VW News: More On the Volkswagen Diesel Mess

[William Maley]

Another day and more bad news for Volkswagen and their diesel engines.

 

Let's begin with the latest. Automotive News is reporting that about 11 million Volkswagen vehicles equipped with diesel engines worldwide have the illegal software. Also, Volkswagen is planning to set aside 6.5 billion Euros ($7.3 billion) in the third quarter to cover the costs of addressing the issue. Volkswagen says the amount could change as the investigation continues.

 

Also, France, Germany, Italy, and South Korea have announced today they will open investigations to see if Volkswagen rigged vehicles to pass their emission tests.

 

The Detroit News has learned the EPA will be expanding their Volkswagen diesel investigation to the 3.0L V6 diesel engine used in a number of Audi vehicles, Porsche Cayenne, and Volkswagen Touareg. This engine was certified for 2016, but in light of the mess with the 2.0L diesel-four, the EPA wants to check the V6.

 

They were certified well before we knew what we know now,” said Christopher Grundler, director of the EPA’s Office of Transportation and Air Quality.

 

Bloomberg has learned from sources that the U.S. Department of Justice has opened a criminal investigation into Volkswagen after the German automaker admitted it had cheated on the EPA tests. This comes days after the Department of Justice announced a $900 Million fine for GM on the ignition switch mess. When asked about the investigation into Volkswagen, Justice Department spokesman Wyn Hornbuckle declined to comment.

 

Next is a report from the Detroit Free Press that says the U.S. Congress' Oversight and Investigations Subcommittee will be holding a hearing into Volkswagen's emission standard violations.

 

“Strong emissions standards are in place for the benefit of public health. We will follow the facts. We are ... concerned that auto consumers may have been deceived — that what they were purchasing did not come as advertised," said U.S. Rep. Fred Upton, R-Mi and Tim Murphy, R-Pa., said in a joint statement.

 

A date hasn't been set for the hearing, but the statement does say it will happen in the new few weeks.

 

Finally, we might have an answer as to how Volkswagen gamed the system in the EPA tests. Consumer Reports explained that the vehicles had two modes; "Dyno” and “On Road”. These modes are necessary as testing is done dynos and could cause the stability and traction controls to turn on. Once the testing is done and the vehicle is turned out, the vehicle goes back to the On Road mode. Somehow, Volkswagen's 'Dyno' mode was programmed to cut emissions.

 

Source: Automotive News (Subscription Required), Detroit News, Bloomberg, Detroit Free Press, Consumer Reports

View full article

[Guest wings4life]

Soooo, eleventy million cancer spewing Diesel engines have been killing our environment,  and will continue to do so for many, many years....all from just one brand alone….so that customers can save a few $$ at the pump….after initially spending many $$$$$$$$$ to be able to do so, and MAYBE one day recover that cost…..in like 20 years.

 

Tell me again why people think they want Diesel?

 

 

And WOW, VW is in a world of hurt now, and no doubt other automakers as well. 

[ccap41]

I don't think there is necessarily a problem with diesel itself as much as how it was used. The people that should be driving a diesel are the ones who commute 80+ miles per day(40 each way). It really is the best situation for them. Phenominal mileage. With the prices relatively similar to mid grade or premium they can recoupe the initial investment much quicker as well.

 

I defniitely think there is a time and place for diesel cars. They just need to be done correctly like everybody else.

[G. David Felt]

No matter what we all think, Bloomberg is now saying that VW is stating this actually affects 11 million auto's they made. Their stock has dropped 25% in the last 2 days so a Market loss of 25 Billion Euros in value. VW estimates 6.8 Billion Euros to fix. The following countries have now stated they will investigate and possibly fine VW. Germany, France, South Korea and Italy on top of the US and Canada.

 

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-09-22/vw-to-set-aside-7-3-billion-as-diesel-emissions-scandal-widens

 

Porsche is now saying that this VW mess will have a drastic affect on them as they own 51% of VW.

 

So Sum this up on what VW has Lost and could cost:

 

25 Billion Euros Value lost in Stock price

6.5 Billion Euros cost to fix the issue

US says possibly as much as 18 Billion fine.

Germany, France, South Korea, Italy, and Canada Additional Fines of unknown value.

 

End Result, VW will survive but be hurt bad by this mess financially

Diesel will get a worse rap as the medical communities and govs will attack it even more.

EV will probably get the biggest push ever.

China will probably lead a revolution of moving to electric auto's.

[SoCalCTS]

i hope the fines are substantial. The engines are putting out 40 times the pollution allowed in California. VW should be banned from selling any diesels for a decade.

[ccap41]

i hope the fines are substantial. The engines are putting out 40 times the pollution allowed in California. VW should be banned from selling any diesels for a decade.

Putting out UP TO 40 times the pollution.

 

That probably means under full throttle acceleration.

 

But, I do agree that the fines should be substancial.

[Guest wings4life]

Clean

Diesel

Technology

 

 

And wow, at 40X above what California allows.

 

 

[G. David Felt]

And then we have those that are trying to say this is no different than Ford with their MPG adjustments they had to make. 

 

WRONG, the cares did not make the MPG but the exhaust pollution was still the same.

 

VW on the other hand purposely changed their computer to pollute more rather than actually build the proper engines to meet the spec. Some countries are saying they will investigate and consider fines plus required engine swaps.

 

Can you imagine if VW has to replace 11 million engines or buy back the autos? This will be very hard on them. Good thing the fired CEO is 68 and able to retire, I doubt anyone would hire him.

[regfootball]

CARB EPA all these regulatory agencies are trying to turn good willing companies into criminals because the screws keep getting tightened.  And all these bureaucratic agencies are really concerned about in this instance is likely collecting fines.

 

The fallout of this, i wonder if Chevy gives up on the next Cruze diesel or if they actually go opposite and make it a marketing point.

[regfootball]

http://wardsauto.com/vehicles-technology/gm-eyed-us-inception-whisper-diesel

 

 

DETROIT – When the second-generation Chevrolet Cruze turbodiesel comes to market in the U.S. in 2017, the engine nicknamed “whisper diesel” will have at least one distinct advantage over its predecessor: American input.

“Our requirements here (in the U.S.) pushed it a lot,” says Mike Siegrist, assistant chief engineer, Chevy Cruze turbodiesel. “The fact that we are going to market this engine here in a Chevy Cruze helped to make it as quiet as it is.”

General Motors’ all-new 1.6L turbodiesel earned plaudits from the European motoring press shortly after it began rolling out last year in Opel products such as the Mokka small CUV. German journalists call it the “flüster diesel,” or whisper diesel, for its uncharacteristically muted noise and vibration qualiti

[El Kabong]

Soooo, eleventy million cancer spewing Diesel engines have been killing our environment,  and will continue to do so for many, many years....all from just one brand alone….so that customers can save a few $$ at the pump….after initially spending many $$$$$$$$$ to be able to do so, and MAYBE one day recover that cost…..in like 20 years.

 

Tell me again why people think they want Diesel?

 

 

And WOW, VW is in a world of hurt now, and no doubt other automakers as well. 

So.

...what you're saying is that because there are blatantly illegal engines pumping out blatantly illegal amounts of pollutants because they ignored the effective remedy (likely on grounds of cost), all Diesel engines are bad.

It is a good thing you logged in as a visitor, because that is the kind of comment that would be downvoted into oblivion otherwise.

Yup. Even by your impressive standards, this is a stupid comment.

[El Kabong]

CARB EPA all these regulatory agencies are trying to turn good willing companies into criminals because the screws keep getting tightened.  And all these bureaucratic agencies are really concerned about in this instance is likely collecting fines.

 

The fallout of this, i wonder if Chevy gives up on the next Cruze diesel or if they actually go opposite and make it a marketing point.

If they used urea then there's probably no need to-the engine is probably compliant.

C/D just interviewed the boffins from West Virginia who did the testing. They also used vehicles like a diesel BMW X5 as a control.

It used urea. It passed.

The crisis is legit. But those who are shouting from the rooftops to disregard diesel entirely have their tinfoil hats on a bit too tight.

[El Kabong]

And then we have those that are trying to say this is no different than Ford with their MPG adjustments they had to make. 

 

WRONG, the cares did not make the MPG but the exhaust pollution was still the same.

 

VW on the other hand purposely changed their computer to pollute more rather than actually build the proper engines to meet the spec. Some countries are saying they will investigate and consider fines plus required engine swaps.

 

Can you imagine if VW has to replace 11 million engines or buy back the autos? This will be very hard on them. Good thing the fired CEO is 68 and able to retire, I doubt anyone would hire him.

As far as I know the only who compared Ford to VW was out redsident fordie. Certainly I didn't.

Be that as it may, then riddle me this: if the emission of choice these days is CO2, then how does overstating mileage make an Al Gore-approved family feel about producing more CO2 than they wanted to? And all because a company lied to them about mileage?

VW omitted an emission control that effectively eliminates NOx. But every single internal-combustion engine on earth will produce CO2, regardless of emission control system.

So... pick your poison.

[smk4565]

They might as well merge with FCA to get economies of scale to offset these losses.  Sergio is probably behind the whole thing!

[ocnblu]

I do love the VW diesel engine.  It is strong, friendly and efficient.  I would buy an Amarok TDi if it were available in the U.S. with a regular or extended cab, 4WD and a six speed stick.  GM has already shown that they are not willing to give me that combo in a baby Duramax Collie.  MOAR DIESELS PLEASE! 

[Sharpner46]

I've always been a fan of VW. While this scandal will hurt their image and that of Diesels I have no doubt they'll make a come back. Their cars are good quality and great designs, their having clean diesel was just a plus. Still not the worst cars on the road.

[hyperv6]

I really wonder if GM will push their Diesels. VW the most trusted has lost the trust and GM already had a tough road to follow as it was now it has just become more difficult. I think they delay it here in the states and push it overseas to prove its worth before they bring it back here.

The real problem here for VW is not only did they cheat but the fact they took $51 million in green energy kick backs. I can see the government not just fining them but really going after the taking of money in a scam. People who hold office are made to look more foolish then they all ready do and they do not take kindly to companies that will hurt their reps.

If they can find who approved this there could be real criminal charges on fraud against the US Government made here.

To be honest I just had to grin when I heard what they did. It was almost like a Smokey Yunick trick. I have to admire what they did in a way. A company should not break the law but what they did is far from the worst thing an Automaker or company has done.

Hell this is the company that also said hey lets make Hitler a car too. That is one area the PR department is careful about.

[El Kabong]

This link provides some names that may be of interest:

http://m.motortrend.com/wot/volkswagen-dieselgate.html

As far as Hitler goes: I ain't gonna go down that road.

[regfootball]

Diesels.....worse than the plague!

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/volkswagen-emissions-scandal-diesel-worse-than-the-black-plague-and-responsible-for-50000-premature-10513845.html

[El Kabong]

Sorry. No self-respecting source uses the term "worse than the Black Plague."

[El Kabong]

Now, if you want to see what the ACTUAL damage VW's stunt did to the environment, THIS article will suffice:

http://www.financialpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/terence-corcoran-riding-volks-into-the-sunset

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

Now, if you want to see what the ACTUAL damage VW's stunt did to the environment, THIS article will suffice:

http://www.financialpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/terence-corcoran-riding-volks-into-the-sunset

 

 

More interesting is this....

 

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2013/jan/27/diesel-engine-fumes-worse-petrol

Edited September 25, 2015 by Wings4Life

[El Kabong]

That link's not that good, really. I mean, it basically means that Ford's Super Duties are killing whole swaths of people every time the ignition key is turned. I thought they got that out of their system with the Pinto.

Edited September 25, 2015 by El Kabong