are just now seeing the minor changed. We are next going to see their own products. They have stated what they have is good but it needs to be better. 

As for the marketing. Well here is the delema. Do you market the cars aggressively that you knowledge as being not as good as you want them to be or do you fix them and then market them as the cars you feel set the standard. It is a mixed message to go out and say the ATS is the ultimate luxury car and in a press meeting discuss how you really need to make changes as the dash is below expectations and other issues you discuss. 

 

As the new and refresh product comes you will see a move from marketing from a attitude to a more product driven plan. 

 

We started out as Dare Greatly and then them went to the next step and next Don't you dare and next it may be We Dare you to try the new CT6. 

The fact the CT6 has a new name will not matter to most people as they could have cared less about the past Cadillac's as they really have little or a poor opinion of the division. They will need to sell what ever they have and with a new name there is no preconceived notions. 

People that are going to buy Cadillac will buy Cadillac. You need to focus on the folks who have not considered them before and change their impressions. It is not much different than the sell to the youth argument as you can sell a old man an young mans car but you can not sell a young man an old mans car. 

Besided if you are building for the future you do not go after 65 year olds you go to the younger buyers. While some may not buy now you need to make an impression on them to consider you as they become more affluent.

The truth is Automaker market to kids today to get them to form a positive opinion on their products that often carry over to adult hood. 

Lets face it many of us were GM fans as far back to when we were 5 years old.  

[El Kabong]

The STS coupe wasn't a failure. The failure was failing to do a second one. It was a pretty bold styling exercise, and got the brand attention.

The ELR was an afterthought. A beautiful afterthought, but an afterthought.

As for the ElMiraj or possibly Ciel: Cadillac chose to go a bit conservative with the CT6. Not my preference, but still recognizable as a big Caddy, and it is a nice place to sit yerself down in. After seeing it in the flesh and spending some time in one, the wife made me a bit nervous when she told me she'd be interested in getting one.

Edited April 29, 2016 by El Kabong

[surreal1272]

 

 

" CRUCIAL QUESTIONS FOR CADILLAC. "http://www.autoextremist.com/

A quote from this piece.

 

 

 

 The new XT5 shows promise, but it should have been called the Escalade S in order to capitalize on the Escalade’s name recognition and reputation.[/size]

I'm sorry what?! NO NO NO NO

I do think Peter does make some good points once in awhile. But they are buried in a mess of other words. To put it simply.

Exactly because then the trolls would be screaming "the FWD Escalade S deludes the Esclalade brand because of FWD der de der!"

 

Thanks for the down vote. That's how I know I was telling the truth.

[smk4565]

 

Delorenzo has some good points, the CT6 marketing campaign is craptastic.  However the XT5 should not be called Escalade S or Escalade sport or anything like that.  Horrible idea when you are going to have at least 3 crossovers, you can't call them all Escalade-something.  

You are aware PDL is an ex GM-copywriter who was 'slighted' in the early '80s and hasn't 'seen a GM ad he likes' since, right?

 

CT6 campaign so far has been very decent- has created nice aspiration & mood. FAR better than the mercedes 'disco chicken' ads.

 

I agree that 'Escalade S' is a poor suggestion. 

 

 

 

Interesting that Johan wants to get to an 11% operating margin in 10 years.  Audi is there now.   People want to say sales don't matter, margin does, well Cadillac margins must be terrible if they are 10 years away from getting to Audi's level, especially when you can platform and engine stare with other GM vehicles.

Mercedes & BMW are hoping to get to Audi's margins too, but they don't have a vast volkswagon part warehouse in which to make it work yet.

Audi A2 thru A6 : VW powertrains. For shame. 

 

 

Uh oh, found this on Forbes. com

 

"The boost in volumes has also trickled down to Mercedes’ margins. As automotive companies typically have large fixed costs, they have a high degree of operating leverage. This means that a significant increase in volume sales/top line trickles down to the profits, as well. Driven by the high volume rise and product and price mix, Mercedes reported EBIT from ongoing business of €2.2 billion in Q3, up 38% year-over-year, and profit margins of 10.4%. The company has recuperated well after one-time costs associated with the launch of new/refreshed models had lowered operating margins to around 3% in the first quarter of 2013. High demand for the luxury automaker, and favorable pricing, should boost profitability in the last quarter, as well. In fact, Mercedes’ 10.2% operating margins for Q1-Q3 2015 are more than Audi’s 9.2% and BMW’s 9% reported operating margins during the same period."

 

Mercedes had a 6.2% operating margin in 2013, and up to 8.3% in 4th quarter 2014.   Slow steady climb up to the 10% of today.  And exactly where they want to be.    I guess their strategy worked.  And a lot of people say the CLA has a lot of volume, the CLA barely outsells the S-class.

[surreal1272]

 

^ Ignored the question.

Do people know the 'CTS' name now or not?

 

How is introducing 'CT6' now any different WRT people learning what it refers to over time?

 

Did people get confused & think the mercedes 'GLC' was a rebadged mazda GLC?

Yes people know CTS now because they spent 15 years advertising it.  So they throw that away and spend 10-15 years advertising CT4 and then they'll throw that away and start over again.

 

GLK to GLC isn't that bad of a change, when there is already a similar looking C-class.  And they changed SLK to SLC even though it has nothing to do with the C-class chassis.  GLC sales up 84% in February and 97% in March.  GLC is on fire!

 

Same problem for both companies but of course you only see it as a problem for one company. Typical.

[smk4565]

 

People that are going to buy Cadillac will buy Cadillac. You need to focus on the folks who have not considered them before and change their impressions. It is not much different than the sell to the youth argument as you can sell a old man an young mans car but you can not sell a young man an old mans car. 

Besided if you are building for the future you do not go after 65 year olds you go to the younger buyers. While some may not buy now you need to make an impression on them to consider you as they become more affluent.

The truth is Automaker market to kids today to get them to form a positive opinion on their products that often carry over to adult hood. 

 

Yes, Cadillac has to market to the people that aren't buying the car now.  This is what they are awful at.  They aren't conquesting from the Japanese and Germans. If they don't conquest, they have to get huge numbers of first time luxury buyers, I don't think they are doing that either.

 

They have to market to people that can afford the car though.  If they make a car that 30 years think is cool, but they can't afford more than a $25,000 car, it doesn't do Cadillac any good.

 

How about the Corvette?  Median buyer age of 61, and they don't build it with VTEC for the younger buyers, they build it to suit the fan base, and the fan base buys it.  They aren't trying to sell it to 30 year olds that can't afford it.

[surreal1272]

 

 

Delorenzo has some good points, the CT6 marketing campaign is craptastic.  However the XT5 should not be called Escalade S or Escalade sport or anything like that.  Horrible idea when you are going to have at least 3 crossovers, you can't call them all Escalade-something.  

You are aware PDL is an ex GM-copywriter who was 'slighted' in the early '80s and hasn't 'seen a GM ad he likes' since, right?

 

CT6 campaign so far has been very decent- has created nice aspiration & mood. FAR better than the mercedes 'disco chicken' ads.

 

I agree that 'Escalade S' is a poor suggestion. 

 

 

 

Interesting that Johan wants to get to an 11% operating margin in 10 years.  Audi is there now.   People want to say sales don't matter, margin does, well Cadillac margins must be terrible if they are 10 years away from getting to Audi's level, especially when you can platform and engine stare with other GM vehicles.

Mercedes & BMW are hoping to get to Audi's margins too, but they don't have a vast volkswagon part warehouse in which to make it work yet.

Audi A2 thru A6 : VW powertrains. For shame. 

 

 

Uh oh, found this on Forbes. com

 

"The boost in volumes has also trickled down to Mercedes’ margins. As automotive companies typically have large fixed costs, they have a high degree of operating leverage. This means that a significant increase in volume sales/top line trickles down to the profits, as well. Driven by the high volume rise and product and price mix, Mercedes reported EBIT from ongoing business of €2.2 billion in Q3, up 38% year-over-year, and profit margins of 10.4%. The company has recuperated well after one-time costs associated with the launch of new/refreshed models had lowered operating margins to around 3% in the first quarter of 2013. High demand for the luxury automaker, and favorable pricing, should boost profitability in the last quarter, as well. In fact, Mercedes’ 10.2% operating margins for Q1-Q3 2015 are more than Audi’s 9.2% and BMW’s 9% reported operating margins during the same period."

 

Mercedes had a 6.2% operating margin in 2013, and up to 8.3% in 4th quarter 2014.   Slow steady climb up to the 10% of today.  And exactly where they want to be.    I guess their strategy worked.  And a lot of people say the CLA has a lot of volume, the CLA barely outsells the S-class.

 

Uh oh. You are trying to compare the entire Mercedes lineup against one brand of GM instead all the brands of GM, which (btw) has increased it's profits every year since coming out of bankruptcy. Just thought you should know before making yet another apples to oranges comparison.

[surreal1272]

 

 

People that are going to buy Cadillac will buy Cadillac. You need to focus on the folks who have not considered them before and change their impressions. It is not much different than the sell to the youth argument as you can sell a old man an young mans car but you can not sell a young man an old mans car. 

Besided if you are building for the future you do not go after 65 year olds you go to the younger buyers. While some may not buy now you need to make an impression on them to consider you as they become more affluent.

The truth is Automaker market to kids today to get them to form a positive opinion on their products that often carry over to adult hood. 

 

Yes, Cadillac has to market to the people that aren't buying the car now.  This is what they are awful at.  They aren't conquesting from the Japanese and Germans. If they don't conquest, they have to get huge numbers of first time luxury buyers, I don't think they are doing that either.

 

They have to market to people that can afford the car though.  If they make a car that 30 years think is cool, but they can't afford more than a $25,000 car, it doesn't do Cadillac any good.

 

How about the Corvette?  Median buyer age of 61, and they don't build it with VTEC for the younger buyers, they build it to suit the fan base, and the fan base buys it.  They aren't trying to sell it to 30 year olds that can't afford it.

 

You're right Cadillac doesn't do that. MB does though MB markets towards that same group of 30 year olds, hence the CLA and the heavy marketing push by MB touting its "under $30,000" campaign. Funny how you don't mention that.

[smk4565]

 

 

 

Delorenzo has some good points, the CT6 marketing campaign is craptastic.  However the XT5 should not be called Escalade S or Escalade sport or anything like that.  Horrible idea when you are going to have at least 3 crossovers, you can't call them all Escalade-something.  

You are aware PDL is an ex GM-copywriter who was 'slighted' in the early '80s and hasn't 'seen a GM ad he likes' since, right?

 

CT6 campaign so far has been very decent- has created nice aspiration & mood. FAR better than the mercedes 'disco chicken' ads.

 

I agree that 'Escalade S' is a poor suggestion. 

 

 

 

Interesting that Johan wants to get to an 11% operating margin in 10 years.  Audi is there now.   People want to say sales don't matter, margin does, well Cadillac margins must be terrible if they are 10 years away from getting to Audi's level, especially when you can platform and engine stare with other GM vehicles.

Mercedes & BMW are hoping to get to Audi's margins too, but they don't have a vast volkswagon part warehouse in which to make it work yet.

Audi A2 thru A6 : VW powertrains. For shame. 

 

 

Uh oh, found this on Forbes. com

 

"The boost in volumes has also trickled down to Mercedes’ margins. As automotive companies typically have large fixed costs, they have a high degree of operating leverage. This means that a significant increase in volume sales/top line trickles down to the profits, as well. Driven by the high volume rise and product and price mix, Mercedes reported EBIT from ongoing business of €2.2 billion in Q3, up 38% year-over-year, and profit margins of 10.4%. The company has recuperated well after one-time costs associated with the launch of new/refreshed models had lowered operating margins to around 3% in the first quarter of 2013. High demand for the luxury automaker, and favorable pricing, should boost profitability in the last quarter, as well. In fact, Mercedes’ 10.2% operating margins for Q1-Q3 2015 are more than Audi’s 9.2% and BMW’s 9% reported operating margins during the same period."

 

Mercedes had a 6.2% operating margin in 2013, and up to 8.3% in 4th quarter 2014.   Slow steady climb up to the 10% of today.  And exactly where they want to be.    I guess their strategy worked.  And a lot of people say the CLA has a lot of volume, the CLA barely outsells the S-class.

 

Uh oh. You are trying to compare the entire Mercedes lineup against one brand of GM instead all the brands of GM, which (btw) has increased it's profits every year since coming out of bankruptcy. Just thought you should know before making yet another apples to oranges comparison.

 

Johan has stated his goal was to get Cadillac to a 10% operating margin.  He never said his goal is to get all of GM to a 10% margin, just Cadillac.  Audi has been over 10% before, the Germans are running 9-10% margin now, (Porsche I am sure higher), why does Johan think it will take 10 years to get there?

 

If you want to compare to GM, here is from their April 21, 2016 press release:

 

"The company set first-quarter records for earnings and margin, with earnings before interest and tax (EBIT) adjusted of $2.7 billion and EBIT-adjusted margin of

7.1 percent. These compare to EBIT-adjusted of $2.1 billion and an EBIT-adjusted margin of 5.8 percent in the first quarter of 2015."

 

​

[hyperv6]

 

 

People that are going to buy Cadillac will buy Cadillac. You need to focus on the folks who have not considered them before and change their impressions. It is not much different than the sell to the youth argument as you can sell a old man an young mans car but you can not sell a young man an old mans car. 

Besided if you are building for the future you do not go after 65 year olds you go to the younger buyers. While some may not buy now you need to make an impression on them to consider you as they become more affluent.

The truth is Automaker market to kids today to get them to form a positive opinion on their products that often carry over to adult hood. 

 

Yes, Cadillac has to market to the people that aren't buying the car now.  This is what they are awful at.  They aren't conquesting from the Japanese and Germans. If they don't conquest, they have to get huge numbers of first time luxury buyers, I don't think they are doing that either.

 

They have to market to people that can afford the car though.  If they make a car that 30 years think is cool, but they can't afford more than a $25,000 car, it doesn't do Cadillac any good.

 

How about the Corvette?  Median buyer age of 61, and they don't build it with VTEC for the younger buyers, they build it to suit the fan base, and the fan base buys it.  They aren't trying to sell it to 30 year olds that can't afford it.

 

 

 

Yawn!!!!

I work with three 30-45 year old ATS owners that love their cars. They all had never considered an ATS let alone a Cadillac till they drove one. 

 

The point is the 61 year olds are going to buy and may get one or two more sales out of them.. The smart move is to market to they young and as they become more affluent you become an option. 

BMW, and Audi took years to build their rep here as they were not always the ultimate driving machines here. They were seen as the old mans quirky cars that they drove with their plaid caps. 

 

This is like building a Football team through the draft. you take the time to get young and new players and taken the time to build them into a team. Then you continue to build this way and retain your advantage. 

Unlike teams that pick up a few free agents that are older and may have lost a step and then have to try to replace them in a year or two. 

[smk4565]

 

 

 

People that are going to buy Cadillac will buy Cadillac. You need to focus on the folks who have not considered them before and change their impressions. It is not much different than the sell to the youth argument as you can sell a old man an young mans car but you can not sell a young man an old mans car. 

Besided if you are building for the future you do not go after 65 year olds you go to the younger buyers. While some may not buy now you need to make an impression on them to consider you as they become more affluent.

The truth is Automaker market to kids today to get them to form a positive opinion on their products that often carry over to adult hood. 

 

Yes, Cadillac has to market to the people that aren't buying the car now.  This is what they are awful at.  They aren't conquesting from the Japanese and Germans. If they don't conquest, they have to get huge numbers of first time luxury buyers, I don't think they are doing that either.

 

They have to market to people that can afford the car though.  If they make a car that 30 years think is cool, but they can't afford more than a $25,000 car, it doesn't do Cadillac any good.

 

How about the Corvette?  Median buyer age of 61, and they don't build it with VTEC for the younger buyers, they build it to suit the fan base, and the fan base buys it.  They aren't trying to sell it to 30 year olds that can't afford it.

 

You're right Cadillac doesn't do that. MB does though MB markets towards that same group of 30 year olds, hence the CLA and the heavy marketing push by MB touting its "under $30,000" campaign. Funny how you don't mention that.

 

CLA median buyer age is 46.  But Mercedes brand overall is 52-56 depending on what survey you believe.  So they are marketing toward younger than their norm with the CLA, but they aren't ignoring their customer base.  CLA is a way to get new buyers into the brand.  That is what smart companies do, they cover all bases.  They sell 4 crossovers, 5 if you want to count GLE coupe as separate. 

 

I have long said Cadillac desperately needs a small crossover, that is a way to attract younger buyers.  But their older buyers probably want V8s and classic American luxury, give it to them.  Cater to both.

[smk4565]

Cadillac needs ads like this, that play on heritage.  They never talk about their history.  They could copy this ad with Since 1902, "standard of the world" put, talk about the first electric starter, the first mast produced V8, the 1930s V16 Phaeton, 50s Eldorado, hopefully they won a race at some point in their history that they can throw in, show the technology of the CT6, lightweight construction, etc.   

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8QnBqH-KfM

 

 

Sorry, I didn't know how to put the video so it plays on here.

Edited April 29, 2016 by smk4565

[smk4565]

Here is another one, "Since 1886"  Cadillac could easily do a similar ad, and talk up the heritage.  Acura, Lexus, and Infiniti have no heritage, unless Lexus wants to run that video of the 1991 LS400 balancing champagne glasses on the hood.   Cadillac needs their word names back, Fleetwood, Eldorado, play up the heritage they have, spark some emotion, you strike the memories of older buyers, you teach the young ones who you were.  To people under 35 they only know Cadillac as a poorly made American land yacht who only recently tried to make sports sedans, and has the Escalade, that rappers and athletes drive.  The millenials don't know Cadillac was the first modern car really with the 3 pedal set up, and gear shifter on the floor that every other car adopted, that they had interchangeable parts, first V8, etc.  You gotta tell the story.

 

https://www.ispot.tv/ad/A5ac/mercedes-benz-since-1886

[surreal1272]

People that are going to buy Cadillac will buy Cadillac. You need to focus on the folks who have not considered them before and change their impressions. It is not much different than the sell to the youth argument as you can sell a old man an young mans car but you can not sell a young man an old mans car.

Besided if you are building for the future you do not go after 65 year olds you go to the younger buyers. While some may not buy now you need to make an impression on them to consider you as they become more affluent.

The truth is Automaker market to kids today to get them to form a positive opinion on their products that often carry over to adult hood.

Yes, Cadillac has to market to the people that aren't buying the car now. This is what they are awful at. They aren't conquesting from the Japanese and Germans. If they don't conquest, they have to get huge numbers of first time luxury buyers, I don't think they are doing that either.

They have to market to people that can afford the car though. If they make a car that 30 years think is cool, but they can't afford more than a $25,000 car, it doesn't do Cadillac any good.

How about the Corvette? Median buyer age of 61, and they don't build it with VTEC for the younger buyers, they build it to suit the fan base, and the fan base buys it. They aren't trying to sell it to 30 year olds that can't afford it.

You're right Cadillac doesn't do that. MB does though MB markets towards that same group of 30 year olds, hence the CLA and the heavy marketing push by MB touting its "under $30,000" campaign. Funny how you don't mention that.

CLA median buyer age is 46. But Mercedes brand overall is 52-56 depending on what survey you believe. So they are marketing toward younger than their norm with the CLA, but they aren't ignoring their customer base. CLA is a way to get new buyers into the brand. That is what smart companies do, they cover all bases. They sell 4 crossovers, 5 if you want to count GLE coupe as separate.

I have long said Cadillac desperately needs a small crossover, that is a way to attract younger buyers. But their older buyers probably want V8s and classic American luxury, give it to them. Cater to both.

Whatever you have to tell yourself. You've been proven wrong so many times that posts like this don't even need a real response. You to try to dodge and weave but just corner yourself with double standards (letter naming schemes), outright lies (like saying dealerships don't matter), and so much BS that I can't do anything but laugh at the utter fanboy blindness.

Here is another one, "Since 1886" Cadillac could easily do a similar ad, and talk up the heritage. Acura, Lexus, and Infiniti have no heritage, unless Lexus wants to run that video of the 1991 LS400 balancing champagne glasses on the hood. Cadillac needs their word names back, Fleetwood, Eldorado, play up the heritage they have, spark some emotion, you strike the memories of older buyers, you teach the young ones who you were. To people under 35 they only know Cadillac as a poorly made American land yacht who only recently tried to make sports sedans, and has the Escalade, that rappers and athletes drive. The millenials don't know Cadillac was the first modern car really with the 3 pedal set up, and gear shifter on the floor that every other car adopted, that they had interchangeable parts, first V8, etc. You gotta tell the story.

https://www.ispot.tv/ad/A5ac/mercedes-benz-since-1886

See above post and then go watch the "get your cheap ass Mercedes for under thirty thousand dollars" ad on YouTube. Yeah, great emphasis on luxury heritage by trying to pimp a car that can be beat by cheaper non-luxury compacts on so many levels. Edited April 29, 2016 by surreal1272

[hyperv6]

Here is another one, "Since 1886"  Cadillac could easily do a similar ad, and talk up the heritage.  Acura, Lexus, and Infiniti have no heritage, unless Lexus wants to run that video of the 1991 LS400 balancing champagne glasses on the hood.   Cadillac needs their word names back, Fleetwood, Eldorado, play up the heritage they have, spark some emotion, you strike the memories of older buyers, you teach the young ones who you were.  To people under 35 they only know Cadillac as a poorly made American land yacht who only recently tried to make sports sedans, and has the Escalade, that rappers and athletes drive.  The millenials don't know Cadillac was the first modern car really with the 3 pedal set up, and gear shifter on the floor that every other car adopted, that they had interchangeable parts, first V8, etc.  You gotta tell the story.

 

https://www.ispot.tv/ad/A5ac/mercedes-benz-since-1886

You really think they care if Cadillac had the first 3 pedal, interchangeable parts or even one that matters like the Electric Starter. Give me a break.

Todays buyers are all about what can you do for me now. They want to know.

How fast can you make me?

How powerful will it make me look owning your car?

How much advanced technology will I get for my money?

How well will my car work with my Cell Phone?

Does the car look cool?

Todays market is all about what can you do for me and look at me. Yes it is self centered. The fact is no one needs a high end luxury or performance car you have to make them want it for what it is and what it can do for your image. We all could easily get by with a Spark if it was just about getting there. It is what the product will do for your experience getting there and what it will do for your image.

A business person going to say Firestone Country club for 18 holes and to make a deal will want to make a good impression. Will his potential business partner be more believing in his pitch if he is in a Honda Civic or a Bentley? When you go down the street many people like it when other see them and wonder what they did to succeed. This is what Cadillac needs to represent. Cadillac needs to be the symbol of achievement.

These buyers can give a turkey about what you did in 1911. Many don't know and most don't care. Just worldly crusty old men who have fond memories of models of the past that often if they were in the last 40 years were no where near as good as they remember them.

By the way they steel the Benz hood ornament's because of the image not what they have done.

Funny how Benz leaves out the great cars they built for Hitler? They were some of their best cars. Selective history?

"Cadillac" we never built cars for people that killed millions. That could catch on.

Edited April 29, 2016 by hyperv6

[surreal1272]

Here is another one, "Since 1886"  Cadillac could easily do a similar ad, and talk up the heritage.  Acura, Lexus, and Infiniti have no heritage, unless Lexus wants to run that video of the 1991 LS400 balancing champagne glasses on the hood.   Cadillac needs their word names back, Fleetwood, Eldorado, play up the heritage they have, spark some emotion, you strike the memories of older buyers, you teach the young ones who you were.  To people under 35 they only know Cadillac as a poorly made American land yacht who only recently tried to make sports sedans, and has the Escalade, that rappers and athletes drive.  The millenials don't know Cadillac was the first modern car really with the 3 pedal set up, and gear shifter on the floor that every other car adopted, that they had interchangeable parts, first V8, etc.  You gotta tell the story. https://www.ispot.tv/ad/A5ac/mercedes-benz-since-1886

You really think they care if Cadillac had the first 3 pedal, interchangeable parts or even one that matters like the Electric Starter. Give me a break.Todays buyers are all about what can you do for me now. They want to know.How fast can you make me?How powerful will it make me look owning your car?How much advanced technology will I get for my money?How well will my car work with my Cell Phone?Does the car look cool?Todays market is all about what can you do for me and look at me. Yes it is self centered. The fact is no one needs a high end luxury or performance car you have to make them want it for what it is and what it can do for your image. We all could easily get by with a Spark if it was just about getting there. It is what the product will do for your experience getting there and what it will do for your image.A business person going to say Firestone Country club for 18 holes and to make a deal will want to make a good impression. Will his potential business partner be more believing in his pitch if he is in a Honda Civic or a Bentley? When you go down the street many people like it when other see them and wonder what they did to succeed. This is what Cadillac needs to represent. Cadillac needs to be the symbol of achievement.These buyers can give a turkey about what you did in 1911. Many don't know and most don't care. Just worldly crusty old men who have fond memories of models of the past that often if they were in the last 40 years were no where near as good as they remember them.By the way they steel the Benz hood ornament's because of the image not what they have done.Funny how Benz leaves out the great cars they built for Hitler? They were some of their best cars. Selective history?"Cadillac" we never built cars for people that killed millions. That could catch on.

I'd up vote this a hundred times if I could!

[surreal1272]

I can see the Mercedes slogan for their heritage commercial now 

 

"Hey. If it was good enough for Hitler, it should be good enough for you. Take over the world in a Mercedes by visiting your local Mercedes Benz Dealership today!"

Edited April 29, 2016 by surreal1272

[Suaviloquent]

I think there was a huge amount of coercion in those times.

 

If you don't make a saloon for the Fuhrer, you die in a back alley, basically.

 

I don't think anyone is proud of that part of history. 

[Suaviloquent]

No. Cadillac is perceived as high-tech from the younger crowd. Why?

 

Most of the people my age here, when I show them the new pics of Cadillac, they are very pleased. Now about the price....none of them could be said to be buying in the segment. They are mostly subsuming to value for money, so they like Hyundai and Kia.... and you know the rest.

 

Now...heritage? F*** it. Cadillac can reinvent itself. Heritage is just history with a future.  I do not agree with the naming system AT ALL....

 

but eventually you see through the veil of the stupid names and actually see the car.

[smk4565]

The advantage Cadillac has over the Japanese brands and Audi for the most part is a long history and their heritage.  That is something they could play up to boost their image.  If they are going to try to advertise their technology and make that the focus, they better have the best technology out there.  And they don't even have Super Cruise yet, when even Volvo has semi Autonomous driving.  There isn't really a true identity or clear focus that they use to differentiate themselves from the crowd.

[Suaviloquent]

I'd say Cadillac is more differentiated now then it ever has been for the last 20 years. It has product wherever it does compete. 

 

They have a focus on light-weighting, and Super Cruise will be just fine. Not everyone is going to jump to the nearest competing autonomous features as soon as they come out.  

 

I think what matters most is how they deal with the legacy issues. They may have a large heritage, but fairly recent going back the last few previous decades, the decline, that's awry.

[surreal1272]

The advantage Cadillac has over the Japanese brands and Audi for the most part is a long history and their heritage.  That is something they could play up to boost their image.  If they are going to try to advertise their technology and make that the focus, they better have the best technology out there.  And they don't even have Super Cruise yet, when even Volvo has semi Autonomous driving.  There isn't really a true identity or clear focus that they use to differentiate themselves from the crowd.[/quote

Again, down voted for your cluelessness

[surreal1272]

The advantage Cadillac has over the Japanese brands and Audi for the most part is a long history and their heritage.  That is something they could play up to boost their image.  If they are going to try to advertise their technology and make that the focus, they better have the best technology out there.  And they don't even have Super Cruise yet, when even Volvo has semi Autonomous driving.  There isn't really a true identity or clear focus that they use to differentiate themselves from the crowd.

Oh and it's coming next year. Nice job of keeping up with times while your'e trolling so hard. Make sure you pay special attention to what they said about the competitions efforts in it thus far.

 

Better to be right, when it comes out, than to be first.

 

http://blog.caranddriver.com/cruise-slip-cadillacs-semi-autonomous-super-cruise-tech-wont-arrive-until-2017/

[hyperv6]

The advantage Cadillac has over the Japanese brands and Audi for the most part is a long history and their heritage.  That is something they could play up to boost their image.  If they are going to try to advertise their technology and make that the focus, they better have the best technology out there.  And they don't even have Super Cruise yet, when even Volvo has semi Autonomous driving.  There isn't really a true identity or clear focus that they use to differentiate themselves from the crowd.

Time to stop living in the past. 

The public is looking at them as asking what have you done lately? 

 

You promote what you are doing today. Few relevant people give a F about a Eldorado as the last one they had was really a crappy car. 

 

Audi has a long history called Auto Union and it means nothing yet people love their present cars. The Japanese gain trusting owners as they move up from their Toyota from their Lexus and the fact they are cheaper than most German cars. 

The fact is why would you try real hard to sell a ATS now when it will see a name change in a year and a decent revamp when it moved to a CT name. Same with the CTS. You have the CT6 and XT5 just now coming online and you will see the focus start here. 

This deal is not a sprint race as it is a Marathon. It take time to build a auto company image and with Cadillac being profitable at this point there is no rush to spend money that will be negated soon with a new product. 

 

There is absolutely no sense in spending millions on a marketing a car that is about to be transformed. It is a waste of money and it makes it less than creditable that you have to re explain to the customer to forget what we just told you as this is the best car now. You do not put money into an old horse. 

[smk4565]

Cadillac has been saying wait till next year since 2002.  

 

Remember they launched the STS, SRX performance crossover, and XLR roadster in the same year.  That was to be an assault on the 5-series/E-class, the X5/M-class and the Mercedes SL and Jaguar XK and Lexus SC430.  They attacked 3 segments in the heart of the luxury market at one time, and got no where, they gave up on all 3 products.

 

They have been saying "wait till next year" and "this product is on the way" for the past 15 years.  The other guys have that product on sale now, and that is where the people are going.

[surreal1272]

Cadillac has been saying wait till next year since 2002.  

 

Remember they launched the STS, SRX performance crossover, and XLR roadster in the same year.  That was to be an assault on the 5-series/E-class, the X5/M-class and the Mercedes SL and Jaguar XK and Lexus SC430.  They attacked 3 segments in the heart of the luxury market at one time, and got no where, they gave up on all 3 products.

 

They have been saying "wait till next year" and "this product is on the way" for the past 15 years.  The other guys have that product on sale now, and that is where the people are going.

You have a very distorted view of history. Not surprising though.

[FordCosworth]

http://247wallst.com/autos/2016/04/29/cadillacs-problem-of-the-cars-it-cant-sell/#ixzz47Vn2bZZ9

[smk4565]

http://247wallst.com/autos/2016/04/29/cadillacs-problem-of-the-cars-it-cant-sell/#ixzz47Vn2bZZ9

Good find.

[balthazar]

Actually, it's not nearly as significant as it would seem.

Reading elsewhere, it seems these numbers for Cadillac are WITHIN 2 WEEKS of it's competition in these segments.

ALL the luxury sedan sales are down/inventories are up.

 

smk- you can call this another one of your "snapshots".

[hyperv6]

http://247wallst.com/autos/2016/04/29/cadillacs-problem-of-the-cars-it-cant-sell/#ixzz47Vn2bZZ9

 

Well lets put this story into better perspective. 

 

#10 ATS. GM has had trouble this year with some decline in sales as this car ages. It is only now getting some changes and late next year may be replaced with a updated Alpha with a CT name.

Lease deals are down and they should have pulled back on production. Keep in mind declines in their segment a 10% decline can be a small number of cars per month. It is not like this is a Camry where 10% drops can be tens of thousands of cars.

 

#9 Kia is the lost soul. They are trying to take them more up market but people already buy Hyundai. They have more work to do to find their place. As of now it is a car lost in a very competitive segment.

 

#8 For one it is a Volvo and this one is at the end of it’s life. Sale will drop. Also keep in mind Volvo is now Chinese. This may affect Cult status with some of their followers?

 

#7 Ok you take a already slow selling and under performing Fiat and make it longer. Do I need to say more? FCA is facing a revolt with dealers as they are not happy with the slow sales of their cars. Many dealers are bailing out if they can. Fiat has more issues than just the 500L.

 

#6 XTS. Oldest Cadillac and basically left for service and fleet sales. What more do you need to know? The CT6 has replaced this car.

The only reason the XTS was done was the CT6 was a ways out and the XTS was already done long back in the banruptcy era. The design was shelved till they had money and it was only used to buy time.

 

#5 The Verano. This was a car Buick tried to see how it would work. It did ok but did not set the world on fire. But that is ok as sales in China have paid for all the tooling and any other cost here so there really was little to lose in risk. It is an old car and again one soon to be replaced. drop off sales are expected anyways. No suprise here to those who know what the hell is going on at Buick.

 

#4 Two things one it is a Coupe and Two it is a Infinity. Also the overseas sales will carry this one so it was worth their risk.

 

#3 ELR What the Hell? It was a question no one asked and just was one of the few bad decisions GM has made post bankruptcy. I expect we will not see a repeat of this again.

 

#2 GT-R. For one they do not sell many. Two they are replacing this car soon with more power and more updated styling. What else do I need to add. Just look at the last year of sales for any sports car and there is a drop off.

 

#1 This one is a real problem as it should see big volumes as it is a cheap affordable car and it is a Honda. It just give proof that even Honda can miss it on models. To sell under 4,000 unit here is a really big issue for this car and Honda. I expect to see them make changes soon as they do not rest long if they do make a mistake. Gas prices did not help but it has not hit other small cars as bad with worse reps than the Honda.

Cadillac still has to earn it’s image and reputation back. They have started on that and will continue to grow that. But it take time and continued investment. We are far from hitting the panic button at this point as we have a lot of things coming.

 

To be honest to sell as many old ATS as they have is pretty amazing in this SUV, CUV market. The segment is stagnate for all.

Also the media appears to like to be misleading on this story head line and kind of hedge a bit in the story. They for years have loved to pile on GM. At time it was fair but many times it is not fair as they are just looking for click bate on the web.

They also try to mix in CR reviews here but that often is based on readers reviews. Most people will not review a product unless they are mad for one. and two just because you subscribe to CR does not make you a automotive expert qualified to understand let alone review a car. 

 

As for CR they are a experts in everything but master of none. Car reviews for them are like going to a a steak house and ordering a vegan platter and then complaining about the quality. 

Edited May 2, 2016 by hyperv6

[surreal1272]

Actually, it's not nearly as significant as it would seem.

Reading elsewhere, it seems these numbers for Cadillac are WITHIN 2 WEEKS of it's competition in these segments.

ALL the luxury sedan sales are down/inventories are up.

 

smk- you can call this another one of your "snapshots".

^This. Don't know how many times people have to be told the obvious, like reminding them of the very fact you just mentioned about sedan sales in general.

[smk4565]

Actually, it's not nearly as significant as it would seem.

Reading elsewhere, it seems these numbers for Cadillac are WITHIN 2 WEEKS of it's competition in these segments.

ALL the luxury sedan sales are down/inventories are up.

 

smk- you can call this another one of your "snapshots".

This was from December 2014, but not good news for Cadillac.

http://www.cheatsheet.com/automobiles/americas-most-wanted-12-vehicles-flying-off-dealer-lots.html/?a=viewall

 

"For a luxury status symbol that only costs a small fortune, the Mercedes E-Class remains at the top of America’s wish list. In fact, data recently showed the E350 sedan ($52,300) is the third-highest selling car priced above $50,000 in the U.S. That would explain the hot demand for this classy Benz offering 302 horsepower and 29 miles per gallon on the highway. Tied with three other vehicles for fourth, fifth, sixth, and seventh on this list, you could say only three automobiles are in hotter demand in America than the Mercedes E350. They disappear from Daimler lots in 11 days on average."

 

11 days!!!

[smk4565]

February 2015 story,  CLA sold in an average of 10 days on dealer lots.  And that is the bad Mercedes no one wants.

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/autos/news/january-2015-fastest-selling-cars-article-1.2101560

[balthazar]

Wake up & read the stats !

 

- - - - -

2016, Year to Date ::

 

BMW 3-series :: DOWN 30%

BMW 5-series :: DOWN 20%

 

MB C-class :: DOWN 15%

MB E-class :: DOWN 24%

 

ATS :: DOWN 22%

CTS :: DOWN 14%

Edited May 3, 2016 by balthazar

[smk4565]

August 2015 fastest selling cars, from September 2015 Cars.com

https://www.cars.com/articles/augusts-fastest--and-slowest-selling-cars-1420681121521/?cmp=sf12686344+sf12686344

 

Mercedes GLE 8 days

Mercedes GL  11 days

[smk4565]

Wake up & read the stats !

 

- - - - -

2016, Year to Date ::

 

BMW 3-series :: DOWN 30%

BMW 5-series :: DOWN 20%

 

MB C-class :: DOWN 15%

MB E-class :: DOWN 24%

 

ATS :: DOWN 22%

CTS :: DOWN 14%

an E-class in its 7th model year and the 2016 is no longer in production.  I wouldn't worry about the E-class, the turn around starts this summer with the 2017.  The more they run that ad where the driver lifts his hands off the wheel and the car drives itself, the more people will want it.   That is next level, none of the competition drives itself.

[surreal1272]

August 2015 fastest selling cars, from September 2015 Cars.com

https://www.cars.com/articles/augusts-fastest--and-slowest-selling-cars-1420681121521/?cmp=sf12686344+sf12686344

 

Mercedes GLE 8 days

Mercedes GL  11 days

Not to split hairs over your bar moving, but those are CUVs your posting while there is a ton of numbers showing the decline in sedan sales. You do understand the difference there right?

Wake up & read the stats !

 

- - - - -

2016, Year to Date ::

 

BMW 3-series :: DOWN 30%

BMW 5-series :: DOWN 20%

 

MB C-class :: DOWN 15%

MB E-class :: DOWN 24%

 

ATS :: DOWN 22%

CTS :: DOWN 14%

an E-class in its 7th model year and the 2016 is no longer in production.  I wouldn't worry about the E-class, the turn around starts this summer with the 2017.  The more they run that ad where the driver lifts his hands off the wheel and the car drives itself, the more people will want it.   That is next level, none of the competition drives itself.

And most of the age demographic that the E Class markets itself to could care less.

[smk4565]

Well I did post examples of E-class and CLA selling in 10-11 days on dealer lots, that were from 2015, at the same time the Cadillacs were taking 120-150 days.   I couldn't find any 2016 numbers.

[Cmicasa the Great]

How ironic that on the day I return to posting.. after being in mourning since last Thursday.. I get this in the mail and endeavor into this page of the thread. Benz is trying to get me to get rid of my CTS for an Eclass.. using the New CTS 2.0L @$45K as a reason I should buy.. LOL.. a Certified E-Class for $1000 less. They are putting out the VALUE proposition thinking that I would.. if I had a 2.0L.. get rid of it for a f@#kin E-Class 

 

 

[surreal1272]

Well I did post examples of E-class and CLA selling in 10-11 days on dealer lots, that were from 2015, at the same time the Cadillacs were taking 120-150 days.   I couldn't find any 2016 numbers.

Yet you continued to post irrelevant numbers about irrelevant to the topic vehicles, in this posting CUV numbers when we have clearly been talking about sedans.