Continental at Pebble Beach Concours

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

My issues with the MKZ are primarily with the interior material quality and in any of the ones with the 4-cylinder power trains.   That 4-cylinder just drooooones... 

 

 

Materials are top notch, and typical in it's segment.

When you go top shelf BL, that much more so.  And the 2.0L in my Fusion is very smooth and quiet and gutsy.  It is even smoother and quieter in my bro's new MKZ.  I would hardly say it drooooones.  In fact, he raves about how smooth it is......for an I4.  But that's what turbos do, they drastically reduce NVH due to routing through cast stainless turbos and fewer rpms as well.

 

Anyway, there are many entry level luxury cars with worst entry level engines.

[Drew Dowdell]

 

My issues with the MKZ are primarily with the interior material quality and in any of the ones with the 4-cylinder power trains.   That 4-cylinder just drooooones... 

 

 

Materials are top notch, and typical in it's segment.

When you go top shelf BL, that much more so.  And the 2.0L in my Fusion is very smooth and quiet and gutsy.  It is even smoother and quieter in my bro's new MKZ.  I would hardly say it drooooones.  In fact, he raves about how smooth it is......for an I4.  But that's what turbos do, they drastically reduce NVH due to routing through cast stainless turbos and fewer rpms as well.

 

Anyway, there are many entry level luxury cars with worst entry level engines.

 

 

Disagree.  In the Black-Line, the materials that are changed over are top notch, however, the materials that carry over from the lesser trims are not.  

 

I have 5 primary objections in the interior which aren't addressed even in the BL trim because they aren't changed.

1. The huge flat black plastic center stack.

2. The switchgear - primarily the stalks on the column

3. The dash cover - I know it is supposed to look like stitched leather, but it come off looking like a giant rubber pad instead.

4. The buttons on either side of the center stack for transmission control etc.  This may seem a bit picky, but they don't have a high end tactile quality when pressed.  Transmission controls done this way are unique to the Lincoln brand and Lincoln must make it a more memorable experience somehow.

5. The Nintendo gameboy chime when starting up that plagues all Fords products.  I don't mind it so much in a Fiesta or Focus, but for god sake, it is the single easiest thing to change in a car... give the Lincoln a classier sound. 

[ccap41]

^ The chime..because like you said it is probably one of the easiest things to change..should just be programable. Make 5-10 little options. I cna't imagine that actually costing them much more at all and it can be a little "check this out" feature to your friends/family.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

 

 

My issues with the MKZ are primarily with the interior material quality and in any of the ones with the 4-cylinder power trains.   That 4-cylinder just drooooones... 

 

 

Materials are top notch, and typical in it's segment.

When you go top shelf BL, that much more so.  And the 2.0L in my Fusion is very smooth and quiet and gutsy.  It is even smoother and quieter in my bro's new MKZ.  I would hardly say it drooooones.  In fact, he raves about how smooth it is......for an I4.  But that's what turbos do, they drastically reduce NVH due to routing through cast stainless turbos and fewer rpms as well.

 

Anyway, there are many entry level luxury cars with worst entry level engines.

 

 

Disagree.  In the Black-Line, the materials that are changed over are top notch, however, the materials that carry over from the lesser trims are not.  

 

I have 5 primary objections in the interior which aren't addressed even in the BL trim because they aren't changed.

1. The huge flat black plastic center stack.

2. The switchgear - primarily the stalks on the column

3. The dash cover - I know it is supposed to look like stitched leather, but it come off looking like a giant rubber pad instead.

4. The buttons on either side of the center stack for transmission control etc.  This may seem a bit picky, but they don't have a high end tactile quality when pressed.  Transmission controls done this way are unique to the Lincoln brand and Lincoln must make it a more memorable experience somehow.

5. The Nintendo gameboy chime when starting up that plagues all Fords products.  I don't mind it so much in a Fiesta or Focus, but for god sake, it is the single easiest thing to change in a car... give the Lincoln a classier sound. 

 

 

 

I don't know, I have heard these same complaints in the past, and here is my view:

 

1. The large center matte black stack is same plastics used by the competition, albeit not glossy black.  There is more of it where the shifter used to be, but that's about it. 

2. The switchgear has excellent tactile feel. Some of the best out there. 

3. Everyone offers the same stitched look.  I don't see one looking any better than the other.

4. The shift buttons are still a bit odd to me.  I asked my bro how he liked them after about 6 months of use, and he replied with.....meh, their OK.  

5. I like the chime.

 

 

Here is the similar priced Lincoln and Cadillac for comparison.  They have an almost identical base MSRP.  I really don't see one outshining the other, in any way.

 

http://jeremysaysyes.com/dealer/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/2013_cadillac_ats_int_lt_102113_600.jpg

 

 

Regardless, new MKZ interior should improve the niggles we have heard till now.

[surreal1272]

[balthazar]

It is MIND BOGGLING that SO many different brands have the SAME steering wheel concept : spokes @ 9 & 3 o'clock, then a 'split spoke' at 6 o'clock.

 

Homogenization Gone Wild ™

[smk4565]

Compare an MKZ to an A4 or C-class. The C-class doesn't even use plastic window switches, the MKZ has acres of black plastic. If anything, the MKX interior should be Audi A6 level because they aren't spending any money on the power train or chassis.

[ocnblu]

The bones of that steering wheel are probably made by the same vendor.

[oldshurst442]

It is MIND BOGGLING that SO many different brands have the SAME steering wheel concept : spokes @ 9 & 3 o'clock, then a 'split spoke' at 6 o'clock.

 

Homogenization Gone Wild ™

I was thinking the same thing about a month ago.

That is what happens when the supplier is the same dude for everybody and ALL the different manufacturers ask the supplier the same question:

 

Manufacturer: "What is your cheapest steering wheel"

 

Supplier: "This one, Sport Model #5, its our biggest seller. GM, FCA, Ford, Honda and Toyota uses it"

 

Manufacturer: "OK...what does BMW, Mercedes and VAG use?"

 

Supplier: " That would be the Sport Model 5b, there is an extra horn icon on the bottom of the airbag cap. The regular Sport Model 5 has two horn icons, the 5b has three for only a quarter more."

Edited August 28, 2015 by oldshurst442

[smk4565]

It is MIND BOGGLING that SO many different brands have the SAME steering wheel concept : spokes @ 9 & 3 o'clock, then a 'split spoke' at 6 o'clock.

 

Homogenization Gone Wild ™

So the 2 spoke wheel on the S-class is looking pretty good all of a sudden. Non one else does that.

[El Kabong]

Uh... no. That wheel makes a clown face. And once you see the clown face, you will ALWAYS see the clown face. Even in the Maybach.

[oldshurst442]

 

It is MIND BOGGLING that SO many different brands have the SAME steering wheel concept : spokes @ 9 & 3 o'clock, then a 'split spoke' at 6 o'clock.

 

Homogenization Gone Wild ™

So the 2 spoke wheel on the S-class is looking pretty good all of a sudden. Non one else does that.

 

 

That reminds me of something...OH Yeah...Im Greek...

 

Ancient Greek play masks!

So yeah...cool!

 

But...you said nobody does that two spoke thing...

 

 

Ok....not exactly 2-spoke...but not status quo either.

[oldshurst442]

EL K...you beat me to the punch with that steering wheel thing...but...I have to like it...Greek drama...it would be a ...tragedy...if I wouldnt like it...

 

But it is a comedy with him always plugging M-B...

 

Yes...pun intended with the red words...

[El Kabong]

The three-spoke wheel is so popular because it offers enough spokes to not be flexible (unlike, say, old Citroen one-spokers), positioned to allow a good view of the gauges (unlike old banjo-style four smokers) and a good resting place for your thumbs at nine and three (unlike my boomerang wheel in my old Mustang).

Also, Ferrari/Momo did them for a long time. So there's the cool factor.

Edited August 29, 2015 by El Kabong

[ccap41]

Uh... no. That wheel makes a clown face. And once you see the clown face, you will ALWAYS see the clown face. Even in the Maybach.

Aaaaaaand you just ruined it for me. lol

[smk4565]

Maybe the MKZ can go KITT style and copy this wheel.

 

[balthazar]

Yea, the MB clown face wheel is pretty terrifying. 

 

But wait- what do you guys mean there's an outside vendor making steering wheels- no OEMs do their own wheels anymore??

 

RE: "The three-spoke wheel is so popular because it offers enough spokes to not be flexible, positioned to allow a good view of the gauges & a good resting place for your thumbs at nine and three."

That's not it at all. First off, instrumentation viewing thru the wheel has never been WORSE than it is in current times. And I've never had an issue with a wheel flexing, even old 2-spokers. This, plain & simple, is lawyer-influenced homogenization in an industry where copying has become a finely honed art.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

 

 

surreal,

are you certain this is the ATS?

 

Just asking.

 

I kid

[El Kabong]

Yea, the MB clown face wheel is pretty terrifying. 

 

But wait- what do you guys mean there's an outside vendor making steering wheels- no OEMs do their own wheels anymore??

 

RE: "The three-spoke wheel is so popular because it offers enough spokes to not be flexible, positioned to allow a good view of the gauges & a good resting place for your thumbs at nine and three."

That's not it at all. First off, instrumentation viewing thru the wheel has never been WORSE than it is in current times. And I've never had an issue with a wheel flexing, even old 2-spokers. This, plain & simple, is lawyer-influenced homogenization in an industry where copying has become a finely honed art.

Airbags in the hub don't help, to be fair. And the spokes are pretty thick to help accommodate that. But before airbags, you can't tell me that a Momo wheel wasn't the shizzle.

[ccap41]

 

 

 

http://jeremysaysyes.com/dealer/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/2013_cadillac_ats_int_lt_102113_600.jpg

 

 

 

 

 I think the Linconl interior looks "classier" and the Cadillac interior looks "sportier". Overall I think the Cadillac looks better(even though I don't like the super light grey in the picture - I've seen black in black or a dark brown that look gorgeour to me).

[Robert Hall]

 

 

 

A Honda Accord is better than an MKS at this point.    I think the Continental will help seal the fate of the Lincoln brand.  They'll spend all this money on the car, sales will tank and they'll realize that the brand is dead and it is time to call it a wrap. 

 

Not in the least. If nothing else, MKC and MKX are currently enough to preserve Lincoln.  A new aluminum Navigator is coming (none too soon), and a refreshed MKZ (also a bit past due).

 

That puts Lincoln at least on par with Acura and Acura isn't going anywhere anytime soon. 

 

The MKZ came out in 2013 model year, it needs a refresh already?  And how do you refresh it, it is still a Fusion.  The GLC should put the hurt on the 2 Lincoln crossovers, now that Mercedes doesn't have an ugly c-segment crossover, they can actually get sales, and the yuppies can buy Q3s for less than a Lincoln.  Why buy a Lincoln and have to explain to your neighbor why you did it, when you can buy and Audi or Benz and be proud.

 

Does that include being proud of those obscene maintenance bills down the road (which will happen with the MB and the Audi)?

 

The key to German car ownership is to trade it before the free maintenance period or warranty expires.  Most are just leased anyway..I wouldn't buy one used.   Anyway, regarding the Continental, I'm interesting in seeing what the production version looks like..it's a rather striking design. 

Edited August 29, 2015 by Cubical-aka-Moltar

[ocnblu]

That is exactly what I did with my TDi Beetle.  Free maintenance period was up, and the next round would have cost beaucoup bucks.

[Guest regfootball]

Maybe the MKZ can go KITT style and copy this wheel.

 

 

 

it influences cop car dash board design LOL

 

 

[Drew Dowdell]

 

 

 

My issues with the MKZ are primarily with the interior material quality and in any of the ones with the 4-cylinder power trains.   That 4-cylinder just drooooones... 

 

 

Materials are top notch, and typical in it's segment.

When you go top shelf BL, that much more so.  And the 2.0L in my Fusion is very smooth and quiet and gutsy.  It is even smoother and quieter in my bro's new MKZ.  I would hardly say it drooooones.  In fact, he raves about how smooth it is......for an I4.  But that's what turbos do, they drastically reduce NVH due to routing through cast stainless turbos and fewer rpms as well.

 

Anyway, there are many entry level luxury cars with worst entry level engines.

 

 

Disagree.  In the Black-Line, the materials that are changed over are top notch, however, the materials that carry over from the lesser trims are not.  

 

I have 5 primary objections in the interior which aren't addressed even in the BL trim because they aren't changed.

1. The huge flat black plastic center stack.

2. The switchgear - primarily the stalks on the column

3. The dash cover - I know it is supposed to look like stitched leather, but it come off looking like a giant rubber pad instead.

4. The buttons on either side of the center stack for transmission control etc.  This may seem a bit picky, but they don't have a high end tactile quality when pressed.  Transmission controls done this way are unique to the Lincoln brand and Lincoln must make it a more memorable experience somehow.

5. The Nintendo gameboy chime when starting up that plagues all Fords products.  I don't mind it so much in a Fiesta or Focus, but for god sake, it is the single easiest thing to change in a car... give the Lincoln a classier sound. 

 

 

 

I don't know, I have heard these same complaints in the past, and here is my view:

 

1. The large center matte black stack is same plastics used by the competition, albeit not glossy black.  There is more of it where the shifter used to be, but that's about it. 

2. The switchgear has excellent tactile feel. Some of the best out there. 

3. Everyone offers the same stitched look.  I don't see one looking any better than the other.

4. The shift buttons are still a bit odd to me.  I asked my bro how he liked them after about 6 months of use, and he replied with.....meh, their OK.  

5. I like the chime.

 

 

Here is the similar priced Lincoln and Cadillac for comparison.  They have an almost identical base MSRP.  I really don't see one outshining the other, in any way.

 

http://jeremysaysyes.com/dealer/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/2013_cadillac_ats_int_lt_102113_600.jpg

 

 

Regardless, new MKZ interior should improve the niggles we have heard till now.

 

 

1. I wouldn't have used black plastic at all, that's my point.  That it is flat black plastic makes it look cheap regardless of the actual cost.

2. The switchgear (again, I am primarily looking at the column stalks in this case) are identical to those in the Focus and Fusion. It is par for their class, but not for the luxury class.

3. It isn't the stitching that I take issue with, it is the material used for the dash cover. It's supposed to look like stitched leather, but instead it looks like stitched rubber.

4. The idea of the shift buttons is sound, I like them.  Their operation needs to be more refined. This is a spot where drivers want a good solid feel.  Make the buttons metal or give them haptic feedback or something. Just make them feel more substantial. 

5. Lincoln needs its own. They should be doing everything possible to distance themselves from Ford and keeping Ford's rather unique  (and to me, irritating) chime isn't cutting it. 

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

Well, I think that's all water under the bridge on their entry level sedan, because it is updated as we speak and launching in months.

[Drew Dowdell]

I look forward to seeing it.  It's a solid car overall and after spending a long weekend in a 1 year old Lexus ES, I can safely say that it and the MKZ are more equal than most people would like to admit.  However, the areas that I pointed out would help to push the MKZ into a "better overall" position over the ES. 

 

I have a complaints list for the ES as well, but I won't pollute the Continental thread with them. 

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

Understood. And I too have voiced my complaints for the MKZ.  It's certainly not perfect.

 

To Ford (Lincoln's) credit, I do like how they typically take the loudest customer complaints to heart and address them.  At least the ones that are addressable (chassis architectures and lack of a Ranger is not so easy).  I expect what will at first seem like a modest interior update, will be much more under the skin, with many engineered changes as well.  New powertrain alone will solve a lot of woes.  Heck, just swapping out the 2.0L for the 2.3L GTDI is a welcome change, combined with improved drivelines and more gears.  But fan blood should boil over nicely with a 400hp 3.0L AWD MKZ.  I see no reason why they would only use a 2.7L, when it packages the exact same.  Fingers crossed on this one.

 

And I actually don't know which they are using.