Pontiac... G3!

[pow]

http://www.autoblog.com/2006/05/03/pontiac...live-in-mexico/

[Cory Wolfe]

I hate Mexico (sorry Esteban).

[Guest YellowJacket894]

That's depressing.

[Northstar]

If it wasn't for the terrible cutline, I'd say that's better than the Aveo.

[Variance]

It's the new Wave (sedan) in Canada.

[Cory Wolfe]

I hate Canada, too.

[Robert Hall]

Pontiac dealers in the US are itching for it, I bet..

[ToniCipriani]

Still looks like a pig...

[Intrepidation]

Better than the Dodge Attitude at least XD

[gerardo]

I hate Mexico (sorry Esteban).

Don't hate us, instead love us.

[ZL-1]

Still looks like a pig...

:rotflmao:

[C.H.U.D.]

I hate it. That fake grille added to the top of the grille is, well, grilled cheese.

As is my sense of humour.

[Imaj]

Stupid GM! How does this rebadge fit with Pontiac's sporty image?

[Robert Hall]

Stupid GM! How does this rebadge fit with Pontiac's sporty image?

The Pontiac V-crest emblem brings excitement to the B-segment!!! While the Chevy Aveo provides solid value in the B-segment.

[RBB]

Pontiac G3 proves badge engineering alive in Mexico

While they did a fair job of saying they're OK with it, why didn't we see this headline:

Acura TSX proves badge engineering alive in USA

Acura CSX proves badge engineering alive in Canada

Scion xB proves badge engineering alive in USA

Toyota Cavalier proves badge engineering alive in Japan

-RBB

[NOS2006]

http://www.autoblog.com/2006/05/03/pontiac...live-in-mexico/

That kind of looks like a Caliber from that angle..

[Mule Bakersdozen LS]

The Toyota Cavalier's been dead for years...the G3 I think has a slightly better grille than the Aveo, but that says little at all seeing as how it is an ugly design in the first place as a whole. Did Acura Canada just start calling its Civic clone the CSX? I always knew it as the EL....I'll have to check it out-still sedan only, right?

[RBB]

The Toyota Cavalier's been dead for years

I know - I just threw it in for fun. hence the

-RBB

[I hope GMRULES again]

The Toyota Cavalier's been dead for years...the G3 I think has a slightly better grille than the Aveo, but that says little at all seeing as how it is an ugly design in the first place as a whole. Did Acura Canada just start calling its Civic clone the CSX? I always knew it as the EL....I'll have to check it out-still sedan only, right?

Yes the CSX is the new name for the EL and it is only a sedan. Apparently there are people who want to pay 3K more for a Civic with an Acura badge.

[NINETY EIGHT REGENCY]

Badge engineering will not die as long as there are cars and there needs to be a cheap version and a expensive version of something(Chevrolet Corvette/Cadillac XLR). It will not die as long as there has to be a business case to produce a car.

For example.. common parts sharing.

Take the business case for the Camaro. There has to be something else on that platform to jusify the production of that car other than Holdens which are not sold here other than the departing GTO.. If you can spread the costs across the car lines, it makes a business case. That is why you have Solstice, Sky and Opel GT.

There has to be:

cost effectiveness

common parts sharing

a plant that can build different cars in the same factory

a marketing plan

a need in the market for that vehicle.

There has to be a profit to be made if one falls short or because as in the case for most badge jobs some people do not see themselves buying cheap versions of this or that because of perception. That is why some buy Mercury's and not Fords.

Toyota does it:

Cheap= Camry

Expensive= Lexus ES

Some times, badge engineering is a stop gap measure so a company can stay in a segment.

In Mexico's case it is because they drive smaller cars more than we do, and Pontiac is sold there and they need a car in that segment.

As far as Pontiacs other badge jobs and marketing in the United States, right now with Chevy and Saturn on one side and Buick on the other, Pontiac is getting the squeeze in the United States. Pontiac does not have one car you can say.. "That's a Pontiac."

Solstice and Sky

Torrent and Equinox

G6 and Malibu

Grand Prix and La Crosse and Impala

Montana SV6 and Relay, Terazza, Uplander

G5 and Cobalt

This is why Pontiac has no clear market or distinction because it has no cars of its own. Anyone can put a sport package on a car.

What does Pontiac mean to people?

You have to ask that question first before it can be clearly defined what makes a Pontiac a Pontiac.

The only reason people buy Pontiacs is because of the name Pontiac not because of a product(Solstice is the only exception for now). These are GM loyal and Pontiac loyal buyers not import buyers or conquest buyers.

Toyota sells because of a reputation for quality.

Honda sells for the same reason.

The thing is.. they have no style.

Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger and Dodge Magnum are basically the same car with three different variations. They sell because style and appeal factor. It is cost effective, but Chrysler is making money off the same car three times over. They now will add a muscle car to the mix.

GM is bigger and is different from others. The other companies spread a car or a platform across two lines. GM in most cases spreads it across three or four just to sustain market share. GM cannot continue to sustain or grow by competing against itself in the market.

Saturn is the only case where I have seen it may work for the benefit of the whole. By selling Opels here and throwing in a few American GM cars, Saturn will get those import buyers and do it by having an image as an import fighter. Saturn does not have baggage.

[Intrepidation]

Badge engineering will not die as long as there are cars and there needs to be a cheap version and a expensive version of something(Chevrolet Corvette/Cadillac XLR). It will not die as long as there has to be a business case to produce a car.

For example..  common parts sharing.

Take the business case for the  Camaro. There has to be something else on that platform to jusify the production of that car other than Holdens which are not sold here other than the departing GTO.. If you can spread the costs across the car lines, it makes a business case.  That is why you have Solstice, Sky and Opel GT.

There has to be:

cost effectiveness

common parts sharing

a plant that can build different cars in the same factory

a marketing plan

a need in the market for that vehicle.

There has to be a profit to be made if one falls short or because as in the case for most badge jobs some people do not see themselves buying cheap versions of this or that because of perception. That is why some buy Mercury's and not Fords.

Toyota does it:

Cheap= Camry

Expensive= Lexus ES

Some times, badge engineering is a stop gap measure so a company can stay in a segment.

In Mexico's case it is because they drive smaller cars more than we do, and Pontiac is sold there and they need a car in that segment.

As far as Pontiacs other badge jobs and marketing in the United States, right now with Chevy and Saturn on one side and Buick on the other, Pontiac is getting the squeeze in the United States.  Pontiac does not have one car you can say.. "That's a Pontiac."

Solstice and Sky

Torrent and  Equinox

G6 and Malibu

Grand Prix and La Crosse and Impala

Montana SV6 and Relay, Terazza, Uplander

G5 and Cobalt

This is why Pontiac has no clear market or distinction because it has no cars of its own. Anyone can put a sport package on a car.

What does Pontiac mean to people?

You have to ask that question first before it can be clearly defined what makes a Pontiac a Pontiac.

The only reason people buy Pontiacs is because of the name Pontiac not because of a product(Solstice is the only exception for now).  These are GM loyal and Pontiac loyal buyers not import  buyers or conquest buyers.

Toyota sells because of a reputation for quality.

Honda sells for the same reason.

The thing is.. they have no style.

Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger and Dodge Magnum are basically the same car with three different variations.  They sell because style and appeal factor. It is cost effective, but Chrysler is making money off the same car three times over.  They now will add a muscle car to  the mix.

GM is bigger and is different from others. The other companies spread a car or a platform across two lines. GM in most cases spreads it across three or four just to sustain market share. GM cannot continue to sustain or grow by competing against itself in the market.

Saturn is the only case where I have seen it may work for the benefit of the whole. By selling Opels here and throwing in a few American GM cars, Saturn will get those import buyers and do it by having an image as  an import fighter.  Saturn does not have baggage.

But you have to remember that the 300, Magnum, and Charger are more than the same car with a different badge slapped on. The only component the Charger shares with the other two is the windshield. The Magnum looks totally different from the 300, since the 300 wagon isn't sold in the states. That is platofrm sharing

The Torrent on the other hand, is an Equinox with a new bmumper grill and headlighs, and a new steering wheel. ANd this is badge engineering

As for engine sharing, no one complains about the shared engines in teh LX cars becomes the midlevel V6 is compitent and the Hemis rock.

The Torrent and Equinox on the other hand, have pretty lame engines, and not many to chose from.

[Flybrian]

As for engine sharing, no one complains about the shared engines in teh LX cars becomes the midlevel V6 is compitent and the Hemis rock.

*cough*wtfisupwiththe2.7lthoughmygoshwhatanoldyellerofadogthatthingis*cough*

[Guest YellowJacket894]

Saturn is the only case where I have seen it may work for the benefit of the whole. By selling Opels here and throwing in a few American GM cars, Saturn will get those import buyers and do it by having an image as  an import fighter.  Saturn does not have baggage.

Maybe so, but I think that the new Saturn could be hurt by the image of old Saturn. The old Saturn was known for mediocre cars sold through dealerships with the friendliest, non-agressive dealer in the buisness. (Okay, so that last part of the old Saturn is a benefit.) You cannot look at the Ion and say it won't have a negative effect on the new Saturn.

The Torrent and Equinox on the other hand, have pretty lame engines, and not many to chose from.

What are you talking about, "not many to choose from." There is only one engine you can currently get in the Tor-i-nox: the lame ass Chinese 3.4L 6-Shooter.

[ToniCipriani]

Badge engineering will not die as long as there are cars and there needs to be a cheap version and a expensive version of something(Chevrolet Corvette/Cadillac XLR). It will not die as long as there has to be a business case to produce a car.

For example..  common parts sharing.

Take the business case for the  Camaro. There has to be something else on that platform to jusify the production of that car other than Holdens which are not sold here other than the departing GTO.. If you can spread the costs across the car lines, it makes a business case.  That is why you have Solstice, Sky and Opel GT.

There has to be:

cost effectiveness

common parts sharing

a plant that can build different cars in the same factory

a marketing plan

a need in the market for that vehicle.

There has to be a profit to be made if one falls short or because as in the case for most badge jobs some people do not see themselves buying cheap versions of this or that because of perception. That is why some buy Mercury's and not Fords.

Toyota does it:

Cheap= Camry

Expensive= Lexus ES

Some times, badge engineering is a stop gap measure so a company can stay in a segment.

In Mexico's case it is because they drive smaller cars more than we do, and Pontiac is sold there and they need a car in that segment.

As far as Pontiacs other badge jobs and marketing in the United States, right now with Chevy and Saturn on one side and Buick on the other, Pontiac is getting the squeeze in the United States.  Pontiac does not have one car you can say.. "That's a Pontiac."

Solstice and Sky

Torrent and  Equinox

G6 and Malibu

Grand Prix and La Crosse and Impala

Montana SV6 and Relay, Terazza, Uplander

G5 and Cobalt

This is why Pontiac has no clear market or distinction because it has no cars of its own. Anyone can put a sport package on a car.

What does Pontiac mean to people?

You have to ask that question first before it can be clearly defined what makes a Pontiac a Pontiac.

The only reason people buy Pontiacs is because of the name Pontiac not because of a product(Solstice is the only exception for now).  These are GM loyal and Pontiac loyal buyers not import  buyers or conquest buyers.

Toyota sells because of a reputation for quality.

Honda sells for the same reason.

The thing is.. they have no style.

Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger and Dodge Magnum are basically the same car with three different variations.  They sell because style and appeal factor. It is cost effective, but Chrysler is making money off the same car three times over.  They now will add a muscle car to  the mix.

GM is bigger and is different from others. The other companies spread a car or a platform across two lines. GM in most cases spreads it across three or four just to sustain market share. GM cannot continue to sustain or grow by competing against itself in the market.

Saturn is the only case where I have seen it may work for the benefit of the whole. By selling Opels here and throwing in a few American GM cars, Saturn will get those import buyers and do it by having an image as  an import fighter.  Saturn does not have baggage.

Nice writeup... but I really don't agree on the Corvette and XLR being "badge engineered." The hardtop and the convertible, and the engines (Northie vs SBC) are enough to make them cars with very different personalities.

[NINETY EIGHT REGENCY]

Thank you for your comments. As far as that Chevy and Cadillac comment, I based it on what I saw. I stood at the car show next to the XLR. Almost every person called the XLR and overprice Chevrolet Corvette and said it was the same thing.

I do not agree with that, but it is the perception that people have.

[Robert Hall]

Thank you for your comments. As far as that Chevy and Cadillac comment, I based it on what I saw. I stood at the car show next to the XLR. Almost every person called the XLR and overprice Chevrolet Corvette and said it was the same thing.

I do not agree with that, but it is the perception that people have. 

They are just stupid if they think the Corvette and XLR are 'the same thing'. They have some components in common ('dirty bits' underneath), but the bodies, interiors, engines, etc are different..

[Intrepidation]

*cough*wtfisupwiththe2.7lthoughmygoshwhatanoldyellerofadogthatthingis*cough*

that's the base, yeah it sucks. But they have 3 other good engines that more than make up for it.