Continental at Pebble Beach Concours

[ocnblu]

Let us take this as a gentle lesson:  1960 and 1961 Lincoln sedans.

[ocnblu]

 

 

Or is it because some of us are still at grade school level reading...and that is why we may doze off...

Ill start posting more pics and less words then...for some posters...

How did you know I was talking about you? 

 

Because I have a habit of being long winded...

I take after my mother. You know the kind...Greek mothers, that always have a story to tell...

Besides...I have gotten compliments of my long windedness before...

 

You really are the first to whine about it... ...and throw a shoe my way...

 

In to which I decided to give you the middle finger...two middle fingers...all in the name of fun of course...

Peace out...

 

Sooooo... you're 8 years old too?

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

Let us take this as a gentle lesson:  1960 and 1961 Lincoln sedans.fec67efd5e5a7996dae7c0bd98e860ab.jpg1961 Lincoln Continental-15.jpg

 

 

My fav will always be,

 

[Drew Dowdell]

Ahem, now that I've cleaned up the personal attacks and off-topic stuff again... moving on. 

[El Kabong]

I think the most troubling thing I've read about this car so far was over in the Taurus thread where someone suggested that killing the Taurus would actually send sales to this thing.

That would indicate to me that someone has NO IDEA how luxury car buyers think. Hopefully, they have no sway in how Ford goes about trying to market this car.

 

 

Show of hands for anyone who thinks that nobody will consider a $55K Conti, after realizing the $50K SHO is no longer available.

...which is precisely my point, really.

Lincoln: hyping Taurus replacements because we STILL DON'T GET IT.

Bump

[ocnblu]

I like the Mark IV and the Mark V.  The Mark VI was a disaster (tiny car with tacked-on big-car styling).  The Mark VII was nice... but then the Mark VIII was just a blob.  Like a bar of soap version of earlier Marks that had been rubbed on too many armpits and butt holes.

[oldshurst442]

 

 

 

Or is it because some of us are still at grade school level reading...and that is why we may doze off...

Ill start posting more pics and less words then...for some posters...

How did you know I was talking about you? 

 

Because I have a habit of being long winded...

I take after my mother. You know the kind...Greek mothers, that always have a story to tell...

Besides...I have gotten compliments of my long windedness before...

 

You really are the first to whine about it... ...and throw a shoe my way...

 

In to which I decided to give you the middle finger...two middle fingers...all in the name of fun of course...

Peace out...

 

Sooooo... you're 8 years old too?

 

Nah...Im just giving you a piece of my mind....with visual stimulation because as you have stated...too many words makes you doze off...

 

 

PS...OCNBLU...dont try to out-wit, out-dramatize a Greek...we invented that shyte...

Sarcasm...its in our blood.

Edited August 18, 2015 by oldshurst442

[ocnblu]

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD.  If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

[Drew Dowdell]

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD.  If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

 

...... but... it's all wheel drive

[El Kabong]

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD.  If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

 

...... but... it's all wheel drive

It is AWD. And that's fine. But it's FWD-based AWD that is riding on a mainstream platform. It is an acceptable stopgap for D6, if the price is right. But it is no more a flagship, or even premium model than the Cadillac XTS, and for the exact same reason.

[ocnblu]

I am not just picking on Ford here.  If the current Impala were RWD, I would not be able to contain the children.

[Drew Dowdell]

 

 

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD.  If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

 

...... but... it's all wheel drive

It is AWD. And that's fine. But it's FWD-based AWD that is riding on a mainstream platform. It is an acceptable stopgap for D6, if the price is right. But it is no more a flagship, or even premium model than the Cadillac XTS, and for the exact same reason.

 

 

If it is the same AWD system used in the Ford Focus (I've had a long day and a martini, correct me if I'm wrong) it doesn't matter if it is FWD or RWD based because its that good. 

[oldshurst442]

 

 

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD.  If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

 

...... but... it's all wheel drive

It is AWD. And that's fine. But it's FWD-based AWD that is riding on a mainstream platform. It is an acceptable stopgap for D6, if the price is right. But it is no more a flagship, or even premium model than the Cadillac XTS, and for the exact same reason.

 

And Im willing to bet, that even if it was RWD...or RWD based AWD...that 99.999999999% of the population would not know what wheels are powering what...

And those include the luxo buyers....

 

Its only the very few car enthusiasts that put an emphasis on RWD...

 

I, however do agree that it should be RWD....or RWD based AWD...,but seriously speaking....Lincoln is not targeting that enthusiast crowd anyway...unlike Cadillac...

 

And like I said...to which you have agreed, it is a great starting point for Lincoln with this Continental...

 

If the price is right?

What is the XTS's selling price anyway?

[Drew Dowdell]

The XTS starts in the mid-high 40s, but it doesn't have the engine power or the AWD that the Continental will likely have. 

[Guest El Kabong]

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD. If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

...... but... it's all wheel drive

It is AWD. And that's fine. But it's FWD-based AWD that is riding on a mainstream platform. It is an acceptable stopgap for D6, if the price is right. But it is no more a flagship, or even premium model than the Cadillac XTS, and for the exact same reason.

If it is the same AWD system used in the Ford Focus (I've had a long day and a martini, correct me if I'm wrong) it doesn't matter if it is FWD or RWD based because its that good.

A martini? Dood, I'm tempted to just go get a fifth of Wild Turkey. And I don't drink anymore

[oldshurst442]

Ouzo anyone?

 

PS...I dont drink anymore either...Ive got too much iron in my blood, so why complicate my liver any further?

Edited August 19, 2015 by oldshurst442

[ccap41]

 

 

 

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD.  If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

 

...... but... it's all wheel drive

It is AWD. And that's fine. But it's FWD-based AWD that is riding on a mainstream platform. It is an acceptable stopgap for D6, if the price is right. But it is no more a flagship, or even premium model than the Cadillac XTS, and for the exact same reason.

 

And Im willing to bet, that even if it was RWD...or RWD based AWD...that 99.999999999% of the population would not know what wheels are powering what...

And those include the luxo buyers....

 

Its only the very few car enthusiasts that put an emphasis on RWD...

 

I, however do agree that it should be RWD....or RWD based AWD...,but seriously speaking....Lincoln is not targeting that enthusiast crowd anyway...unlike Cadillac...

 

And like I said...to which you have agreed, it is a great starting point for Lincoln with this Continental...

 

If the price is right?

What is the XTS's selling price anyway?

 

I can't agree more with those statements. I've even said them before, myself. The people who drive these cars and heck even being extreme and saying Bentleys and Rolls don't know the powered wheels.

 

I want it to be RWD based.. but they aren't going after the enthusiast. They're going for the quiet, luxurious, and comfy kind of higher end car(yes 50k is higher end) unlike most BMW/MB/Audi/Cadillac. Those are all "sport sedans" for a reason. They're typically driven with a little more sport as well.

[ccap41]

 

 

 

 

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD. If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

...... but... it's all wheel drive

It is AWD. And that's fine. But it's FWD-based AWD that is riding on a mainstream platform. It is an acceptable stopgap for D6, if the price is right. But it is no more a flagship, or even premium model than the Cadillac XTS, and for the exact same reason.

If it is the same AWD system used in the Ford Focus (I've had a long day and a martini, correct me if I'm wrong) it doesn't matter if it is FWD or RWD based because its that good.

A martini? Dood, I'm tempted to just go get a fifth of Wild Turkey. And I don't drink anymore

 

WILD TURKEY?!?!  Ha. I bought a shot of wild turkey for a friend this past weekend.. he didn't enjoy it too much. He was offered what we were taking(some "bomb" shot.. but he didn't want it..so I got him his own Wild Turkey to shoot with us! lol

[El Kabong]

My preference back in my drinking days was 12 year-old Gibsons. But I wasn't too picky.

[ocnblu]

The old Town Car was RWD, and it was one heck of a cushy roller.  How does being RWD require a car to be hardcore?

[oldshurst442]

The old Town Car was RWD, and it was one heck of a cushy roller.  How does being RWD require a car to be hardcore?

Good question...

By the same token...a real Mini Cooper from the 1950s/1960s/1970s was FWD and it handled like a go-kart...one could say it was a hardcore in handling prowess for races....

 

I want the Continental to be a plush rider, just like it was during the good 'ol days...and not a performance oriented car like a CTS or CT6 or whatever Cadillac is doing right now to compete with sports sedan cars from Germany...but I would want it to be RWD just for sentimental reasons as you said..the Town Car, the Continental cars themselves from the 1950s/1960s/1970s, Fleetwood Broughams, the RWD Eldorados of the 1950s and early 1960s...

[Cmicasa the Great]

The Avenir certainly has a more contemporary look. And underpinnings.

GM should build it. It likely won't hurt Cadillac sales.

 

 

 

Its a gorgeous concept, but again, like the Continental is a concept. 

[Cmicasa the Great]

 

 

I would instantly forgive the Continental any failings perceived by me if it were RWD.  If I were shown a photo of the same exact car twice, and was told that one is FWD and one is RWD, my opinion of the RWD version would be far more charitable.

 

...... but... it's all wheel drive

It is AWD. And that's fine. But it's FWD-based AWD that is riding on a mainstream platform. It is an acceptable stopgap for D6, if the price is right. But it is no more a flagship, or even premium model than the Cadillac XTS, and for the exact same reason.

 

 

 

 

I agree... and that's the reason I would have moved past that Lincoln display and went straight to this like a bat outta hell

 

CT6, CTS, ATS.. SEXY

[El Kabong]

Long time no see, meng! Also, you chose wisely

[Cmicasa the Great]

Long time no see, meng! Also, you chose wisely

 

 

 

Always do. While I will not call the Continental unattractive, because it is a nice looking car, but I see it as nothing special in the same way I see the Chrysler 300. IOronic that both attempt to pull cues from a Bentley

[cp-the-nerd]

The XTS starts in the mid-high 40s, but it doesn't have the engine power or the AWD that the Continental will likely have. 

 

Not sure I follow. The Cadillac XTS--which will be 4 years old when the Continental is released--uses HALDEX torque vectoring AWD, a more advanced system than anything Ford currently produces, and has an available 410 hp turbo V6. It also has standard magnetic ride control and a hi-per strut front suspension. Mechanically, the Continental does not impress. It will sell on interior and exterior design and whether it can be better than the sum of its parts.

[El Kabong]

Long time no see, meng! Also, you chose wisely

 

 

 

Always do. While I will not call the Continental unattractive, because it is a nice looking car, but I see it as nothing special in the same way I see the Chrysler 300. IOronic that both attempt to pull cues from a Bentley

Ya, but the Chrysler at least has a Hemi

[Drew Dowdell]

The XTS starts in the mid-high 40s, but it doesn't have the engine power or the AWD that the Continental will likely have.

Not sure I follow. The Cadillac XTS--which will be 4 years old when the Continental is released--uses HALDEX torque vectoring AWD, a more advanced system than anything Ford currently produces, and has an available 410 hp turbo V6. It also has standard magnetic ride control and a hi-per strut front suspension. Mechanically, the Continental does not impress. It will sell on interior and exterior design and whether it can be better than the sum of its parts.

Indeed it does have those options available, but not standard at that $47k price. (except hi per strut and mrc) To get the power level and awd that the continental is supposedly going to have, you'll be into the $60k range.

[cp-the-nerd]

 

 

The XTS starts in the mid-high 40s, but it doesn't have the engine power or the AWD that the Continental will likely have.

Not sure I follow. The Cadillac XTS--which will be 4 years old when the Continental is released--uses HALDEX torque vectoring AWD, a more advanced system than anything Ford currently produces, and has an available 410 hp turbo V6. It also has standard magnetic ride control and a hi-per strut front suspension. Mechanically, the Continental does not impress. It will sell on interior and exterior design and whether it can be better than the sum of its parts.

Indeed it does have those options available, but not standard at that $47k price. (except hi per strut and mrc) To get the power level and awd that the continental is supposedly going to have, you'll be into the $60k range.

 

 

I'll believe the hype when the production Continental is revealed along with pricing and powertrains.

[Drew Dowdell]

 

 

 

The XTS starts in the mid-high 40s, but it doesn't have the engine power or the AWD that the Continental will likely have.

Not sure I follow. The Cadillac XTS--which will be 4 years old when the Continental is released--uses HALDEX torque vectoring AWD, a more advanced system than anything Ford currently produces, and has an available 410 hp turbo V6. It also has standard magnetic ride control and a hi-per strut front suspension. Mechanically, the Continental does not impress. It will sell on interior and exterior design and whether it can be better than the sum of its parts.

Indeed it does have those options available, but not standard at that $47k price. (except hi per strut and mrc) To get the power level and awd that the continental is supposedly going to have, you'll be into the $60k range.

 

 

I'll believe the hype when the production Continental is revealed along with pricing and powertrains.

 

 

400 HP from a 3.0 V6 doesn't sound like too much of a stretch.  Cadillac is doing that in the CT6.

[El Kabong]

But will it have pushrods?

[Cmicasa the Great]

 

 

Long time no see, meng! Also, you chose wisely

 

 

 

Always do. While I will not call the Continental unattractive, because it is a nice looking car, but I see it as nothing special in the same way I see the Chrysler 300. IOronic that both attempt to pull cues from a Bentley

Ya, but the Chrysler at least has a Hemi

 

 

 

 

Yeah.. it does. Can't hate on the Hemi

[oldshurst442]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Always do. While I will not call the Continental unattractive, because it is a nice looking car, but I see it as nothing special in the same way I see the Chrysler 300. IOronic that both attempt to pull cues from a Bentley

Ya, but the Chrysler at least has a Hemi

 

 

 

 

Yeah.. it does. Can't hate on the Hemi

 

No...no you cant hate on the Hemi...

 

And that goes for the Bentley too...at least the Chrsyler has a Hemi...

[ocnblu]

Again, look at that wavy aluminum body on the CT6. 

[Suaviloquent]

Well, I think the Continental concept is a spectacular styling achievement, and I really do not see any semblance to any Bentley.

 

The AWD system used on the Continental is supposed to be similar - if not the same as the Ford Focus RS. 

 

Lincoln is getting a commitment now just like Cadillac received a decade ago. I'm very sure people were impatient of Cadillac then, but we've seen progress in their 3rd round of products, and the CT6 launches the 4th round.

 

Lincoln could very well learn from Cadillac when it comes to making every new generation far superior than the last. But otherwise, Lincoln and Cadillac are going after the completely different audience.

 

As for the prestige of RWD, whenever I see an XTS whether from up close or far away; I don't care about it's driven wheels because it looks damn good. The details in the back are especially well done. I'm sure it's role as a large Cadillac sedan isn't hampered at all by its driven wheels; and honestly; GM is making money using the well established Epsilon platform. 

 

We know from the testing done by MT of the CD4 derived Edge Sport that it can hang with the Porsche Macan in testing numbers. Ford is already making some of the best performance front drive cars - Fiesta/Focus ST. If Lincoln's mission was being a performance/luxury automaker, I think they could; albeit unorthodox, pull off great FWD biased AWD driving dynamics. But that isn't the case, and I don't really want Lincoln to do that.

Edited August 23, 2015 by Suaviloquent

[El Kabong]

I wish Lincoln success. I just don't expect them to have it with this car.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

Well, I think the Continental concept is a spectacular styling achievement, and I really do not see any semblance to any Bentley.

 

The AWD system used on the Continental is supposed to be similar - if not the same as the Ford Focus RS. 

 

Lincoln is getting a commitment now just like Cadillac received a decade ago. I'm very sure people were impatient of Cadillac then, but we've seen progress in their 3rd round of products, and the CT6 launches the 4th round.

 

Lincoln could very well learn from Cadillac when it comes to making every new generation far superior than the last. But otherwise, Lincoln and Cadillac are going after the completely different audience.

 

As for the prestige of RWD, whenever I see an XTS whether from up close or far away; I don't care about it's driven wheels because it looks damn good. The details in the back are especially well done. I'm sure it's role as a large Cadillac sedan isn't hampered at all by its driven wheels; and honestly; GM is making money using the well established Epsilon platform. 

 

We know from the testing done by MT of the CD4 derived Edge Sport that it can hang with the Porsche Macan in testing numbers. Ford is already making some of the best performance front drive cars - Fiesta/Focus ST. If Lincoln's mission was being a performance/luxury automaker, I think they could; albeit unorthodox, pull off great FWD biased AWD driving dynamics. But that isn't the case, and I don't really want Lincoln to do that

Agreed, but Lincoln is not just now getting a commitment really.  They are just now finishing what could be considered phase II, with the continental being the last product of that phase.  Sure, the previous phase I was a bit half hearted, with the MKS, MKX, MKT and Zephyr were attempts that just never really catapulted the brand.  But they did set Lincoln on a new path. Last December, Lincoln presented their next phase (phase III) and it got the green light from Ford execs, complete with at least one new platform that could spin off several vehicle products.  That timeline is 4-5 years out before we will see anything hit the streets.  And they will no doubt close some gaps in missing segments.  But, in the interim and near term, with the current phase II all in place along with new updates, I think Lincoln will not only be healthy, but the come-back luxury brand.   

Edited August 23, 2015 by Wings4Life

[El Kabong]

Phase I was simply business as usual, which doesn't make it a phase at all, but a continuation of the problem.

[Suaviloquent]

The Continental has a pretty simple mission. It just has to maintain the majority of the concept's looks, deliver the 30 way power seats, have killer audio; and be the most comfortable sedan out there. Out LS the Lexus LS. They really got to give an extraordinary level of interior quality and refinement.

 

Here's to hoping that they deliver just that.

[Drew Dowdell]

The Continental has a pretty simple mission. It just has to maintain the majority of the concept's looks, deliver the 30 way power seats, have killer audio; and be the most comfortable sedan out there. Out LS the Lexus LS. They really got to give an extraordinary level of interior quality and refinement.

 

Here's to hoping that they deliver just that.

 

That's probably the best description of the Continental's intentions out there.  Out LS the LS.   Keep it close to concept in appearance and it will also look better doing it. 

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

Agreed, well said suave.  

[smk4565]

I think Lincoln could price the Continental at $39,995 (including destination charge) and the Lexus ES will still mop the floor with it in sales.  Good luck getting people to buy a full size Lincoln sedan.

[Drew Dowdell]

I think Lincoln could price the Continental at $39,995 (including destination charge) and the Lexus ES will still mop the floor with it in sales.  Good luck getting people to buy a full size Lincoln sedan.

 

It's not going to suddenly become the best selling car in the segment, whatever segment that may be.  It doesn't need to be though, it just needs to convince enough people at a growing rate that it is gobs better than the MKS (not a very high bar). 

[smk4565]

A Honda Accord is better than an MKS at this point.    I think the Continental will help seal the fate of the Lincoln brand.  They'll spend all this money on the car, sales will tank and they'll realize that the brand is dead and it is time to call it a wrap. 

[Drew Dowdell]

A Honda Accord is better than an MKS at this point.    I think the Continental will help seal the fate of the Lincoln brand.  They'll spend all this money on the car, sales will tank and they'll realize that the brand is dead and it is time to call it a wrap. 

 

Not in the least. If nothing else, MKC and MKX are currently enough to preserve Lincoln.  A new aluminum Navigator is coming (none too soon), and a refreshed MKZ (also a bit past due).

 

That puts Lincoln at least on par with Acura and Acura isn't going anywhere anytime soon. 

[oldshurst442]

A Honda Accord is better than an MKS at this point.    I think the Continental will help seal the fate of the Lincoln brand.  They'll spend all this money on the car, sales will tank and they'll realize that the brand is dead and it is time to call it a wrap. 

What gives you that dumb idea?

 

A Honda Accord is a nice car and all, but the TLX, for me at least, moves no emotional needle...in fact, it distanced me from being an Acura guy...

I own a 2012 Acura TL SH-AWD, and I love everything about that car. ESPECIALLY the polarizing looks. I know those looks are not for everyone...but at least it was talked about, and you could spot one a mile away. The TLX, just like an Accord, gets lost in the crowd...

The Lincoln Continental....whether you want to admit it or not...has presence.

And if Lincoln gets the interior quality right, then its Acura that should fear Lincoln for Lincoln would probably surpass Acura in that all important hierarchy ladder...the Acura NSX is delayed again...and if Acura botches that launch just like Lexus did with the LFA...Acura's shining armor will get slightly tarnished...again...

I know you want controversial posts....but this one is just...dumb.

 

EDIT: I just read your post Drew on Acura....I agree with you, Acura aint going anywhere anytime soon.  But if the Lincoln Continental is done right, the way we as fans want Lincoln to do it right, it could only be very good news for Lincoln.

Edited August 28, 2015 by oldshurst442

[smk4565]

 

A Honda Accord is better than an MKS at this point.    I think the Continental will help seal the fate of the Lincoln brand.  They'll spend all this money on the car, sales will tank and they'll realize that the brand is dead and it is time to call it a wrap. 

 

Not in the least. If nothing else, MKC and MKX are currently enough to preserve Lincoln.  A new aluminum Navigator is coming (none too soon), and a refreshed MKZ (also a bit past due).

 

That puts Lincoln at least on par with Acura and Acura isn't going anywhere anytime soon. 

 

The MKZ came out in 2013 model year, it needs a refresh already?  And how do you refresh it, it is still a Fusion.  The GLC should put the hurt on the 2 Lincoln crossovers, now that Mercedes doesn't have an ugly c-segment crossover, they can actually get sales, and the yuppies can buy Q3s for less than a Lincoln.  Why buy a Lincoln and have to explain to your neighbor why you did it, when you can buy and Audi or Benz and be proud.

[Guest Wings4Life(BANNED)]

The MKZ is still new and fresh to many and hardly in need of an update, although it will get one to better align the new styling direction, in addition to improving the complaints on the interior.  I think the performance versions coming will also help to change peoples perceptions of the brand a bit as well.  I would expect the new 3.0L (+400hp) to be in a performance MKZ model.  I don't think Lincoln will be chasing anyone around a track as they try to establish the performance image/brand, but again, they don't really have to. It would only need to be properly biased in the comfort -vs- performance category of 'quiet luxury.' 

[Drew Dowdell]

My issues with the MKZ are primarily with the interior material quality and in any of the ones with the 4-cylinder power trains.   That 4-cylinder just drooooones... 

[surreal1272]

 

 

A Honda Accord is better than an MKS at this point.    I think the Continental will help seal the fate of the Lincoln brand.  They'll spend all this money on the car, sales will tank and they'll realize that the brand is dead and it is time to call it a wrap. 

 

Not in the least. If nothing else, MKC and MKX are currently enough to preserve Lincoln.  A new aluminum Navigator is coming (none too soon), and a refreshed MKZ (also a bit past due).

 

That puts Lincoln at least on par with Acura and Acura isn't going anywhere anytime soon. 

 

The MKZ came out in 2013 model year, it needs a refresh already?  And how do you refresh it, it is still a Fusion.  The GLC should put the hurt on the 2 Lincoln crossovers, now that Mercedes doesn't have an ugly c-segment crossover, they can actually get sales, and the yuppies can buy Q3s for less than a Lincoln.  Why buy a Lincoln and have to explain to your neighbor why you did it, when you can buy and Audi or Benz and be proud.

 

Does that include being proud of those obscene maintenance bills down the road (which will happen with the MB and the Audi)?

Edited August 28, 2015 by surreal1272