Cadillac CT6 Review Thread: Post Them ALL Here.

[Cmicasa the Great]

Still missing, outside of the handing capabilities what is pigeon holing the CT6 in the Sports car segment. If we were taking Vseries... Sure.. But this car screams luxury. By the same rationale some are coming up with.. The 7series, A8, and XJ are all Corvette competition

[ccap41]

My ONLY gripe with this car is just that the exterior design is about 10% shy of enough visual drama. I'm obviously a GM guy, especially Chevy and Cadillac, and I guarantee I can't pick this car out from a CTS beyond 50 feet.

 

I've grown to like it more than I did at first, because when it was unveiled, I was HUGELY disappointed not to see cues from the Ciel and Elmiraj. Just because this isn't a "true" flagship, IMO that's not an excuse to give the car a face that could pass for a mild refresh of the car slotted below it.

 

But I digress. I give the exterior a B or B-, but the rest of the car seems to be a straight A student.

 

I completely know what you mean. The CTS and CT6 from almost ANY distance at all look the exact same. And if it's tough for us car guys to tell them apart then there is no way the ignorant public will be able to tell them apart. They both look very very good to me but they do look very similar. Now, I know MB is on a fast track to do the same thing from C->S and I'm not excusing them either. I think they look very good but these luxury automakers need to differentiate A LITTLE bit more. 

[Suaviloquent]

Yeeseeeh, I was alluding to the dig against BMW for the same reason - buyers in this class are irrational sometimes.

 

But alas, having an excellent interior in this size and class is a basic care factor. You expect it no matter what. Or you should.

 

What you don't expect is compact sport sedan beating handling. And that is the true selling point of the CT6.

 

"Look at us. We can make a car handle better than our own ATS, and we can make it the size of the S-Class"

 

^^^^^

 

That my good sirs is what Cadillac I think is going for. We make more happen out of less, and of the less we use, it's the best.

 

I can't believe people think I'm making digs against the car. No sirreee - i've been playing it up the whole time, but talking at the core strategic level.

 

Okay, I do apologize in one respect - I realize I was bit abrupt and not exactly explaining the mishmash, but here in the explanation I'm getting at now.

 

But Cadillac has to convince the buyer that this is worth while, and worth pursuing. Many people get out of the sport sedan for the very reasons they want a luxury barge. Okay, the CT6 can do that too. But if it's only driven like that for some, where's the value in better handling - unless of course, efficiency will be killer, and other qualitative and quantitative.... dadada dada...

 

Now why would I talk up the Continental? Okay, then why are everyday people - who really are unfamiliar with both brands - the average joe  putting two and two together.

 

Because that is the key marketing riddle Cadillac has to solve. Do it, and they are bound for greatness. Like I said before, I would get the CT6 because to me, the mission of the car, as presented above (what I think atleast) is what makes the car incredible.

[Stew]

 

Sedan sales were all down last year.

I am hopeful for Cadillac sales improving, but I don't think this sedan will do it.

 

Sedans sales will remain flat. The SUV models at Lincoln and Cadillac will provide volume and the sedans will make it on profit. Cadillac is in a place they do not have to sell a ton of sedans anymore. The price point here carry's them to high profits and the volume in China takes care of the rest, 

 

Lincoln will not sell a ton of sedans but they too will do fine on profit. They will sell these at twice the price of the average Fusion and they do not really cost close to that to build. That is why everyone is looking to this segment and why those inside Ford were able to save Lincoln. There is just too much profit per unit to give up here. Unless you are Chrysler and you discount the 300 to the price of a mid size car. It is really sad how mismanaged FCA is. They could and should be making a killing on the 300 if they would update it with a new platform and added technology. Yet they let it wither on the vine. They have mismanaged the 200 and Dart now they think leaving the segment is a good idea? Just plain nuts. 

 

 

Any chance to take a shot at FCA....  You realize Cadillac rebates right now are FAR higher than 300 rebates, right?  I can pretty well guarantee you they are making plenty of profit on each 300 sold.  Also, where is it missing tech?  The platform is also fine for what the 300 is.  With the CT6 Caddy is finally realizing it isn't all about figure 8s and lateral Gs, it is about the ride to most and the 300 has that in spades.  it also has a good looking exterior.  if it is lacking anywhere it is the interior design. We are just a couple years off from it's replacement anyway which WILL be on a new platform.   It just feels bland.  Caddy is doing interiors right.  heck, Dodge is doing better interior design than the 300 has got in their LX variants.  If they updated the interior to be more inline wih the 200/Pacfica that alone would be he biggest upgrade it needs.  And none o this is a kick on Caddy, I LOVE what they are doing, but i think the CT6 is where they need to be on all their cars except the sportiest variants and they will get there. 

[smk4565]

As far as China goes the Audi A6 is the luxury car champion there. I think A6 sales in China are higher than Malibu sales in the US. Continental and CT6 are a lot bigger than an A6, plus that market is slowing.

Continental going to $70k for a black label would be ridiculous. I still think Continental should be $44k base, $50k with the turbo and loaded black label for $59k.

I would be surprised if the E-class does not go down in price since they now have a standard 4. So if the E300 is $50k and E450/E43 is $62k, you have stiff competition at that price point. This is why the Acuar RLX is a sales dog, that car should be $40k not $50k.

[ccap41]

^ That's just unreasonable pricing, you realize that right?

 

For example, A Malibu starts at 22k and can be built up to 36k or so. That's 14k from base to top of the line. And you're saying a luxury car should go from base to top of the line for only 14k as well?

 

A 3 Series starts at 33k and can be built up to 63k and that's no M3. Just a fully loaded 340i xDrive.  But if it's a Lincoln it can't price simlarly. 

 

Even an RLX starts at 55k and built to about 70k. And you get one weak 3.5L or a hybrid. 

 

#DoubleStandardSMK 

[hyperv6]

Sedan sales were all down last year.

I am hopeful for Cadillac sales improving, but I don't think this sedan will do it.

 

Sedans sales will remain flat. The SUV models at Lincoln and Cadillac will provide volume and the sedans will make it on profit. Cadillac is in a place they do not have to sell a ton of sedans anymore. The price point here carry's them to high profits and the volume in China takes care of the rest, 

 

Lincoln will not sell a ton of sedans but they too will do fine on profit. They will sell these at twice the price of the average Fusion and they do not really cost close to that to build. That is why everyone is looking to this segment and why those inside Ford were able to save Lincoln. There is just too much profit per unit to give up here. Unless you are Chrysler and you discount the 300 to the price of a mid size car. It is really sad how mismanaged FCA is. They could and should be making a killing on the 300 if they would update it with a new platform and added technology. Yet they let it wither on the vine. They have mismanaged the 200 and Dart now they think leaving the segment is a good idea? Just plain nuts.

 

Any chance to take a shot at FCA....  You realize Cadillac rebates right now are FAR higher than 300 rebates, right?  I can pretty well guarantee you they are making plenty of profit on each 300 sold.  Also, where is it missing tech?  The platform is also fine for what the 300 is.  With the CT6 Caddy is finally realizing it isn't all about figure 8s and lateral Gs, it is about the ride to most and the 300 has that in spades.  it also has a good looking exterior.  if it is lacking anywhere it is the interior design. We are just a couple years off from it's replacement anyway which WILL be on a new platform.   It just feels bland.  Caddy is doing interiors right.  heck, Dodge is doing better interior design than the 300 has got in their LX variants.  If they updated the interior to be more inline wih the 200/Pacfica that alone would be he biggest upgrade it needs.  And none o this is a kick on Caddy, I LOVE what they are doing, but i think the CT6 is where they need to be on all their cars except the sportiest variants and they will get there.

Stew I know well that Cadillac has rebates but they are not selling their luxury cars for $28k-$35K either. My in-laws own one they bought for just over $30K new. It was a very good buy for them but little meat on the bone for FCA.

Now even with discounts on Cadillac the profits are still there as they have a lot of meat on that bone even at the rebated price.

Now if you are comfortable with Chrysler selling a 300 that cheap that is fine but that is a car that should hold a much higher and much more profitable price point.

Keep in mind you are the one who said the 200 and Dart were just doing just great and I said they were struggling You got mad at me for that. Well are you now mad at Sergio for killing them for struggling vs. fixing them like he should?

I think most here would agree with my observations of FCA and their failure to do the things they should be doing. Stop relying on Alfa to save them. To not abandon the small car segment and if you want to fix FCA the path is through a better financed and better focused Chrysler not any of the Italian brands. Chrysler would bring the volume and profits they need but not just by only doing trucks and SUV models.

A well balance and executed portfolio of Chrysler owned products would be strong for FCA but right now Sergio either can not afford to do it or is foolish enough to think they can not do a mid size car?

Now if you think that is a shot at Chrysler then I really question your allegiance to the brand. To me you have a house on fire and you appear to think it will not burn down if you deny it is on fire.

Most of my Chrysler buddies are besides themselves over what is going on there. These are some real hard core guys and they are not happy with Sergio or FCA.

But I guess we are all wrong and only you and Sergio are right.

FYI if this all goes south I will be the first to tell you I told you so. I will not do it with glee but in hope as I really will be sad to see Chrysler go down.

[Stew]

 

 

 

Sedan sales were all down last year.

I am hopeful for Cadillac sales improving, but I don't think this sedan will do it.

 

Sedans sales will remain flat. The SUV models at Lincoln and Cadillac will provide volume and the sedans will make it on profit. Cadillac is in a place they do not have to sell a ton of sedans anymore. The price point here carry's them to high profits and the volume in China takes care of the rest, 

 

Lincoln will not sell a ton of sedans but they too will do fine on profit. They will sell these at twice the price of the average Fusion and they do not really cost close to that to build. That is why everyone is looking to this segment and why those inside Ford were able to save Lincoln. There is just too much profit per unit to give up here. Unless you are Chrysler and you discount the 300 to the price of a mid size car. It is really sad how mismanaged FCA is. They could and should be making a killing on the 300 if they would update it with a new platform and added technology. Yet they let it wither on the vine. They have mismanaged the 200 and Dart now they think leaving the segment is a good idea? Just plain nuts.

 

 

Any chance to take a shot at FCA....  You realize Cadillac rebates right now are FAR higher than 300 rebates, right?  I can pretty well guarantee you they are making plenty of profit on each 300 sold.  Also, where is it missing tech?  The platform is also fine for what the 300 is.  With the CT6 Caddy is finally realizing it isn't all about figure 8s and lateral Gs, it is about the ride to most and the 300 has that in spades.  it also has a good looking exterior.  if it is lacking anywhere it is the interior design. We are just a couple years off from it's replacement anyway which WILL be on a new platform.   It just feels bland.  Caddy is doing interiors right.  heck, Dodge is doing better interior design than the 300 has got in their LX variants.  If they updated the interior to be more inline wih the 200/Pacfica that alone would be he biggest upgrade it needs.  And none o this is a kick on Caddy, I LOVE what they are doing, but i think the CT6 is where they need to be on all their cars except the sportiest variants and they will get there.

 

Stew I know well that Cadillac has rebates but they are not selling their luxury cars for $28k-$35K either. My in-laws own one they bought for just over $30K new. It was a very good buy for them but little meat on the bone for FCA.

Now even with discounts on Cadillac the profits are still there as they have a lot of meat on that bone even at the rebated price.

Now if you are comfortable with Chrysler selling a 300 that cheap that is fine but that is a car that should hold a much higher and much more profitable price point.

Keep in mind you are the one who said the 200 and Dart were just doing just great and I said they were struggling You got mad at me for that. Well are you now mad at Sergio for killing them for struggling vs. fixing them like he should?

I think most here would agree with my observations of FCA and their failure to do the things they should be doing. Stop relying on Alfa to save them. To not abandon the small car segment and if you want to fix FCA the path is through a better financed and better focused Chrysler not any of the Italian brands. Chrysler would bring the volume and profits they need but not just by only doing trucks and SUV models.

A well balance and executed portfolio of Chrysler owned products would be strong for FCA but right now Sergio either can not afford to do it or is foolish enough to think they can not do a mid size car?

Now if you think that is a shot at Chrysler then I really question your allegiance to the brand. To me you have a house on fire and you appear to think it will not burn down if you deny it is on fire.

Most of my Chrysler buddies are besides themselves over what is going on there. These are some real hard core guys and they are not happy with Sergio or FCA.

But I guess we are all wrong and only you and Sergio are right.

FYI if this all goes south I will be the first to tell you I told you so. I will not do it with glee but in hope as I really will be sad to see Chrysler go down.

 

Dude, your first HUGE wrong assumption is hat Chrysler is a full-on Luxury brand like Cadillac, they are not.  They are actually the mainstream and before that more entry level ala Buick.   FYI, the 200 IS doing just great, never said as much on the Dart though, just that it DOES sell enough to be profitable.  Again, they are NOT leaving those segments, basically just outsourcing the smaller cars.  It makes sense and ou would realize that if ou had read my other post in the Chrysler forum.  I also called out the 300 where it actually NEEDS work.  You simply do not like them and take every chance to down them, even in a Cadillac thread.  That says a lot about our thoughts..............

[Cmicasa the Great]

 

My ONLY gripe with this car is just that the exterior design is about 10% shy of enough visual drama. I'm obviously a GM guy, especially Chevy and Cadillac, and I guarantee I can't pick this car out from a CTS beyond 50 feet.

 

I've grown to like it more than I did at first, because when it was unveiled, I was HUGELY disappointed not to see cues from the Ciel and Elmiraj. Just because this isn't a "true" flagship, IMO that's not an excuse to give the car a face that could pass for a mild refresh of the car slotted below it.

 

But I digress. I give the exterior a B or B-, but the rest of the car seems to be a straight A student.

 

I completely know what you mean. The CTS and CT6 from almost ANY distance at all look the exact same. And if it's tough for us car guys to tell them apart then there is no way the ignorant public will be able to tell them apart. They both look very very good to me but they do look very similar. Now, I know MB is on a fast track to do the same thing from C->S and I'm not excusing them either. I think they look very good but these luxury automakers need to differentiate A LITTLE bit more. 

 

 

 

 

 

U two.. Please make an excuse for the BMW 5 and 7series

 

 

 

 

 

Hell on the S-Class, C-Class, and E-Class.. they didn't do anything but shot the first with a miniature ray. At least with the Cadillacs... one doesn't have to break out a measuring tape to tell the difference

[ccap41]

C'mon man, I even said, " Now, I know MB is on a fast track to do the same thing from C->S and I'm not excusing them either. I think they look very good but these luxury automakers need to differentiate A LITTLE bit more."

 

I'm not "excusing" anybody. I acknowledged that they are not the only ones to do so.  I didn't mention BMW but if it makes you feel better BMW and Audi are the same way, better? I doubt many could differentiate an A6 from and A8 or an A4 from an A8. 

[Cmicasa the Great]

Yeeseeeh, I was alluding to the dig against BMW for the same reason - buyers in this class are irrational sometimes.

 

But alas, having an excellent interior in this size and class is a basic care factor. You expect it no matter what. Or you should.

 

What you don't expect is compact sport sedan beating handling. And that is the true selling point of the CT6.

 

"Look at us. We can make a car handle better than our own ATS, and we can make it the size of the S-Class"

 

^^^^^

 

That my good sirs is what Cadillac I think is going for. We make more happen out of less, and of the less we use, it's the best.

 

I can't believe people think I'm making digs against the car. No sirreee - i've been playing it up the whole time, but talking at the core strategic level.

 

Okay, I do apologize in one respect - I realize I was bit abrupt and not exactly explaining the mishmash, but here in the explanation I'm getting at now.

 

But Cadillac has to convince the buyer that this is worth while, and worth pursuing. Many people get out of the sport sedan for the very reasons they want a luxury barge. Okay, the CT6 can do that too. But if it's only driven like that for some, where's the value in better handling - unless of course, efficiency will be killer, and other qualitative and quantitative.... dadada dada...

 

Now why would I talk up the Continental? Okay, then why are everyday people - who really are unfamiliar with both brands - the average joe  putting two and two together.

 

Because that is the key marketing riddle Cadillac has to solve. Do it, and they are bound for greatness. Like I said before, I would get the CT6 because to me, the mission of the car, as presented above (what I think atleast) is what makes the car incredible.

 

 

 

OK.. I'll give U a pass. But in truth.. the in order for sales supremacy.. what Cadillac really needs to do is convince the current XTS owners.. that the replacement CT6 isworth the extra starting price. Considering the fact that most XTSs go out the door for far more than the $46K starting price. I willing to bet that they can get some of them to pony up for the extra 8 thousand measly dollars

[Cmicasa the Great]

C'mon man, I even said, " Now, I know MB is on a fast track to do the same thing from C->S and I'm not excusing them either. I think they look very good but these luxury automakers need to differentiate A LITTLE bit more."

 

I'm not "excusing" anybody. I acknowledged that they are not the only ones to do so.  I didn't mention BMW but if it makes you feel better BMW and Audi are the same way, better? I doubt many could differentiate an A6 from and A8 or an A4 from an A8. 

 

 

I read what U highlighted.. and only pointed it out for others. The thing is that there are several actual differences in the ATS to CTS to CT6.. and even XTS. despite from FAR OFF they look similar. The S-Class and C-Class are almost exact copies of each other.. certainly the 5 and 7Series are as well. 

[hyperv6]

Sedan sales were all down last year.

I am hopeful for Cadillac sales improving, but I don't think this sedan will do it.

 

Sedans sales will remain flat. The SUV models at Lincoln and Cadillac will provide volume and the sedans will make it on profit. Cadillac is in a place they do not have to sell a ton of sedans anymore. The price point here carry's them to high profits and the volume in China takes care of the rest, 

 

Lincoln will not sell a ton of sedans but they too will do fine on profit. They will sell these at twice the price of the average Fusion and they do not really cost close to that to build. That is why everyone is looking to this segment and why those inside Ford were able to save Lincoln. There is just too much profit per unit to give up here. Unless you are Chrysler and you discount the 300 to the price of a mid size car. It is really sad how mismanaged FCA is. They could and should be making a killing on the 300 if they would update it with a new platform and added technology. Yet they let it wither on the vine. They have mismanaged the 200 and Dart now they think leaving the segment is a good idea? Just plain nuts.

 

Any chance to take a shot at FCA....  You realize Cadillac rebates right now are FAR higher than 300 rebates, right?  I can pretty well guarantee you they are making plenty of profit on each 300 sold.  Also, where is it missing tech?  The platform is also fine for what the 300 is.  With the CT6 Caddy is finally realizing it isn't all about figure 8s and lateral Gs, it is about the ride to most and the 300 has that in spades.  it also has a good looking exterior.  if it is lacking anywhere it is the interior design. We are just a couple years off from it's replacement anyway which WILL be on a new platform.   It just feels bland.  Caddy is doing interiors right.  heck, Dodge is doing better interior design than the 300 has got in their LX variants.  If they updated the interior to be more inline wih the 200/Pacfica that alone would be he biggest upgrade it needs.  And none o this is a kick on Caddy, I LOVE what they are doing, but i think the CT6 is where they need to be on all their cars except the sportiest variants and they will get there.

Stew I know well that Cadillac has rebates but they are not selling their luxury cars for $28k-$35K either. My in-laws own one they bought for just over $30K new. It was a very good buy for them but little meat on the bone for FCA.

Now even with discounts on Cadillac the profits are still there as they have a lot of meat on that bone even at the rebated price.

Now if you are comfortable with Chrysler selling a 300 that cheap that is fine but that is a car that should hold a much higher and much more profitable price point.

Keep in mind you are the one who said the 200 and Dart were just doing just great and I said they were struggling You got mad at me for that. Well are you now mad at Sergio for killing them for struggling vs. fixing them like he should?

I think most here would agree with my observations of FCA and their failure to do the things they should be doing. Stop relying on Alfa to save them. To not abandon the small car segment and if you want to fix FCA the path is through a better financed and better focused Chrysler not any of the Italian brands. Chrysler would bring the volume and profits they need but not just by only doing trucks and SUV models.

A well balance and executed portfolio of Chrysler owned products would be strong for FCA but right now Sergio either can not afford to do it or is foolish enough to think they can not do a mid size car?

Now if you think that is a shot at Chrysler then I really question your allegiance to the brand. To me you have a house on fire and you appear to think it will not burn down if you deny it is on fire.

Most of my Chrysler buddies are besides themselves over what is going on there. These are some real hard core guys and they are not happy with Sergio or FCA.

But I guess we are all wrong and only you and Sergio are right.

FYI if this all goes south I will be the first to tell you I told you so. I will not do it with glee but in hope as I really will be sad to see Chrysler go down.

Dude, your first HUGE wrong assumption is hat Chrysler is a full-on Luxury brand like Cadillac, they are not.  They are actually the mainstream and before that more entry level ala Buick.   FYI, the 200 IS doing just great, never said as much on the Dart though, just that it DOES sell enough to be profitable.  Again, they are NOT leaving those segments, basically just outsourcing the smaller cars.  It makes sense and ou would realize that if ou had read my other post in the Chrysler forum.  I also called out the 300 where it actually NEEDS work.  You simply do not like them and take every chance to down them, even in a Cadillac thread.  That says a lot about our thoughts..............

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.

You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.

Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?

The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

[ccap41]

 

C'mon man, I even said, " Now, I know MB is on a fast track to do the same thing from C->S and I'm not excusing them either. I think they look very good but these luxury automakers need to differentiate A LITTLE bit more."

 

I'm not "excusing" anybody. I acknowledged that they are not the only ones to do so.  I didn't mention BMW but if it makes you feel better BMW and Audi are the same way, better? I doubt many could differentiate an A6 from and A8 or an A4 from an A8. 

 

 

I read what U highlighted.. and only pointed it out for others. The thing is that there are several actual differences in the ATS to CTS to CT6.. and even XTS. despite from FAR OFF they look similar. The S-Class and C-Class are almost exact copies of each other.. certainly the 5 and 7Series are as well. 

 

Well when you quote me and say "u two" I felt like it was directed at me(and cp).

 

The ATS does have a little more differentiation, and in a good way. I just don't see much unless you look in detail at the CTS and CT6 and the same can be said for the G3. I think BMW has been doing it for a longer period of time and now MB and Audi are doing it from bottom to top and Cadillac with their two newest in the CTS and CT6.  

 

I understand WHY they all do this..but..I just with there was a little more differentiation. Not a lot more, because if you nailed a design language then there is no point in venturing too far from that but a litle more would be appreciated, especially in MB's case. It sucks because I think the C->S look great individually but when together they look like an evolutionary picture of the vehicle growing and basically the same. 

[surreal1272]

After reading a few more reviews of how the CT6 drives, I am coming away more and more impressed with it. Will it be enough to make a big impression to the masses? Who knows? The market is so topsy turvy with the CUV demand and the emerging EV market, it's hard to tell. Now, am I weird for wishing to see a sport wagon version of this (since they no longer have the CTS in wagon form)? BTW, I will not apologize for my love of wagons (it's a history thing).  

[Stew]

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.


You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.
Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?


The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

 

No, the fact is YOU do not like the reality.  You bitched about their engines, their new 4s will be out this year, then it was hybrid tech, oops, look at that a hybrid Pacifica and Plug-in with 80MPHe in a MINIVAN, oops, and again, they are not stopping production of the 200, the statement is simply that the next one will be based on a platform from another manufacturer.  It is dollars and cents (sense.....).  Use your brain.  With Alfa going all RWD and Dodge basically doing the same, Chrysler is left with only Chrysler needing FWD.  Without the sharing it becomes an expensive proposition that would price the car out of it's competitive set.  Use your brain, basically every midsize car from the Fusion, to the Malibu, to the Camry has platform mates under their mothership umbrella to share amortization costs and manufacturing costs with.  It becomes much more of an issue if you have only 1 or 2 vehicles under the same umbrella to try to spread all of the development costs, tooling, and manufacturing costs with.  The do need a lighter platform for their midsize/compacts and in this case that is simply the most cost-effective way to go.  It is the same reason Ford used he Mazda 6 platform for the Fusion and GM and Ford teamed up fr the new 10 speed auto.  Seriously, if you actually think about it,it makes sense.  You are just too busy singing Chysler death knell sto see that.

[ccap41]

 

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.

You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.

Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?

The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

 

No, the fact is YOU do not like the reality.  You bitched about their engines, their new 4s will be out this year, then it was hybrid tech, oops, look at that a hybrid Pacifica and Plug-in with 80MPHe in a MINIVAN, oops, and again, they are not stopping production of the 200, the statement is simply that the next one will be based on a platform from another manufacturer.  It is dollars and cents (sense.....).  Use your brain.  With Alfa going all RWD and Dodge basically doing the same, Chrysler is left with only Chrysler needing FWD.  Without the sharing it becomes an expensive proposition that would price the car out of it's competitive set.  Use your brain, basically every midsize car from the Fusion, to the Malibu, to the Camry has platform mates under their mothership umbrella to share amortization costs and manufacturing costs with.  It becomes much more of an issue if you have only 1 or 2 vehicles under the same umbrella to try to spread all of the development costs, tooling, and manufacturing costs with.  The do need a lighter platform for their midsize/compacts and in this case that is simply the most cost-effective way to go.  It is the same reason Ford used he Mazda 6 platform for the Fusion and GM and Ford teamed up fr the new 10 speed auto.  Seriously, if you actually think about it,it makes sense.  You are just too busy singing Chysler death knell sto see that.

 

Chrsler is putting out their first hybrid in 2017, right? How far have GM and Ford come in that same time? I know Ford's had a few hybrids and obviously GM has had some, and they have a full EV next year as well. Ford's Fusion was 09 and Escape in 2004! The Volt came out in 2010 and a Silverado/Sierra with a hybrid system in 2005 as well. 

 

So yes, Chrysler will finally have a hybrid in 2017 a mere 20 years after Toyota, 13 years after Ford, 12 after Chevy. Good job. 

 

The Dart's engines weren't tops in their class when it came out, or top 3. That is a fail when you introduce a BRAND NEW vehicle to a class and you aren't class leading in mpg, or any performance metric(be it efficiency or 1/4 mile - doesn't matter, it wasn't very good).

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Wait, Chrysler? Screw that, let's get back to talking about the sweet and sexy CT6! Any ideas if the new ttV8 will be a V Series? or VSport? or just a badass engine before a V Series..? 

[Drew Dowdell]

 

 

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.

You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.

Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?

The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

 

No, the fact is YOU do not like the reality.  You bitched about their engines, their new 4s will be out this year, then it was hybrid tech, oops, look at that a hybrid Pacifica and Plug-in with 80MPHe in a MINIVAN, oops, and again, they are not stopping production of the 200, the statement is simply that the next one will be based on a platform from another manufacturer.  It is dollars and cents (sense.....).  Use your brain.  With Alfa going all RWD and Dodge basically doing the same, Chrysler is left with only Chrysler needing FWD.  Without the sharing it becomes an expensive proposition that would price the car out of it's competitive set.  Use your brain, basically every midsize car from the Fusion, to the Malibu, to the Camry has platform mates under their mothership umbrella to share amortization costs and manufacturing costs with.  It becomes much more of an issue if you have only 1 or 2 vehicles under the same umbrella to try to spread all of the development costs, tooling, and manufacturing costs with.  The do need a lighter platform for their midsize/compacts and in this case that is simply the most cost-effective way to go.  It is the same reason Ford used he Mazda 6 platform for the Fusion and GM and Ford teamed up fr the new 10 speed auto.  Seriously, if you actually think about it,it makes sense.  You are just too busy singing Chysler death knell sto see that.

 

Chrsler is putting out their first hybrid in 2017, right? How far have GM and Ford come in that same time? I know Ford's had a few hybrids and obviously GM has had some, and they have a full EV next year as well. Ford's Fusion was 09 and Escape in 2004! The Volt came out in 2010 and a Silverado/Sierra with a hybrid system in 2005 as well. 

 

So yes, Chrysler will finally have a hybrid in 2017 a mere 20 years after Toyota, 13 years after Ford, 12 after Chevy. Good job. 

 

The Dart's engines weren't tops in their class when it came out, or top 3. That is a fail when you introduce a BRAND NEW vehicle to a class and you aren't class leading in mpg, or any performance metric(be it efficiency or 1/4 mile - doesn't matter, it wasn't very good).

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Wait, Chrysler? Screw that, let's get back to talking about the sweet and sexy CT6! Any ideas if the new ttV8 will be a V Series? or VSport? or just a badass engine before a V Series..? 

 

 

2009 Chrysler Aspen Hybrid

[Stew]

 

 

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.

You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.

Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?

The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

 

No, the fact is YOU do not like the reality.  You bitched about their engines, their new 4s will be out this year, then it was hybrid tech, oops, look at that a hybrid Pacifica and Plug-in with 80MPHe in a MINIVAN, oops, and again, they are not stopping production of the 200, the statement is simply that the next one will be based on a platform from another manufacturer.  It is dollars and cents (sense.....).  Use your brain.  With Alfa going all RWD and Dodge basically doing the same, Chrysler is left with only Chrysler needing FWD.  Without the sharing it becomes an expensive proposition that would price the car out of it's competitive set.  Use your brain, basically every midsize car from the Fusion, to the Malibu, to the Camry has platform mates under their mothership umbrella to share amortization costs and manufacturing costs with.  It becomes much more of an issue if you have only 1 or 2 vehicles under the same umbrella to try to spread all of the development costs, tooling, and manufacturing costs with.  The do need a lighter platform for their midsize/compacts and in this case that is simply the most cost-effective way to go.  It is the same reason Ford used he Mazda 6 platform for the Fusion and GM and Ford teamed up fr the new 10 speed auto.  Seriously, if you actually think about it,it makes sense.  You are just too busy singing Chysler death knell sto see that.

 

Chrsler is putting out their first hybrid in 2017, right? How far have GM and Ford come in that same time? I know Ford's had a few hybrids and obviously GM has had some, and they have a full EV next year as well. Ford's Fusion was 09 and Escape in 2004! The Volt came out in 2010 and a Silverado/Sierra with a hybrid system in 2005 as well. 

 

So yes, Chrysler will finally have a hybrid in 2017 a mere 20 years after Toyota, 13 years after Ford, 12 after Chevy. Good job. 

 

The Dart's engines weren't tops in their class when it came out, or top 3. That is a fail when you introduce a BRAND NEW vehicle to a class and you aren't class leading in mpg, or any performance metric(be it efficiency or 1/4 mile - doesn't matter, it wasn't very good).

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Wait, Chrysler? Screw that, let's get back to talking about the sweet and sexy CT6! Any ideas if the new ttV8 will be a V Series? or VSport? or just a badass engine before a V Series..? 

 

Here we agree.  Chrysler should have never even been brought up.......

 

Anyways......  The V8 is just supposed to be an optional engine on higher trims.  I have my doubts they will do a V series o this car because I don't really think the boy racer bits would fit here as they do on the smaller and sportier CTS.  IMHO, the CT6 is about class and luxury above all else and that I believe will be a winner.

[Stew]

 

 

 

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.

You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.

Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?

The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

 

No, the fact is YOU do not like the reality.  You bitched about their engines, their new 4s will be out this year, then it was hybrid tech, oops, look at that a hybrid Pacifica and Plug-in with 80MPHe in a MINIVAN, oops, and again, they are not stopping production of the 200, the statement is simply that the next one will be based on a platform from another manufacturer.  It is dollars and cents (sense.....).  Use your brain.  With Alfa going all RWD and Dodge basically doing the same, Chrysler is left with only Chrysler needing FWD.  Without the sharing it becomes an expensive proposition that would price the car out of it's competitive set.  Use your brain, basically every midsize car from the Fusion, to the Malibu, to the Camry has platform mates under their mothership umbrella to share amortization costs and manufacturing costs with.  It becomes much more of an issue if you have only 1 or 2 vehicles under the same umbrella to try to spread all of the development costs, tooling, and manufacturing costs with.  The do need a lighter platform for their midsize/compacts and in this case that is simply the most cost-effective way to go.  It is the same reason Ford used he Mazda 6 platform for the Fusion and GM and Ford teamed up fr the new 10 speed auto.  Seriously, if you actually think about it,it makes sense.  You are just too busy singing Chysler death knell sto see that.

 

Chrsler is putting out their first hybrid in 2017, right? How far have GM and Ford come in that same time? I know Ford's had a few hybrids and obviously GM has had some, and they have a full EV next year as well. Ford's Fusion was 09 and Escape in 2004! The Volt came out in 2010 and a Silverado/Sierra with a hybrid system in 2005 as well. 

 

So yes, Chrysler will finally have a hybrid in 2017 a mere 20 years after Toyota, 13 years after Ford, 12 after Chevy. Good job. 

 

The Dart's engines weren't tops in their class when it came out, or top 3. That is a fail when you introduce a BRAND NEW vehicle to a class and you aren't class leading in mpg, or any performance metric(be it efficiency or 1/4 mile - doesn't matter, it wasn't very good).

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Wait, Chrysler? Screw that, let's get back to talking about the sweet and sexy CT6! Any ideas if the new ttV8 will be a V Series? or VSport? or just a badass engine before a V Series..? 

 

 

2009 Chrysler Aspen Hybrid

 

Muahaha.  That was the hybrid system they developed with GM and it was also in the GM fullsize trucks and SUVs I think? 

[G. David Felt]

I am wondering if the CT6 as well as the whole Cadillac line up will get some of the creature comforts you find in China. Massage chairs, extended length version so us tall folks will have extra leg room. I would really like to see some of the cool things sold in China offered here also. Global is Global so why only keep it in China?

[Drew Dowdell]

 

 

 

 

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.

You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.

Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?

The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

 

No, the fact is YOU do not like the reality.  You bitched about their engines, their new 4s will be out this year, then it was hybrid tech, oops, look at that a hybrid Pacifica and Plug-in with 80MPHe in a MINIVAN, oops, and again, they are not stopping production of the 200, the statement is simply that the next one will be based on a platform from another manufacturer.  It is dollars and cents (sense.....).  Use your brain.  With Alfa going all RWD and Dodge basically doing the same, Chrysler is left with only Chrysler needing FWD.  Without the sharing it becomes an expensive proposition that would price the car out of it's competitive set.  Use your brain, basically every midsize car from the Fusion, to the Malibu, to the Camry has platform mates under their mothership umbrella to share amortization costs and manufacturing costs with.  It becomes much more of an issue if you have only 1 or 2 vehicles under the same umbrella to try to spread all of the development costs, tooling, and manufacturing costs with.  The do need a lighter platform for their midsize/compacts and in this case that is simply the most cost-effective way to go.  It is the same reason Ford used he Mazda 6 platform for the Fusion and GM and Ford teamed up fr the new 10 speed auto.  Seriously, if you actually think about it,it makes sense.  You are just too busy singing Chysler death knell sto see that.

 

Chrsler is putting out their first hybrid in 2017, right? How far have GM and Ford come in that same time? I know Ford's had a few hybrids and obviously GM has had some, and they have a full EV next year as well. Ford's Fusion was 09 and Escape in 2004! The Volt came out in 2010 and a Silverado/Sierra with a hybrid system in 2005 as well. 

 

So yes, Chrysler will finally have a hybrid in 2017 a mere 20 years after Toyota, 13 years after Ford, 12 after Chevy. Good job. 

 

The Dart's engines weren't tops in their class when it came out, or top 3. That is a fail when you introduce a BRAND NEW vehicle to a class and you aren't class leading in mpg, or any performance metric(be it efficiency or 1/4 mile - doesn't matter, it wasn't very good).

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Wait, Chrysler? Screw that, let's get back to talking about the sweet and sexy CT6! Any ideas if the new ttV8 will be a V Series? or VSport? or just a badass engine before a V Series..? 

 

 

2009 Chrysler Aspen Hybrid

 

Muahaha.  That was the hybrid system they developed with GM and it was also in the GM fullsize trucks and SUVs I think? 

 

 

The system was part of the global hybrid alliance.  GM, Chrysler, BMW, and Mercedes-Benz all participated.

[Drew Dowdell]

I am wondering if the CT6 as well as the whole Cadillac line up will get some of the creature comforts you find in China. Massage chairs, extended length version so us tall folks will have extra leg room. I would really like to see some of the cool things sold in China offered here also. Global is Global so why only keep it in China?

 

Because Americans are too accustom to Walmart prices on everything. 

[G. David Felt]

^  

 

Probably true, but I would like to still see it as it is a Luxury auto maker. I see the massage chair is only in the S class and 7 series so I guess for the US market, only the best of the best on product lines to offer this.

[hyperv6]

BMW used it too.

Stew you have your view and I have mine. I am not trying to change yours so stop trying to stop me from having mine. I don't agree with much of what you post but I only respond to you generally when you counter mine.

It is what it is.

Now back to the movie folks!

[Stew]

BMW used it too.

Stew you have your view and I have mine. I am not trying to change yours so stop trying to stop me from having mine. I don't agree with much of what you post but I only respond to you generally when you counter mine.

It is what it is.

Now back to the movie folks!

Views are views, but you badmouth FCA every chance you get, even in threads such as this that didn't have the first thing to do with them.  that is outright annoying.  In any case i am done here.

[ccap41]

 

 

 

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.

You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.

Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?

The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

 

No, the fact is YOU do not like the reality.  You bitched about their engines, their new 4s will be out this year, then it was hybrid tech, oops, look at that a hybrid Pacifica and Plug-in with 80MPHe in a MINIVAN, oops, and again, they are not stopping production of the 200, the statement is simply that the next one will be based on a platform from another manufacturer.  It is dollars and cents (sense.....).  Use your brain.  With Alfa going all RWD and Dodge basically doing the same, Chrysler is left with only Chrysler needing FWD.  Without the sharing it becomes an expensive proposition that would price the car out of it's competitive set.  Use your brain, basically every midsize car from the Fusion, to the Malibu, to the Camry has platform mates under their mothership umbrella to share amortization costs and manufacturing costs with.  It becomes much more of an issue if you have only 1 or 2 vehicles under the same umbrella to try to spread all of the development costs, tooling, and manufacturing costs with.  The do need a lighter platform for their midsize/compacts and in this case that is simply the most cost-effective way to go.  It is the same reason Ford used he Mazda 6 platform for the Fusion and GM and Ford teamed up fr the new 10 speed auto.  Seriously, if you actually think about it,it makes sense.  You are just too busy singing Chysler death knell sto see that.

 

Chrsler is putting out their first hybrid in 2017, right? How far have GM and Ford come in that same time? I know Ford's had a few hybrids and obviously GM has had some, and they have a full EV next year as well. Ford's Fusion was 09 and Escape in 2004! The Volt came out in 2010 and a Silverado/Sierra with a hybrid system in 2005 as well. 

 

So yes, Chrysler will finally have a hybrid in 2017 a mere 20 years after Toyota, 13 years after Ford, 12 after Chevy. Good job. 

 

The Dart's engines weren't tops in their class when it came out, or top 3. That is a fail when you introduce a BRAND NEW vehicle to a class and you aren't class leading in mpg, or any performance metric(be it efficiency or 1/4 mile - doesn't matter, it wasn't very good).

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Wait, Chrysler? Screw that, let's get back to talking about the sweet and sexy CT6! Any ideas if the new ttV8 will be a V Series? or VSport? or just a badass engine before a V Series..? 

 

 

2009 Chrysler Aspen Hybrid

 

There it is!!! I knew something had to be missing.. but I honestly couldn't find anything. Terrible research on my part, lol

 

..In my defense I'm working and I shouldn't be googling things.. 

Edited January 29, 2016 by ccap41

[hyperv6]

BMW used it too.

Stew you have your view and I have mine. I am not trying to change yours so stop trying to stop me from having mine. I don't agree with much of what you post but I only respond to you generally when you counter mine.

It is what it is.

Now back to the movie folks!

Views are views, but you badmouth FCA every chance you get, even in threads such as this that didn't have the first thing to do with them.  that is outright annoying.  In any case i am done here.

Just telling the truth bother and sorry if you can't handle it.

I speculate that Chrysler us working to cut the low volume and lower profit cars to help them in a merger with someone with a strong car line and no trucks. I saw one financial watcher call it a hail mary. Not my term but the Wall St Analyst.

If you also note what I do say is FCA should have put all their money into Chrysler from the start and not Alfa. Where am I wrong here. Is that bashing too? My beef is FCA has raped Chrysler and Sergio is hurting FCA as a whole by not using his strongest division to increase volume and profits. You do not agree Chrysler should not have gotten the Alfa Money. Even now with Alfa losing sales that should make it even clearer.

Like I said it is what it is.

[balthazar]

…you have your view and I have mine.

 

Just telling the truth… sorry if you can't handle it.

 

Well, which is it; your opinion or the truth?

[oldshurst442]

There are several movie references I could make here with endless amounts of pics, GIFs and youtube clips.

 

PICS & GIFS & YOUTUBE CLIPS...OH MY!

 

You see, there goes another one...

 

I wont post any of them though, as maybe too much of a (good thing?) maybe too much? 

 

 

Ill just make one quote though:

 

What people believe prevails over the truth.

SOPHOCLES.

Edited January 29, 2016 by oldshurst442

[Cmicasa the Great]

 

 

 

 

Chrysler was as grand as any Cadillac or Lincoln but in the last few years they lost their grip and now are a discount luxury car. The point is they could be selling this car with an updated platform and improvements in technology and compete making twice the profit.

You may note they are leaving these segments to focus on CUV, SUV and trucks. The fact is they did already outsource the cars as they are not Chryslers already as they are based on older Fiat corporation platforms.

Basically FCA has no faith in Chrysler but I do as well as most Americans. You have a much better chance at profitability of a better 300 than an Alfa.

Again do you really think the sales will climb from 68K to 450,000 as Sergio predicted from 2014-2018? You really believe that is possible. Note last year sales fell and this year China is not in the picture.

Answer this if the 200 is doing great why are they shutting production down and Sergio is calling the designers names?

The fact is you do not like the reality. I would never comment on your post if you had not seeked me out.

If anything I have said here was not done fair and accurate I ask anyone else here to call it out. The bottom line is FCA is mismanaged and at risk as long as Sergio continues the path he is on. The path to save FCA is in Chrysler and it should have started when they merged not now that Alfa is failing to meet its goals.

Reality sucks I get it but don't get mad at the messenger.

 

No, the fact is YOU do not like the reality.  You bitched about their engines, their new 4s will be out this year, then it was hybrid tech, oops, look at that a hybrid Pacifica and Plug-in with 80MPHe in a MINIVAN, oops, and again, they are not stopping production of the 200, the statement is simply that the next one will be based on a platform from another manufacturer.  It is dollars and cents (sense.....).  Use your brain.  With Alfa going all RWD and Dodge basically doing the same, Chrysler is left with only Chrysler needing FWD.  Without the sharing it becomes an expensive proposition that would price the car out of it's competitive set.  Use your brain, basically every midsize car from the Fusion, to the Malibu, to the Camry has platform mates under their mothership umbrella to share amortization costs and manufacturing costs with.  It becomes much more of an issue if you have only 1 or 2 vehicles under the same umbrella to try to spread all of the development costs, tooling, and manufacturing costs with.  The do need a lighter platform for their midsize/compacts and in this case that is simply the most cost-effective way to go.  It is the same reason Ford used he Mazda 6 platform for the Fusion and GM and Ford teamed up fr the new 10 speed auto.  Seriously, if you actually think about it,it makes sense.  You are just too busy singing Chysler death knell sto see that.

 

Chrsler is putting out their first hybrid in 2017, right? How far have GM and Ford come in that same time? I know Ford's had a few hybrids and obviously GM has had some, and they have a full EV next year as well. Ford's Fusion was 09 and Escape in 2004! The Volt came out in 2010 and a Silverado/Sierra with a hybrid system in 2005 as well. 

 

So yes, Chrysler will finally have a hybrid in 2017 a mere 20 years after Toyota, 13 years after Ford, 12 after Chevy. Good job. 

 

The Dart's engines weren't tops in their class when it came out, or top 3. That is a fail when you introduce a BRAND NEW vehicle to a class and you aren't class leading in mpg, or any performance metric(be it efficiency or 1/4 mile - doesn't matter, it wasn't very good).

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Wait, Chrysler? Screw that, let's get back to talking about the sweet and sexy CT6! Any ideas if the new ttV8 will be a V Series? or VSport? or just a badass engine before a V Series..? 

 

 

2009 Chrysler Aspen Hybrid

 

Muahaha.  That was the hybrid system they developed with GM and it was also in the GM fullsize trucks and SUVs I think? 

 

 

 

It was actually a GM developed Hybrid system with Daimler and BMW being licensed the rights to it for the sake of funding. GM was in a bad way at that time as we all kno. The fundamentals of the 2Mode have their roots all the way back into the 80s and 90s..  It had been around for almost a decade.. and put to the test as the Hybrid system in GM Transit Buses. Before then.. the Dual-Mode system was being used in Locomotives

[Stew]

 

 

BMW used it too.

Stew you have your view and I have mine. I am not trying to change yours so stop trying to stop me from having mine. I don't agree with much of what you post but I only respond to you generally when you counter mine.

It is what it is.

Now back to the movie folks!

Views are views, but you badmouth FCA every chance you get, even in threads such as this that didn't have the first thing to do with them.  that is outright annoying.  In any case i am done here.

 

Just telling the truth bother and sorry if you can't handle it.

I speculate that Chrysler us working to cut the low volume and lower profit cars to help them in a merger with someone with a strong car line and no trucks. I saw one financial watcher call it a hail mary. Not my term but the Wall St Analyst.

If you also note what I do say is FCA should have put all their money into Chrysler from the start and not Alfa. Where am I wrong here. Is that bashing too? My beef is FCA has raped Chrysler and Sergio is hurting FCA as a whole by not using his strongest division to increase volume and profits. You do not agree Chrysler should not have gotten the Alfa Money. Even now with Alfa losing sales that should make it even clearer.

Like I said it is what it is.

 

 

Knew you couldn't just let it drop.... 

 

Honestly, no.  I hate to say it, but Chrysler hasn't been  the strongest leg of the company for a very long time.  Dodge got the lion's share.  The CUV, the coupe, the sport's car, the 3 row SUV, and IMHO, they should have gotten the minivan.  I like Chrysler, but honestly, they are redundant.  Their product portfolio has not been strong for a very long time and until now with the current 200 and Pacifica they were judge a bunch of Dodge leftovers.  If they killed CHrysler and gave Dodge back the minivan and a version of the 200 no one would miss them.  It is sad, yes, but too many companies standing under one umbrella is not a good hing.  If done right, Alfa could be a boom.  Something fresh and covering a new sector that is currently not covered here under the FCA banner.  Also, the Ram break off was under way well before Fiat was even in he picture.  The though was each brand gets to concentrate on what it specializes in.  It has worked too.  Probably not what you expected and certainly don't agree with, bu there it is. 

[Stew]

This is one of my favorite images of the CT6 so far.  i can really see previous caddy concepts there, especially in that front.

 

[hyperv6]

 

 

 

BMW used it too.

Stew you have your view and I have mine. I am not trying to change yours so stop trying to stop me from having mine. I don't agree with much of what you post but I only respond to you generally when you counter mine.

It is what it is.

Now back to the movie folks!

Views are views, but you badmouth FCA every chance you get, even in threads such as this that didn't have the first thing to do with them.  that is outright annoying.  In any case i am done here.

 

Just telling the truth bother and sorry if you can't handle it.

I speculate that Chrysler us working to cut the low volume and lower profit cars to help them in a merger with someone with a strong car line and no trucks. I saw one financial watcher call it a hail mary. Not my term but the Wall St Analyst.

If you also note what I do say is FCA should have put all their money into Chrysler from the start and not Alfa. Where am I wrong here. Is that bashing too? My beef is FCA has raped Chrysler and Sergio is hurting FCA as a whole by not using his strongest division to increase volume and profits. You do not agree Chrysler should not have gotten the Alfa Money. Even now with Alfa losing sales that should make it even clearer.

Like I said it is what it is.

 

 

Knew you couldn't just let it drop.... 

 

Honestly, no.  I hate to say it, but Chrysler hasn't been  the strongest leg of the company for a very long time.  Dodge got the lion's share.  The CUV, the coupe, the sport's car, the 3 row SUV, and IMHO, they should have gotten the minivan.  I like Chrysler, but honestly, they are redundant.  Their product portfolio has not been strong for a very long time and until now with the current 200 and Pacifica they were judge a bunch of Dodge leftovers.  If they killed CHrysler and gave Dodge back the minivan and a version of the 200 no one would miss them.  It is sad, yes, but too many companies standing under one umbrella is not a good hing.  If done right, Alfa could be a boom.  Something fresh and covering a new sector that is currently not covered here under the FCA banner.  Also, the Ram break off was under way well before Fiat was even in he picture.  The though was each brand gets to concentrate on what it specializes in.  It has worked too.  Probably not what you expected and certainly don't agree with, bu there it is. 

 

 

Now do agree with part of what you state and not with some of the rest. Just let me have my opinion too with out you come storming in on every comment like I hate Chrysler. My post are not in hate they are of the issues I see and my wish they can correct them before they become irrelevant. 

 

I know you are passionate but so am I and we can both have our space if you let it happen. 

 

I just am sick and tired of being labeled for what I am not because our views are different. 

 

To me when I speak Chrysler I speaks of Jeep, Ram, Dodge and Chrysler cars. I see a place for all of them if managed correctly. I easily see Dodge being like Ford or Chevy and if done right Chrysler could rival Lincoln and even Cadillac. But at this point they are making Chrysler much less than what it could be. 

As for Alfa. There just is not much love or past history outside of Europe on a wide scale. The dreams of taking on BMW may be some where in the future but it is no where near 2018. Even for Cadillac it is in the future as you have to earn you spot even if you have a better car. 

Cadillac I see is years from being the automatic class leader. They first have to get the cars right and then they have to earn the market and reputation back. Like a Heavy Weight title you do not get it for going rounds. Too often it takes a knock out over time to earn the title. I believe they will get there but there is plenty of work to do and still a lot of trust and admiration to earn. 

 

You can build the best car in the world but you can not just design or engineer it to the top. You have to let the public embrace it for what it is once they learn and love it for what you did. Also a lot of Ego is involved with buying this car. Make it shine on someones ego or vanity they will buy it no matter what. That is one of the keys to BMW and many of their owners. 

 

If Cadillac could find a way to make the CT6 cool in the eyes of the public it could change the whole division. I do not think this is the car that will get them past that but I feel we will soon see it by 2020.

 

That is a good photo of the CT6. I have noted Cadillac's do not photo well but in person you really get the 3D depth of the design much better. 

Edited January 29, 2016 by hyperv6

[smk4565]

I am wondering if the CT6 as well as the whole Cadillac line up will get some of the creature comforts you find in China. Massage chairs, extended length version so us tall folks will have extra leg room. I would really like to see some of the cool things sold in China offered here also. Global is Global so why only keep it in China?

Massage seats like an E-class, S-class, CLS, SL, or GLS have?  I would hope Cadillac has them, especially the Escalade when the GL550 has them standard.

[cp-the-nerd]

Massaging front and back seats are already confirmed. I'm pretty sure they're even advertised on the CT6 page of the official website.

[Cmicasa the Great]

Massaging front and back seats are already confirmed. I'm pretty sure they're even advertised on the CT6 page of the official website.

 

 

 

It is.

 

 

 

. And every journey delivers the utmost comfort and convenience for all with optional Bose® Panaray® Sound System featuring 34 speakers, individual climate control and extended comfort seats with five massage settings.

 

 

 

 

[Stew]

 

 

 

 

BMW used it too.

Stew you have your view and I have mine. I am not trying to change yours so stop trying to stop me from having mine. I don't agree with much of what you post but I only respond to you generally when you counter mine.

It is what it is.

Now back to the movie folks!

Views are views, but you badmouth FCA every chance you get, even in threads such as this that didn't have the first thing to do with them.  that is outright annoying.  In any case i am done here.

 

Just telling the truth bother and sorry if you can't handle it.

I speculate that Chrysler us working to cut the low volume and lower profit cars to help them in a merger with someone with a strong car line and no trucks. I saw one financial watcher call it a hail mary. Not my term but the Wall St Analyst.

If you also note what I do say is FCA should have put all their money into Chrysler from the start and not Alfa. Where am I wrong here. Is that bashing too? My beef is FCA has raped Chrysler and Sergio is hurting FCA as a whole by not using his strongest division to increase volume and profits. You do not agree Chrysler should not have gotten the Alfa Money. Even now with Alfa losing sales that should make it even clearer.

Like I said it is what it is.

 

 

Knew you couldn't just let it drop.... 

 

Honestly, no.  I hate to say it, but Chrysler hasn't been  the strongest leg of the company for a very long time.  Dodge got the lion's share.  The CUV, the coupe, the sport's car, the 3 row SUV, and IMHO, they should have gotten the minivan.  I like Chrysler, but honestly, they are redundant.  Their product portfolio has not been strong for a very long time and until now with the current 200 and Pacifica they were judge a bunch of Dodge leftovers.  If they killed CHrysler and gave Dodge back the minivan and a version of the 200 no one would miss them.  It is sad, yes, but too many companies standing under one umbrella is not a good hing.  If done right, Alfa could be a boom.  Something fresh and covering a new sector that is currently not covered here under the FCA banner.  Also, the Ram break off was under way well before Fiat was even in he picture.  The though was each brand gets to concentrate on what it specializes in.  It has worked too.  Probably not what you expected and certainly don't agree with, bu there it is. 

 

 

Now do agree with part of what you state and not with some of the rest. Just let me have my opinion too with out you come storming in on every comment like I hate Chrysler. My post are not in hate they are of the issues I see and my wish they can correct them before they become irrelevant. 

 

I know you are passionate but so am I and we can both have our space if you let it happen. 

 

I just am sick and tired of being labeled for what I am not because our views are different. 

 

To me when I speak Chrysler I speaks of Jeep, Ram, Dodge and Chrysler cars. I see a place for all of them if managed correctly. I easily see Dodge being like Ford or Chevy and if done right Chrysler could rival Lincoln and even Cadillac. But at this point they are making Chrysler much less than what it could be. 

As for Alfa. There just is not much love or past history outside of Europe on a wide scale. The dreams of taking on BMW may be some where in the future but it is no where near 2018. Even for Cadillac it is in the future as you have to earn you spot even if you have a better car. 

Cadillac I see is years from being the automatic class leader. They first have to get the cars right and then they have to earn the market and reputation back. Like a Heavy Weight title you do not get it for going rounds. Too often it takes a knock out over time to earn the title. I believe they will get there but there is plenty of work to do and still a lot of trust and admiration to earn. 

 

You can build the best car in the world but you can not just design or engineer it to the top. You have to let the public embrace it for what it is once they learn and love it for what you did. Also a lot of Ego is involved with buying this car. Make it shine on someones ego or vanity they will buy it no matter what. That is one of the keys to BMW and many of their owners. 

 

If Cadillac could find a way to make the CT6 cool in the eyes of the public it could change the whole division. I do not think this is the car that will get them past that but I feel we will soon see it by 2020.

 

That is a good photo of the CT6. I have noted Cadillac's do not photo well but in person you really get the 3D depth of the design much better. 

 

ok, fair enough, we will see what happens with Chrysler because there is a huge question mark out there.  Hopefully Marchione is gone within a couple years.  Would love to see someone like Giles take over, a very passionate car guy in charge would be interesting. 

 

Cadillac has the product and I agree they need to find a way to rebuild their cache as a brand.  They have fantastic vehicles and more is coming.  I do understand they have a recent not so great past to overcome.  The CT6 is just so fantastic, but it irks me badge snobs won't give it the light of day.    I think a major issue too, with Caddilac and Lincoln, right now is the discounted price factor.  Everyone is used to discounts and the dealerships being willing to lop off thousands to get them in their cars.   Anywho.  i want this car to succeed and the car has the chops for sure. 

[hyperv6]

Thank you Stew!. That has been my point as they have not had some one like Giles in charge. Sergio has been pro Italian brands and really not given Chrysler or Dodge what they should have gotten. If he had they would be giving a return like Jeep and he would not be begging for a partner. His trump card has been the Chrysler holdings and he has only really played one. I think if you really understand what I am saying we both wan the same thing a strong Chrysler Corporations line up with them leading the FCA comeback not the Italian brands. 

 

 

As for Cadillac the path ahead is clear. They just need to build the best car in class and let time and the public do the rest. Badge snobs can be over come but it takes time and good product. One you can speed up the other you can not.

What excites me is the CT6 is not really the destination. This car is below what is expected in the future product. With $12B I can only imagine what the other models will see in change. It could be very exciting to see things in 5 years.

[Robert Hall]

I can't see FCA having a non-Italian in charge, though..

 

Thank you Stew!. That has been my point as they have not had some one like Giles in charge. Sergio has been pro Italian brands and really not given Chrysler or Dodge what they should have gotten. If he had they would be giving a return like Jeep and he would not be begging for a partner. His trump card has been the Chrysler holdings and he has only really played one. I think if you really understand what I am saying we both wan the same thing a strong Chrysler Corporations line up with them leading the FCA comeback not the Italian brands. 

 

 

I can't see that happening w/ the Italians owning/running FCA..the Chrysler brands will remain lower priority to the Italian brands..

[hyperv6]

I can't see FCA having a non-Italian in charge, though..

 

Thank you Stew!. That has been my point as they have not had some one like Giles in charge. Sergio has been pro Italian brands and really not given Chrysler or Dodge what they should have gotten. If he had they would be giving a return like Jeep and he would not be begging for a partner. His trump card has been the Chrysler holdings and he has only really played one. I think if you really understand what I am saying we both wan the same thing a strong Chrysler Corporations line up with them leading the FCA comeback not the Italian brands. 

 

 

I can't see that happening w/ the Italians owning/running FCA..the Chrysler brands will remain lower priority to the Italian brands..

 

Then that may be their down fall. They have never been known for their strong management since the fall of Rome. 

 

My hope is a merger is made and who ever comes in knock Sergio out and takes over FCA. Technically they are a England based company with their headquarters in London If I recall. 

 

I think if they kill their cars off and add more SUV and Truck models Mazda would be a good fit for them. They already shared the base of the Miata. Mazda has a strong small car line and would compliment Chrysler. They also need a dance partner too. I just hope FCA does not go parasite on them and suck what life they have for their own projects. 

Lets face it if Sergio had taken over GM would he have invested the $12 In Cadillac or would he have put it into his own preferred brands that are struggling yet with the Jeep money. 

 

All I know is with the moves he is making now the strategy is changing and something us up. I am not sure if they are just working to try something or if they already have something in the works. Somethings afoot here at least at FCA. 

Could even be Peugeot too. they have been in need of help and linked too. The money that Sergio was expecting just did not come. 

[Stew]

I think Mazda would be a perfect fit too.  I think there would be good synergy there.  Maybe Mazda could use the upcoming Wrangler pickup platform for a reintroduction of their B series. 

[hyperv6]

I think Mazda would be a perfect fit too.  I think there would be good synergy there.  Maybe Mazda could use the upcoming Wrangler pickup platform for a reintroduction of their B series. 

 

Mazda really have nothing like jeep or Ram and it would be good for them. Mazda also could supply better platforms than Fiat has and let Chrysler and Dodge continue to do the larger RWD cars and the minivans. 

This is a move I would do if I were to save FCA. 

I would also tone down the Alfa and Maserati attack and just focus on high end cars that would do well in Europe for Alfa and Maserati in America. 

 

Leverage the plants for Jeep and Mazda in Europe to cut the over capacity and need to import. 

Not sure what to do with Fiat. It might not hurt to let Mazda take over their direction. This way they would end up with a better car and one that may also do well in Japan. If Mazda touches it the people of Japan may be attracted to it as they love small and home brewed but with a twist. How more niche can you get than Italian heritage and Japan quality. 

 

Edited January 30, 2016 by hyperv6

[Robert Hall]

Or if they didn't hook w/ Mazda, they could go back to their old partner, Mitsubishi...

[smk4565]

The problem with FCA is most of those brands are money losers and worthless.  Mazda for example builds better cars that Fiat, Dodge or Chrysler.  They don't need any of those brands.  Likewise with Hyundai or Honda.  The only brands of value are Ram, Jeep and possibly Maserati for an auto maker that needs a luxury brand.  And Maserati is only valuable if they can actually sell cars, which right now they can't.  Basically you'd be buying Jeep and Ram and forced to take a lot of crap.  FCA is actually more valuable if they shed brands I think.  Maybe dropping some cars, lets them move to phasing out brands and making a more streamlined company to sell.

[hyperv6]

Or if they didn't hook w/ Mazda, they could go back to their old partner, Mitsubishi...

 

Mitsu is in pretty bad shape money wise. I am not sure they would be much help. Their car lines are not as strong either. 

[hyperv6]

The problem with FCA is most of those brands are money losers and worthless.  Mazda for example builds better cars that Fiat, Dodge or Chrysler.  They don't need any of those brands.  Likewise with Hyundai or Honda.  The only brands of value are Ram, Jeep and possibly Maserati for an auto maker that needs a luxury brand.  And Maserati is only valuable if they can actually sell cars, which right now they can't.  Basically you'd be buying Jeep and Ram and forced to take a lot of crap.  FCA is actually more valuable if they shed brands I think.  Maybe dropping some cars, lets them move to phasing out brands and making a more streamlined company to sell.

 

Well if you had paid attention to what is going on Chrysler is mostly focusing on Trucks, Jeep and CUV/SUV models to max profits and killing the 200, Dart and any plans for any new small cars. This would set them up to mess well with a company like Mazda that could supply what they don't plan to make. 

 

The moves of the last 2-3 months are in readiness to make a move. No one on the outside is sure there is any definite move or just setting it up to make it more appealing. 

I think when Sergio gave up on GM in Dec there may have been a plan made but just not finalized yet for a merger but hard to say who yet. 

For sure there is something going on. I just pray it is Mazda as most other potential partners I see more as a liability due to their own poor lines or lack of cash. Another weak partner like Fiat and they will be in trouble. 

They do need an in with China too. Not sure how they will work it but too many car buyers not to be there. At least get Jeep in ASAP. 

[hyperv6]

Getting back to the CT6

 

Anyone catch why the CT6 Hybrid is coming from China. The incentives from China are much better than the USA for new energy cars as they call it. 

 

http://www.autoblog.com/2016/01/29/gm-import-Cadillac-ct6-china/

 

It appears to be a real no brainer as why along with the the lower number of sales here. 

[El Kabong]

It sounds like a great idea for China, IF they are getting their electricity from Three Gorges or some other hydroelectric project. If it comes from COAL?... not so much.

[hyperv6]

It sounds like a great idea for China, IF they are getting their electricity from Three Gorges or some other hydroelectric project. If it comes from COAL?... not so much.

 

The real issue there is to get it to the people. Like us plug in's are not part of their infrastructure and it will take time to put them in. Also many of the people in metro areas live in apartments so where do you plug in? 

 

They have some things to work out just as we do. 

 

Now here our issue could be lack of power with the coal plants getting shut down and no Nukes being built along with increased demans. We already see brown outs in California in heat waves as it is now.