Beautiful Cars Appreciation Thread

[oldshurst442]

Yes. Just opinions. But its fun ribbing each other though.  

I must admit. The Riviera is not too shabby in this early to mid 1980s era. I do prefer it over the other two GM siblings. Between all three siblings, to me, the Riviera is more classy and oozes more luxury presence. 

The Oldsmobile seems to be more "sporty" looking. And "sporty" is in quotation marks. Because in the 1980s. whether we like it or not, whether we like or hate these frustrated failed racing car driver automotive journalists, the 6 Series wipes the floor with this GM platform...the 6 Series WOULD be sporty...especially in M635CSi guise...

 

And the Cadillac Eldorado just PROVES  why Cadillac has failed in the market place the last 40 or so years as compared to BMW and Audi and Mercedes. Its just a badge job Oldsmobile.  At least the Riviera had a few curvey body panels that were different. The Toronado and the Eldorado seem to share the same pieces...except for front and rear clips. And even if the Toro and Eldo do NOT share the same body panels, BECAUSE it SEEMS like they do...THAT would be a BIG NO NO for the halo car Caddy...

I do like the Riviera. This Riviera. Not the transverse V6 ones that came after. Better than the other two GM siblings for sure.  But I prefer the Bimmer. It may not be as classy as the Riviera in looks. But BMWs are not supposed to be classy...  The 6 Series is sporty. And its certainly more sporty than GM's trio in looks , feels and driving dynamics.  And GM's interiors at this point in time, including these three...were certainly no better than BMW's 6 Series...

 

Edited April 20, 2020 by oldshurst442

[oldshurst442]

I could feel the '80s douchey yuppiness oozing out of the computer screen as I post these pics.

 

[oldshurst442]

Here. Some real 1980s style from General Motors. From Chevrolet.  

This style borrows heavily from its past, but its oh so 1980s goodness. Not that dullard, stale, staid, antique styling of those  E Bodies from Cadillac, Buick and Oldsmobile. But the fresh, cocaine inspired, yuppie enthused, Wall Street madness,  new aged '80s craziness of the C4 Corvette.  

[oldshurst442]

Even Pontiac joined in on the 1980s party.  Those GM E Bodies were leftovers from the 1970s...and I wouldnt have said anything if those GM E Bodies embodied Glam Rock from Kiss or Sweet like a KITT Firebird or a mullet Camaro or even Disco like a G Body...  Those E Bodies embody boogie woogie bugle boy dreams.  Not new money, millionaire yuppiness that a BMW 6 Series embodies. 

And for the Cyndi Lauper and WHAM lovers out there.  A Pontiac Fiero, as far as the1980s go , IS a beautiful machine.  

And what it could have been had GM not bean-counted it to death. Which blows both Corvette C4 AND BMW 6 Series outta the sky.  This 1990 or 1991 concept  was supposed to be the 2nd generation Fiero. Some believe it to be how the original Fiero was to be.  

 

 

 

[balthazar]

8 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

What makes that 1980s Riviera special?   Because its painted all black? 

I believe that's a Type S turbo coupe. The one pictured is mildly customized.
I think the Type S had a number of upgrades, including suspension.

It a far more distinguished 2-dr than the generic BMW. You take the pig nostril grillettes out and just have the black plastic grille go straight across and I have a narcolepsy episode. It also has a near Pacer-esque fishbowl going on (glass height-wise).

 

Edited April 20, 2020 by balthazar

[balthazar]

6 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

And the Cadillac Eldorado just PROVES  why Cadillac has failed in the market place the last 40 or so years as compared to BMW and Audi and Mercedes. Its just a badge job Oldsmobile.

That's NOT the definition of a 'badge job', sorry.
They share no body panels below the beltline, and the quarter windows / C-Pillar are unique too.

[oldshurst442]

2 minutes ago, balthazar said:

That's NOT the definition of a 'badge job', sorry.
They share no body panels below the beltline, and the quarter windows / C-Pillar are unique too.

 

6 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

And the Cadillac Eldorado just PROVES  why Cadillac has failed in the market place the last 40 or so years as compared to BMW and Audi and Mercedes. Its just a badge job Oldsmobile.  At least the Riviera had a few curvey body panels that were different. The Toronado and the Eldorado seem to share the same pieces...except for front and rear clips. And even if the Toro and Eldo do NOT share the same body panels, BECAUSE it SEEMS like they do...THAT would be a BIG NO NO for the halo car Caddy...

Its still a big no no...

 

 

[balthazar]

‘Seems to share’ quite literally says ‘I’m not interested enough to actually look at the cars’. 

[oldshurst442]

It also means lazy GM designers not putting enough effort to distinguish their Cadillac pride and joy that is Eldorado from the rest of the gang.   

If a car crazy enthusiast much like myself doesnt care and isnt interested enough to tell the difference, what does that tell you about the Eldorado's styling?

 If a car crazy enthusiast much like myself doesnt see the minute details, how can you expect an Average Joe to see those minute details and...ultimately: 

How can you expect an Average Joe to care enough to buy an Eldorado in 1985 over a 1985 BMW 6 Series then BECAUSE it has minute styling differences from the other two? 

Cadillac losing market share to BMW in the 1980s and into the 1990s is a very real thing. And that Eldorado styling choice to look like an Oldsmobile ( a brand BELOW the Cadillac line no matter how much you think Oldsmobile is luxury, Oldsmobile is still BELOW Cadillac) is a big no no.

One has to look at how the styling was done in 1969 to see why its a big no no...

[balthazar]

It sounds to me like we -as 2 car enthusiasts- are each approaching 2 vehicles in the same way; you don't find the Eldorado properly enough stylisitically distanced from the Toronado, and I don't find the 6-series anymore stirring than a old VW rabbit.

Stalemate. :)

[oldshurst442]

yes. stalemate. 

 

[oldshurst442]

OK...now that we came to a conclusion, let's find common ground again!

And I KNOW what Cadillacs to post that you and I together like!  (I dont like it when we are on different pages) 

Ill do 4 doors instead of coupes

 

[riviera74]

That's a lot of mid-fifties Cadillacs there.  All Fleetwoods or other models too?

[oldshurst442]

I googled 1957 and 1958 Fleetwood and Sedan DeVille.  I chose quickly, the nicest photographs to post without actually looking at what model I was posting.  I think the first and second to last pic are Sedan DeVilles and the rest are Fleetwoods.  

But Im not 100% sure.  

Edited April 22, 2020 by oldshurst442

[balthazar]

Cadillacs above :
1 ::  '58 Series 75 Fleetwood (factory limousine)
2,  4 & 7 ::  '57 Series 60 Special Fleetwood
3,  5 & 6 ::  '58 Series 60 Special Fleetwood

S60S got all the lower quarter panel brightwork, SdVs never did.
 

Edited April 22, 2020 by balthazar

[balthazar]

'58 Oldsmobubble :

[balthazar]

'60 DeSoto Adventurer :

[ykX]

On 4/21/2020 at 11:59 PM, balthazar said:

'58 Oldsmobubble :

My eyes hurt from all the chrome! 

What a disaster, and people thought this is good looking ... 

[oldshurst442]

20 minutes ago, ykX said:

My eyes hurt from all the chrome! 

What a disaster, and people thought this is good looking ... 

It was a sign of the times.   Chrome symbolized excess. Richness and excess.   Success. 

Today...we got plastic. Plastic everywhere.  Black plastic.  Grey plastic.  Very drab.  Very durable. But very drab.  

Plastic symbolizes another type of excess and success.  Over consumption.  Plastic symbolizes disposable. Disposable shyte that we dont take care of, dont respect and throw out on a whim only to replace it with another disposable over consumed shytty product.  

Between you and me, Id rather be blinded by that "tacky",  "cringey" chrome rather than be suffocated by that depressing, suicidal thought induced black, grey plastic. 

The chrome makes me...HAPPY!

 

 

Edited April 23, 2020 by oldshurst442

[ykX]

@oldshurst442  This is a lowly 2020 Mazda 6 interior.  I don't think I have to say anything else on its behalf.

[riviera74]

9 minutes ago, ykX said:

@oldshurst442  This is a lowly 2020 Mazda 6 interior.  I don't think I have to say anything else on its behalf.

That looks better than some interiors I have seen of late given the price of a typical Mazda 6.

[frogger]

7 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

That looks better than some interiors I have seen of late given the price of a typical Mazda 6.

It's the 35 grand/top trim level with the nappa leather and "ultra suede" on the dash and doors.   Probably nicest interior in its shrinking class but not much of a sales success.

 

Edited April 23, 2020 by frogger

[oldshurst442]

Well...its dark. Its drab.  Its kinda...sad.  Like a gloomy cloudy day...

Ill tell you another thing...

The Oldsmobile interior pic only focused on the speedometer and the steering wheel.  

That would be the WHOLE picture...

Not too much chrome in THAT regard, non?  And to tell you the truth, that Oldsmobile interior is happy. Jovial. And the shiny bits, especially for the time period, means money...

Lets see how a close up of that 2020 Mazda6 steering holds up to scrutiny... And lets be honest here...this is a 2020 model when in 2020....ALL manufacturers have greatly improved the cheapness of plastic...  From 1980-2010...modern plasticky interiors are cheap cheap cheap and it dont matter if we are talking about Mazdas or Mercedes.  Buicks or BMWs.  Chevrolets or Citroens. Cadillacs or Datsuns.  Pontiacs or Audis. 

 

Is that  plasti-dipped fake chromed plastic there to emulate...chrome? For the interior to have a slight touch of class and shininess so it wont to soooo drab? 

I guess the French Stitching is what symbolizes success and money in 2020. And there is an abundance of that.  In some cars, luxury oriented ones, contrasted stitching makes that pop. 

 Maybe in another 50 years from now, in 2070, the 50 year old people then that are born now will find it odd that we have french stitching in 2020 cars to symbolize comfort and success?

 

 

 

Edited April 23, 2020 by oldshurst442

[ykX]

This is 2020 CT5-V, $50k interior

This is 2020 MB C300 (at least $45k) interior

I will take Mazda's interior over any of these "luxury" cars

[oldshurst442]

I will take the 1950s-1960s chromey but colourful interiors over any other.  Your pics of the Caddy, Mercedes or Mazda just proves my point. They are all cheap, drab, gloomy, dark and depressing....

And the french stitching is rampant.  MUST mean money...

But wait...

 

French stitching in that vinyl steering wheel...

 

[frogger]

Not a fan of chrome, whether on plastic or metal.  I prefer real aluminum or brushed metal.  Most manufacturers are pretty conservative with colour choices now on mainstream vehicles.  Lincoln and Genesis are offering some choice.

 

 

Edited April 23, 2020 by frogger

[oldshurst442]

Brushed aluminium and brushed nickel as a decorative trim choice is just an evolution of chrome trimmed pieces. 

You see that in household appliances.  Chromed faucets are sooooo old fashioned nowadays. Brushed nickel and dark bronze faucets are what is in today...

Just like how black fridges and appliances were at the tail end of the 1980s and how stainless steel became hot and even that in 2020, stainless steel appliance are not so hot anymore. 

Carbon fibre interior trim pieces already hit that fever pitch and is already on the decline...

Fins on cars are sooooo ungodly cringey in today's world.  The jet aged themed taillights and exhausts that defined sooooo many 1950s and 1960s cars seem so childish today. 

There is nothing wrong with not being a fan of chrome.  I just wanted to put a little of perspective on this whole thing.  About not viewing past fads with today's eyes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[G. David Felt]

3 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

Brushed aluminium and brushed nickel as a decorative trim choice is just an evolution of chrome trimmed pieces. 

You see that in household appliances.  Chromed faucets are sooooo old fashioned nowadays. Brushed nickel and dark bronze faucets are what is in today...

Just like how black fridges and appliances were at the tail end of the 1980s and how stainless steel became hot and even that in 2020, stainless steel appliance are not so hot anymore. 

Carbon fibre interior trim pieces already hit that fever pitch and is already on the decline...

Fins on cars are sooooo ungodly cringey in today's world.  The jet aged themed taillights and exhausts that defined sooooo many 1950s and 1960s cars seem so childish today. 

There is nothing wrong with not being a fan of chrome.  I just wanted to put a little of perspective on this whole thing.  About not viewing past fads with today's eyes.

Yet additional perspective is that some auto lines, specifically Cadillac is well known for their Vertical Tailights and Headlights and the Chevrolet headlights on the 2021 Escalade is just TERRIBLE and says Cheap to me. They should have stayed with the vertical headlights complementing the Vertical Tail Lights.

[riviera74]

1 hour ago, dfelt said:

Yet additional perspective is that some auto lines, specifically Cadillac is well known for their Vertical Tailights and Headlights and the Chevrolet headlights on the 2021 Escalade is just TERRIBLE and says Cheap to me. They should have stayed with the vertical headlights complementing the Vertical Tail Lights.

I must concur.  The new Escalade front reminds me of the current XT4 and the current XT6.   The interior is what will sell the SUV for most people.

[balthazar]

I like the '21 Escalade 'luxury' trim with the bright grillework. Cadillacs should be shiny.
The '90s monocromatic 'sport' version doesn't look great, IMO.

[oldshurst442]

 

[G. David Felt]

On 4/23/2020 at 6:16 PM, balthazar said:

I like the '21 Escalade 'luxury' trim with the bright grille work. Cadillacs should be shiny.
The '90s monochromatic 'sport' version doesn't look great, IMO.

I know some like a monochromatic look which I believe the Sport package gives. I on the other hand would like a BLACK CHROME package. Shiny but understated. To me it looks very rich and says luxury without the huge traditional chrome bling look.

[trinacriabob]

I'll do this in YouTube - the first two cars I went bonkers over were different animals ... the Pontiac Firebird and the Cutlass Supreme coupe, of roughly the same period.  I'd sketch them an awful lot.

I found a couple of these on YouTube ... beautiful.

1.) '75 Cutlass Supreme coupe - great color that year - swivel out buckets - crank windows (fine with me)

misses:  no dual body color sport mirrors, no gauge package when there's a console, black seat belts (didn't pop for the upcharge), whitewalls would have looked better, and these metallic rust ones looked better with white vinyl landau roofs

the price was way too much IMO (see windshield) but someone went for it

1.) '75 Cutlass Salon coupe (top of the line) - great color combo but landau roof should have been burgundy or silver, not black - crank windows (fine with me), gauge package comes with this trim level

misses:  black seat belts (would have expected color ones with this trim level), didn't like the exhaust note since that's not what a stock one with an intact exhaust system should sound like

sold ... price unknown ... this thing is a dream, a true icon of Americana at its best circa the bicentennial

Those were the days.

Edited June 25, 2020 by trinacriabob

[G. David Felt]

To me a Cadillac with Black Chrome is Luxury!

[oldshurst442]

Ill always do the muscle car version of the vehicle in question when it comes to the muscle car era.  

One thing the later Colonnade versions have it on the earlier ones is T-Tops.  I love them T-Tops.  One thing Id do to that 1973 Hurst is Id ditch the vinyl roof and Id very much do T-Tops.  

 

I love a 1973 Grand Am too.  I just LOVE the rear.  From the rear quarter panels and on to the ass of the car.  

 

 

[balthazar]

The '70s era stuff was all around me growing up- I rejected them for older, better stuff.
Designed, fitted bumpers, detailed lights & trim. 'Full-flow' body design concept. God; GM pulled off some true modern art in the '60s - unsurpassed.

[trinacriabob]

On 6/29/2020 at 9:50 PM, oldshurst442 said:

One thing the later Colonnade versions have it on the earlier ones is T-Tops.  I love them T-Tops.  

I love a 1973 Grand Am too.  I just LOVE the rear.  From the rear quarter panels and on to the ass of the car.  

 

That opera window on that 1973/4 Olds is a real miss.  It looks like it belongs on an AMC Hornet.  The way that Gran Am was photographed looks svelte.  The strong taper doesn't look good on more "conservative" trims of LeMans of the same years.   I'm certainly not complaining about the concept, overall look, front grille, seating, and cool dashboard of that Grand Am you've posted.

Edited July 6, 2020 by trinacriabob

[balthazar]

42 minutes ago, trinacriabob said:

That opera window on that 1973/4 Olds is a real miss.  It looks like it belongs on an AMC Hornet.

Agreed; blame Hurst. The factory quarter window was well done:

[oldshurst442]

Hurst left it alone in 1974.

But I prefer the front and back end of the 1973 model Cutlass over all other Colonnade Cutlasses.   And yes, I too prefer the original Olds opera window, but I dont seem to mind the smaller, 1973 Hurst opera window.

And to be honest, its a much better opera window than what Oldsmobile ended up doing with it in the later years. At least in my opinion.  

 

I didnt know that Hurst did another in 1975.  No opera window Im observing...  And Im honestly thinking no opera window looks best. Of course with the T-Top!!!

 

On 7/3/2020 at 11:26 AM, Alanhocke said:

To me, the Ford f150 is a great car

 

I love the F-150 in Raptor form myself!

Edited July 6, 2020 by oldshurst442

[Robert Hall]

11 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

Hurst left it alone in 1974.

 

But I prefer the front and back end of the 1973 model Cutlass over all other Colonnade Cutlasses.    

IMO, all the '73 GM mid sizers had the best rear styling of the '73-77 generation---'73 was the only year they had the tight rear bumpers before the '74 federal bumpers.  The '73 Olds and '73 Buick are probably my favorites of that generation.

[balthazar]

I got no use for the ‘73-77 A-Bodies. Maybe the only palatable on for me is the ‘77 Can Am.

[oldshurst442]

Just to finish what Balthy started

 

 

Edited July 7, 2020 by oldshurst442

[balthazar]

Dats da sheet!

[balthazar]

[oldshurst442]

 

[G. David Felt]

^ If only they did not have the heinous front end! 

[oldshurst442]

I, more and more, have come to terms with the front end and in certain cases, as this Yenko 800 HP super special, have come to LOVE not only the whole package, but the front end included. 

[Robert Hall]

12 minutes ago, oldshurst442 said:

I, more and more, have come to terms with the front end and in certain cases, as this Yenko 800 HP super special, have come to LOVE not only the whole package, but the front end included. 

I can't take seriously the legendary Yenko name applied to an ugly ass truck.  Now a modern use of the name on a Camaro, that would make sense.

Edited July 20, 2020 by Robert Hall

[oldshurst442]

2018 I think...

 

PS:  surprisingly, Id rather the truck...

Edited July 20, 2020 by oldshurst442

[oldshurst442]