Random Thoughts Thread

[trinacriabob]

Good morning ...

 

[oldshurst442]

The comments say he made himself bigger blah blah blah.

While true, it looked like that was a baby bear and well baby bears usually dont look for a fight.  And while Im trying to talk a big game, I dont know how I would have reacted. Probably not as brave as this driver, but I do know one thing, had momma bear been around, no amount of making one's self bigger would have worked... 

 Best comment goes to this gentleman though:  (Im a sucker for bad puns and dad jokes!)

Alan Smith

1 month ago

Porch Pirates are becoming unBEARable! (pun)

Edited January 23, 2022 by oldshurst442

[trinacriabob]

2 hours ago, oldshurst442 said:

The comments say he made himself bigger 

While true, it looked like that was a baby bear and well baby bears usually dont look for a fight.  And while Im trying to talk a big game, I dont know how I would have reacted. Probably not as brave as this driver, but I do know one thing, had momma bear been around, no amount of making one's self bigger would have worked... 

I think it was a teenage bear.  It looks like it might have just recently parted ways with its mother and any siblings.  Lucky for the Amazon delivery guy.  He was so damn relaxed about the whole thing.

- - - - -

I had mentioned Greek yogurt before and how much I liked the flavor Toasted Marshmallow.  I then tried one called Creme Brulee because I couldn't find Toasted Marshmallow.  I didn't like it.  (Their basic Strawberry and Strawberry Cheesecake are good.) With basic Greek yogurt being blander in taste, it's great to have the addition of some flavor so I'll eat it more readily.  I like that it's good for the gut.  So, I again found and stocked up on this Toasted Marshmallow flavor.  So damn good.

 

[oldshurst442]

^^^ 

Adolescent bear is a more accurate description than saying it was a baby bear.  I just wanted to say (and type) baby bear. LOL.   Rolls off the tongue better (and the words look better on screen).  LOL   

 

Creme Brulee and/with Greek yogurt?  It doesnt sound that appetizing...   I wouldnt have the courage to try it.   

How come in Canada, we dont get those kinds of choices?    I doubt that in Greece, or in any Middle Eastern country that multiple flavoured "Greek" yogurts exists either...    What I find cool about that is in Greece, a small yogurt package comes with a little packet of honey on the side.   

And what I mean about multiple flavoured and the lack of choices is what you presented us with.  Strawberry and blueberry and peach yogurt in Greek yogurt guise is available.  What is not is cheesecake and creme brulee and roasted marshmellow and anything else that seems illogical to the non-American diet...  LOL

 

 

 

[balthazar]

Not sure what year this was but not very recently - Wangers (pictured) retired from public life at 91 in 2018.

Edited January 24, 2022 by balthazar

[trinacriabob]

@oldshurst442  Check the label on the photos.  Dannon makes these yogurt cups, so you may very well have them in Canada.  Not all American grocery stores carry all these flavors.  Once certain ones do, and I do know the rhyme and reason as to how they choose to carry, and not carry, certain flavors of yogurt.  It's the same situation with salad dressing flavors.

[Robert Hall]

On 1/19/2022 at 5:51 PM, balthazar said:

'61-62 Pontiac final drive ratio options : 
2.56, 2.69, 2.87, 3.08, 3.23, 3.31, 3.55, 3.64, 3.90, 4.44, 4.67, 4.88, 5.13, 5.38, 5.57, 5.86, 6.14 

That’s a lot of options.  Been a long time since most cars had any optional axle ratios.  

 

 

For yogurt-like food product, I like Siggi’s Skyr.  An Iceland product with more protein and calories than yogurt.  Smooth and tasty. 

[Drew Dowdell]

On 1/19/2022 at 4:56 PM, balthazar said:

Nothing established as a hard end-date yet, so we'll see (BOF SUVs & trucks especially; GM has backpedaled there more than once.).

- - - - - 
Leno is one of the best reviewers out there, because he has actual hands-on perspective and has no need for awkward 'click bait' word games / phraseology. 

Ultium is body on frame. It's just now the frame is stuffed full of batteries.

[balthazar]

Yep.

Funny how after decades of espousing the reputed virtues of unibody construction, we're now going to do a hard pivot back to BOF. 

[surreal1272]

1 hour ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Ultium is body on frame. It's just now the frame is stuffed full of batteries.

But in this case, BOF for the EVs is not the same as old school BOF correct? My understanding is that EVs like the Hummer will be using a modified version of the BOF found in their full size pick ups but that doesn't mean that EVs like the future Equinox will be like that.

Edited January 24, 2022 by surreal1272

[balthazar]

I'm sure there are subtle differences from OEM to OEM, but looks like a textbook BOF to me. Rivian : 

[surreal1272]

5 minutes ago, balthazar said:

I'm sure there are subtle differences from OEM to OEM, but looks like a textbook BOF to me. Rivian : 

What I am referring to is the ride difference though. Yes, it looks like a traditional BOF but it rides like unibody. Besides harping about unibodies is missing serious context. BOF rides like $h! compared to unibody and that is a fact. Great for towing and hauling but garbage for everyday ride quality when compared to unibody. That applies to ICE cars only though as the Ultium is not like the BOFs of yore. To compare the two beyond that, in order to make some ridiculous point about what was being touted with ICE cars is not an apples to apples deal.

Edited January 24, 2022 by surreal1272

[Drew Dowdell]

6 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

What I am referring to is the ride difference though. Yes, it looks like a traditional BOF but it rides like unibody. Besides harping about unibodies is missing serious context. BOF rides like $h! compared to unibody and that is a fact. Great for towing and hauling but garbage for everyday ride quality when compared to unibody. That applies to ICE cars only though as the Ultium is not like the BOFs of yore. To compare the two beyond that, in order to make some ridiculous point about what was being touted with ICE cars is not an apples to apples deal.

Unibody v. BOF ride quality comes down more around what the manufacturer does beyond that decision.  My BOF Avalanche rides fantastic on the highway, most of the Ram pickups and Magnaride equipped Denalis do too.  The F-150 rides terrible unless there is one version out there with an active suspension that I haven't driven yet.  The Ford Mach-E rides like crap if you don't get the active suspension.  The Telsa Model 3, which is unibody, rides like a Conestoga wagon. 

You may be thinking of the really old tech stuff, but even then the Town Car v. DTS, the Town Car rode better, but the DTS handled better. Part of the reason was that the DTS was so stiff for its time that Cadillac had trouble dialing out the road imperfections. All of the last generation GM G-Bodies have that issue. 

[Robert Hall]

That Rivian platform reminds me of a perimeter frame used on older full size (and some midsize) cars (like the GM B-body or Ford Panther).   Not a ladder frame w/ leaf springs like trucks usually have. 

A sturdy frame to hold the battery pack makes sense, esp. considering how heavy some of these BEVs are.

Edited January 24, 2022 by Robert Hall

[G. David Felt]

7 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Unibody v. BOF ride quality comes down more around what the manufacturer does beyond that decision.  My BOF Avalanche rides fantastic on the highway, most of the Ram pickups and Magnaride equipped Denalis do too.  The F-150 rides terrible unless there is one version out there with an active suspension that I haven't driven yet.  The Ford Mach-E rides like crap if you don't get the active suspension.  The Telsa Model 3, which is unibody, rides like a Conestoga wagon. 

You may be thinking of the really old tech stuff, but even then the Town Car v. DTS, the Town Car rode better, but the DTS handled better. Part of the reason was that the DTS was so stiff for its time that Cadillac had trouble dialing out the road imperfections. All of the last generation GM G-Bodies have that issue. 

Have you or Bill asked for a week of a Rivian to drive and review? That would be cool!

[Drew Dowdell]

9 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

That Rivian platform reminds me of a perimeter frame used on older full size (and some midsize) cars (like the GM B-body or Ford Panther).   Not a ladder frame w/ leaf springs like trucks usually have. 

A sturdy frame to hold the battery pack makes sense, esp. considering how heavy some of these BEVs are.

The Rivian (and remarkably similar Ultium) platforms are kinda a hybrid of the two. The batteries on these are structural.  A ladder frame is just a perimeter frame with extra cross members for strength. 

And no one will be putting leaf springs in new EVs these days, if nothing else they won't have the room under the chassis.

9 minutes ago, David said:

Have you or Bill asked for a week of a Rivian to drive and review? That would be cool!

No, I've been out of the industry rotation since Covid started. 

[surreal1272]

19 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Unibody v. BOF ride quality comes down more around what the manufacturer does beyond that decision.  My BOF Avalanche rides fantastic on the highway, most of the Ram pickups and Magnaride equipped Denalis do too.  The F-150 rides terrible unless there is one version out there with an active suspension that I haven't driven yet.  The Ford Mach-E rides like crap if you don't get the active suspension.  The Telsa Model 3, which is unibody, rides like a Conestoga wagon. 

You may be thinking of the really old tech stuff, but even then the Town Car v. DTS, the Town Car rode better, but the DTS handled better. Part of the reason was that the DTS was so stiff for its time that Cadillac had trouble dialing out the road imperfections. All of the last generation GM G-Bodies have that issue. 

Very good points but I am not just referring to the super old stuff. Let me ask you this. Which rides better? A 2011 Pathfinder or a 2012 Pathfinder?

[Robert Hall]

Just now, Drew Dowdell said:

The Rivian (and remarkably similar Ultium) platforms are kinda a hybrid of the two. The batteries on these are structural.  A ladder frame is just a perimeter frame with extra cross members for strength. 

And no one will be putting leaf springs in new EVs these days, if nothing else they won't have the room under the chassis.

I guess I think of ladder frames like trucks where the cab, floor and bed bolts on it and sits above the frame, while a perimeter frame the floorpan fits down in the frame (I.e. 60s and newer BOF cars sat low like a unibody car, not high like a truck)   

[Drew Dowdell]

6 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

Very good points but I am not just referring to the super old stuff. Let me ask you this. Which rides better? A 2011 Pathfinder or a 2012 Pathfinder?

Never rode in a 2011.

But I can tell you that a 2022 Wagoneer rides like Town Car to the point that Albert hated driving it because it was too mushy. 

[surreal1272]

10 minutes ago, Drew Dowdell said:

Never rode in a 2011.

But I can tell you that a 2022 Wagoneer rides like Town Car to the point that Albert hated driving it because it was too mushy. 

And that happens only because of extra suspension goodies and an extremely massaged chasis. On its own, BOF will not ride well at all (ver bouncy for example). Here's what I know regarding the question I asked you. The 2012 is unibody and rides way better than the 2011 BOF PF. While it sucked that they ditched the BOF platform for it, there were good reasons for it as well. 

 

Also, I should note that my pointing this put was due to Balths assertion that GM and others are doing a 180 back to BOF after years of upsell on unibody, when it is not true nor does it make a damn if it is. 

Edited January 24, 2022 by surreal1272

[ccap41]

6 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

And that happens only because of extra suspension goodies and an extremely massaged chasis. On its own, BOF will not ride well at all (ver bouncy for example). Here's what I know regarding the question I asked you. The 2012 is unibody and rides way better than the 2011 BOF PF. While it sucked that they ditched the BOF platform for it, there were good reasons for it as well. 

Are they both IRS or solid rear axle? 

[Drew Dowdell]

6 minutes ago, surreal1272 said:

And that happens only because of extra suspension goodies and an extremely massaged chasis. On its own, BOF will not ride well at all (ver bouncy for example). Here's what I know regarding the question I asked you. The 2012 is unibody and rides way better than the 2011 BOF PF. While it sucked that they ditched the BOF platform for it, there were good reasons for it as well. 

 

Also, I should note that my pointing this put was due to Balths assertion that GM and others are doing a 180 back to BOF after years of upsell on unibody, when it is not true nor does it make a damn if it is. 

I agree that it doesn't matter... but I disagree that BOF can't ride well or inherently rides better/worse than unibody.  Both can ride well, both can ride like crap.  It's all the other stuff that goes into it that makes the difference.  The 2011 Pathfinder was a truck based vehicle with some respectable off-roading chops. The 2012 was a Mommymobile that Nissan built for soccer moms.  You might as well compare a Wrangler to a new Pathfinder. The old Trailblazers rode better than the new Traverse.  That's probably a more apt comparison. 

 

[G. David Felt]

Wow, Maverick gas truck new orders on hold now too.

https://amp.freep.com/amp/6634931001

Seems demand is so crazy that Ford is stopping new orders to manage customer expectations. 

[Drew Dowdell]

1 hour ago, David said:

Wow, Maverick gas truck new orders on hold now too.

https://amp.freep.com/amp/6634931001

Seems demand is so crazy that Ford is stopping new orders to manage customer expectations. 

I have a particularly contrarian view on the Maverick

 

[trinacriabob]

Good afternoon ...

 

[balthazar]

2 hours ago, Drew Dowdell said:

I disagree that BOF can't ride well or inherently rides better/worse than unibody.  Both can ride well, both can ride like crap.  It's all the other stuff that goes into it that makes the difference. 

Agreed. Whether the structural members are welded to the floor or are bolted to the floor makes very little difference- the vast majority of ride characteristics are in the suspension/tires. SOME examples of BOF probably can't be made to ride well due to the level of engineering incorporated, but it's not mutually exclusive. 

My BOF Sierra has an excellent ride, IMO. One thing I do agree with a bunch of other owners on; it could use a shock upgrade (which I'm planning on doing); that's more about sudden directional changes - highway/around town cruising is fantastic. 
 

2 hours ago, surreal1272 said:

Balth's assertion that GM and others are doing a 180 back to BOF after years of upsell on unibody, when it is not true

Other than the Corvette (I believe) is there a GM non-truck/van/non-RWD-based SUV that hasn't been unibody construction in the last 20 years? Are the upcoming BE vehicle bodies welded to their structural chassis'... or bolted? 

3 hours ago, surreal1272 said:

harping

Do you ever unclench your fists? ?

[Drew Dowdell]

54 minutes ago, balthazar said:

Agreed. Whether the structural members are welded to the floor or are bolted to the floor makes very little difference- the vast majority of ride characteristics are in the suspension/tires. SOME examples of BOF probably can't be made to ride well due to the level of engineering incorporated, but it's not mutually exclusive. 

My BOF Sierra has an excellent ride, IMO. One thing I do agree with a bunch of other owners on; it could use a shock upgrade (which I'm planning on doing); that's more about sudden directional changes - highway/around town cruising is fantastic. 
 

Other than the Corvette (I believe) is there a GM non-truck/van/non-RWD-based SUV that hasn't been unibody construction in the last 20 years? Are the upcoming BE vehicle bodies welded to their structural chassis'... or bolted? 

Do you ever unclench your fists? ?

I don’t think there’s been a FWD BOF from any brand since ‘85.

Solstice//Sky counts if you count Corvette.

 

[balthazar]

Watched what I could find on Hummer EV assembly.  GM has only released a bit of video, which numerous different videos sample from, it seems.

From what I saw, I feel the Hummer best fits in the 'unibody' category, as the raw shell moving down the line getting spot welded up already shows chassis structure attached.   Later on, the battery pack is seen being lifted up from below into the chassis's bottom.

While I accept that there is a 'structural contribution' via the battery pack, I wouldn't be surprised if it's largely to do with the large bottom plate that bolts to the body structure & seals the battery compartment, making a huge, solid, rigid 'squaring' of the body.  I don't think it would be advisable to have liquid-cooled batteries themselves subjected to repeated torsional stresses, esp in an intended off-roader like the Hummer.  

[G. David Felt]

GM seems to have major announcements coming tomorrow for the state of Michigan.

GM to Make Major Michigan Investment Announcement

Since I cannot read the automotive news story as it is by subscription only, thank goodness others are posting about it as the details have leaked.

Report: GM plans more Michigan EV assembly, battery plant (greencarreports.com)

$6.5 Billion investment in two plants, 1 for EV battery production and 1 for EV auto assembly. 

The news says that $4 Billion is to be invested in the Orion Assembly Plant in Orion Township, Michigan as it will build the Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra electric pickup trucks.

$2.5 billion will be the battery production plant.

Really liking the looks of the SilvErado electric pickup.

Silverado EV (gm.com)

Even the Work truck is not bad looking.

[G. David Felt]

The Trail Boss electric Silverado should do well for Chevrolet.

WOW, like this new video and the attention to detail on the truck. Very cool.

 

 

[balthazar]

"Completely reimaged what a pickup can be."
Jesus.

- - - - - 
Where is the real pickup - when is GM going to show it???

What would be interesting is if Silverado went BE and the Sierra stayed IC. Of course- they've also hinted at the BE Sierra.

[G. David Felt]

Seems the NACS - National Association of Convenience Stores has testified before congress wants to partner with the Federal Government to install fast EV charging at convenience stores across the US especially focused on the Rural sector according to the following story.

Convenience stores want to bring EV charging to rural America (greencarreports.com)

According to the NACS, 93% of America lives within 10 minutes of a convenience store and as such should have access to charging at these locations.

Interesting quote from the writeup: And it wouldn’t be the first time the federal government has stepped in to build up the grid. By 1930, just 10% of U.S. farms were connected to the grid, and by the end of World War II, just 40% of U.S. farms had electricity. Just getting rural America connected to electricity in the first place took federal loans, administered by the Rural Electrification Administration established in 1936.

[G. David Felt]

Interesting, Cadillac just launched the XT4 in china, it is a 48V mild hybrid AWD CUV. Where the US XT4 has 9 color choices and the same 4 banger Turbo Motor getting 26 mpg average, the China version being hybrid gets 31.6 mpg and 6 color options.

https://www.cadillac.com.cn/suv/xt4.html

https://www.cadillac.com/suvs/xt4

[balthazar]

[balthazar]

One more pic of a Tesla 60-kW pack being disassembled- the grid-like steel enclosure box is undoubtedly where the structural contribution comes from, but there battery packs themselves just sit in the 'trays' like ICe cubes.  it's interesting to see how it's constructed. 

Edited January 25, 2022 by balthazar

[surreal1272]

14 hours ago, balthazar said:

Do you ever unclench your fists? ?

My fists are rarely clenched and I stand by my statement. 

[G. David Felt]

Seems after 13 years since its resurrection that the Dodge Challenger has finally taken the crown as top selling Muscle Car.

It Took 13 Years, But The Dodge Challenger Has Finally Won (jalopnik.com)

In 2015 Ford Mustang hit it peak followed by the Chevrolet Camaro and every year since has dropped in sales. 2015 was also the year that Ford released the current Mustang that is still selling 7 years later.

2015 Ford Mustang sold 122,349 to 66,377 Challengers.

2021 Sales

• Ford Mustang 52,414
• Chevrolet Camaro 21,893
• Dodge Challenger 54,314

Dodge say's being the segment leader was not the aim, but rather delivering to the Muscle car crowd what they wanted in the form of various packages and special limited-edition Challengers like the 392, Scat Pak, Demon, Hellcat, etc.

Dodge has done one thing that both Ford and GM are missing from their Muscle cars as well as the full lineup and that is the Skittles of Color options and package options.

I do have to agree with the final statement of this story:

I have no pony — sorry — in this race, but I will commend Dodge for doing the most with the oldest. The Challenger only has two years left, tops, and I have a feeling the 2024 run will set sales records as people try to snap up the very last of the ICE muscle car breed. If the supply chain allows Stellantis to build enough of them, that is.

With only a couple years left before Dodge, Chevrolet and Ford are supposed to start transitioning their muscle cars to BEVs, it is going to be an interesting time over the next 24 month.

[G. David Felt]

Seems Chevrolet is sending out a link to allow one to do a Virtual up close and personal tour of the Chevrolet Silverado EV.

S-Electric AR Final - Animations (silveradoevathome.com)

[oldshurst442]

It Took 13 Years, But The Dodge Challenger Has Finally Won (jalopnik.com)

In 2015 Ford Mustang hit it peak followed by the Chevrolet Camaro and every year since has dropped in sales. 2015 was also the year that Ford released the current Mustang that is still selling 7 years later.

2015 Ford Mustang sold 122,349 to 66,377 Challengers.

2021 Sales

• Ford Mustang 52,414
• Chevrolet Camaro 21,893
• Dodge Challenger 54,314

 

 

 

Edited January 26, 2022 by oldshurst442

[riviera74]

OK. Why are Camaro sales last year so low compared to the Challenger and the Mustang?

[Robert Hall]

52 minutes ago, riviera74 said:

OK. Why are Camaro sales last year so low compared to the Challenger and the Mustang?

It hasn't changed much in 6 years, and is the least practical of the 3 with it's tiny bunker slot windows. 

[G. David Felt]

24 minutes ago, Robert Hall said:

It hasn't changed much in 6 years, and is the least practical of the 3 with it's tiny bunker slot windows. 

Bunker Slot Windows is the Number One Complaint I hear about the Camaro. Especially from more established Camaro fans. Young, new Muscle car people seem to not care as much, but the current Camaro is a Failure IMHO.

[oldshurst442]

@riviera74   Ill also add, in addition to crappy outward visibility, and old, loooong in the tooth styling...

Is that Dodge has sparked off a horsepower war that not only put Mustang and Camaro owners on edge, but Corvette owners too.  On top of that, Lamborghini and all other exotic owners too. 

And although the Challenger wont beat anybody around a race track,  the Challenger with the big horsepower has shamed all in straight line acceleration including the fastest of the fastest of them all:  EV straight line acceleration. 

And although the Challenger is not a race track kinda car,  it actually doesnt handle all that bad.  Its quite good actually. But it plays to ITS strengths and THAT is what people LOVE about it.    MOST folk that buy MUSCLE cars (The Challenger)  dont give a shyte about track times around the 'Ring. 

 The Challenger plays to ITS strengths and doesnt follow anybody else. The Challenger plays on its own terms and lets others follow them.   And when I say others, I do include all other performance cars such as the Camaro and Mustang but also INCLUDING exotics and supercars and EVs.

A question:      Who wants to drive a Zee Elle One  when one could drive one of these?

 

And they are having fun doing it.  Challenger owners are having a blast! 

 

 

Edited January 26, 2022 by oldshurst442

[G. David Felt]

Seems Dodge is missing out on the $23 Billion aftermarket for performance parts / upgrades. As such Dodge who started the Performance aftermarket for OEMs and where Ford and GM copied them has returned to their roots with Direct Connection of Warranty Backed, Emissions legal Performance Go Fast Parts that you can have your dealer install or do yourself.

Dodge Announces New Direct Connection Performance Parts Lineup, Parts Catalog and Technical Hotline | Dodge Garage

Gotta love Package upgrades of performance.

Direct Connection will provide enthusiasts with the “keys” to unlock the full horsepower potential of their vehicle in the form of a new Direct Connection Tuner and Stage kits for the Dodge Challenger Hellcat and Redeye models:

• Direct Connection Tuner (included in Pre-stage Kit) Plug-and-play engine tuner gives enthusiasts the power to upgrade an engine calibration at the touch of a button, plugs into the OBD-II port and can be used to install factory-tuned, 50-state-legal Stage kit calibrations. Tuner includes a hand-held tuning device and mounting hardware.
• Pre-stage Kit (Challenger SRT^® Hellcat Redeye) Includes the Tuner along with a performance air cleaner and low temp thermostat.  Pre-stage Kit also comes with a pre-loaded 50-state emissions-legal calibration that adds five horsepower and allows future performance upgrades via downloadable tuning maps.
• Stage I Kit (Challenger SRT Hellcat Redeye) Features a key code to unlock installation of the Stage I factory-tuned, 50-state emissions-legal calibration, resulting in a jump to 840 horsepower and 770 foot-pounds of torque when in high-octane mode. (Requires purchase of Pre-stage kit)
• Stage II Kit (Challenger SRT Hellcat Redeye) Building on Stage I Kit, includes a 3.17-inch “Hellephant” engine pulley and key code to unlock installation of the Stage II factory-tuned, 50-state emissions-legal calibration which achieves a huge boost up to 885 horsepower and 787 foot-pounds of torque. (Requires purchase of Pre-stage Kit and Stage I Kit)
• Pre-stage Kit (Challenger SRT Hellcat) Pre-stage Kit includes Tuner and a pre-loaded 50-state emissions-legal calibration that adds five horsepower and allows future performance upgrades via downloadable tuning maps.
• Stage I Kit (Challenger SRT Hellcat) The Stage I kit adds a 3.17-inch “Hellephant” engine pulley and the Stage I key code that unlocks factory-tuned, 50-state emissions-legal calibration to achieve 757 horsepower and 696 foot-pounds of torque. (Requires purchase of Pre-stage Kit)

Go to the link at the start or here for more details, but talk about a ton of performance go fast competition packages that are now warranty backed by Dodge.

Dodge Announces New Direct Connection Performance Parts Lineup, Parts Catalog and Technical Hotline | Dodge Garage

 

Other News:

Seems that Toyota is now coping in looks and details the American Full size SUV.

2023 Toyota Sequoia Arrives With 437 HP And New Luxury Trim | CarBuzz

 

[balthazar]

25 minutes ago, David said:

As such Dodge who started the Performance aftermarket for OEMs and where Ford and GM copied them

What’s this now??

[G. David Felt]

4 hours ago, balthazar said:

What’s this now??

If ya read the story from the link they say that Dodge started the Performance Upgrade aftermarket with warranty and that Ford and GM copied it with their own performance department. That is what the story says, I have no idea who is first, just stated what the stories said.

Quote:  In 1974, Direct Connection officially launched as the exclusive source for performance parts and technical information, straight from the manufacturer.

[balthazar]

OK, yeah; that needs some fact-checking.

[G. David Felt]

47 minutes ago, balthazar said:

OK, yeah; that needs some fact-checking.

I do find it very cool to sell Performance Upgrade Parts with a 24-month warranty even if it is used in actual racing.

?

Though I bet their lawyers have written in some very hard language to make it hard to actually have to honor the warranty. Who knows, we will see how this goes.

[Robert Hall]

Neat...I remember seeing 'Direct Connection' ads in car magazines as a kid back in the day. 

[balthazar]

From a FB GTO group ~ bone stock '69 GTO Judge hardtop on individual digital scales :
weight distribution : 59.4 / 40.6
total weight : 3696 lbs.